English early years stragedy please [Archive]

Mechstra

06-28-2003, 12:59

If you can, bribe the Welsh rebels to your side so that you get some longbowmen to use with your crappy spearmen and feudal men-at-arms. Feudal Sergeants should be incorporated into your battle lineup as soon as possible.

Use hobilars extensively, and Highland Clansmen and Gallowglasses are good infantry in the British Isles. Try to grab Flanders as soon as possible, perhaps by inciting revolt using spies, then attacking the rebel peasants.

Navarre is a good province if you can grab it before the Spanish.

The_Emperor

06-28-2003, 13:25

Attack the French as swiftly and efficiently as you can... Flanders, Champagne and Ile De France must be taken. They are very rich provinces and will serve you well for the long road of conquest ahead. Wait too long and the French will dig in with superior numbers.

Taking Ile de France will pretty much deal a mortal blow to the French as they will have difficulty rasing a good army without it. Providing you can hold on to the lands you already have, you should be in a good strategic position when the war is finally over.

Don't worry about getting excommunicated too much, only the Spanish can launch crusades so early on (so get an Alliance with them ASAP) The HRE, and Aragon should also be made allies, that way you can keep your attention on wiping out the French, and they may help you in some attacks.

Afterwards your free to consolidate your lands, and deal with any independent rebels that may hold Scotland or Ireland.

Then build up a good infrastructure and good armies, and decide who you want to attack first, the HRE or Spain. I sugguest Spain because they will probably wipe out the Aragonese in a few years and excommunicate themselves, allowing for some Crusades to take their lands.

Balamir

06-28-2003, 13:46

Build an army consisting of a lot of hobilars and archers, mounted sergeants can help too . Invade every province of the french that you are neighbours with within 1 turn. that will give you their economical boost if you succeed. You should have no problem after that.

Mechstra

06-28-2003, 13:51

I really can't stress enough the importance of hobilars. They can beat Royal Knights bloody, and are cheap and easy to create. They make good generals, too.

The_Emperor

06-28-2003, 14:09

Hobilars beat Royal Knights? never heard of that before.

Balamir

06-28-2003, 14:18

Quote[/b] ]Hobilars beat Royal Knights? never heard of that before.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif I never saw royal knights getting battered by hobilars either. I suggest you are mixing them with another uniit or something because hobilars are light cavalry, and they cant beat RK, not as far as Im concerned..

Mechstra

06-28-2003, 15:46

Well, I had a hobilar general unit, 4 command stars (which means about 2 valour, no other upgrades), take on and win against the French King's unit of Royal knights. I'm just recounting my experience, and it was possibly a fluke, but there you have it.

Razor1952

06-28-2003, 22:23

Playing almost any faction the formula is quickly grab a few provinces, try for ones with good trade goods, don't worry about building stuff except for trade and loyalty,spend your florins on troops on high number units for staying at home and good attack guys to win your battles.

Playing England your can get most of the French or you can get Wales and get Sweden/Norway. Both have very good trade goods. Build a dominant navy and trade to $$$ then kick the other factions out of europe.

The_Emperor

06-28-2003, 22:39

trade takes time to develop sadly, but farm income is already there and doesn't take too much to develop.

Besides you require a Navy to attack Norway and Sweden, and that takes time to build. I'm talking about Killing the French as soon as is possible... At best you should do it within King William II's lifetime.

Flanders is the Ultimate Gem that the French have, with 3 Exportable Trading goods and a Massive farm income, it is one of the richest in the game. After that I sugguest you move on to attack Ile De France to wipe out the troop production there... and Then it is mopping up time as the French should then have control of Tulouse, Brittany and Champagne that should be isolated provinces, so attack the one with the Royals in it (probably Champagne) and execute all captives.

The French Royal line will crumble and the rest will be rebels who can be very loyal for the right price.

Afterwards when the navy has been built up along with everything else I conquer Ireland, Sweden & Norway... Such rebel provinces can always wait til later. A Faction strategically positioned like the French always has to be eliminated (Much like the how Almohads and the Spanish cannot co-exist in a campaign for very long)

Portuguese Rebel

06-29-2003, 01:23

About the Hobilars and RK issue:

Hobilars

Charge 6
Attack 1
Defense 2
Armour 3
Morale 0

Royal knights (early-gets worse for hobilars latter)

Charge 8
Attack 4
Defense 5
Armour 5
Morale 8

My guess is that, although random things can happen, th RK will munch the Hobilars most of the times and get them running for their mamas (morale 0 really sucks for a 40 guys unit, since the morale penalty seems to be calculated by the percentage of men lost in unit, meaning that a spearmen unit of 100 guys will suffer less morale breakdown for each casualty).

Knight Keimo

06-29-2003, 10:47

Quote[/b] (jbmagic @ June 28 2003,02:44)]
Well, it seems that I´m pretty alone with my own methods.
Here it comes...

First, set taxes as high as you can, and dispand those units on France Thats right, they are good and rich provinces, but let them rebel After you lost them, French will usually take them. And that´s good.

Seems weird? After French unite their country, they usually go to war against HRE, not you.. Especially if you marry with them.

So you are now alone on your little island and next thing to do, is take those rebel Wales and Scotland. Take them by force, dont bribe becouse every florin is needed

When British Isles are conquered, you need only one army to protect borders. Use Highland Clansmen and peasant, they are cheap.

You should build a facilities to produce ships ASAP.
Focus to create ships and when possible, take Sweden And Norway if you want.. That´s it You have now conquer everything what you need for a long time. Garrisons are needed both Wessex and Sweden, but try to keep maintenance cost´s low.

Build more and more ships and develop trading. There are very good trade provinces like Sweden, Northrumbia (?), wessex and Ireland. Eveyone of these can make allmost 2000 Florins per turn, Sweden even more. Its not difficult to make 10 000 Florins income with only merchants if you get your ships to mediterrania..

I dont see a big difference are you playing Easy or Expert settings, just follow my ordes and everything will go just fine...

Wow, my first post Great..
I really feel that I´m something now...

(I´m sorry, english isn´t my first language.
But try to understand)

Big King Sanctaphrax

06-29-2003, 11:04

Welcome to the .Org, Knight Keimo http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

Knight Keimo

06-29-2003, 11:26

Quote[/b] (Big King Sanctaphrax @ June 29 2003,05:04)]Welcome to the .Org, Knight Keimo http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif
Thanks a lot
I have been dreaming about this for a long time.. Long time.. The First Time is allways exiting.. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

Balamir

06-29-2003, 15:14

Hey Keimo Nice to see you with us http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

BTW a bit off topic but I xperimented with the unit guide on the Berserk Unit Guide (http://shogun.cafe24.com/medieval/) and a valour 3 wep0 arm0 charging hobilar can beat a val0wep0arm0 royal knight on early period. So it can be done, I'd say.

frogbeastegg

06-29-2003, 16:04

Nice sig Big King, I was going to do the dueling smilies. Oh well first come and all that. At least it looks good. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

On topic: this disscussion about the hobiliars is really interesting, I must try it out some time. In my games the Catholics build armies of royal knights so using higher valour hobilars as counters could really add some new tactics to the game.

Big King Sanctaphrax

06-29-2003, 17:31

Quote[/b] (frogbeastegg @ June 29 2003,16:04)]Nice sig Big King, I was going to do the dueling smilies. Oh well first come and all that. At least it looks good. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

On topic: this disscussion about the hobiliars is really interesting, I must try it out some time. In my games the Catholics build armies of royal knights so using higher valour hobilars as counters could really add some new tactics to the game.
Sorry about that. I can get another if you want.

frogbeastegg

06-29-2003, 18:23

It's ok you can keep it Big King http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pat.gif . I wasn't sure whether to use it or not and you did post it before me, even if I mentioned it a couple of days ago.

I just need to think of something to replace my rather lame current sig. I saw another star wars smiley duel in a sig several years ago. It featured the Empire Strikes Back duel with Luke's hand being cut off and Darth Vader holding up a sign with 'father' on it. I preferred it to the Return of the Jedi one you've got. Unfortunately I can't find that one. Oh well, back to the old drawing board.

On topic: You weren't kidding about high valour hobilars They turn into 'knights' at valour 3 but without the expensive buildup and support. This really boosts my English/early strats.

Lord_PH

06-30-2003, 00:18

greetings all

just watch out for the many, many rebellions in scotland and ireland. each rebellion gets bigger and bigger, so i suggest a garrison, a fort (at least), churches and low taxes in scotland. the highland clansmen will serve you very well...as well as the gallowglasses http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

seems that everyone agrees with one stratergy: defeat the french immediately (or very, very soon)

hobliars are good, but, not up against RKs. excellent at running down routers http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

have fun

Razor1952

06-30-2003, 02:09

Another thing a bit cheesy is to try to get someone to invade your home provinces then hope you will get a loyalist revolt with free troops often good quality, works in this scenario as well as others, and often these good troops early on will mean your success in defeating 2 rival factions within the first 20 years

(Just succeeded with Egyptians/Byzs as Turks-- got 3 units of Saracen infantry early on by loyalist revolt)

Gregoshi

06-30-2003, 04:32

Welcome aboard Knight Keimo. Very nice first post. Is the France vs HRE outcome a certain thing in your strategy? How did you discover this? By accident or on purpose?

Knight Keimo

06-30-2003, 09:28

Quote[/b] (Gregoshi @ June 29 2003,22:32)]Is the France vs HRE outcome a certain thing in your strategy? How did you discover this? By accident or on purpose?
I found it out by accidentally, but sure, the strategy is the reason of that..

First reason why I let those provinces rebel, was that they just didn´t suit for me.. At early game I focus everything to create a good economy and infrastucture. These provinces are too vulnerable and risky at middle of France. Most of the time I´m playing at Expert, and can´t afford much to the garrisons maintenance cost´s. It´s so much easier to stay on you own island and use that 4000 Florins to build trade routes.

At beginning, peace is all I want. Let the big boys fight..

Mechstra

06-30-2003, 09:55

See, I wasn't talking out of my arse about the hobilars. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif When you use them in a general unit, and get them up to valour 9, they really prod buttock.

Balamir

06-30-2003, 10:42

Even peasants with valour 9 can kick arse, so I think your description should be altered --> hobilars at 9 val kick RKs but regulars cant.

And to add, I leave the rebels on their own in the beginning, I garrison a unit of 15-20 soldiers (a full unit that took casualties during a battle would do it) so if they ever try to invade me from scotland, I will retreat to fort and it will say this fort will not fall without a direct assault . Thats just for security.

What I do with the rebels is after I took over france I bribe them from that huge income of flanders and ile de france, and there you go, a decent army.

If you want to set up a good economy, the fastest way is to put %60 farming on flanders, %40 on ile de france and the rest that are very fertile, I dont remember the names. That will easily give you a nice income that you can spend on anything you want. If you find that insufficient, then you can do the trading strategy.

The_Emperor

06-30-2003, 13:21

In my latest Almohad Game the French have suddenly turned into a major power, the English were pushed back into their island and then the French invaded Wessex after reuiniting France...

Last Night they made the HRE theirs and wiped them off the map (and they didn't get Excommunicated doing it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif).

Just goes to show that giving the French breathing space might make matters a lot worse for you

Balamir

06-30-2003, 13:52

Mostly in all of my campaigns, I stated, that french beated english. french are dangerous because they are rich enough to field a tremendous army.

And the excommunicating thing, I had a problem:

I had a castle in toulose as the english. I had 60 men in the province. The aragonese invades toulose. I retreat to my castle and say hehe you bastard retreat in three turns or you'll be excommunicated and eat my crusades.

So on the first turn I assume the pope gave them the warning thing, they still stayed. The next turn, yet again, they didnt move. and the turn that you are meant to be excommunicated, they still stayed and nothing happened http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif After I got over the rage era, I pressed end turn, and yet again they didnt get excommunicated http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/angry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pissed.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pissed.gif

jbmagic

06-30-2003, 17:05

good tips so far playing the english early years campaign

i see most peopel are saying to take out french as soon as possible.....do u mean use my starting units i get at wessex and attack flanders right away...or do i build an army first before i take the french out?

also who should i allie with? and which countries i should denied to allie.....i am not clear on this and why.

thanks

Knight Keimo

06-30-2003, 17:13

Quote[/b] (The_Emperor @ June 30 2003,07:21)]Just goes to show that giving the French breathing space might make matters a lot worse for you
Yes, your right.. I´v also seen allmost every time when both France and England are AI controlled, how French swept over english.. But still, I say that Wessex defended by a decent army, is less likely to being attack than one of those three provinces.

Or then I´v just been very, very lucky.. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

I was attacked by French when I kept those provinces, and when I now let them go, I´v not being attack. Simple, but ofcourse it can be just luck. I don´t denied that.

One more thing French and HRE have engaged to hostilities every time, so God only knows what would happen if they don´t. Nothing good, propably..

frogbeastegg

06-30-2003, 17:42

Who to ally with - generally speaking anyone who you aren't attacking at that moment in time Allies are slightly less likely to attack you and can help you in wars against other AI factions. Also your allies won't send crusades at you if you are excommunicated (unless they declare war of course) Of course there are exceptions to this rule, for example if a faction is horribly weak and about to die there is no point in allying with it. Also you can only have an alliance with one of two warring parties so try to ally with the one that poses the most threat to you. It is more important to ally with factions that are close to you than ones on the other side of the map because it is unlikely that those along way away will attack you.

bighairyman

07-03-2003, 02:37

bribe welish and scots land. in northundia or something, built the cheapest ship you can and built a trading building and sent ships to russia. u can make some real money there. trade w/ denmark, sweden, norway ect.....

built highlanders in scotland and longbowmen, wait, that's not possible in early. just built highlanders and sent some to weesex to repel possible french attacks. if norway and sweden hasn't been conquer by the Danes yet. invade with highlanders. then built spearmen in all ur provinces in france. just a couple in every province.
trade more for more money, tech up, built CMMAs and some fedule knights, and invade france. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif