Got any info on "The Old Man of the Mountains"?

[Zauba'a]

I'd like to know more about this dude mentioned in the game.
So he smokes a lot of hashish and kills people? Was he real? Any links would be helpful. TY.

[Jemasze Toda]

Hail Zauba'a,

"The old man of the mountain" is a rude translation of the "Sheik al-Djebel", a titel of the syrian leader of the Ismaelitic sect known as "Hashishin" or in the european translation: "Assasins". The Ismaelits were and still are a religious group of muslim people, belonging to the "Shiat Ali" or just Shiat-fraction within Islam.
The Assasins were a very powerful and much feared (both by muslim AND christian Lords and Rulers) fanatic sect, terrorists if you will, who got famous for killing many mighty leaders (for example: Konrad of Montferrat and the famous seljuk vezir Nizam-al Mulk) during the crusaders time. They operated from strong hill-fortresses in Syria and in Persia and managed to survive for almost 200 years. The most famous stronghold of the Assasins was "Alamut", which is located in Persia, near the black sea.
The sect was founded by Hassan ibn-Saba and he was the first to be known, at least in legend, as "Old man of the mountain." Since his time, or so it is said, the sect used Hashish on a grand scale in order to make their members more wilful for their deadly missions. In the gardens of Alamut and its sister-fortresses Hassan and the later "Wise old men" tried to persuade their followers, that they were in possesion of the key to the muslim paradise with its 40 Huris for each single brave man. Hashish seems to have helped building and upholding that nice illusion...
Well, they were successful, weren't they? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
In the 13th century the "Hashishin" were totally destroyed by the Mongols, but in legend they still live

yours Jemasze

[Hakonarson]

Hash was certainly useful - apparently their recruitment method consisted of getting impoverished young men stoned with the promise of a vision of heaven, then when they woke up they'd find themselves surrounded by 72 virgins, plenty of everything, etc.

After a little while they'd be drugged again and wake up to find themselves back on Earth.

After that they couldn't WAIT to die

It has depressing parallels with promises of paradise to moslem martyrs today - especially since both start from a position of poverty and harsh conditions for life (relatively speaking)

[Lord_PH]

perhaps it was the hashishin that was the ansector of our today terrorists groups: not necessarily deriving from its practices, but having the same spirit and legacy...

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/idea.gif

could the hashishin inspired the creation of terrorists groups? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

[Rosacrux]

Not really, "terrorism" is as old as the organized human communities.

Just some people fail to recognize that... oh well http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Tachikaze]

It is a song by Cab Calloway.

[noramis]

All the answers have been the general concensus on his history ... there are several books out that go more in detail.

Konrad of Montferrat was killed by their hand ... and another crusader if I remember correctly.

[spmetla]

The Assasins were the Ninjas of the Middle East. If modern terrorists were like them they'd be assasinating world leaders like Tony Blair, George W. Bush, and Arial Sharon instead of bombing civilian targets and insiting general "terror" into the civilian populace.

[Mega Dux Bob]

Quote[/b] (noramis @ Nov. 18 2003,01:11)]All the answers have been the general concensus on his history ... there are several books out that go more in detail.

Konrad of Montferrat was killed by their hand ... and another crusader if I remember correctly.
They tried to kill Edward I while he was attending mass in Acer, but Edward killed the man with a chair and Edward's wife sucked the poison from Edward's wound.

[Somebody Else]

Quote[/b] (Mega Dux Bob @ Nov. 18 2003,23:21)][quote=noramis,Nov. 18 2003,01:11]Edward killed the man with a chair and Edward's wife sucked the poison from Edward's wound.
Ha With a chair Brilliant. Why have I not heard of this before?

[Orda Khan]

The Hashishin were no glorified freedom fighters. They were no more than terrorists who manipulated others by threat. Unfortunately ( for them ) they made the mistake of threatening the life of Mangku Khan. Hulegu systematically destroyed them in their mountain 'strongholds'

.....Orda

[Leet Eriksson]

good riddance,the mongol did us a favour by wiping these heretics out,they blackmailed,threatened and assasinated alot of leaders for their own interests.

and they made them a unit available to their most hated enemies,the egyptians & turks...i dunno what they are doing in north africa too http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

[Orda Khan]

Quote[/b] (faisal @ Dec. 08 2003,12:35)]good riddance,the mongol did us a favour by wiping these heretics out,they blackmailed,threatened and assasinated alot of leaders for their own interests.

and they made them a unit available to their most hated enemies,the egyptians & turks...i dunno what they are doing in north africa too http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif
Exactly....I could never understand how these units were available to the factions they terrorised http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/dizzy.gif

....Orda

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] ]Quote (faisal @ Dec. 08 2003,12:35)
good riddance,the mongol did us a favour by wiping these heretics out,they blackmailed,threatened and assasinated alot of leaders for their own interests.

and they made them a unit available to their most hated enemies,the egyptians & turks...i dunno what they are doing in north africa too

Exactly....I could never understand how these units were available to the factions they terrorised

....Orda

Agreed. I've modded the game so they aren't trainable by any faction. Only hired as mercenaries. I know it's not an elegant solution, but it seems to aliviate the problem...

Edit:
I said the Hashishin were only hirable, but I've changed my MOD again, to try and correct it further.

Now, they aren't recruitable as mercenaries. They are only trainable by Muslim factions and only in Syria, needing a Great Mosque besides the normal requirements. A bit like Egyptian Nizari.