Theoretical question

[Dillinger]

If you are in a complete void, in complete darkness and completely free of gravity, and are totally alone, having been there from the instant you were alive, are you anything? Things are things because you can compare them to other things, right? So what if there is nothing to compare yourself to?

[Papewaio]

If you are self aware then you are the sum total of things plus the various things that come through combining those things.

[Pindar]

Quote[/b] ]So what if there is nothing to compare yourself to?

The ability to compare exists exactly where there is division between the self and what is not.

[Voigtkampf]

There is still the void… In reference to that, you can be everything if there is nothing else… If you need the reference at all to define yourself… But in a void, to what purpose?

[k1injuries]

Well you know there's that saying....

I think, therefore, I am.

I don't know the name of the person to credit to.

[Pindar]

Quote[/b] ]Well you know there's that saying....

I think, therefore, I am.

I don't know the name of the person to credit to.

Descartes.

[ichi]

Is there such a thing as a void?

ichi

[k1injuries]

Maybe voids exist beyond the boundaries of the universe... you know how the universe is expanding according to physics... well right outside of the universe limits.

Haha I have no idea. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[Ludens]

According to a certian neurological hypothesis, the brain is a conductor of information (I beg your pardon if I got the translation wrong). In other words:

input *x +y log (z) = output

In your void, input = 0, zo output = 0.
Your brain just doesn't work.

You are not.

From a practical point of view: if you have been there for you entire life, it means you must have developed (physically and psychically) there. How can you develop mentally when there is no input? You cannot learn

Again: You, just, are not.

[InsaneApache]

Just to add a note of levity and as Pindar brought him up...
Descartes goes into a fish and chip shop
'Fish and chips please' says Descartes
'Would you like salt and vinegar with that?'
'I think not' says Descartes
And promptly disapears

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif
Apache

[o_loompah_the_delayer]

Quote[/b] (Ludens @ Jan. 07 2004,04:19)]From a practical point of view: if you have been there for you entire life, it means you must have developed (physically and psychically) there. How can you develop mentally when there is no input? You cannot learn

Again: You, just, are not.
Well in a void you couldnt develop physically as there is no food adn in any case without air you would explode.

Supposing this was not the case and in some way you did manage to survive, I would guess that the input = 0 , output = 0 argument holds true - without any language skills how could you think?

[Voigtkampf]

Maybe we should test this… Any volunteers?

[sambo]

Hi,

I remember this quote from an old C64 game called Ankh :

There is a tendancy for information encoding structures to arise which form representations of thier environments. The human brain is an example of this, as is a rock battered by waves on a sea-shore.

Where is this void, anyway ?

see you.

sam

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] ]Maybe we should test this… Any volunteers?
If you have the possibility to isolate a baby from the momenth of his birth and then wait 20 years, go right ahead http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Voigtkampf]

Welcome to the Org, Sambo. You sure did chose a peculiar subject to begin with...

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/frown.gif I forgot http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif

Welcome to the ORG, sambo http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif




Quote[/b] ]Where is this void, anyway ?
If you're talking about one that can be used to deprive a human being of sensorial stimulation, then any good isolation tank in a space station will do just fine.

If you're talking about the abstract concept of nothingness, then nowhere. But where is nowhere? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Voigtkampf]

Quote[/b] (Aymar de Bois Mauri @ Jan. 07 2004,14:20)]If you're talking about the abstract concept of nothingness, then nowhere. But where is nowhere? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
Right over there... Behind somewhere...

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] ]Right over there... Behind somewhere...
And what's in front of somewhere? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Bezalel]

Speaking of descartes,

Why couldn't Descartes walk in front of the horse?


Because da' cart goes behind the horse.

[makkyo]

?????????????????
Homer no function beer without- Homer Simpson

[Papewaio]

Quote[/b] (voigtkampf @ Jan. 08 2004,03:50)]Maybe we should test this… Any volunteers?
We already are aren't we?

After all we are debating this on the net http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif.

----

External input maybe zero, but there is still internal input, heart/breathing/nerves/brain cells communicating so I would not say that nothing happens in the brain just because of zero external input. Although it would be a safe assumption that atrophy would occur.

[Dillinger]

Interesting responses. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Personally, I figured that our whole concept of 'being' was based on our relation to other things (People, environment, etc.) and thus, when there is nothing to relate to, you are nothing. I suppose the whole I think, therefore I am thing does offer debate, however, if you were in complete darkness your entire life, with no experiences, what would you think about? Nothing. Your brain would not function.