Latest Reply form Activision re: 56 year VI bug

[Frankymole]

Latest responses from the Activision forum/customer care:

Customer - 07/06/2003 07:49 AM
Kings die at 56.

No matter what the faction, faction leaders inevitably die at the age of 56, without exception. This is a problem if they have not fathered an heir by the age of 39 - some of the A.I. factions have lapsed into rebellions this way.

Is there going to be a fix for this?

Response (Raymond Wong) - 07/06/2003 07:54 AM
Hi,

Thanks for contacting Activision Customer Support. I am sorry to hear you are having problems with Medieval: Total War - Viking Invasion.

We are aware of this issue and looking into it. Currently, there is no way to prevent this from happening.

--
Q:The bug that kills all Kings at age 56 is making the game unplayable. Other factions are simply unable to compete and keep dissolving into civil war. Can you please give an idea when a patch, even a small interim one, can be released?

Response (Christopher O'Neill) - 07/11/2003 12:46 PM
Hi,

Thanks for contacting Customer Support. I'm sorry you are having a gameplay issue with Medieval: Total War - Viking Invasion expansion.

I suggest that you download the latest patch for Medieval: Total War if you have not already done so. You can get that here:

/activision.custhelp.com/...atches.php

Unfortunately, we do not know what will be included in future versions of the game.

I suggest that you take any suggestions to the forums on www.totalwar.com .

NB it is not advisable to load the v.1 MTW patch over VI -- the advice given above contradicts advice given elsewhere by Activision.

[Frankymole]

N.B. I did try to post this in the Game-Related main hall thread that was talking about the patch. I thought the Activision advice might be useful. However it seems because I am a newbie that I am not permitted to place it in the correct thread. Apologies to all

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

I posted this in the main hall topic for you mate. Welcome to the .Org, by the way. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

[Lehesu]

This is the correct forum. The Entrance Hall encapsulates all of the other forums in one, for guests. Ask a moderator to move this thread to the main hall, and I am sure you will get a reply.

[Odinn]

Why don't they just make a patch???
I am definately not going to buy Rome when the producers/developers don't give a s**t about the consumers.

[ShadesPanther]

hmmm does it seem a bit......scripted?
or Else they have employed the BT people http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

[Kongamato]

You think you're mad about the 56-year bug

Think about the Kings CA is going to need to deploy Blade Runner units to stop them from attacking their offices

I want more life, F****rs


http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[Monk]

Quote[/b] (Kongamato @ July 13 2003,20:24)]You think you're mad about the 56-year bug

Think about the Kings CA is going to need to deploy Blade Runner units to stop them from attacking their offices

I want more life, F****rs


http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif good one

[Gregoshi]

Welcome aboard Frankymole. Your type of correspondence with CA/Activision is all the rage (double meaning intended) at the moment. Unfortunately both replies sound very much like canned responses:

We are very sorry you are having problems with the (insert problem description here) in MTW VI. We recommend you download the latest patch...

I know at least one patron who received what read like a reply composed by a real person. Which makes the replies you got really sound lame. That is just bad, impersonal support. Alas, it is almost everywhere you go.

[JohnCee]

Quote[/b] (Kongamato @ July 13 2003,19:24)]You think you're mad about the 56-year bug

Think about the Kings CA is going to need to deploy Blade Runner units to stop them from attacking their offices

I want more life, F****rs
Logan's Run: Total War

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/idea.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[Shahed]

Well thanks for posting those replies. Basically they are telling you to piss off in a very polite manner, just as expected no less.

Regardless your initiative is one we should all take. They really should be getting more emails from us.

[Frankymole]

Big King Sanctaphrax and Lehesu, thank you very much for the welcome and letting my post into the Main Hall. It's very nice to be here - despite one annoying bug, I'm still veyr much a M:TW afficionado.

SeljukSinan, I agree. I figure if you don't ask, you don't get. The more polite complaints they get, the more ammunition for our case for a patch. If they get enough, it'll be hard to ignore (I hope they're hearing the people who have said they won't buy Rome TW unless this is fixed). Sometimes commercial companies listen to their customers... sometimes

[Frankymole]

I like the theory proposed in Main Hall that the new generals die feature is to blame. Basic premise is that a chance has been incorporated from the age of 55, an increasing percentage probability that a general will die. For some reason, Kings have also been given that algorithm and the chance is 100%.

It sounds feasible - someone should tell CA and Activision At least then they'd know where to start on a quick fix. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Doug-Thompson]

Look at it this way --

The 56 bug should guarentee another patch.

[Celtlan]

Im going to give this method a try to try to get something done. It may be small potaoes but if lots of people did it it could pay for the time to be spent on fixing it.

I dont have MTW or IV yet Id like to buy them. I like STW which I do have but im glad that TW was taken away from EA as they are so awful with all the games and problems etc.
Id like to give Activision 3 crisp £10 notes which are in my hand now.

(waves them at the screen)
(smells them, yep real money)
If you want them fix the game
If you dont then its off to buy some console game that does not have bugs or need patches.

Your choice.
(Bet I know which one they will go for so im researching those console games)

[barocca]

The 56 Bug is hardcoded,
there were complaints that generals lived forever in v1.0 and v1.1, which was classed as unrealistic and also caused some hiccups with the inheritence issue if a faction dies out, princesses married to a general 200 years ago...

for v2.0 CA adjusted the code so a general dies 40 years after taking command,
UNFORTUNATELY no-one considered princes, which the game classes as a general unit,
a prince takes command at age 16, therefore he will die at 56, wether he becomes a king or not,

For replacement generals the default is inheriting daddy's V&V's,
there is a command line switch to force in-experienced replacement
when a general dies -green_generals

At this time it remains uncertain wether a patch will be released for VI.

one point of interest, CA recently employed some new QA testers, i am confident that CA take QA seriously, are not happy about the 56 bug slipping through and future releases will have fewer bugs.

I have despatched, to Activision head office, a few STW Geisha, (the Geisha are assassins in STW),
here's hoping they help the cause...

[Monk]

Quote[/b] (barocca @ July 15 2003,15:33)]I have despatched, to Activision head office, a few STW Geisha, (the Geisha are assassins in STW),
here's hoping they help the cause...
Well, lets hope they fair better than those two ninja i sent last...err yeah i got to go http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif *dashes away*

[Portuguese Rebel]

Quote[/b] ]for v2.0 CA adjusted the code so a general dies 40 years after taking command,
UNFORTUNATELY no-one considered princes, which the game classes as a general unit,
a prince takes command at age 16, therefore he will die at 56, wether he becomes a king or not,

Sounds like severe incompetence to me http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

Also the QA department must have been sleeping all day not to notice this...

[Gregoshi]

Quote[/b] (Portuguese Rebel @ July 15 2003,14:53)]Sounds like severe incompetence to me http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

Also the QA department must have been sleeping all day not to notice this...
Really? I think it is only blatantly obvious because it has been pointed out to us. Until someone noticed this 56 year bug, how many people paid attention to the EXACT age their kings died? I know I don't. At best I know he died in his early/mid/late 50's/60's/70's. Maybe those who take detailed note to write up their campaigns would notice such a thing. I find it hard to believe that with the blazing speed most players seem to play their campaigns, that they'd have time to notice the age of death of their kings.

IMHO severe incompetence is a severely over-harsh description of the CA/Activision QA department.

[Demon of Light]

Quote[/b] (Gregoshi @ July 15 2003,20:48)]how many people paid attention to the EXACT age their kings died? I know I don't.
Of course you wouldn't, Gregoshi. Don't you hold the record for longest incomplete campaign? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Shahed]

Whatever.

CA is reponsible for neglecting it's clients, has proved industrial cash first marketing, and definetly cannot expect customer loyalty in exchange.

EDIT: IMO these are serious lapses in an otherwise good organisation, and it is up to the employees to address these issues intelligently with management, unless they agree with these policies. And indeed we as clients have to address these issues to the company as some have done.

[Old Bald Guy]

I dunno, Gregoshi, it seemed pretty obvious something was going on when three or four kings would die on the same turn. It didn't take me long to figure out what the problem was, and I'm not the most observant person in the world. If they were going to fix it, it would have been fixed, is what I'm thinking.

[Portuguese Rebel]

Quote[/b] ]Really? I think it is only blatantly obvious because it has been pointed out to us. Until someone noticed this 56 year bug, how many people paid attention to the EXACT age their kings died? I know I don't.


Gregoshi, even someone not attentive to his king age would notice the effects in the 2.0 campaing. How many times had you gotten factions wiped out without any king killed in a war. For people who play GA it is pretty obvious since several factions get wiped out and their score reset to 0.

I did not say that CA made a bad game or anything, just that they made a royal mess in the QA department. And the fact that they are searching for new people to work in their QA seems to support this. Also, if you are a programmer and you are coding something like generals deaths, don't you think that the kings, who are generals, might get affected?

They probably overlooked it in the stress to get the game out, but it is still a royal mistake (pun intended).

[Shahed]

Well I may have been critical, but not overly so. If you combine the SP bugs with the MP bugs (which get worse in 2.0 than 1.1) I think some soul seraching is due.

I always loved the TW series, still do. All I would like is just a minimum effort done to fix the things that went wrong.

EDIT:_ I'm not saying off the heads or to the firing squad. But please at least hire the people necessary, train those who need and want to be, give everyone more time, and give us a PATCH, if possible.

[Kraxis]

I have wondered for a long time how it would be if it had been Blizzard that had made TW.

Perhaps not as esthetic, but with 20 patches in three months, and thus 0 bugs of significance.

One can only hope some other company will challenge CA/AV in this genre, forcing them to actually put out patches to keep players.

[Gregoshi]

I'm in total agreement that CA should fix this bug (and others).

My point is the not-so-nice comments tossed at CA's QA department are based on heavy doses of hindsight.

OBG, I'm not sure I understand how 3-4 kings dying on the same turn makes the 56 bug obvious. I had a similar thing happen to me and I think it was a MTW 1.1 campaign.
I've also seen about 5 kings dies in a stretch of 6-7 years. Neither situation has obvious significance by itself unless you are seeing the same exact sequence of kingly deaths after replaying the same campaign a few times.

DoL - you are absolutely correct. It is one of my goals in life to actually complete a MTW campaign. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Jacque Schtrapp]

A new breed has arisen: Behold the armchair developers http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[Portuguese Rebel]

Quote[/b] ]A new breed has arisen: Behold the armchair developers

lol... everybody knows the developers work standing up... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[Teutonic Knight]

yeah...I've been screaming about this for 3 weeks.....

I E-mail Activision just about everyday.... (he he he)

I wait for a patch....

(sorry for short post, I don't have much time)

[The_Emperor]

Check the Main Hall... a patch has been announced http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Captain Fishpants]

Viking Patch (http://www.totalwar.org/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=7;t=8997)

OK then? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

MikeB ~ CA

[Shahed]

That's much better. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

We eagerly await a list of bugs, as pertaining to SP & MP, resolved in this patch.

[Shahed]

I hope the patch is good, then I can revoke my totally painful decision to cancel my pre-order of RTW, and re pre-order it. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif