housecarles and huscarls

[Heraclius]

I was looking at the totalwar.com site's viking invasion page and noticed that two of the new units will be the axe-wielding huscarls and housecarls but I thought these were actually the same thing with a different spelling. Am I wrong or is CA taking a few small liberties with history for the sake of gameplay (which I don't mind that much, I mean come on, axes are just plain awesome).

[Hakonarson]

CA have always taken liberties with history - the vast majority of "differences" between troops are nonsense.

I suspect one will be a Viking unit, the other Anglo-Saxon English.

[Stormer]

hmm i always thought huscarles were cavary http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

[Brother Derfel]

Housecarles, or huscarles as far as i can remeber were the 'house hold' guard of the king or the warlord. They were almost always foot soldiers (as were all troops during the middle ages realy, cavalry was not big in britain till the normans bought them over). I imagine that the Houscarles will be the anglo saxon version, and the huscarls the Viking equivalent. They should be basicaly the same unit/

[BlackWatch McKenna]

Same unit.

House + Carl = House Carls

Then, via some bad pronunciation you get Huscarls (which are really vikings come to fight for the Anglos = House Carls).

Anyways -that's what I picked up from the Viking Sagas book I read. Someone got a better history of them?

~BW

[Tachikaze]

I found the multiple references to huskarls (in various spellings) interesting. For many years, I only knew of the royal guard of Harold the Saxon king at Hastings, usually spelled "House Carls". They were foot soldiers usually depicted with long shields and long axes and swords. However, the Bayeux Tapestry, one of the main sources for information about Hastings, shows the Saxons and Normans essentially with the same equipment. It is more likely that Harold's men had round shields, since they were not horsemen.

It should come as no surprise that there are huskarls all over the North Sea area. All of the cultures of that region (Danes, Saxons, Vikings, etc.) were closely related. Indeed, many of the nobles were literally in the same extended family. The Norwegians at Stamford Bridge and Normans at Hastings were of the same extended family as Harold and Edward the Confessor.

More than any other region in the world, British/Americans seem to like to divide Western Europeans into many small groups, each with a different name. But in the big picture, the distinctions between the cultures, languages, and families of northwestern Europe were minor. Chalk it up to Anglocentrism.

The variations in spelling is a normal part of English history. There was no standardized spelling until very recently (Shakespeare spelled his own surname 15 different ways). Also, all of the Norse/Germanic languages were very close. They had many variations of the same words. Look at the word "king" (könig, caeninge, etc.) for instance.

[Theodoret]

The Norse definately had Huscarls in their armies. There is an account of a armoured viking axeman at the battle of Stamford Bridge holding off a significant portion of Harold's army at a river crossing single handed. After unwisely trying to rush him (cue flying limbs and heads), the Saxons eventually sent a spearman under the bridge to stab him.

The Varangian Guard were effectively mercenary Huscarls recruited from Scandinavia and England, and Harald Hadrada himself fought for the Romans in such a role (as did Harold Godwinson for the Normans). Huscarls were very effective, although Alfred the Great tried to persuade his nobles and their retinues to fight on horseback, suggesting that heavy infantry with axe and shield were already starting to become outdated by the Eighth Century.

Harold's royal guard at Hastings were not the only Huscarls in the Saxon armies, many leading noblemen at this time still fought on foot with their retinues. If Harold's brother had been a little less useless (Harold was not the last Saxon king of England btw), William of Normandy might have met his end at the hands of Huscarls as he marched on London.

[The Wizard]

Huskarls and Housecarles are the same thing... yet 'huskarl' is the Norse word for it and 'housecarle' the Anglosaxon word for it.

In the Norse culture, if you were a 'karl', you were a free man, a peasant, who owed allegiance to a local noble, a jarl. When called to war, they would make up the bulk of the army. My guess is since a lot of Norse were called Karl, the called the class of people 'karls' http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

Huskarls were the professional bodyguard of a Norse (or Saxon) king, prince, or even jarl (or noble, if we're talking Saxons). They were the 'karls of the house', hence huskarls or housecarles. =)