Anyone get to Geisha yet?

[Red]

I just finished the 1550 campaign on expert.
I got the gisha house but had no use for it as it came too late in the game. But Gisha cost 1200, I think, I am alittle unsure die to the sticker shock of training time 12or 16 turns. I double check tonight.

[Jaguar]

I love Geisha, they never lose. I can eliminate a R4 general the season before a attack, and rout the enemy in no time cause of the morale penalty. Just pick one province at the start of the game and just concentrate on castle, tea house, and ninja upgrades. Before you know it, especially with the x-pack, you have geishas!

http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Honour to Clan Shades!

[Koga No Goshi]

Am I just really slow?

I've noticed a lot of guys saying stuff like "anyone who knows what they're doing finishes the game before they can even get legendary dojo upgrades anyway..." and stuff along those lines. I almost always get them. I'm never in a HUGE hurry to push on with my army till I feel comfortable, and I enjoy getting all the upgrades. Plus, I really don't know HOW you guys finish in like 10, 20 years. How do you do it? Pump out nonstop yari sam and sam archers and just continuously attack?



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Koga no Goshi

"Nandai"
Since time began
the dead alone know peace.
Life is but melting snow.

[Forward Observer]

Quote Originally posted by Koga No Goshi:
Am I just really slow?

I've noticed a lot of guys saying stuff like "anyone who knows what they're doing finishes the game before they can even get legendary dojo upgrades anyway..." and stuff along those lines. I almost always get them. I'm never in a HUGE hurry to push on with my army till I feel comfortable, and I enjoy getting all the upgrades. Plus, I really don't know HOW you guys finish in like 10, 20 years. How do you do it? Pump out nonstop yari sam and sam archers and just continuously attack?

[/QUOTE]

Your last statement is pretty much how it is done. Use the Nathan Bedford Forrest strategy of "Get there firstest with the mostest"



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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.

[Satake]

I've tried speeding through the campaign too.. But i can't keep an ongoing assault as i need to secure loyalty in each province. How do you work around that , or were you maybe talking about playing as ronin? http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

[barocca]

perhaps a couple of shinobi in captured provinces to help the army maintain order?

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DoragonBarocca of Clan Doragon (http://doragon.cjb.net)

[Dark Phoenix]

Well I have never got a Geisha or even a Citadel. I just go at a steady pace across the map consolidating when needed or when I come to a new clan and need more soldiers. Also I am a lazy prick so I do not build as much as I possiblky could. I only normally get Cav when I am down to 1 clan left or none and just cleaning up the provinces left.

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DoragonPhoenix of the Clan Doragon (http://clandragon2.homestead.com/Dragon01.html)

I am no hero I just like to hit people in the head. :p

[BakaGaijin]

Speed runs are boring. I honestly don't know why anyone does them. You've got this massive, rich game with dozens of units at your disposal and hundreds of provinces to conquer... So you pump out two or three unit types in massive numbers and auto-resolve all of your battles.

Huh? Did I miss something?

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Disappear into the Darkness!!

[This message has been edited by BakaGaijin (edited 08-16-2001).]

[evilc]

i get through it quick cos the AI in the battles is not a challenge, so i know i can attack with only 2/3 the men the AI has.

[hach]

It's wjem the other guys get Geisha first!!
Thats when to shit your pants!!!

Hach

[Laertes]

*chuckle*

It was in the original game, not the expansion, but once I did see Ronin geisha, probably from a highly developed but now extinct clan. Now that's a disturbing sight...

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He is justly served; It is a poison temper'd by himself.

[Maltz]

*cough cough*

In reality your enemy won't give you the time to sit and develop. You gotta strike them down as fast as you can! woohoo!

[Forward Observer]

Quote Originally posted by BakaGaijin:
Speed runs are boring. I honestly don't know why anyone does them. You've got this massive, rich game with dozens of units at your disposal and hundreds of provinces to conquer... So you pump out two or three unit types in massive numbers and auto-resolve all of your battles.

Huh? Did I miss something?

[/QUOTE]

Yes. You did. After playing all the clans through on easy, then normal, then hard, then
expert, I started playing for speed as a personal challenge. What I mean by speed, is to try to conquer Japan in the least number of years possible. Guess what? No more horde. It doesn't have time to form.

I know that for a lot of players, getting wrapped up in the minutia of the game is very immersive, and there is nothing wrong with that. I just happen to be a Georgie Patton fan, so that is how I started to play.

I also do not use auto resolve. It is too random and unforgiving, unless it is the very end and I have become the horde. I once had a single man beseiged. I attacked with 180 on auto-resolve. I won but lost 80 plus men.

On all but the split clans, you can successfully attack on the first move, and in the case of Hojo, you can eliminate the
Useugi on the first move. I particularly like the small army battles that you fight early in the game. Playing very offensively
preserves those small army battles for a longer part of the campaign.

Cheers


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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.

[BakaGaijin]

Playing offensively is different from playing a speed run, though.

I suppose I see the challenge, but if the AI is so damned easy, why don't you just go online and play against humans? Isn't that why multiplayer exists?

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Disappear into the Darkness!!

[Forward Observer]

Quote Originally posted by BakaGaijin:
Playing offensively is different from playing a speed run, though.

I suppose I see the challenge, but if the AI is so damned easy, why don't you just go online and play against humans? Isn't that why multiplayer exists?

[/QUOTE]

Agreed. While speed and offensive play are not exactly the same, you have to play offensively to achieve and maintain the speed.

To your qestion about on line play; it is a just a personal preference with me. I am sure on-line play is great for many, but it does not appeal to me personally. The
A.I. may not always be the sharpest knife in the drawer, but it is usually consistant, and its honesty and honor is always above reproach. Haha!

Cheers!


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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.

[Thomas Ressler]

Geishas Rock! I love 'em! I would never even DREAM of trying to run a campaign now without them!

Of course, my first encounter with them was as the victim... and what near-panic I felt as I watched them decimate my generals, and bring my campaign effors to a ruinous end!

I've found it takes a careful balance of resources and a maintenance of other critical military capabilities in other provinces to succeed. Once I have a handful of them trained, though... it's OVER!

[NOLA_Jay]

Love them I've got to them in 2, so far on MI games. Had to lose my original game I got to them, due to a recuring freeze with a saved game. The damage they can do can often keep your clan alive. I was under massive attack by 4 clans, my troops were spread, and by using the Geisha I managed to hold on to my territory, and eventually turn the tide in my favor. They work great for when a clan you destroyed reapears, lets you take out the resurfaced clan's daimyo, and eliminate it before it can become a major threat. Then you are just left with a few ronin, wich are often easy to mop up. would rather deal with ronin than with a resurfaced clan anyday.
They also work great to help train ninjas.
I would use a geisha to kill a general in an army then the next turn I would use a ninja to kill the replacement general. Let me up the ninja to a good honor level quick.
I allways try to put my geisha house in a province with a port lets me get them where I need them most real quick.
I love my Kunonichi (Geisha).

[ishikawa2]

One thing not yet mentioned is that if you use the "special forces" to keep an eye on enemy citadels, you can SEE when they even start to build a Geisha House. That gives you plenty of time to plan an assault to eliminate the threat.

With respect to the speed of the campaign, I usually finish the original scenario before Geishas are an issue, and in fact I don't have much experience with muskets, before I'm usually mopping up by the time the Dutch appear. A few shinobi trailing behind the advacing army can usually pacify the newly-conquered provinces, so you don't have to slow down too much.

[Pachinko]

Now you can get the Geshia in about 1545 or so 1550ish?. Thats fast! I tried it. I dont like it. To fast. I was Hard mode..Hojo was 1530.

P.

[Forward Observer]

My original post on speed play was referring to the original STW game, and not the X-pack.
With the new game and the new shortened build times, it is easier to tech up to a Geisha earlier in the game. I just finished my first single player campaign as Shimazu on hard starting at 1560. It took me 36 years to win as opposed to my usual 20 or less in the old version game. Hojo was able to spring 2 geishas on me. The good news is that they seem to have been toned the geisha down slightly in the X-pack, so I was able to get them with ninjas before they did too much damage.

My old blitzkrieg tactics don't seem to work as well with the X-pack. The higher morale factors, and the weird reinforcements feature caught me off guard, and those changes certainly make things more challenging.

Cheers

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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.



[This message has been edited by Forward Observer (edited 08-24-2001).]

[A Nerd]

Geishas take the challenge out. With no good generals you can mop up the opposition. Kind of like the ronin hordes of days of old. They might be better implemented for gaining alliances and making bribes.

[KumaRatta Yamamoto]

Geishas have been toned down a bit in MI, they still never miss butyou can bring down a high honor taisho, a heir or a daimyo,only after you have elevated the geishas honor.

Try it with a H0 Geisha and she will practically never find "a suitable opportunity". Giving you ample time to kill her with ninjas.

Ninjas seem to be more successfull in MI also, did anyone notice the same thing?