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deus ex machina
02-24-2003, 22:33
Hello all. First post.

Although I tried to ensure that this topic is not repetitive, please forgive if I have overlooked something.

I have been playing MTW lately as the Turks and have working on tactics for defeating the GH. Because the steppes of eastern Europe (western Asia?) offer little in the way of hills, I have been experimenting with different forces mixes that take advantage of tree cover. I have found that axe troops and peasants with high valor, when positioned in trees, do very well against the GH. No doubt, this comes to no surprise, but getting the GH to take the bait and charge into those trees is something else. Hence, my experiments.
First, I start out with a relatively small army - 1/2 archers; 1 spear; and the rest axemen and/or peasants.
Alhtough there is not a right way (or at least I have not found it), positioning a few groups of light foot troops, e.g. archers, with spearmen in the open, behind and to either flank of the main body of tree-covered force usually draws the GH in. At this point, the importance of a small army becomes apparent. The GH, when faced with a small threat, sends its forces piecemeal, with little appreciation of over-whelming force.
Once the GH is engaged, I can either ambush the same GH detachment or wait for a GH unit to notice my forces in the trees and come charging in. If I am luckly, my tree-positioned troops can wipe out or route the GH detachment.
Afterwhich, the GH usually sends another detachment and my forces are promptly wiped-out. But, I usually net a 2:1 kill ratio, even higher at times and can capture a general, who I promptly put to the sword. Moreover, this approach is relatively cheap and produces interesting v&v for surviving generals, e.g. excellent defender, etc.

I believe this is a non-gamey tactic and presents a feasible approach to dealing with the GH.

Comments welcomed and appreciated. (As a note, I have been a long time reader of this board - excellent work). Thanks.

Alrowan
02-25-2003, 02:27
i deploy n the very edge with spears and bows... and make them all hold, and replace the wasted units with freshies...

Gregoshi
02-25-2003, 03:53
Hello deus. Thanks for coming out of the trees and joining us...or are you trying to lure us in???? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/idea.gif

SmokWawelski
04-11-2003, 15:25
You know, I do nto want to sound like not-so-brave player, but since I usually start in the western Europe, I just ally with the horde and let it roam the east. Two games that I started from the east: one I allied with them, one I just pulled back and tried to wear them down over time with similar tactics: always staying in the cover of the forest, althout the eastern europe, western Asia maps might lack them a little...

Aurelius1
04-24-2003, 09:24
That sounds like strategy, smok- nothing else. Have no fear...

Asmodeus
04-24-2003, 10:18
Its a very effective tactic. Playing as the Danes I defended Lithuania about 9 times in a row against about 2-1 odds.

My method was very similar to yours:

Form a wall of Spearmen (or FS/CS if you have them) at the edge of the forest on Hold Position/Formation. Use archers and crossbowmen in front of the Spear wall to skirmish and harrass the enemy cavalry - they will innevitably charge at your archers so get ready to run them into the woods. I used Vikings and Woodsmen as the 'butchers', if the line becomes broken or the spearmen are wavering charge in the butchers out of the forest. They get a bonus for surprise and on the charge they cause shocking casualties, mad axe wielding maniacs http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Axes and swords are the only melee weapons that are effective in forest.

After the first victory he lost so many heavy cavalry that the next battle he stood off and peppered me with arrows without risking melee. I managed to win that one with my archers and crossbowmen who seem more accurate than their mounted enemies.

I now have new tactic, include a couple of catapults safely behind the shield wall. They can fire out of the trees without any problem (dont try this with ballista obviously) and will pound the enemy horse archers who have to remain stationary in order to fire. After about 4 battles my catapults were on valour 5/6 and were so effective they would rout units that werent even in range of the archers, that 'weapon causes fear' bonus should not be overlooked With the valour that high they could even catch horse archers or heavy cavalry on the move It also forces the Mongols to make an attack instead of standing off for an archery duel.

Its very satisfying for your troops to see huge rocks smashing through ranks of cavalry, i swear i can hear them chearing and laughing sometimes http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

P.S. If you use Vikings, keep them on Hold Formation http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

A.Saturnus
04-24-2003, 10:58
If you have halberdiers in the woods, the Horde has no chance to defeat you. You can either slaughter them all coming into the wood or wait untill time-out (what doesn`t really help you since they don`t lose men by that).

Dogmeat
04-24-2003, 11:15
some good tactics there, i'll be sure to take note of them.
For the first time i'm on the front line where the horde appear, so at last i'll know how it feels to have 9 full golden stacks attack your province at the same time http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif
I've thought them before, but only using by sending fleets of troops via the sea and attack their coastal towns and relieving the odd siege against my allies (makes me popular with my allies anyway). But now i'm the Turks, and have pretty much defeated the byzantines and have conquered the north rebel lands. Just waiting for the horde, oh and dealing with the odd crusade, should be fun http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif