View Full Version : how does one defeat spanish Jinettes?
Hey all, this being my first post...hello. Now that thats done...I'm the English and I just thoroughly crushed the French, leaving them only Champange, there year is 1141 and the Spanish have invaded Aquitane (b@st%rds) I countered with my FMAA's and Mtd Sergeants..who were crushed by the Jinettes (who ate up enough sgt so that the spanish royal knights clobbered the rest). This has happened twice now. Also my archers are relatively ineffective since the jinettes 'loose form.' it and it takes to much time to eliminate them before they do significant damage to the rest of my army (FMAA or any cav. i have around). So I was wondering if anyone has any (useful) words of wisdom?
DemonArchangel
08-01-2003, 00:48
Two Words
You don't
Demon, you have been spamming a lot, which is fine. However, giving useless advice really isn't helpful. How are Jinettes chewing you up? I, myself, haven't seen them do so much damage that they become a critical target to kill. They do have a short range, however, and if you send light cavalry their way, they tend to run away because they are in skirmish mode. If there are multiple Jinette units, you could try charging one light cavalry group through the flank; you should catch some before the rest flee. They really are just a nuisance; ignore their paltry sting and try to focus on the other units.
Demon of Light
08-01-2003, 01:37
Here's a trick that works sometimes (not always though):
Grab some Royal knights or Feudal Men at arms and target a unit behind the jinites. Sometimes the jinites don't move away in time and get clobbered by the charge. Its almost as though charging the unit behind them makes them believe they aren't in any danger. Only works sometimes though.
DemonArchangel
08-01-2003, 01:57
Lehsu, my advice is legitamate enough, you actually let the jinettes exhaust their ammo on your fodder units, then they're rendered bascially ineffectual by the fact that their melee sucks compared against the rest of your units.
Sjakihata
08-01-2003, 02:53
Your first post WOULD have been valid if you did attach that comment, but you didnt and hence he (I assume) is relativly new you cannot make the assumption that he figure out how to interpret your first post (no offence to thrawn).
The trick described by Demon of Light is good, only works when they are in skirmish mode, and since you not directly attacking them, they dont skirmish.
But that I consider cheating the AI so I dont opt for it.
A lot of archers always work well vs horses and then just spear men or something similar to receive their charge when they ran out of ammo.
The easiest way to take care of them is to have archers nail them as jinettes dont have much armour if any and horses are big targets. Then when they are reduced to 75 percent or less charge them with good cavalry and hopefully there morale will be reduced enough to rout them wich can be advatageous into leading there army into a mass rout
-Isapostolos-
08-01-2003, 09:25
I usually just shoot the light cav down. Figuring that you use normal archers ,since you said that your archers are ineffective against the cav, I suggest that you use either high honour archers or longbowmen. Once you get pavise Arbalesters you should be fine; none of the light cav can hope to win a missile duel vs them.
And dont worry about light cav charging your missile troops, they almost never dare.
Welcome Aboard. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
-If you had only CMAA and MTD SGTS, you would have to trap the jinettes in between your units effectively, so that they cannot skirmish away. It's difficult but possible and actually easier done than said.
-My easiest tactic against any cavalry (SP) is having about 4-6 archers protected by spears and a couple of MTD SGTS. Simply sit tight and let the skirmishers come and try to take out your spears. Once all the archers have a clear shot at the enemy open fire. Use ALL archers in volley fire against ONE unit of cavalry. The Jinettes should not last more than about 10 volleys. Thne target the next unit and repeat. Sometimes the enemy skirmishers may run back and fortth to minimise casualties. In this case fire at them when they approach NOT when they withdraw.
-You can also get them if it's all cav vs all cav army, provided you have better valor than them. Simply put ALL your army in a single line from map edge to map edge, and then CHARGE across the map to the other side. This depends ofc in what the enemy has.
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif
Urban Legend
08-01-2003, 16:38
Having lots of archers are really good against javelin throwers.
RollingWave
08-01-2003, 18:01
Normal archers are pretty ineffective against just about everything except peasents ..... Jinnets as cavs (which stands still pretty often too) are somewhat vunerable if you have enough archers firing from good positions...
However normally the best idea is to have light or heavy calvary chase them down.... they are generally good enough to take on light calvary in melee though (And it's quiet likely their fellow troop will come alone and eat your light cav alive).... that's rather problematic... nothign in this game runs faster than they do (they run just as fast as all the other light cav)... if you don't have decent archers or a overwhelming calvary they become rather problematic when used right (javilins hurts heavy armor troops really badly...)
But since you are defending the situation changes a bit... firing uphill is bad for any range unit espically one that doesn't have much range to began with http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif just wait for them come to you... and you could either take the hits by hiding in a forest and going loose formation or chase them off a bit before hiding back ... then wash them away with the rest of their army in a might downhill charge...
btw: milita sergets and FMAA aren't reknown to be the bravest soliders .... both of them are pron to routing if you aren't careful...
King Creole
08-01-2003, 21:50
I tend to send a small battered unit of Hobilars there way, this way they run (as they are in skirmish(, and keep them off of your core units. then concentrate on the main bulk of his army, as you normally would. once you've broken his army (off of the filed hopefuly) it shouldn't be too long before you chase down, or break the Jinnets by sending literrally the whole of your remaining force towards them.
It is a messy method, and might not be to everyone's tastes, but it works for me every time, when the armies are similar in size, and there is an annoying unit.
hope this heps... if not, then sorry http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif
Mega Dux Bob
08-01-2003, 22:57
Place a mounted sergeant unit behind an archery unit. The Jinettes will get sucked into a missile due and try to close the range to drive back the archers. Once the Jinettes move forward charge them with the sergeants and the Jinettes will not be able to turn around before the sergeants hit them.
DemonArchangel
08-01-2003, 23:53
I just shoot them out of the saddle with crossbows if i'm strapped for time.
Red Harvest
08-02-2003, 04:12
Arbalesters. Mow down annoying units that you can't chase down. They can kill at a range tha the Jinettes won't react to. Crossbows are useless units, too slow to do any good and not enough range. I love facing crossbows.
RollingWave
08-02-2003, 05:34
And what do you do when your facing them in early? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif the English range support is close to the worest in early....
Shadow_Wolf33
08-02-2003, 05:40
a few mods can fix that problem right up...my longbows have a range just shy of a catapult, and are backed up by gothic knights, gothic sergeants and a unit of my own creation that I like to call 'Battlefield Assasins'
When I see jinettes, they pretty much become my senioritas http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif
have you tried flanking them?
they can't run away with troops converging from both sides...especially with their short range...they wont be able to beat a retreat to the sides quick enough to not have at least half the force caught in the run.
HopAlongBunny
08-02-2003, 08:51
Jinettes are annoying http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Sounds like you did what I did in my last English campaign: Wallop the French...Gawd that felt good...Spanish at my door?...Pah Charge
Its a bit of a pain til you rework your army make-up a little. Archers work ok. I like to use what cavalry I have to flank them...wide flankers. If you get behind, string your 20 ponies or whatever you have wide. The inf gets its revenge by herding the jinettes into the path of your returning cavalry. You have to box them. Can be done with all inf...just more trouble than its worth (usuallY)
Sometimes you will not get the opportunity. Then you just have to take your lumps and use the pain to remind you...The Spanish army ain't quite the same as the French... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Just concentrate on breaking the force and watch your flanks
ps yes they do have an unusual number of javelins and some can be pretty high valour http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif
|OCS|Virus
08-02-2003, 09:07
I havn't read all above posts, but to kill spanish janets, no one unit will do it, usualy you have to rush them with your fastest cav available then use your spearmen to take them, they are not easily killed unless you can lure them into close quarters combat. Also swordsmen would probly work, I don't know I havnt realy had to fight spanish to often.
Thrawn could you please tell me what your army was and what the enemy army was, approximately. Please do this ASAP, coz over the week-end I can play it out and post the replay.
Leet Eriksson
08-02-2003, 14:11
basically you get 2 hobilars and trap them,i always have some elements of light cav in the army,they are very useful.
Red Harvest
08-02-2003, 18:18
Quote[/b] (faisal @ Aug. 02 2003,08:11)]basically you get 2 hobilars and trap them,i always have some elements of light cav in the army,they are very useful.
If speaking about early only, then on defense use cav with spears in front. On offense use multiple units of hobilar along with spears. Flanking is the key.
thanks to all for the advice, it has helped. I have had much success with light calvary, specifically hobilars (they are actually good for something...). Also I invaded Leon (only garrisoned with spears and built an army of Jinettes myself...the joy of beating the b*st$rds at their own game http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Yup, kill Jinnette with horses is best. But I have a little trick I want to share:
Don't chase the Jinette around, they are fast enough to get away. You need to send the horses around, and only attack the Jinnettes backward, sending them skirmishing into your troops. Sideway is fine too. The point is, if they turn and try to send jav into your horses, your horses turn tail and run away (Jinnette has very short range). then you can shoot the jinnete some more.
This trick sometimes work even with human players, so with AI, it should work http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
BTW, go to war without horses is quite imprudent. Cav should make at least 1/4 of your army.
Annie
If you really don't have the time to micromanage the elimination of the Jinettes then simply assign a unit or two of light or medium cavalry the task of chasing them all over creation. Either that or buy some mercenary Horse Archers units to keep them honest.
The_Emperor
08-05-2003, 21:42
My advice is, same as has been said above Jinettes are very vulnerable to archers and since they are so fast they tend to be the first enemies within range of yours.
If your having real trouble with them annoying your units, it will take a good ole pincer movement of Light Cav (Hobilars)to crush them. Move two light cav slowly around to the diagonal sides to the rear of the Jinettes, have more waiting in front of the Jinettes with their backs turned (to act as bait to lure them in) then when the Jinettes have crept up behind your Hobilars and your other two are in position have all three units charge the Jinettes...
The Jinettes will try to Skirmish away but be unable to do so and they will certainly Rout with no hope of escape.
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