One or two big armies . . .

[deus ex machina]

Hello. I've been playing the Turkish - early/hard- and have been experimenting with different military organizational models. Please note, these models only apply after the initial consolidation - the first 15-20 yrs.

The first model is two large armies: The first army is composed of heavy cav (usually mercs.) with a even mix of spear and missile units. This army is posted to face the Byz. empire (or what is left of it). The second army is composed of desert units with maybe a unit of heavy cav. This army operates in North Africa and attempts to push to Spain.

The second model is numerous smaller armies that are organized on a more ad hoc formula and seldom exceed more than half of the max. number of troops allowed.

The problem I experience with the first model is that my Crusader proviences are left open (florins do NOT permit a standing army there of any worth) and once those pesky Christian units get a foothold, things tend to collapse from the inside out. The issue with the second model is that my armies tend to be defeated in detail because, unlike some other factions, the Turks do not have the benefit of interior lines due to the Med.

I've tried to rely upon merc. armies raised at the first sight of trouble, but, those tend to be very expensive and spotty as far as unit pool. Moreover, once the GH arrives, my empire usually is on the verge of collapse that the first assualt brings the walls down.

Any thoughts or suggestions? I really enjoy playing the muslim factions and hope to develop some approaches that will allow me to fully exploit their advantages - if only I could win some stability at the outset. Please forgive if these questions/issues have been addressed before or seem a statement of the obvious, i.e. the game of MTW itself, and therefore unanswerable.

[wordsmith]

They way i start out with the turks is an immediate strike at constenople because almost all crusades to the holy lands come through there and a large standing army will hold them and any other agressors for the north back. Once constenople is taken I ether mop the byz or usually i turn around and come charging in on the eygptians, this is where things get hairy. Expect losses and a lot of province swapping, have massive peasent armies trained for garrisons in rebbellious provinces. The key is speed speed speed both the byz and the eygptians have extreamly rich, well developed lands. Time is NOT on your side. When the horde arrives you will want to have already taken egypt and constenople. When the horde shows up dont spred yourself thin and try to protect provinces, destroy all happyness buildings you can and keep your foces consolidated. The biggest mistake you make against the horde is to let them spread your forces out over many provinces. use peasents and other such cheapo troops to absorbe arrows and only have your elite units engage horde troops that are already engaged. With the number of troops they arive with (after patch) you cannot afford sending elite units into head on clashes with horde. Loyalist revolts might turn the tide for you, if the horde leaves a province taken from you lightly garrisioned DONT automaticly take it, consider the odds of a rebbellion and often you will want to let them keep it and hope for a loyalist revolt which will give you a random mix of elites.

and lastly, your muslim, JIHAD JIHAD JIHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

When i play muslim i almost always have 2 jihads in ever province. They dont cost maintainance but can be used as standing armies against invaders, very nice, and noooo its not cheesy tactics, at least not any cheeser then doing crusades http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wacko.gif

oi, all that typeing made me want to play the turks again, gotta love those sapai of the port, godly

[troymclure]

hey deus

Well, not too sure how much help i can be... but you say that crusaders are causing you problems? solution is pretty simple. Take Constantinople and do it 10 turns ago. Once you've got that you should be secure from europe and free to turn your attention to the rich african provinces. Stick a big enough army in it and the crusades won't even attack (if the army they have to go through is bigger than they are crusades will often just sit at the borders and slowly die out).
Having said that, paradoxically my first move when playing the turks is often to take out the egyptians. If you can do it fast enough it's great, but only do it if you're confident, i personally think it's safer to take out the byzantium first but more beneficial in the long run if you take out the egyptians first.
As to the size/structure of armies i think that really it is up to personal preference but i personally prefer big armies. I personally think the turks are one of the easier factions simply cause of their insanely good borders. ie. you can have say 10-20 provinces all under control with only three border provinces to station troops at. Those being Kazaar, Constantinople and whatever african coastal province you want to stop at.
Hmmm, i get the feeling that i've just prattled out three paragraphs without answering any of your questions but heh, hope it helps anyways.
ps:- Little help from above huh?

[deus ex machina]

Thanks for the responses - very helpful.

I think given this input I will start a new game and drive immediately for Constantinople. Once taken and consolidated I shall turn on the Egyptians. As far as the GH, I have been trying to defend everything and, consequently, losing everything - so the suggested approach is well received.
One further question, what is the perferred Turkish unit, if any, for countering the GH units. I've been using spearmen to engage while trying to exact as many casualities with missile units before my main line breaks. Any suggestions? Again, thanks.

[troymclure]

Janissary Heavy Infantry. They will absolutely destroy the MH units. Actually they do that to just about everything.
if i could marry a unit..... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Panther]

JHI and lots of archers like turcoman foot or Jannisary archers should wipe out the GH oh and try to get light cav the chase those damn HA if you dont have enough archers

[Alrowan]

i usually have a set standard army, like 2 archers, 3 spears 3 cav 2 swords.. i make stacks of these sets and no more, then as i play if i get attacked or attack the number of men is the number of stacks, all ratios the same... its good for lasrger battles as i know when my re-inforcments are coming and what they will be