What about the Spartans?

[Fearless]

Rome Totalwar..............Were the Spartans about in that period?

By the way, make sure you all go and see LOTR Twin Towers.............AWESOME

[The Marcher Lord]

The Spartans were pretty much history by the fourth century BC and are unlikely to fit into the timescale suggested by what is currently known about Rome TW (3rd century BC to 4th century AD ?). Rome never fought the Spartans, but the Greeks and Persians certainly did.

[Fearless]

Thanks The Marcher Lord for your reply. I had a hunch that was going to be the answer. Shame as I would love to have fought the romans with a spartan army.

[ZIM!]

as an independant faction? not bloody likely, but perhaps..... unique units http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/idea.gif

[Knight_Yellow]

ermm it aint called the twin towers m8.
and it sucks.
Elfs, orcs, dwarves...... go back to games workshop.

[Lehesu]

Oh come on now, Knight It wasn't that bad, was it? I know that in your deepest, most unplumbed depths of your heart, you and every other fantasy curmudgeon hold some satisfaction in mystical lookin' people hacking at each other.

[Gregoshi]

He didn't like The Two Towers because there weren't any Scotsmen in it. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[MacGregor]

Sure there were, Dwarves are basically just mini-Scotsman.

[Heretic]

Quote[/b] (The Marcher Lord @ Dec. 30 2002,07:56)]The Spartans were pretty much history by the fourth century BC and are unlikely to fit into the timescale suggested by what is currently known about Rome TW (3rd century BC to 4th century AD ?). Rome never fought the Spartans, but the Greeks and Persians certainly did.
Well, they actually fought with them.
(Rome vs Spartans)
But Spartans were not alone, they joined a league against Rome after roman legions defeated Philhippos V with greek help, but romans did not hold their word about the favors they sweared to the greek cities who supported them against the macedonians. Of course the romans needed them because at that time the macedonians were allied with Hannibal http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[jeffreyLebowski]

Quote[/b] (Knight_Yellow @ Dec. 30 2002,14:15)]ermm it aint called the twin towers m8.
and it sucks.
Elfs, orcs, dwarves...... go back to games workshop.


um... yeah. lotr sucks so much in fact, that its sucked its way all to way to the 2nd most read book of all time. it cracked the 200million dollar barrier in 12 days because its such a horrible movie.


i mean, we're all free to like or dislike, but you clearly have a predisposition against the genre.

[Surak-nar]

Spartans...Corinthians, Athenians, Thebans, Macedonians, and many more were all Greeks.

Their specific names are known to us because in the begining Greece was made up of Independed City States.

They fought together as One against outside Agressors (Persians), and they fought eachother for Supremacy within the Hellenic World.

These Internal fewds are the roots and contributors to the fall of the Empire to the hands of the Romans much Later.

However, by that time, the City States were already united under Alexander's father rule, Phillip of Macedon.

Sparta is a city in southern greece which does still exist today. Back then thought Sparta was known for its fierce Warriors that sprung from a Dictatorship style of Life, in contrast to a Democracy instituted by the Athenians.

In Any case, since this would be a Game about Rome and not about Greece, by that time the Romans had eliminated the Etruscans and were marching outside of the Italian Peninsula. We would see Spartans being part of the Greek Faction, prolly compose the basis of a sort of Hoplite Unit being buildable by that Faction.

[rasoforos]

well suranak says some very nice things BUT i have an objection. you say that that by that time the city states were united. well it depends on when the game will start , if the game starts with the birth of rome or a couple of centuries afterwards then the greek city states were definatelly divided , moreover the greeks fought the romans without being united just before Alexanders time ( king perros ) . i HOPE and pray to the gods for a game with divided city states or a mixture of seperate until a time and then united ( this actually would make a cool SP campaign when your goal as a greek city state would be total domination of greece untill a certain year to be able to proceed to a later goal ( expansion eastwwards or westwards). it would be a loss if the game leaves the historical treasure of the city state disputes out.

[Surak-nar]

I agree with you Rasoforos,

And yes, King Perros, I beleive and if memory serves, it was from the kingdom of Hepiros, sent troops to fight the romans by request of the Greek Colonies in Sicily and southern Italy. No objection there...not about History itself, we can inform eachother with facts but can't really debate.

What we can debate on however, is from a Game point of view.

And from that perspective, consider the following arguments.

If the game does start at a period where the city states are not united then that game could not be a game about the Roman Empire, since there can't be a Greek faction.

Furthermore, a game about the Roman Empire would have to have a map which is pretty similar to MTW, which in turn would not permit such a fragmentation of territories in Greece as to historically represent the city states.

I think that a Good period to start it would be after the Romans have conquered Italy in its intirety. Which coincides roughly with the period where the city states were united.

And that would still give us Factions such as Romans, greeks, Egyptians, Persians, Armenians, Gauls (And Celts of England, however Gauls were Celts themselves - Ireland England and France of today was all Celt territory), then Add Phoenicians to the Fray and one could even separate them in two, Phoenicians in Middle East and Carthaginians in North Africa.

We also Have the peoples of the Spanish peninsula, and the Dacians in present day Romania/and northern Bulgaria.

Germanic peoples can cover the North of the European Map.

(Ostrogoths, Goths, Vandals, Francs etc..only came in to the playground at the decline of the Roman empire pushed by the Huns, so they would not be good candidates of such a game to be factions, except maybe the Huns if there is a very Late era Campaign, then again we are talking of a Roman Empire which had already been sliced in two between Orient and Occidental parts, the Oriental one survived as Byzantium)

Now, I would personally love to see the city states fighting it out, but that would be more of a Game about the Greek Empire/Civilisation rather than the Roman Empire.