View Full Version : Birds and concealed units
Sir Chauncy
11-23-2001, 00:51
Is it just me or do bird s seem to flap around the trees where concealed units hide? I may be totally wrong but there seem to be a lot of bird flapping about around one particular clump of trees so I sent some people over to investigate and WHAM! a whole lot over warrior monks suddenly appear, not happy that I had ruined ther game of hide and seek and ran over quite a few men. Am I being paranoid here or are those little flappy fellows useful?
Catiline
11-23-2001, 01:34
Yep, birds usually mean men when they're over trees, in the original demo this was mentioned in one of the tutorials.
The demo music was better too. i still play it for that alone on occaision
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Oderint dum metuant
Hosakawa Tito
11-23-2001, 01:39
I don't remember if the WE manual mentioned it, but the STW manual did. Very useful info and can save you a lot of marching around searching for the enemy. Realize that it can work against you too.
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Diplomacy is the art of telling someone to go to hell so that they look forward to making the trip.
BSM_Skkzarg
11-23-2001, 05:23
If you get your men placed quickly, the birds sometimes move on or disperse (or land?) and then your set - until you move again.
Conceal early - and don't move unless you HAVE to!
Qapla!
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BSM_Skkzarg
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."
Catiline
11-23-2001, 06:36
Do klingons agree with hiding in the bushes?
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Oderint dum metuant
I often use this to find the enemy on a large forested map. It usually works aswell.
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Fight first, then scream 'Doh, why did I forget my Kensi!'
Yeah they took this one straight out of Sun Tzu. He talks about this phenomenon specifically.
Matt
BSM_Skkzarg
11-23-2001, 11:48
Catiline,
Hiding in bushes?? Well... we Klingons honor battle, and while we are a fierce warrior race, we do utilize the versatile cloaking device. Being honorable warriors does not mean you must always look your opponent in the eye before you sink your Dak'tah into his heart. The proper use of stealth is in and of itself an honorable art provided one uses it only for a tactical advantage.
A true Klingon understands that the use of stealth, be it in woods or in space, is to be used only to outmaneuver the enemy. Should a Klingon be faced by an overwhelming force, the warrior shall not seek to hide, but rather will stride boldly forward into battle, knowing he will soon pass into the honored halls of Sto'Vo'Kor. This is the way of Kahless the Unforgettable.
The three perfectly balanced blades of the symbol of the Empire:
Duty - Loyalty - Honor
Sharpen these as you would the blade of your Bat'leth, and your service to the Empire will be glorious!
Qapla!
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BSM_Skkzarg
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."
Jeez u're such a nerd BSM.. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Matt
Gaxebo-sama
11-23-2001, 17:19
So,
Will battle field ninja can also be detected, when they are hiding in the wood ? Will the birds will be the same indicator ?
The war bird can be used to sneak from behind but I don't believe it would be usefull tactics againts a romulan.
Catiline
11-23-2001, 21:23
Time to rename this thread 'warp signatures and concealed units' it seems.
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Oderint dum metuant
BSM_Skkzarg
11-24-2001, 02:24
Gaxebo-sama,
An IKV B'rel class (the infamous Bird of Prey or BoP) is perhaps the most "famous" Klingon cloaker. However, every class of warship in the Empire is equipped with a cloaking device, except for the single "qeylIS betleH" class vessels. These -the dreaded Sword of Kahless Battleships, are too large to maintain a stable cloak using current Klingon technology.
Everything from the escort class (BoP) to the massive "pumwI" class Dreadnaughts can cloak. Given the power of some of these ships, the question of the cloak's tactical advantage againt the dishonorable Romulan Star Empire is answered obviously. While the Romulans also employ a cloak, their heavy weaponry (Plasma Torpedo's in three seperate sizes) is nearly useless against a cloakable vessel. This makes Klingon ships superior to those on the Star Empire, as we have proven in recent wars. Not to mention, the damage of plasma torpedo's, while heavy, cannot compare to the destruction that our heavy ships can dish out. The Accuser class AMFP and the Emperor class's Dual FMPA weapons are much more deadly than Plasma torpedo's.
The largest danger to Klingon ships tend to be from non-escort class Tholian vessels, as they all pack the dreaded Tholian web, which renders you unable to move or fire for a brief time. Combined with the extremely tough hulls on Tholian vessels, the non-carbon life forms are the foes who bring the greatest challenge to the battlefield.
If you doubt the veracity of my tactical analysis, I challenge you to investigate a program called Klingon Academy, which will allow you to test various classes of ships for each of the major empires. Klingon, Romulan, Federation, Gorn, Tholian and Shakurian. You will find that at nearly every class (Escort, Battle Frigate, Destroyer, Light Cruiser, Cruiser, Command (Heavy) Cruiser, BattleCruiser, Dreadnaught and Battleship) the Klingon vessel is superior to its counterpart. Their are a few exceptions - but overall Klingon Vessels are superior.
Qapla!
General Skkzarg
BSM Command Staff
Commanding, BSM Chaotic
aka
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BSM_Skkzarg
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."
BSM_Skkzarg
11-24-2001, 02:32
Khan7 (Matt),
Ya.. I know. I am a nerd LOL. But that's ok. I figure being married with 4 kids gives me a good excuse to get a little wrapped up in something different. My Klingon online persona has been around for 3+ years - I figure it keeps me sane! ROFL.
And no... I don't wear pointy ears, have a Klingon outfit or go to conventions for those of you with the question on your minds LOL!
Qapla!
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BSM_Skkzarg
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."
It's just occured to me to ask:
'Qapla'?
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Fight first, then scream 'Doh, why did I forget my Kensi!'
BSM_Skkzarg
11-25-2001, 03:37
Qapla - Klingon for "Success" - usually in reference to combat.
The traditional parting between two warriors.
Qapla!
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BSM_Skkzarg
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."
Thx. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
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Fight first, then scream 'Doh, why did I forget my Kensi!'
Yoshitsune
11-26-2001, 01:17
Birds flapping around a concealed unit also has a famous historical reference. During the 11th Century, Minamoto Yoshiie fought against the Kiyowara in the 'Later Three Years War':
'On the way to invest Kanezawa fortress, Yoshiie observed a flock of wild geese rising in disordered flight from a distant forest. He at once concluded, correctly, that an ambush had been laid. What is significant in this incident is that the rule that the rising of birds indicated an ambush was one that Yoshiie had learnt from an ancient Chinese manual on the art of war...'
'Samurai: A Military History' - Stephen Turnbull
Pretty cool feature of the game I think which enables the skillful player to observe and act on what he/she sees.
NB The 'Gosannem Kassen Emaki' picture scroll shows that Yoshiie adopted a 'geese in flight' emblem to commemorate this event. He had them painted on his camp-curtains.
Muneyoshi
11-26-2001, 20:03
Ya know whats sad abotu all the stuff BSM just said is that...I understad every part of it http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
Quote Originally posted by BSM_Skkzarg:
Khan7 (Matt),
Ya.. I know. I am a nerd LOL. But that's ok. I figure being married with 4 kids gives me a good excuse to get a little wrapped up in something different. My Klingon online persona has been around for 3+ years - I figure it keeps me sane! ROFL.
And no... I don't wear pointy ears, have a Klingon outfit or go to conventions for those of you with the question on your minds LOL!
Qapla!
[/QUOTE]
GAH! You beat me to the convention question! ROFLMAO!
Yes those birds are very helpful!
Once I learned of there ability to identify the whereabouts of hidden enemy units I have been able to take advatage and save my armys' unnecessary searching around the map (wasting time and inrerasing fatigue). It has also been helpful to negate the affects of an ambush, by approaching from a direction where the ambush can be turned against them.
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