starting up an english campaign - any advice?

[Al Qasim Hussein]

Before I get started on my first ever English campaign in Total War I was just wondering what folks stratagies/tips/advice/complaints for them are?

My preliminary plans are to swamp the world w/ ships (using MedMod but not Viking Invasion, by the way) and try to build up serious cash thru trade. But since I've time to burn here @ work, I'd be welcome to entertain any ideas anyone had about the ol' Englishmen.

I have read the entries in ToC, by the way, but thought that some fresh discussion might not be a bad thing.

[JohnCee]

For what they are worth a few thoughts in no particular order:

Longbows and billmen are excellent units particularly when created in wales and mercia (respectively)

Maintain a strong sea link in the English Channel, loose control of that and your units in mainland Europe can be utterly cut off.

I've found that the Iberian peninsula tends to fall to the elmo-heads, it's been my approach to let this happen then send a couple of crusades over to reclaim the area for the mother Church. You get the land without annoying the Pope by picking on Catholic Spain and Aragon (the Elmos have done that for you).

Even if you decide to take the Home counties first (Wales, Scotland and Ireland) you should still try to keep France under firm control, if they get too strong they can cause huge problems later on.

If you like to take Europe from two fronts then don't forget that you are nice and close to Scandinavia, while these lands don't give you great stuff they can open up a handy second front when taking on central European factions like the HRE

[Pdifolco]

I'm just playing English in Early Medmod, overall I have same plans : create a merchant empire with control of sea lanes, keep the French down and use any opportunity to take juicy provinces

I started calmly and peacefully, only reinforcing my fleet and the continental provinces in France http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif to keep French at bay, and building ports.
I just bought Wales and their longbowmen through bribery, and conquered Scotland easily.
Soon I also took Sweden (&#33http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif - the Danes did forget it and took Norway instead, bunch of fools http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif -
Then in 1110-1115, when the French were busy fighting the Germans east I attacked and managed to crush French fleet and have total sea control, then took Flanders, then Toulouse, then Champagne ... Poor French king, I also assassinated an heir of him http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Oh and yes, it was much more easy thanks to the Italians, they crushed the Pope in 1105 or so, no excomm
A really fun and relatively easy campaign up to now, you can use the historical English strategy 3 centuries earlier http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif , the insular nature of Britain makes the country really easy to defend http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[The_Emperor]

My advice is to attack and crush the French as early and quickly as possible.

The French have very rich provinces and the current king has a very high acumen, they have the capability to outnumber your forces within a few years.

So attack the French hard and attack fast, Wales and Scotland can be bribed at a later date. At any rate Scotland will require a large garrisson and that will tie up your forces. After the French have died out, secure alliances and consolidate your lands with a massive building campaign for several years.

I sugguest you use Mercia for training Spearmen (Eventually Billmen), Wales (ready for Longbows) for your archers and Wessex for your Knights and Cavalry. Train your Men At Arms and Militia in either Scotland or Northumria. France should be used for income generating, Strategic Agents, Farmland and Shipbuiding (except Tulouse, which can give you +1 valor for Chiv Knights when you get access to them).

Using this technique (if you control the sea lanes) you can quickly raise an army within a few years and send it out to anywhere within range of your fleets... This gives you a very quick response to threats makes it easy to invade others.

From here you have three ways to advance...

1, Attack the HRE, Very difficult as the HRE has vast armies and generally poor lands with little strategic value, and the Pope will have a few things to say about attacking another Christian Faction. An attack on the Germans should wait.

2, Attack across the ocean into Norway, Sweden and then on into the Steppes. Risky and provides the risk of overextending your reach, but attacking Rebels and Novgorod does avoid Papal anger and can utilise crusades.

3, Cross into Iberia when the time is right and crush everyone. This is the best strategy, as the Spanish will eventually crush Aragon and find themselves the targets of Papal Anger (allowing for some nice crusades), plus when your done you can move into North Africa which is very defendable The Iron found there can also be put to good use, and the lands tend to be very wealthy.

Once Iberia is yours, you then should be well placed to march eastwards. Chances are you'll be at war with the Germans or the Italians within a few years... But you should be well placed to deal with most threats.

[ichi]

All good ideas. I take full advantage of the insular chokepoint to build up first. After I take Scotland, Wales, and Ireland, I build up the florin production, navy, castles, and buildings. This is dull and takes a while, but when I come out I'm ready.

So I try to maintain peace, get trade going, and build, keeping a minimal army in the rear and a strong (but lean) defensive force at the crossing.

I time my expansion based on world events - picking up rebel provinces or exploiting a conflict between other factions. Usually this is viking country, Spain, or France. Path of least resistance thing.

The issue of Ireland is interesting. I take it, but like Scotland, it requires more support (in terms of garrison size) than production - for a while. I like to get em early and build up the happiness and production. The best case comes if I can find a governor with good acumen AND a happiness virtue. Placing this type of guy in Ireland and Scotland helps immensely.

ichi

[DrHaphazard]

FLANDERS Anything else need to be said? Flanders is the richest province in all of northern Europe and its just within your grasp. I think your whole strategy from the start should revolve around capturing this important point and turning it into a trade machine.

As always i recommend building up your navy ASAP, and this is especially critical if you are going to allow Flanders to make you rich. Head east with your ships because thats the fastest way to come in contact with a lot of possible trading partners.

In order to physically take flanders you might want to find a ready source of swordsmen. The French early on will be putting out lots of Spearmen and Peasants, so get some swords to plow right through them. It takes a long time to make Feudal Men-at-Arms, especially with those necesary castle upgrades to get a swordsmith, but luckily you have a readily available souce of swordsmen...SCOTLAND. Scotland gives you those Highland Clasmen and all you need is a Fort to get them. Best of all they come with a +1 valor bonus.

In any case, thats pretty short term. In the longer run, build up (as always) your Navy so that if you want to Crusade anywhere on the map you can get there instaneously. Stay allied to the Germans, or don't go to war with them. If you'r lucky they will fall into civil war after being attacked by someone else. If not wait as long as possible and you'll force them into civil war when they attack you.

Oh but those Spanish/Almohads. Eventually one of those two powers will conquer the other and then luck out. Aquitaine is rich and right in their path into the rest of Europe. Keep Aquitaine well stocked, and hopefully they won't attack, but if they do realize that the Aquitaine is expendable, and just hold on to Flanders. The rest can be reconqured in due time.

By the way, Lithuania (although it might not seem it) can be turned into a trading powerhouse as well. Capture it early while its still held by rebels and work on building trading posts. Again, however, you will need to keep this province stocked with troops because it will be a rich province all alone admist the enemy.

Oh and if you are willing to fight the danes then capture Sweden, or whatever the eastern province in Scandanavia is. Once again it can be made into a trading power and more importantly it has black gold (iron.)

[hoom]

A simple strategy:
Use lots of billmen.
Conquor.

Personally I don't find Longbows particularly useful.
Less power, range & accuracy than arbs.

But don't be afraid to push the ones you have into melee, they have a shield & their axe has armour piercing so they can do a fair bit of damage.
I've had more than one unit of royal knights wiped out by longbows in melee (princes & generals at that http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/frown.gif )

Get hold of Ireland quickly too since Gallowglasses are good http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Sadly you don't get to upgrade their weapons http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/frown.gif

A core infantry of Billmen supplemented with flanking Gallowglasses is a fearsome enemy indeed.

[The_Emperor]

Quote[/b] (arrrse @ Aug. 15 2003,14:12)]Personally I don't find Longbows particularly useful.
Less power, range & accuracy than arbs.
Yes but its rate of fire where Longbows make up the difference Longbows teamed up WITH Arbs makes for the deadliest combination in defence and attack.

The +2 Valor of Longbows trained in Wales with a Master Bowyer is a must for me... Teamed up with some Arbs the Enemy won't know what hit them.

[Mount Suribachi]

Definately want to wipe out France ASAP. Their army consists of mainly peasants with a few spearmen & is pretty easy to beat. Flanders is a must have province & Toulouse gives you instant access to the Med.

Then you can follow the excellent advice given above by others.

[Jazzman]

have successfully finished two campaigns with the english. have to ditto the remarks on building up trade, particularly i'd stress the trade lanes and getting Sweden asap, its as good as flanders tradewise and easier to conquer and defend. livonia and novgorod also good to take after that. battling the french is pretty much unavoidable, let the elmos take iberia and then turn on them when french subdued and coast thru n.africa into mideast. HRE will implode at some point soon after.
btw, i think it takes a bit of the fun out, if you ask for how others succeeded in a particular campaign. half the fun is figuring it out yourself and learning from your mistakes. dont want to be confrontational, just a happy thought. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

Alternatively, retreat all of your units into Britain at the start of the game, abandoning your French holdings. It will sting, but you can manage. You only need to garrison Wessex. Then let the HRE and the French whup each other for a bit while you build up your economic and military infrastructure, and yout armies. Then when the time is right, strike.

[Dogmeat]

My usual strategdy
Can't add anything really new. Its a good idea to crush the French almost instantly, they can become a problem if you let them keep all the rich provinces. Waste no time and train lots of troops asap, you can regain your florins later. Secure Flanders straight away while it is weak, so your lands are connected, otherwise your nation will be separated and without ships it will be hard to reinforce your troops. Flanders and Ile de France are the main jewels of the Frenchies kingdom, secure them ASAP and try to get the French to ceasefire if you want to move onto other targets, that way the money will roll in. It may be easier to just crush the French all together as they are your only immediate foe.

Wales and Scotland are not a problem, I've never seen them invade or give any hassle at all, even if those pesky scots can be a tad rebelious. Great idea to bribe wales for its longbowmen, but Scotland can wait. Its only good point is its highlanders, and it will need a decent garrison to prevent rebelion. Conquer or bribe when you can spare the troops/cash. Ireland is easily conquered, but remember that any successful army you send over there will be trapped until you can build a port, which can be expensive for early in the game when income is low. I once made the mistake of getting my king stuck out there for years.

Once the homelands are tamed, and the French lands have been added to your rightful kingdom. Build the fleets, make lots of allies and trade. Become incrediblely rich and the door to european domiation is open. Either expand your empire, or complete those pesky GA, the choice is yours.....

[Pdifolco]

About "Rebellious" Scotland,
I just play at Normal or Hard - I don't like the Rebels-everywhere Expert style http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif - but never had any difficulties avoiding any rebellion anywhere, be it Scotland, Prussia, or Livonia.
Just give it to a high DREAD governor (5-skulls +), even if you squeeze less money if he has a not-that-high acumen you'll be quiet, anyway these provinces suck money-wise http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

[The_Emperor]

Quote[/b] (Pdifolco @ Aug. 15 2003,22:48)]anyway these provinces suck money-wise http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif
I don't know... Portugal can be quite profitable with its trading goods (and it rebels just as much as Scotland)

[Mount Suribachi]

Yeah Scotland is worthless from a financial point of view. Provinces like that I tend to permanently leave at low or very low taxes as there is no point in risking a rebellion for the sake of squeezing an extra 20 or 30 florins out of a province.

As for Highland Clansmen, they make great garrison units - low build cost, low upkeep, but still useful in a scrap. Secondly, they make great infantry in desert provinces with their speed and lack of armour. I used them to great effect in an Italian campaign through N Africa.

[The Last Emperor]

Num 1 enemy is the french coz their army gets quite strong and can outnumber u in just a few turns if they r left uchecked so try to wipe them out asap and with their rich land u can have a stable base and income source to start building up in Europe. Start building ur fleet also to secure ur homebase and get access and trade to new lands. Work on getting as many allies also to stay away from possible attcks.

Next u can go for the wales, scotland and ireland to secure ur homebase and also for their special units. Try bribing wales and scotland if u have the cash to and ireland can b taken quite easily with those newly aquired forces.

With a growing war chest by nw, u can start looking at either the HRE whenever there is a civil war. The Spaninsh usually tangles wif the Almo so look for weak province just taken by the Almo. If u manage to take the Iberian Penisular, look to the north African lands for their gold and access to the Muslim lands. It would be a nice idea to take these lands inch by inch with Crusades for u get OFS and Templers. Rebel provine in the Scandinavia and Lithuania r good catches also. They give u xtras cash and opportunities to the backdoor of future conquest. Try not to get involved in wars on too many front. Focus on 1 target at a time to prevent ganged up invasion into ur lands and pissing the pope for tat excom. Wont want to have province loyalty dropping at tis time and rebellions sprouting in t heart of ur empire. Oh yes the italian and sicilian usually r fighting each other so just ally with the stronger of the 2 to leave them alone and also for the trade florins they offer as well.

With ur wings nw quite well spread, wait for the late period which by nw should be around the corner and when it comes, get those Billmen, Longbowers, pavise Aba and Chi Knights-as many as u can. THe mongols coming would can also work in ur advantage coz they will usually start messing up the eastern powerhouse like the Byzans and Egyptians. If can ally with the Horde and try bribing their units to join u. If u seek action ur strong army should also be able to give u some fun going head on with the Horde. The chioce is urs. And at tis stage everything should be a breeze for u so have fun with the English.

[GoldenKnightX2]

Man, everyone has such good strategies, gotta try them out. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Al Qasim Hussein]

Good strategies all I've got the campaign revved up, conquered (or purchased&#33http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif the british isles, and moved down into iberia. i was able to build ships so fast that taking flanders and attacking the french wasn't a concern. I can pretty much ship my troops to wherever I'd like (which right now is into the rich north african holdings of the Almohads)

I'm eagerly anticipating the billmen, longbowmen, chiv knights, and of course the ensuing chaos it is going to cause for the rest of western europe. France and the HRE have had chances to acquire land/war/whatever they do, and hopefully this will make for a rowdier and tougher central european campaign (I'm playing on normal...).

Again, thanks for the insights.

[NewJeffCT]

One thing is to bribe Wales in the first few turns of the game. That gives you a big advantage with having 3 units of longbows early in the game. I generally leave one in Wales and then send 2 up to Scotland to help me conquer those pesky Scots. I like having the island all red as soon as possible. It just looks better.

From there, I start building ships out of Northumbria and Scotland, start building spear upgrades in Mercia and bowyer upgrades in Wales. I move my fleet through Europe and the north part of the map so I can reach out to touch Ireland, Sweden and Norway. I then move to conquer all three of those. Usually all three are fairly easy – you can just pepper them all with arrows. Build up a port and trading post in Sweden & Norway and you are soon rolling in the florins. Also, start working on building up to the castle and you can build a metalsmith in Sweden...From there, you can move to Finland, Livonia and Lithuania if they are held by rebels. Though, Finland is pretty rebellious, like Scotland. Livonia, Lithunia, as well as Prussia and Pomerania are all held by rebels early and fairly good tradewise.

Crusades are also your friend. Build your ships until you can get to the Middle East. By then, the Turks or Egyptians is probably being worn down or near elimination. Declare a crusade to wipe out the infidels once and for all. Plus, it is always good to Crusade into Antioch, as it is one of the best income provinces in the game with Egypt, Tripoli, Constantinople and Flanders.

Or, you can crusade a province at a time – if you want to conquer Iberia from the Almos, do it one province at a time to push them back one at a time.

Oh, and while you are bribing the Welsh and conquering Scotland, build your troops in Europe to defend against the Frenchies. Give up all 3 of your initial mainland provinces if you can snag Flanders and hold onto it, though.

Be very aggressive early, then hold on and build your trade and upgrade your troop building capability, then you are ready for the high era and your billmen, longbowmen and chivalric knights.