Tactics for the Irish?

[Prince Lom]

Does anyone have any good tactics for the Irish when fighting against Saxons, Northumbrians, Mercians or Vikings?

I've just started playing the Irish for the first time, and I've done well against other 'celtic' armies, but I think that the non-celts that I mention above look a lot more robust, and so could cause me a lot of headaches.


I'm thinking the following might work, though it will be costly in terms of manpower (lucky then that the Irish units are all so cheap&#33http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif. Bear in mind these are just general ideas.

- Mass charge with Gallowglasses and Bonnachts, with Kerns and Dartmen lobbing javelins into the units tied up in the melees. Meanwhile my Horsemen, Mounted Nobles or Royal Bodyguards have gone around the flanks to make some rear-charges on any 'hot-spots', or attack some archers.

I'm thinking that Huscarles are going to be difficult to deal with though. From experience in using them, I know just how tough these lads are They will hack just about any Irish unit to pieces. Any tips for dealing with them?

[YunDog]

Im playing the irish at the moment, for some part you need to be a bit of a skirmisher - use bonnachts to skirmish and tire the heavyest dudes like Joms and Huscarls. Then once they engage hit them in the side with a few units of fully upgraded gallows (which should be in abundance). And be prepared to take heavy losses cause those viking are hard hitting dudes. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Obex]

yeah, most of my ideas to deal with the superpowered huscarls involved hitting them from all sides, while my missle units pounded them, and praying for a rout.

the next question might be, how do you defeat them when you dont outnumber them? when they have six or so units of huscarls? the answer: you dont. or i never did. there is a reason the irish never owned the british isles. go back to your island and get pissed.

[Nowake]

THe answer is simple: outnumber them. And use some cav.

[mosborne]

Maybe it is stating the obvious, but my tactic has been Divide and Conquer combined with a healhty dose of Swarm Them Like Buzing Killer Bees

Because the Irish lack archers, victory, whether attacking or defending can only come with close combat. But they have some strong units (gallows and bonnacts), and some very inexpensive and effective close skirmishers (kerns/darts). Use this to your advantage.

You can often afford to build larger armies than your opponents. certainly larger than the Vikings, and often larger than the Saxons et. al. if you've invested in farmland. Make sure you have large contingents of kerns/darts within your armies. Include some fast, but not necessarily high valour, horsemen, as well. I use a ratio of 1 arm spear: 1 gallow: 1 bonnacht: 1 horse: 4 kerns/darts.

When the battle starts, keep your main battleline back and use horsemen to draw away and isolate the enemy's flank units. (Most often Huscarls, and it seems they are more than willing to go off chasing some harrasing enemy unit to the ends of the earth.) Send some kerns/darts after them, using the horse to draw the Carls back around towards the advancing kerns, if necessary. The kerns should use their missiles to harrass the Carls. Keep the horse and kerns moving around the isolated units. As the Carls turn on one of the units, rush up from behind with the others and pelt it with missiles. When the unit is substantially weakened, take it from all sides with all three units. Two kerns and a horse can destroy a Carl easily, and the combination is about as cheap as one Carl.

Avoid main battleline combat as long as possible while you destroy the isolated units.

Your main battleline should also include a few skirmishing kerns, which can be used to further separate the advancing enemy line, or keep it distracted while you take care of the flanks.

I use spearmen in the middle of my battleline, with bonnachts behind, and gallows on the flanks. (I keep the bonnachts in hold or attack mode so they can continuously engage, rather than having them recoil out of range.) When contact comes, the spears hold the center and the bonnachts inflict an intial round of serious damage. The gallows manuever around and chew into the enemies flanks.

By this time you will have either defeated the isolated units and brought your horse around to pursue routing units, or will have withdran spent skirmishers in favour of new horsemen.

It certainly takes some time getting use to a tactical method without archers, but I have found the Irish to be very deadly, if handled properly. Good luck.

[Auxilia]

Historically the Irish were masters of ambush and forest fighting and generally avoided set piece battles, unless there were either lots of them, they had plenty of allies more suited to larger engagements or both.