Most effective Vikings strategy?

[eXistenZi]

I find it really hard to play the Vikings in VI...does anyone have any good strategies for them?

[terryblack825]

I have seen people post that raiding the southern provinces is the best way to start your campaign.

[eXistenZi]

Quote[/b] (terryblack825 @ May 11 2003,21:23)]I have seen people post that raiding the southern provinces is the best way to start your campaign.
OK But exactly how do you raid? Should I just take over a province and then abandon it or what?

[Dimeola]

Vikings seem to get most income from raids, not like S Englansd`s rich farmlands. There is one island to the NW, I take that first. Then Move south to the next island. I keep the N one. If the rebellion on the S one is huge I leave. Look down the W coast for lightly held provinces and rebel held provinces. Take them and leave. Would put 360 warriors into taking a province and the rebellion next turn gives them up to 2000 warriors. The cost of that victory could be too much. You want to build a warchest without losing too many men. Ireland is rich booty the first time.
But be aware that after several raids the coastal provinces will start building larger armies. So head south to the Saxons.
There will come a time when you want to hold real estate. Be sure to put in a large army and have reinforcements for them. And you can draw their armies in one direction then invade behind them.
Dimeolas

[insolent1]

Build trade posts in jutland & norway & have ships in all teh seazones with ports. You can make nearly 3000 from just these 2 provinces, this will enable u to have 2 nice small elite armies & keep teching up. Don't bother with farmin it takes to long to get up & runnin & ain't worth it. To make max money from raids make sure u assault the keep/fort as you get more money from doing this then just attackin the province.

[Kristaps]

Raid provinces with Abbeys in them: raids on abbeys apper to be much more profitable than raids on provinces without them. On another note: as Vikings you do not need a 'huge' army. A few units of huscarles (jomsvikings once you can build them) and a few more berserkers + one unit of horse raiders to chase down archers is all you need to beat most armies vikings face even if outnumbered 10 to 1... Frequently it will be your three to four beserker units that will rout huge armies single handedly...

[Bob the Insane]

Quote[/b] (Kristaps @ May 12 2003,08:14)]Raid provinces with Abbeys in them: raids on abbeys apper to be much more profitable than raids on provinces without them. On another note: as Vikings you do not need a 'huge' army. A few units of huscarles (jomsvikings once you can build them) and a few more berserkers + one unit of horse raiders to chase down archers is all you need to beat most armies vikings face even if outnumbered 10 to 1... Frequently it will be your three to four beserker units that will rout huge armies single handedly...
Quite true...

Playing as the viking you are economicly challanged, effective you can't make enough money to fund yourself... I got a good game going by raiding the entire east coast until I had about 20,000 florins in the bank and a big fleet of ships.. The strength of your soldiers and the mobility provided by your ships are your greatest strength so use them...

Also, don't get a superiority complex.. Yes Huscarles and Beserkers are well hard, but the Thrall are really just spearmen so don't think you are invincible...

[Satyr]

OK I did all that and then started trying to take and hold some territory. The problem is, that once you get to this point, there isn't enough money to be had from continued raiding and you burn all farming to the ground when you take over a province so how in the heck do you get enough money to take over the world?

[Bob the Insane]

Trade, trade like mad... forget the farming lark and trade...

Also try and minimise your costs, underman rear areas (ie only the governor unit) and never has high accumen governors been more important.... You don't need really large armies, concentrate on good troops instead as the are effective even when seriously outnumbered..

But get ships every where, limit your raiding to Rebels and trade...

Pick on one or two factions at once to maintain your trade empire..

But you will still lose money, that why raising a good 20K florins at the start is important...

I'll post a save game for you if you like...

[insolent1]

First off I would make a trade route to the irish sea(once the AI gets the ports built this is a goldmine) I normally leave one ship around the south coast. Then tech Jutland up to trade post. While doing this only build beserkers as they have very low support costs. Once u have a trade post in jutland build one in norway. Dish out the titles to good acumen govenors. You might need to raid once to pay for the trade post but once thats built u will not need to raid until u start building expensive Jomsarmies. In my last game i had made 100k by 880 with only 2 raids & the rest from trade, then i build some small elite(all max upgrades) armies & took over britain.
Dere & the province above it r good for trade so if u don't like the northumbrians take it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Kristaps]

Quote[/b] (Bob the Insane @ May 12 2003,08:37)]Also, don't get a superiority complex.. Yes Huscarles and Beserkers are well hard, but the Thrall are really just spearmen so don't think you are invincible...
Actually, a moderate http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif superiority complex playing as vikings is all right. Forget about thralls: my huscarles, berserkers and jomsvikings (later on) were all I needed to defeat any cavalry I faced... Funny to sit back and watch a group of junkies (berserkers) rout a unit of royal knights http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

On another note: beware that for some reason (design?) vikings are unable to build any horse-breeder upgrades (+ valor to viking raider cavalry) in Norway and Denmark (Jutsland) however they can do so in the conquered territories. I would suggest pacifying the island between ireland and wales and building up a horse breeding operation there as early as possible. This is a good locale for its iron deposits which would allow for armor and weapon upgrades later in the game.

[Kristaps]

Quote[/b] (Mary, Queen of Scots @ May 12 2003,10:01)]OK I did all that and then started trying to take and hold some territory. The problem is, that once you get to this point, there isn't enough money to be had from continued raiding and you burn all farming to the ground when you take over a province so how in the heck do you get enough money to take over the world?
The way I did it was: in year 1 - raid pictish territories in the north including the standalone island in north-east. With the inital troops given you can easily gather 2+ raiding parties ready to rake in some cash in year 1... Every raid on an abbey'ed province gives you around 2-3K raid money... Next, stick to raiding picts (whenever you see an abbey going up) and rebels (you will need the rest of the factions to trade with for some time to build up revenue). And, for Odin's sake, Take the island in the Irish sea (between Ireland and Wales): there you can build upgraded horsebreeders (+2 valor to cavalry) with iron deposit support (+armor and +weapons which you will need for the not-so-stable-in-the-saddle drunken viking raider cavalry). If you need more cash: try to raid Irish (that was my subjective choice since I was planning to take over the Irish provinces anyways) and work your way into Pictish provinces from the north (again, my subjective approach).

Note, that there is cash to be gained from quelling rebellions... In my experience, a couple prince units (huscarles) + a couple berserker units and maybe a unit of carles or two was sufficient to quell rebellions far superior in numbers...

By the way, using this approach (raiding Picts, Rebels, and a bit later also Irish; holding on to the two standalone islands and the Pictish island in the north-west of the british isles; building up trade network from then on) I got a 2000 surplus/year economy about 10-15 years into the game. Supplemented by raids, this was sufficient to build up infrastructure to steam-roll over the unsuspecting Christians of the British Isles...

[Oda Matsu]

The historical Northmen won by establishing a strong base, drawing up an elite force of housecarls and cavalry, then hitting the south hard and in force. They essentially struck at the Saxons after they were already weakened by warfare with a northern (Danish, also Viking) faction.

I would personally build up a good-sized uberstack, hit one of the most choice provinces in the south, then use regular raids in the north to help develop it (call it "harrying"). I'd also keep building up my well-nigh invulnerable home provinces, mainly for troop production. And I'd make (trading) friends with everyone but my chosen targets.

You have naval supremacy, superior troops at the start, and can thus strike at will in force. So long as you keep raiding those provinces you do not choose to hold onto, you will maintain that troop quality superiority. Since you have naval supremacy, you also have a secure rear area for your expanding southern beachhead.

Haven't tried the Vikings yet, but I think I will now.

[Jagger]

The difficulties with the Vikings are neither making money through raids and trade nor winning battles. The difficulty is capturing territory and holding it. At some point, you have to conquer and hold provinces to win the game.

Rebellions are very likely because Vikings are pagan and conquered land is Catholic. So large occupation armies are needed which slows down conquest. It also means it is hard to knock out a faction quickly because the Vikings usually don't have the armies to both conquer and occupy all of a faction provinces simultaneously or within a few turns. Building pagan shrines and having good spies to kill off bishops is important in securing provinces. But regardless, conquered provinces are usually a money drain until stable enough for small occupation armies.

A second difficulty is the inability of Vikings to build abbeys. Often my Vikings will pillage a province after capturing the fort even if I want the province permanently- which means having to build the province back up. However many provinces are not money makers without abbeys. They just become a drain on money until I can use a very small force to hold the province. Spies can be very handy in capturing a fort without battle and thus preserving the infrastructure in place-which can mean a money making province quickly.

The Vikings are a lot of fun raiding but balancing money with occupation and conquest is tough.

[Kristaps]

Quote[/b] (Jagger @ May 12 2003,13:48)]The difficulties with the Vikings are neither making money through raids and trade nor winning battles. The difficulty is capturing territory and holding it. At some point, you have to conquer and hold provinces to win the game.

Rebellions are very likely because Vikings are pagan and conquered land is Catholic. So large occupation armies are needed which slows down conquest. It also means it is hard to knock out a faction quickly because the Vikings usually don't have the armies to both conquer and occupy all of a faction provinces simultaneously or within a few turns. Building pagan shrines and having good spies to kill off bishops is important in securing provinces. But regardless, conquered provinces are usually a money drain until stable enough for small occupation armies.

A second difficulty is the inability of Vikings to build abbeys. Often my Vikings will pillage a province after capturing the fort even if I want the province permanently- which means having to build the province back up. However many provinces are not money makers without abbeys. They just become a drain on money until I can use a very small force to hold the province. Spies can be very handy in capturing a fort without battle and thus preserving the infrastructure in place-which can mean a money making province quickly.

The Vikings are a lot of fun raiding but balancing money with occupation and conquest is tough.
As was said in some other thread: have faith, young ones, have faith http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif As Vikings you DO NOT need a large army to quell rebellions... My rebellion quelling army is usually 2 units of housecarles + 3 units of berserkers. These take down rebel armies numbering in thousands... And once you have been in a province for a couple years and get the shrine going all it needs is a peasant garnison of 100. On another note, I even welcome rebellions: helps to raise the valor of my berserkers http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif) [Note: don't auto-resolve rebellions -- the AI logic would slaughter your outnumbered heroes. However, a human player wouldn't lose the battle and even wouldn't lose too many troops in the process either].

p.s.s. once my 9 star king (housecarles) with one unit of berserkers routed a peasant/spearment assortment numbering more than 2000... they lost like a dozen men in the process...

[The Blind King of Bohemia]

Pick on the picts,irish and northumbrians,that usually works. Destroy everything but keep the mercians or saxons and scots on your side,and then destroy them

[WesW]

Well, I played my first VI game as the VIkings, on Expert, and I had achieved a Minor (2/3's) victory by 820.

I set up a trade network to the north and around to the Irish Sea, while I invaded, and held, the southern rebel provinces, expanding as I could afford to after building up loyalty. I then attacked and knocked out the Mercians. I had taken over about 10 provinces by now, which I then built up to producing Spearmen, Archers or Landsmen, hiring mercs for cavalry and artillery. (I didn't try and make farms) About this time, the other factions came calling with offers to ally, so I was never at war with more than one faction at a time. Oh, and I made a mistake by not knowing what enabled Merchants, so I never got a dime from trade in Jutland.
When I had enough troops, I invaded all the Saxon provinces simultaneously, knocking them out in one turn. After securing 100% loyalty with peasant and thrall occupying troops, I took out the Welsh and Northumbrians the same way. This was when the option to retire popped up, and I took it. I believe I would have had complete domination in about 6 more turns or so.

[Lord of the Isles]

I've found the Vikings to be by far the easiest faction. A couple of points to add the those above:

Trade brings lots of money because of your naval supremacy. Cover the sea provinces in ships and raid. Raiding will put you at war with other factions, so try to choose just one or two of them at a time. Raid a few provinces, either leaving next turn or assaulting their town and then leave. Then, when you've milked the current enemy or enemies, move your ships away from contact with them for a turn or two. That'll end the war, set your relations with them to neutral, and you can move your ships back in and start trading again.

The second point concerns farming. Some have commented on how slow this is and they are right. But if you have the patience to wait the returns on your investment can be great. You might pay 1,500 florins but in the better farming provinces you can get 400-600 extra florins a turn once the improvement is built. And if memory serves the 20% and 40% improvements are even cheaper. So once you've raided enough to build up a decent war chest, choose an area to invade and settle and get those farms built (after watchtowers and shrines for loyalty and religion of course).

[Satyr]

Woooohooooo Thanks for the help. I started a new campaign last night as the Vikings. I am building Huskarls and Berserks and now some cav. The date is 818, and I own 3 additional provinces including my first one on the mainland. I have 17,000 in the bank and am starting to turn a profit. I love the slaughter that almost all battles turn into. Slam your huskarls (led by your king) into the front of the enemy, while your berserkers (who are faster) run around the ends and hit them from behind and your cav charge their archers. If you don't have cav yet, use your berserksers, 12 of those skinny little guys will kill all 60 archers after chasing them across the entire map. Great fun. I will keep raiding and try to take over the pict and northumbrian provinces and then slaughter some more mercians for a game win. I should get some vikingcarls soon and I can't wait. And for the first time since I got MTW, I am enjoying attacking forts. Burn baby burn Great job CA

[BDC]

I killed the Pict king 1st turn and decided to take Scotland/Pictland. Big mistake. Total income = about 200.

[Satyr]

It really, really helps to get peasants building somewhere. They are so cheap (17 florins upkeep) for those 100 units they are the only way to afford garrison forces as the vikings. Also, I don't think it ever pays to build carls and landsmen when you can build berserkers and huskarls pretty quickly. Then get 2 provinces building ships and take over a few provinces with trade goods and make lots of money trading with the factions you are not at war with. I am allied with the Scots and Mercians and occasionally with the Irish and that leaves the Northumbrians and Picts open for take overs and I still have the Saxon provinces to raid if I need more $$$$. The ease with which my troops go thru Bonnachs in Ireland, I am looking forward to taking Ireland over soon too.

[Kristaps]

Quote[/b] (Mary @ Queen of Scots,May 13 2003,12:12)]Also, I don't think it ever pays to build carls and landsmen when you can build berserkers and huskarls pretty quickly.
Hehehe, my solution was to build only berserkers and viking raider cavalry (in an occupied iron deposit island preferrably so i could build horse breeder upgrades unavailable in Scandinavia) until I was able to train Jomsvikings. At least in my game, the viking kings and princes were reproducing at such a healthy rate that I never had to bother building additional housecarles' units... Horray to those Irish female slaves http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif They really did a great job I also used my king's unit in battles extensively (free refills... and the guy just refused to die especially after a few battles against 2000+ peasants/spearmen) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

As to peasants: yes, that was the only unit I used for garrisoning occupied non-border provinces.