Kings Influence

[King Edward]

Hello all

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

Playing as france, King henry has sat on the thrown since he was 19. his influence is very high with people supposedly quing up to be in my favor. now after 35odd yrs i realise that non of the six heirs are married and things look like they could get nasty with all the sons getting old. But no one will marry them every faction on the map has turned me down does my influence not count for anything?? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif so looks like we are off for a civil war http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif

[Gaius Julius]

Hi King http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif
Do you have any alliances with the other factions?
Are you at war with anyone?
Have you been excommunicated?
Since your ruler has a high degree of influence, the other factions should view him with greater respect.
Also do your hiers have any nasty vices?
Don't forget to check out Table of Contents in the Main Hall. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Naagi]

It is not required for your eldest heir to be married to take over the throne. Just has to be the eldest, and afterwards he can get married. I hardly ever have my heirs married when my king dies, and when the heir takes over it usually only takes a couple turns before he gives up on other factions and marries a noble woman. I still havent figured out all the little diplomatic intricacies yet, but the easiest marriages are very early in the game.

Naagi http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[SmokWawelski]

Yes, it looks like you can marry foreign girl only early in the game, and the more years fly by, the harder it is. Not a well tested out feature, if you ask me....

[Strategery]

I am currently testing a theory. It seems to be working. If there is a weak faction seeking an alliance with you, turn him down, perhaps more than once. Then, when your heir comes of age, ask for a Princess. So far this tactic has worked when I've been able to try it. It is not 100%, nor should it be, but it seems to improve my chances of a positive reply, even when my faction is in a fairly dominant game position.

[Exile]

I am pretty sure that the bigger your empire gets, the harder it is to arrange marriages. I suppose the AI factions dont want to do anything to help you prevent a civil war. It is important to marry your heirs. If the King dies old and his eldest son is 60 or so, there's a good chance he wont have heirs of his own. Then you have a problem. You can avert this sometimes by killing off the older, unmarried heirs.

I usually find that if an AI faction agrees to the marriage, that faction will also agree to subsequent requests at least for a while. So once I find a willing AI faction, I quickly send emissaries to any other princesses they have until all my heirs or married off.

[Ueriah]

Wuv... true wuv... and mawwiage...

Sorry, a lil' Princess Bride for you there. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Keeping a successful lineage is always important, particularly if you are starting in the Early age.

I agree with the bit about turning people down from time to time to increase thier chances of accepting wedding proposals.

Also, don't forget that certain traits are genetic. So if you notice that there happens to be a king out there who has a whole heap of great virtues, you might wish to get a piece of his daughter. There's a good chance some of those virtues will make thier way into your bloodine.

I evaluate the princes as they come of age. If they look to be promising (ie more Virtues then Vices) I try to get them hitched ASAP. If they are... uh... less than desirable (the future king is Strange with an odd number of toes) then I try to throw them off into battle and get them killed.

Getting your prince married young has a big advantage over relying on waiting until he is the king. The younger you marry him, the better the chances are that he will already have children of his own when he becomes king. Should this happen, all of his brothers are no longer in line for the throne since the king has an heir appearant. When this happens, I believe the king's brothers stop aging and become regular generals, albiet with royal blood and any virtues that you have groomed them with.

The most heirs I've had at once is 6. Has anyone had more?

[Gregoshi]

Greetings King Edward May your reign here be a long one...and, uh, one small request: keep those sons of your home. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[King Edward]

Thanks for all the tips folks I saved my game at the point i was at at my 1st post and carried on as normal sure enough i had a civil war as the king died and his son was 60 so i had a civil war a few yrs later. I then went back and killed off all the old heirs in rather unfair battles and bang, the yongest son of 30 kame to the throne and saved my from the civil war http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Grothgar]

I find perserverance to be a key attribute to getting your heirs married off as well as huge influence and everything else discussed on this board.

Build about 5 emissarys and keep them together and go headhunting. Find a princess you like and then bombard her with proposals, eventually they Faction Leader will get so bored turning you down, he will just say yes. Although it can get annoying with 5 messages saying your proposal has been turned down.

Also the higher your emissarys valour, the greater the chance to be accepted, or maybe that should be the lower the chance of being turned down.

And as for the other matter, i think 6 heirs is the maximum at one time, but then these are the 6 that have survived, you dont get to know about miscarriges and death at birth in this game. So you could have had 15 children, but only 6 survived.

Also if your having trouble getting your princesses or your heirs married off, just be an Arab Faction, problem solved http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Grothgar]

Actually always read before you post. It seems that some people have had 7 heirs, so 6 obviously isnt a maximum.

As an aside, an edit function would be a good idea, while im not begrudging my nice shiny new post count, it would make me look less silly if i could change my origional post before people see it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wacko.gif

[Gregoshi]

Grothgar, as a Junior Patron, you aren't allowed to make mistakes. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif When you do get promoted, there will be an edit link next to the quote in the upper right corner of your posts.

I had never thought about the bombardment approach to getting married. I see you are an innovative thinker...or an expert pest. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif Good idea though. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pat.gif

[Grothgar]

Well i like to think of myself as innovative but its probably the second option, i am very tenachious, even if i cant spell it. If i find something i want then ill go after it until i succeed.

This is how i found out this, i was after the french kings only daughter, the french king was quite the mean machine, having loads of useful traits, and what with them being genetic, and what with a few of my heirs being a bit inbred, i wanted her to their sons might at least be a bit suitable for ruling.

So the french king said no, so i kept going and after 6 years, and 30 rejections he said yes, of course the fact that the princess was 6 years older and getting a bit on in life might have had something to do with it but i stand by my persistance http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

[Asmodeus]

Quick question....

Is there a way to tell which of the heirs is the eldest and due to inherit the throne? I had six princes scattered over my empire and couldnt remember who was the eldest.

Cheers http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Mr. Juice]

Good Sir Asmodeus,

Just click on the button with the crown in the lower left corner.

[cugel]

:sure enough i had a civil war as the king died and his son was 60 so i had a civil war a few yrs later. I then went back and killed off all the old heirs in rather unfair battles and bang, the yongest son of 30 kame to the throne and saved my from the civil war

You don't need to send your heirs off into unfair battles to get them killed. Simply dismiss their unit. Presto - no heir. When my king died once and I got a civil war, I just reloaded and killed off all the rival heirs, except the one I wanted to inherit, by dismissing their units. Next turn the King died right on time and the remaining heir inherited with no trouble at all. (You do have to eliminate all but one, if there are two or more they fight). It's generally better to get the heirs married off early (if you can). Diplomacy in this games starts out moderately difficult in the early campaign and quickly degenerates into impossible. After 50-100 years I don't even bother any more trying to make alliances, make peace or marry into other factions. You just get endless rejections and it's a big waste of time. (I suppose you might get some results if you try 30 times - perhaps there's a low probability chance of success on each attempt) but it generally is more bother than it's worth. You don't even need a King with great attributes. Even a poor king generates improved attributes over time if you rule right (just don't try to use him in battle) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif Some vices like bribeable +50% don't matter with Kings since you can't bribe them anyway and, if you don't use him in battle, a king with a low command rating also doesn't matter. It's much more important to keep you king in close communication by sea or land with all your provinces to avoid rebellions.

[Asmodeus]

Quote[/b] (Mr. Juice @ Jan. 14 2003,13:21)]Good Sir Asmodeus,

Just click on the button with the crown in the lower left corner.
DOH

I didnt notice it showed their age on that screen I was looking at the profiles for each prince and surprised it didnt show his age like it does for the king.

Cheers http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Asmodeus]

Quote[/b] (cugel @ Jan. 14 2003,15:51)]:sure enough i had a civil war as the king died and his son was 60 so i had a civil war a few yrs later. I then went back and killed off all the old heirs in rather unfair battles and bang, the yongest son of 30 kame to the throne and saved my from the civil war

You don't need to send your heirs off into unfair battles to get them killed. Simply dismiss their unit. Presto - no heir. When my king died once and I got a civil war, I just reloaded and killed off all the rival heirs, except the one I wanted to inherit, by dismissing their units. Next turn the King died right on time and the remaining heir inherited with no trouble at all. (You do have to eliminate all but one, if there are two or more they fight). It's generally better to get the heirs married off early (if you can). Diplomacy in this games starts out moderately difficult in the early campaign and quickly degenerates into impossible. After 50-100 years I don't even bother any more trying to make alliances, make peace or marry into other factions. You just get endless rejections and it's a big waste of time. (I suppose you might get some results if you try 30 times - perhaps there's a low probability chance of success on each attempt) but it generally is more bother than it's worth. You don't even need a King with great attributes. Even a poor king generates improved attributes over time if you rule right (just don't try to use him in battle) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif Some vices like bribeable +50% don't matter with Kings since you can't bribe them anyway and, if you don't use him in battle, a king with a low command rating also doesn't matter. It's much more important to keep you king in close communication by sea or land with all your provinces to avoid rebellions.
I have used the 'disband lousy heir' technique on occasion but now I prefer assassinating them so I can keep the rest of his knights as good shock troops or assign them to other princes who have lost some knights in battle - a lot cheaper than training new ones. Also I think disbanded troops become mercenaries (i may be wrong) so I am wary about disbanding 'dangerous' troops that may one day come back and fight me. I've also had a couple burnt at the stake that had very low piety and other perversions - if you dont do it, the odds are the enemy's Inquistors will.

Diplomacy does get harder later in the game especially if you've behaved rather badly to other factions. Having Emersaries with good valour stars or using princesses can help a little.

Also a lot seems to depend on the reputation or 'Influence' of the king. I used to always keep my King safely in his castle and use my generals or princes as captains of armies. But I noticed as time went on that my king's influence seemed to dwindle even though my empire was powerful - consequently his offspring seemed to lack the glory of the kings I started out with. I also wondered why the AI used his kings in battle so often. Anyway I have started in my new Danish campaign to use my King in battle, not just as the commander at the rear but actually to send him into the fray when the odds were not too unfavourable.

Whilst it is risky to do so, I have noticed his 'influence' has increased by one or two crowns to the level that 'rival factions will even consider going to war with other factions to secure an alliance with you'. His command level went up a star too and since then his princes have started out better too. Anyway I havent used this strategy enough yet to be certain, but the indications so far are good and as King of the Danes, it seemed appropriate that he should be a tough son-of-a-bitch http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[King Edward]

I agree, much better to use the king in battle as the heirs he produces become fantastic generals as one Byzantine campagne illistrated. I had an ex-heir general who was a legendary leader, skilled attacker, expert defender and natural born killer (We forgave his secret perversion shhh&#33http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pat.gif

[Exile]

I always send my first few kings and their eldest heirs into battle. The useful V&Vs and stars they get go a long way to making a stronger lineage. I also valiantly dispose of unworthy heirs http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

In my latest Almo campaign, the King started with 6 stars I think. I sent he and then his eldest son into battle at every opportunity and now a couple generations later I have almost all 7-8 star heirs and kings. On occassion I get a lower star rating due to the pride vice, so if he's the eldest I send that heir on a 'proud' mission to battle the enemy all by his lonesome.

[Gregoshi]

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif Is that how you got your user name Exile? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Portuguese Rebel]

Hmmm there is a drastic way of getting your heir married. have anyone tried incest? i heard its possible. I wonder whats the down side to that. It seems you get a vice or something. Does anyone know what this vice is and whats the effect?

[hooah]

are you sure you can just disband princes' units? from what I remember its impossible - you've got to get them killed before they give up trying to get the throne

[Longshanks]

Quote[/b] (Portuguese Rebel @ Feb. 24 2003,15:56)]Hmmm there is a drastic way of getting your heir married. have anyone tried incest? i heard its possible. I wonder whats the down side to that. It seems you get a vice or something. Does anyone know what this vice is and whats the effect?
As far as I know they get the secret incest vice. I don't know what penalties that carries if it gets exposed though. I imagine any heirs would be chinless wonders and have an odd number of toes.

[redrooster]

after failing to marry off my daughter(which comes as no suprise based on the fact that she has to shave her beard three times a day) and she is approaching that age where she woyuld condemmed to spend the rest of her life in a cold, damp tower knitting. i decided to drop her on my seventh son. voila, a genration of circus freaks spew forth,beards and opposable toes, fur on the sole of the foot and eyes on the back of the head. well at least the emperor's court no longer needs pretty little greek boys on lyres and lithe nubians dancing girls for entertainment.