Timer on or Off in Single Play?

[Forward Observer]

I thought I already posted this, but either I goofed or it got lost.

Anyway, do you play with the time on or off in single player? In the Old STW, I allways played with it on. I rationalzed that it was the only way to defend against the horde sometimes, and it also gave some balance between gaming, gaming forums, and a personal life. I realize that a timer isn't very realistic, but then feudal Japan didn't have accelerated time or drop down menus either.

With the larger maps in WE it just takes longer to get from one edge to the other, and before the patch, the morale and reinforcement oddities seemed to make battles require more time. My losses simply from runnig out of time seemed to increase with the new WE. Just 10 minutes extra would have reversed several defeats and saved having to make a second go at the province. It also might create a few defeats when defending but I can live with that. The patch may change this some, but I haven't had enough time to form an opinion.

It would be nice if you could adjust the timer like you can in the custom battles.

Any thoughts or comments are welcome.

Cheers.

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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.

[This message has been edited by Forward Observer (edited 10-02-2001).]

[solypsist]

i usually play with it on, but have noticed that the Owari province is probably unique in these traits, when playing SP
1. enemy AI usually will set up within archer range of the westermost bridge (from attacker's starting position). other river provinces, AI stays out of archer range unless missile dueling.
2. AI army will set up for attack and then not move (if timer is off) meaning you either attack them or quit battle (and lose). i did an experiment the last time this happened (the Owari invasion happened after a game save) and time after time the AI wouldn't move. so then I decided to speed up the time, and read a magazine. after twenty realtime minutes of waiting, i quit the battle.

[Nelson]

The clock has always seemed "gamey" and artificial to me. I always turn the timer off so that I can attack as methodically as I choose and enjoy the graphics and music, etc. Besides, sneeking around with BN takes time! Of course this precludes me from getting any "timer" wins also when I defend. As a handicapping device though it can make the game a little tougher so it makes sense to use it when the game becomes too easy. For those who like it, I think that's the reason. So the timer makes a good option.

[Gothmog]

I usually play with timer on. But sometime I turn it off on really large scale battles. And that did cause some problem solypsist mentioned.

It happened a few times when multiple armies attacked me at Shinado. Sometimes one of the AIs would simply station its army on the cliff and decide to sit there for ever. I had to either quit or attack them.


[This message has been edited by Gothmog (edited 10-01-2001).]

[BSM_Skkzarg]

On - simply because of the "attacker camp" and the fact that battles in the age we are dealing with were not infinite in time. The idea of the clock is to simulate roughly a day long period. While battles often took days to play out - there was usually a single "main day skirmish" that decided the outcome. This is what is simulated in the timer - the main battle. Only time I do not use the timer is the rare Easy level game - only to see how large a kill ratio I can get against huge armies.

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BSM_Skkzarg
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."

[Shoko]

Timer off,take ur time and try different methods or attack and so on http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

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Shoko Emperor
Die by the Sword
http://hatamotokill.homestead.com/files/Skeleton3.gif

[Anssi Hakkinen]

On, always on, for the reasons mentioned above. I rarely find myself in attacker-camper situations (principally because I'm usually so aggressive that nobody gets to attack me http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif), and it adds that touch of challenge.

Plus, it deters me from ever attacking in winter, as is realistic. (Although once I had to, to prevent a MHC group from rampaging through my rear areas... And that turned into a disaster, because I had to simply select all forces and attack the enemy in a mad charge to finish the battle before the timer ran out. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/mad.gif )

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"Feeling deeply the difference between oneself and others, bearing ill will and falling out with people – these things come from a heart that lacks compassion. If one wraps up everything with a heart of compassion, there will be no coming into conflict with people."
- Yamamoto Tsunetomo: Hagakure

[celtiberoijontychi]

both options are equally hard (or easy)to play.
timer on is better for the defender, timer off is better for the attacker. Since you play roughly as many games as attacker than as defender, it really doesn't matter what setting you choose, except for timer off allows a human defender to massacre ai and the reinforcements, while timer on will allow the ai reinforcements to survive the battle.


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Gloria y honor al Clan Celtiberos
Glory and Honour to Clan Celtiberos

[Whitey]

Timer off, its not as though battles would be lost because it took too long (all things being equal) even if you have destroyed the opponents army...it is too annoying for me.

[Hosakawa Tito]

I play with the timer off.I hate losing a battle that I'm winning because time runs out.I also don't like having to rush uphill and take a lot of unnecessary casualties because there isn't "time" to go the long way and flank the enemy.To win on defense by running out the clock is a very cheap win in my opinion.I think you become a better player by not using the clock and relying on tactics instead of a stop watch. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Diplomacy is the art of telling someone to go to hell so that they look forward to making the trip.

[Maltz]

Honestly I've never turned the timer and all other default settings off. In my deep, evil feelings I regard turning disadvantageous factors off not very self-rewarding... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif

[Papewaio]

Timer On.

1) It makes a palable difference between Summer and Winter... strategy becomes more important.
2) Fatigue becomes a issue. You can't just wander around the battlefield you may actually have to charge opponents uphill.
3) It diminshes the fantasy units like Kensai and BN. They can't take out massive armies as they don't have the time to do it.
4) It is fast and furious not a game of checkers were you get to set up your pieces... makes defending a true advantage.
5) Yes its frustrating when a single unit runs and hides... but even the romans performed guerrilla warfare ... this is when you need truly superior numbers to hold onto a province not just enough to win a battle head on.
6) Without timer on, the limited view isn't really a hinderance... as you have plenty of time to see where your opponents are and can setup, you don't end up rushing to a hill to get a tactical advantage or run into a monkey ambush as you carefully explore the map.
7) You can play tag the daimyo with timer off, rush him forward or another high honour mobile troop. Position all your troops in a nice position. Get the enemies to follow said Daimyo back into your ambush position... repeat and rinise.
8) Given enough time most people can set up an attack that will win. What a timer does is gives you less leeway for mistakes...
"Oh no! I didn't bring enough guys to hunt down those pesky NoDs hiding in the forests!",
"doh!, that tactics no good I didn't see those guys hiding with limited view I'll repostion my forces, argh timer is halfway through I'd better attack now"
I think it separates the novices from the experts... unfortunately I tend to find myself in bad tactical situations and chasing rogue ashi in knee deep snow as the sunsets http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gifhmmm...

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Victory first, Battle last.

[clink]

Allways with the timer off. Imagine in real life if an emisary was sent to Khan,telling him he had a certain amount of time to do the battle. What kind of response would you get?..laugh probibly.
I just don't think that in real life this would happen.

[Papewaio]

Yeah Right timer off because it is more authentic!
So the Khan could in real life stop the sunset or did his Mongol Hordes come with nightvision goggles so they could fight all night... I seem to remember he had trouble with the a 'light' breeze ....

Japan is the land of the rising sun hence it is also the land of the setting sun [timer on] and eventually reinforcements from other provinces would intervene... maybe the timer would make more sense if there was more then one battle, with each one resulting in more faituge in your troops [the number of consecutive timed battles could be equal to the generals rank] or the timer could be dependent on both the season and the generals rank [higher rank general representing his ability to coordinate his troops better giving a time bonus... it should be effected by the defenders rank since a great general defending would be hard to pin down]

[Moriboy]

For those who believe "timer off" is more realistic, I beg to differ. Many battles throughout history ended at dusk because of confusion & difficulty to manage troops. I'm a Civil War buff and can name at least half a dozen battles where this was the case in: Shilo (the rebels halt from pressing the routed Union soldiers), Gettysburg, (Anderson's men unable to dislodge the Union troops on Culp's Hill after dark), Chancellorsville (Confederates unable to complete the destruction of Hookers army, not to mention the friendly fire death of their "honor 9, rank 6" general Jackson. The list goes on...

That was my devils advocate reply. I see the point for this game though, and have done it myself on occasion. Even so, I'm almost always outnumbered in SP and find it to my advantage, not to mention more realistic to leave the timer on. The only time I feel like a dirty cheap ho, is when my horribly outnumbered, depleted, wavering, surrounded, totally exhausted troops "win" because the time runs out.

[RedStone]

Timer off, and radar map off - for realism.