View Full Version : Capitals in RTW
I think every faction should have a capitol and the loss of that city would be dire. (I'm tired of watching Constanople get sacked because the Byzantines think I'm more of a threat to that city at 5 provinces away than the Turks who are knocking at there door, come on now that city is usually the most devoloped than all the others at least in the early era and should be the last or near last 1 to fall for the Byzantines). My ideas for the capitol is it gets double income for that faction as to help the small factions out, a capitol can also produce up to 4 units or more so when the capitols being closed in by the enemy and can also be bulding 2 buildings at once. So does anyone else think there should becapitols and how should they work
Hear Hear Great idea, same should go for Rome, and Alexandria and Carthage and such. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif
Oaty, sometimes I think you can read minds. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif It always bothered me too in Medieval that nations often wouldn't fight to the death do defend their "home" province--Spanish: Castille, Almohads: Morocco, English: Wessex, French: Ile de France, etc. And yes, this was particularly ridiculous when the Byzantines won't fight for Constantinople. In my mind, that province should, on average, be the most difficult to conquer in Medieval.
So yes, I definitely like the idea of each faction having a Capitol city, and that it should confer some type of bonus to that faction. I also agree that a faction should suffer a major penalty should they lose it, although it shouldn't be so crippling that the faction can't still win--it should just be harder for them to do so. It would add a lot of flavor to the game, not to mention some realism. Also, if it was done right, it could greatly contribute towards making each faction feel more distinct.
This was something that Birth of the Federation (for those of you who remember the game) did fairly well. Your homeworld, even after it was no longer your major resource and industrial base, was still important to your empire. It was home to several unique structures (which gave bonuses to your empire) that couldn't be built anywhere else. And if your capitol system was conquered, you lost not only the benefit of those buildings; but your empire's population also suffered a huge blow to morale.
Now as for what bonuses Capitols in RTW would confer, I think you could use some of the same ideas that BotF did. I think having a Capitol would allow you to build a couple special structures that give your faction a certain bonus. Perhaps you could have a building that gives your military units trained in your Capitol a larger-than-normal boost in valour. Maybe you can build a structure that boosts trade or otherwise improves your economy. Also, I think troops garrisoned in your Capitol ought to receive a (temporary) morale boost for the duration that they're stationed there; this would reflect a "courage bonus" given to the garrison's soldiers should the Capitol come under seige and be attacked.
As for penalties should you lose your Capitol..... First off, I'd better state right away that we probably shouldn't be allowed to "move" our Capitol from one city to another. To keep it simple, it should probably just be the the main town or city you start out with at the beginning of the game. The loyalty of your faction's cities should drop a certain percentage (thereby increasing the chance of riots and/or rebellion); this should go doubly so for towns/cities near your fallen Capitol, as they are the mostly likely to go down next If game-balancing warrants it, I might even suggest that all your troops suffer a morale penalty in battle as well, at least for a certain number of turns.
Any other thoughts? Ideas?
mercian billman
12-20-2003, 08:14
I do think that you should be allowed to move your capital but, this should incur a loss of morale and, loyalty especially in your former capital.
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif
I also think it should be possible to move your capitol, since this happened in reality, but it shouldn't happen to often. Moving your capitol should be an expensive operation that takes time and, should you lose your first one, the second one won't be capitol until the progress is completed. I think that the capitol province should allow you to construct buildings that give "global" benifits, like a expensive palace, to bolster the morale of all your troops (because it sends out the message that you are a guy to be reconed with since you can afford that expensive, and otherwise pretty useless thing), or a military academy, to improve the capabilities of all your officers (improved discipline, slightly improved morale, better generals with more command and loyality). This are only suggestions though, but I like the idea.
RisingSun
12-20-2003, 17:15
I agree wholeheartedly with the idea of capitols being important. And not just troops garrisoned in the city should get a morale boost. If the city is directly threatened (Like a field battle nearby, but not necessarily right outside the city) there should be a substantially large morale boost to your (or their, depending whose capitol) troops. Although the direct amount should vary slightly through the game. Romans in 300 BC probably would be less insulted and worried about the sack of Rome (Since it already happened before by the Gauls) than in 50 BC, when if the city was taken, the whole "glory of Rome" ideal would be sacked. (Pardon the pun... It doesn't even make sense)
The Wizard
12-20-2003, 18:16
Good idea.
Take a look at a screenshot detailing the civ selection. It shows the Julier faction, and that faction's capital. So, as far as that stage of development is concerned, there are capitals http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Hirosito
12-20-2003, 18:31
also you should regain morale according to how quickly you retook your capital once you lost it.
Indeed, some political clout would be good.
Quote[/b] (Ludens @ Dec. 20 2003,07:35)]I also think it should be possible to move your capitol, since this happened in reality, but it shouldn't happen to often. Moving your capitol should be an expensive operation that takes time and, should you lose your first one, the second one won't be capitol until the progress is completed. I think that the capitol province should allow you to construct buildings that give "global" benifits, like a expensive palace, to bolster the morale of all your troops (because it sends out the message that you are a guy to be reconed with since you can afford that expensive, and otherwise pretty useless thing), or a military academy, to improve the capabilities of all your officers (improved discipline, slightly improved morale, better generals with more command and loyality). This are only suggestions though, but I like the idea.
That could definitely work. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif In fact, except for being able to move them, Capitols in BotF work almost exactly as you described them just now. Most of the empires' homeworlds have an academy that produces ships with superior crews; most of them also have a structure of some type that improves the population's morale throughout their respective star systems. Many also had buildings that improved your research, intelligence abilities, etc. Most of the Ferengi capitol's buildings focused on giving you huge amounts of cash. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif But I digress.....
As for moving the Capitol, I agree it should be a lengthy and expensive process. Mercian Billman also had a good idea in that the city that was your old Capitol should suffer a drop in loyalty and/or happiness, at least for a certain period of time. Hirosito also made a good point that if you regain your Capitol, your morale should go back up.
On the flip side of that issue, I would also suggest that if you capture an enemy Capitol, it would improve the morale/happiness of your own population and/or troops. For instance, I'm pretty sure there was quite a bit of celebration in Rome when Carthage was captured during the 2nd Punic War. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/birthday.gif
Quote[/b] (Wizzy @ Dec. 20 2003,11:16)]Good idea.
Take a look at a screenshot detailing the civ selection. It shows the Julier faction, and that faction's capital. So, as far as that stage of development is concerned, there are capitals http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Cool cool. That is good to know
Which screenshot exactly are you referring to, by the way? Is it one that's here on the Org?
alman9898
12-21-2003, 00:12
If you look the faction selection screenshot, I believe it indicates the faction's capital city.
The Wizard
12-21-2003, 18:58
That's what I said. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
http://www.legiontotalwar.com/PDVD_001%5B1%5D.jpg
RisingSun
12-21-2003, 20:32
Thanks for re-posting that picture. I was beginning to forget how sweet this game looked outside the battles. Thanks for reminding me. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif
I hate to say this but after seeing that pic right where it says capitol it says 5000 denari. My guess is where it says capitol means either how much money you start with or the annnual income of the territories you hold. But maybe if we are ucky they havent yet got that far in the program to label the capitols yet
Beelzebub
12-22-2003, 05:42
Actually, I think that "capital" in that screenshot is the title for the breakdown of the nation's capital resources, not the city that houses the seat of govt... My guess is that the 1 star is the stat for it's overall rating, and then under that it shows the exact breakdown for treasury, cities, and other assets. Of course, I don't really know any more than you guys do, so your guess is as good as mine http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif . Who knows what the hell that row of 9 gold icons under the name in the top left are for..
The Wizard
12-22-2003, 12:53
Note the fact that the star and "5000 Denarii" is some distance under "Capital". It is strange there is no name detailing the capital, but those two other things have nothing, or little, to do with "Capital".
Mind you, all three Roman factions share the same capital, and this is under control of the Senate.
o_loompah_the_delayer
12-22-2003, 15:32
I think having a capital/ home city would be great as well http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif
Perhaps looking at the screen shot you get to select your capital? The other star is with faction leader ???? Julius, which is presuambly fixed at the start. Either that or they havent gotten round to naming the cities yet?
BobTheTerrible
12-22-2003, 21:05
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif
It does say "capital" rather than "capitol." If any of you actually knew any grammar, http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif then you'd realize that "capital" refers to money of a nation, and "capitol" is the city that is the center of government for a nation.
Unless I am mixed-up? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif
my my, the world doesnt revolve arround america http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
Capital is the English spelling (and correct spelling)
please learn to accept other cultures in future http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
BobTheTerrible
12-23-2003, 00:49
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif
Sorry 'bout that. I thought something was up when all those people didn't realize the speeling error. I guess that would make me a stereotypical American. Again, please accept my apoligies for being so "American."
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif
Clownmite r u tring tu sey I'm illiterate http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif
Somebody Else
12-23-2003, 20:47
I have to say the English language should really invest in some new words... Capital meaning both the seat of government, and material resources available. And then of course, there's capital punishment...
Beelzebub
12-24-2003, 17:15
Actually, capitol isn't an american word, it's a universal english word that's for the actual building where the govt meets. The capital is the city (as well as being a word for resources/assets), and capitol is the building. Those definitions are the same regardless of whether you're in the USA, Canada or Britain.
bighairyman
12-28-2003, 01:39
yes i vote for capitals. it will make the game more "real" http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif . but i think u should be able to change capitals, after all the roman moved their capitals http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif .
But there should be loyalty drops and loyatly rise in the new capital area. i think the comp should also easily accept peace when thier capital is captured. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif
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