What is the use of this mighty "naptha throwers"

[rolin]

Is there anybody who can handle this unit effectively? What can this guys do?

I'm not able to find a useful task for them, is there a reason why should I build them.

[A.Saturnus]

Some time ago someone posted a screen of napthas frying a king (or was it an emperor?). If you manage to bring them close to enemy formations, you can inflict really heavy damage. Just be sure to disable skirmishing. The napthas are quite able in melee too.

[Portuguese Rebel]

Disable skirmish and use them to attack low morale units. They are better used in large numbers. I don't like them that much though. Too much time to built and little effect compared to an archer unit, although routing a unit with their fear ability can be useful, but then again you can get rolled over in there is any cavalary or fast moving unit around.

[The_Emperor]

Naphtas are great at guarding key choke points and for softening up the enemy upon their advance.

As has been said above you need to disable skirmishing because they always skirmish away before they are within range to throw their Greek Fire Pots.

I have seen Naptha eliminate kings, and also seen it cause up to 70 casualties in one throw guarding a bridge http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif

It is powerful when used correctly, and being considered a gunpowder weapon it can have a morale shattering effect.

[Marshal Murat]

I was battleing Sicily once, and all I had were 2 peasent units, a byz inf. and Napatha throwers. I had to fight off Feudal knights, feudal foot men, and I won a victory, by attacking the Knights in the woods. My napatha throwers created havoc on the disorderly knights.

[o_loompah_the_delayer]

If you are playing turks early, naptha can cause significant damage to the otherwise almost indestructible kataprats.
If you can get them round the back of an enemy unit in a melee they are very destructive, taking out as many as 6 katas per throw.

As said before, the key is you got to take them of skirmish, like when you use jiniettes or murbatin/ kern infantry (the javelin throwers).

[rolin]

Thanks a lot. I've now an additional question.

Play this game a lot on expert, but never found out how to use the 'skirmisher-units' like kerns and napthas, because they were to slow in defence. Not so the jinetes, they were fast enough to avoid melee. Can I place this units behind my speermen lines and throw the javelins or naptha without threating my own lines, or have I to place them in front of the defence wall and bring them back manually?

[Revenant69]

Hey rolin. I must say that i love skirmishing units. It does take awhile to learn how to use them properly. But they are SOOOOOOO worth it. With javelin type units i usually position them right behind my main infantry line, so when infantry is engaged the javelineers can throw over their buddy's shoulders. This works wonders You will take some friendly fire casualties but thats nothing compared to the casualties that the enemy wil take. Say bye bye to expensive knights http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Oh yeah as everyone had already told you- take them off skirmish http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

PS I usually keep my naptha throwers in front of he infantry line. So when enemy approaches they throw their grenades and then i charge - the morale penalty from naptha and seeing the charging maniacs usually makes the enemy break (or at least think about it) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Shahed]

http://webplaza.pt.lu/shahid/images/napthaking1.jpg

http://webplaza.pt.lu/shahid/images/napthaking2.jpg

http://webplaza.pt.lu/shahid/images/napthaking3.jpg

Here are two replays on how to use em:

NapthaWinners (http://webplaza.pt.lu/shahid/downloads/mtwreplays/NapthaWinners.zip)

These are from v 1.1, if you want to view them in VI, change the file extension to .vrp
It should work then.

Cheers http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

[The_Emperor]

Ahh the classic shots from SeljukSinan...

It was those replays that taught me how to use Napthas the first time http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pat.gif

[Shahed]

Cheers. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Kongamato]

There is a bug which I call the dry volley which makes it very hard to use Javelin and Naptha units. Apparently, the first volley fired by these units wont fire, they go through the motions and say their lines but do not throw any projectiles. This means that only the stupidest of units will get caught by an unprotected Jav/Naptha volley. If you want to use these units, you have to have them protected and off of skirmish mode. Try to get the enemy clumped up and then send in the Jav/Naptha units.

[Shahed]

I 've done ok with em even in MP, against human players. It's true about the dry volley thing though, they waste one whole cycle just standing there.

[ChErNoByl]

i did a test battle with a bunch of naptha throwers versus lots and lots and lots of infantry. i turned off skirmish mode and the infantry routed after 3 throws at most. Maybe their morale wasnt too high, or naptha throwers are just godly.

[Oaty]

They are also excellent units to have strategically retreat to a castle. Whats this a big cluster**** of men rushing through the gates. Ewwwwwwwwww a big cluster of deadmen Hey look another unfortunate good runner Well they usually don't win the day but cause a rather high expense to the enemy assaulting the castle. I usually throw in 36 of these guys and either a 60 man unit or a 100 man unit as naptha throwers have a small arsenal and it depends how long the castle will hold out a siege.

Also archers can be quite effective in the defense of a citadel or a fortress as I have had the opportunity on a long assault to let them exhaust all there ammo as it takes a while to break the gates and you can keep retreating archers to the next gate and when they get to the final keep the archers are on high ground and thats where they unleash there final hell.

[Quokka]

Wow I just watched those replays and I amazed at the skill of Seljuk Sinan.

Do the Naptha throwers cause fear in your troops as well? There was one part in the Sicilian King replay where the Naptha throwers attacked some Spearmen locked in battle with Peasants. It seemed to not effect the peasants either in damage or fear.
Did the peasants escape damage because they have no armour?

[ichi]

Quote[/b] ]Do the Naptha throwers cause fear in your troops as well?

Seems to me that they do inflict casualties and cause fear amongst your own troops. With the Byz put them with a VG unit, with Turks with JHI.


Quote[/b] ]Can I place this units behind my speermen lines and throw the javelins or naptha without threating my own lines, or have I to place them in front of the defence wall and bring them back manually?

I try to start out with them in front, and then move to just behind my infantry/melee unit. To maximize their effect I try to stretch out the naptha (or jinetes) as much as I can protect.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxMelee Unitxxxxxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

OOOOOONAPTHAOOOOOOOOOO

ichi

[Brother Maynard]

Naptha Throwers are best used to break enemy formations. Sure, Swiss Armored Pikemen may R0XX0RZ, or whatever is the current in term, but their armor doesn't really protect against explosions. A dozen grenades can wreak havoc in such a group. If you are not too concerned with the casualties on your own side, you can just toss grenades into melee. To be completely honest, you were probably going to let those Ghazis die anyhow, so why not spice things up?

-- Brother Maynard

[rolin]

Good Morning

Thank you for the visual aids in this topic. Tried last night to play a few battles with this guys. Never got such devasting results like in the replay, but it worked to my satisfaction.

Had a good result with the irish kerns in defending a bridge, (Map of Flandres against the French) but nothing not can be done with archers as well. I think I have to get some more experience by rote.

[The_Emperor]

Welcome to the Org Brother Maynard http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

You are right Naptha is best used to sow terror within tight enemy ranks... This is why in chokepoint defence they can be so powerful.

It may not be as powerful as the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch, but still very powerful http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Gregoshi]

Quote[/b] (The_Emperor @ Sep. 02 2003,02:33)]You are right Naptha is best used to sow terror within tight enemy ranks... This is why in chokepoint defence they can be so powerful.
I've not used Napthas yet, but I've used their cousins the Thunder Bombers in STW/MI. I found the TB just as effective in chokepoint attacks too.

Brother Maynard, welcome to the Entrance Haaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhh... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Lancer6969]

Hey,

I like the Naptha throwers for sneaking behind the enemy and bombarding them with flame. It reduces moral, and inflicts heavy casualties. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Lancer
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif

[BDC]

Down a hill at infantry, just as you charge at the front with swordsmen and into the flanks with cavalry. With luck you won't take any casulties. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif