Battle Map Editor - Q & A's

[PseRamesses]

Using the map editor to create a custom battle map leaves me with some questions:
1. How do I determine startingpoints for each army on the battle-map?
2. How do I create farms? Is there a palette for it?
3. How do I create sea, both on the map and in the background?
4. Beaches, how do I do it?

Thanks in advance

[Antalis::]

1. Not possible.
2. Use the textures and models-section of the map-editor.
3. Hold left (guess also the other works) "Alt" on the keyboard and click with the left mouse button on a place with a certain height you want to have as the sealevel.
4. With textures. Also the beach should be in the east of the map.
The important thing is to have somewhere in the east a part with sea to get a working beach.
I would link them also with your beach, if your main beach is not in the east.

[Eastside Character]

I personally haven't tried that, but is it possible to make an island map? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-curtain.gif

Regards
EC

[Norseman]

EDIT: On 3: Do what Antalis said, he's the map-expert here. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif


Quote[/b] ]
1. How do I determine startingpoints for each army on the battle-map?

You can't I'm afraid. With the single exception of Historical Battles and Campaigns, it is done by the game following some rules. I don't remember them very well right now but I'll try:
1)When there is riverbattles the attacker always start on the "North" side of the map (or was it the other way round??)
2)Castlebattles; defender starts in what the computer can recognise as a closed ringwall. When there are several ringwalls, the one with the keep/fort enclosed is defined as the main castle.
3) In open battles it depends a bit on the strategymap I think, it can vary.


Quote[/b] ]
2. How do I create farms? Is there a palette for it?

By combining buildings and tiles. You will find farm-houses and hedges among the buildings, and tiles with different agricultural fields.


Quote[/b] ]
3. How do I create sea, both on the map and in the background?

"Fly" under the surface, and you will see that the sea-level is below the landscape. Make a low-point on the map with the same level that you want the sea to have. Then hold Alt and then right-click (I think this was so, but not sure) with the mouse on that point. This will be the new sea-level.


Quote[/b] ]
4. Beaches, how do I do it?

Well, make a slowly sloping downhill and do the above. Then use sandy tiles.

[Antalis::]

Ok here are some more "secrets" of map-making:
I randomly discovered some of those functions (some with the help of my cat http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif , because she walked over my keyboard, lol) :


To copy a height:
1. Click anywhwere on the map with the right height, then hold "STRG"+"ALT". Than paste it with the left or right (doesn´t matter) Mouse button.
After you have paste some terrain heights, press "Enter" to make them smooth.


2. Raising terrain with different sizes:
Use 1-9 of your keyboard.
1 is the smallest brush, 9 the largest.


3. Set textures very fast:
Go into your textures section of the map-editor:
-Press space: Look at your minimap:
You will get a map-grid with the possiblity to set textures very fast on the minimap.

-Press space again and
you will get an overview of the textures you can use.

----
About islands: I´v tried it 2 times and failed, but maybe the troops had no terrain to deploy.
But I guess it doesn´t working.

[Antalis::]

HOW TO MAKE MAPIMAGES:
(preview pictures in the custom battle and in the campaign)



First you´ll need a graphic program like "Paint shop pro 8":

You can download a trial version (60 days) at:
Paint Shop Pro 8 trial version (http://www.jasc.com/trialreg.asp?pid=K-PSP8-USDIR)


Than you will need also a second graphic-software that can save in the lbm-format.

But be aware: Paint-shop pro (and I think no other software can, except Ultimate paint) cannot save it right in lbm-format, so you will need:
"Ultimate Paint 2.8 or higher (maybe also lower)":

Ultimate paint (http://www.regnow.com/softsell/visitor.cgi?affiliate=19793&action=site&vendor=2780&ref=http://www.ultimatepaint.com/upsw.zip)

Its also a sharware version (so don´t use it too often ).

If it don´t working anymore, use another version of it (or delete your harddisc, lol, or buy it).



Ok, here we go: Make an ingamescreenshot with F2 from your map.
You will find your screens in the TGA folder.

Open this image with Paint Shop Pro and open also a new white image there with the resolutuion: 716x120.

Select the whole new white paper with the selection tool:
Than select a part of your screenshot (the part you will show in the preview), and press copy in the panel above.
Now go back to the white new image and click on it: Now its activated.
Go to "Edit"/Paste/Paste into selection".
Now your mapimage has the right resolution.

Save it as tga-format.


Now open this new tga with Ultimate Paint and go to "save as": Choose "AMIGA IFF (iff, lbm, bbm, ilb, ilbm).

BUT after you have choosen AMIGA IFF you HAVE TO WRITE behind the name of your map: "lbm".
You cannot save it without this

Example what you have to write while saving it: "hillyinland04.lbm"

Also Choose 256 colours


So now your mapimage is finished and ready to get tested.


Your new mapimage goes into the MapImage folder (Battle/Mapimage/Arid, Lush, Temperate and so on": Choose the right clima folder for your map: Arid, Lush, Temperate and so on.
So if you have made your screenshot in a Temperate area and your startpos.txt definitions have only temperate areas (look into it): Then the mapimage goes into your "Temperate" folder.
It must have the exact same name as your map

So if you are very buisy, then make a mapimage for every clima-zone, but that depends how much you don´t like the imagination of a arid-mapimage and you fight on a temperate battlefield ,)


Antalis



btw: Can we make this a sticky, where all mapmaker could write theire tipps and expiriences with mapmaking?

[Antalis::]

To build a castlemap:


The castle should be near (or in) the middle of the map.

And never use "Don´t snap model to gruid" when you´re building the walls and gates
For towers and keeps it doesn´t matter.

Use ALWAYS the "Snap model to grid centre/edge/corner" (try what from this 3 is best for the currently situation) to get a working castle.


Will walls, which are not closed as a ring will work: No.
Your castle must always be closed:

Never like this: "-----"


So it should look like : "[]"

[PseRamesses]

Quote[/b] (Antalis:: @ Feb. 04 2004,15:01)]2. Raising terrain with different sizes:
Use 1-9 of your keyboard.
1 is the smallest brush, 9 the largest.

----
About islands: I´v tried it 2 times and failed, but maybe the troops had no terrain to deploy.
But I guess it doesn´t working.
Explain raising terrain with 1-9 on the keyboard as I was a child Antalis.

I have made working island maps but Norseman´s persistance that it will fail eventually makes me worried since they are gems to play. I guess extensive game-testing is the only thing to do. What I did was to make a small land-connection in the north and south.

[Antalis::]

Activate in the mapeditor your heights-raise-section in the panel above:

Press the number 1 on your keyboard to get a very small brush to make hills and so on.

Use 9 on the keyboard and you´ll get the largest brush to make very large hills in no time.


1-9 (numbers on your keyboard) means that with every step from 1-9 the brush to raise a hill or dig a hole is larger.

Use the left mouse button to raise a hill, the right to make it smaller.

[Antalis::]

How to create a castlemap with a river:


The castle has to be in the south of the map on the other side of the river.
The attacker has the abbility also to DEPLOY on the battlefield, like the defender
He starts like in riverbattles comon, on the other side of the river.
The defender starts in the castle.

So you have both: A riverbattle and a castleattack map in one map.

Thanks Norseman for some tipps in this case.


Here is a screenshot of such a map:
http://max45.250free.com/castle6.jpg


btw: If you have any tipps for battlefieldmapmaking, please post them here.

[PseRamesses]

Quote[/b] (Antalis:: @ Feb. 20 2004,14:50)]http://max45.250free.com/castle6.jpg


btw: If you have any tipps for battlefieldmapmaking, please post them here.
Awsome castle-map , as usual, Antalis I thought I played every darn castle-map in HTW but I sorley missed this one though - which one is it? One creative point of critisism from me regarding the HTW castle-maps though, is that too many of them looks pretty much like the next. Nomatter how exiting you get playing HTW at some point the player is going to auto-resolve many castle-battles.

Q: When placing bridges on the map do I extend them in lenght, if needed, in the same way as with walls: place, left-click to get a longer one etc or how do I do it?
Q: If I decide to have two bridges on a map will that confuse the battle-engine? Ex: on a rivermap can I have a water-grave?, sorry for the spell, around the castle with yet another bridge?

[Antalis::]

Thanks for your kind words about that river-castlemap http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif


Well the castles in HTW follow a construction plan with upgrades and so on, so I cannot make them very variable and there should always something like an acropolis and sometimes a city with a wall around.
Since the beta 2.01 I´ve reworked many of the castles and made much better textures for them.

Also: I kicked castlehilly08 and added one new castle-series.

You will not find that river-castle-map in the actual beta: I´ve reworked castlehilly01 for it.

You will find the new river-castle map in the next beta.



To your questions:

1. Placing bridges is quite simple: You need a working river. Thats the important thing: Without that MTW will not know that its a riverbattle.

I always make one part of the river more in the south at the right site, a bit below, and then make the rest of the river. This always works well (look at the minimap in the image).



Then place anywhere at the river your bridge.
The bridge is now short and reaches not the other site, but that doesn´t matter.

Then start a custom battle and you will see that your bridge fits yet to the other river site.

Now MTW knows that you´ve created a rivermap.


Or you build a river without a bridge, start a custom battle and a bridge is automaticaly set on a good place (but you can delete it afterwards).


Go back to the map-editor and now you can set bridges, which will automatically fits to the other river site.



2. No you cannot make a working water ditch, which goes around the whole castle: The engine of MTW is very limited for rivers.


But you can make a water ditch like this:

Your water ditch should not surrounding the whole castle.


To make a working bridge on such a water ditch:

You need a piece of land exactly in front of
the bridge on the other part of the water ditch to get a working bridge there (thats the reason, why the water ditch should not surround the whole castle).
Look at the screenshot: (This castle is not from me, I only solved a problem there and made this working bridge):

http://max45.250free.com/calais.jpg


But you can place up to 3 bridges, but not one in the south and one in the north, like in front of the castle and behind of it in a water grave.


Water is always a problem: A single river is working well, coast should be in the east, lakes should not be to large and also not too long and the river should go from one side of the map to the other, from right to left (or vice versa).

[Lord Of Storms]

I am going to pin this topic for now.
I will leave it here as long as it takes to post relevant information, once it has been built up to a decent guide it will be moved to the Repository for safekeeping and future refrence, I will prune any posts that are not needed for the topic, and to those who post here please stay on topic and do not repeat information already included.
...LOS

[Antalis::]

Thank you LOS http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif

[PseRamesses]

Quote[/b] (Antalis:: @ Feb. 22 2004,09:27)]Thank you LOS http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif
Thanks LoS
If thread is now pinned is there a way to change the header to more accurately reflect the topic of the thread? Or a completely new sticky-thread on the topic could be created? I think a more correct header should be: "Battlemap editing - Q&A´s". What do you think?

[PseRamesses]

How steep does a hill need to be to be unpassable/ greyed out on the minimap. Is there a separate landscape texture for this? What I mean is can any texture be used like woods, grass etc and just by raising the ground enough creates an unpassable cliff? Darn, I hate not being able to express myself fully in English sometimes. It would be better if everyone was speaking Swedish, LoL

[Antalis::]

Yes, it depends, which textures you´re using:
No matter how steep the mountain is.


If you´re using, as an example, a cliff texture AND you make a height or hole you will get an unpassable area.

Not on flat ground, also if you´re using a cliff textures

So you will need both: The right texture and a height (or hole).


If you´re making a mountain with forrest textures, you will get no unpassable area, no matter how large your mountain is.


If you´re making a hill or mountain without the right texture, then you´re units can walk like flys up the walls of the mountain.
Very strange.


There are three groups of textures, which can be used for unpassable areas.In my picture are the arid version of them, but its always the same texture numbers:

http://max45.250free.com/textures.jpg


Antalis

[Norseman]

Quote[/b] ]
So you will need both: The right texture and a height (or hole).


Although I have always experienced the same as you before, I somehow, just by making a downhill, got an unpassable area on the Carcassonne map currently in my workshop. The texture is the basic one(nr.4?). Methinks this is a bit odd .

Well, it actually suits the map very well so I won't try to change it, but I thought I should mention it. You can have a look at it when the map is finished if you're interested.

[Antalis::]

Sure http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif


Antalis

[PseRamesses]

Thanks guys I suspected that it was connected to certain textures. I just had an idea and needed someone to spoil it for me, he he Are we the only ones interested in this topic?
Yahoo... three musketeers rides again http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/ht_charge.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/grouphug.gif

[Antalis::]

How to implementate a custom battlefieldmap into the campaign:



Open your MTW-Maps folder (Battle/Maps): There you will find very different names for maps.
But they have always the same elements in the name:

plains
flat
hilly
mountain

inland
coastal
river

desert
steppes

to

hills


Now open a campaignmap.txt, like "early.txt" (campmap/startpos): There are the landscape definitions:

You will find definitions for terrain, clima, architecture style.

Scroll down a bit in this early.txt and you will find this landscape definitions:

//========================================
//Border Info
//Attributes of borders between provinces
//and the maps available to each border
//========================================


As an example:

SetBorderInfo:: ID_NORTH_UMBRIA ID_MERCIA 7712 6000 0 LUSH AT_WESTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND FLAT NO_RIVER

What is defined here:

If you´re attacking FROM North_Umbria TO Mercia you will get a "FLAT" terrain, with a "LUSH" clima and with "WESTERN_EUROPEAN" architecture style.
Also the battlefieldmap is INLAND (not coastal).

So, the battlefieldmap that will be used in such a battle will have this name: "flatinland01" (or any number: from 01-...) (don´t know if there is an end: but I doubt so)).


Other example:

SetBorderInfo:: ID_KHAZAR ID_CHERNIGOV 27656 6568 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND FLT2HLL RIVER

Name of the map that would be used: "flattohillsinlandriver01"

You can see that this is a rivermap with a river definition: The "NO_" (NO_RIVER) is deleted and only RIVER is written.


But don´t beliefe that your map has to be really flat and inland like in the first example: If it has this NAME then it will be used, no matter if its in reallity a mountainmap or something else.


-------------------
Look again into your mapsfolder: You will find following names for maps (wihout the castles):


flatinland
flatinlandriver
flattohillsinland (FLT2HLL/HLL2FLT: vice versa)
flattohillsinlandriver
flattomountaininland

hillyinland
hillycoastal
hillyinlandriver
hillytomountaininland (HLL2MNT/MNT2HLL: vice versa)

mountaininland
mountaincoastal

plainsinland
plainsinlandriver

desertflat
deserthilly
desertcoastal

steppesinland

---------------

You can see again: flat, hilly, mountain, inland, coastal, plains, river and so on.

Sometimes there is a "to" in it and "hills".


So all you have to do is to name your custom map with such a name that fits to your landscape (but you must not, the name is the important thing): If you have made a mountainmap without a coast then name it: "mountaininland01" (02, 03, 04, 05 ...) (never forget the zero).

If your mountainmap has a coastal-character, then: "mountaincoastal01".


But MTW is very flexible: You could also define new names:
like: "mountaininlandriver":

SetBorderInfo:: ID_BURGUNDY ID_MILAN 11600 12968 0 ARID AT_SOUTHERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN RIVER


Then simply put the custom map into your Maps folder (Battle/Maps) and if you have replaced all maps with your maps you will always get them in the campaign.
If you have only replaced a few or only one then not very often, randomly.

So evertime you´re attacking a province from a province with the attack-definition (from province1->province2) (look above) for the battlefieldmap "mountaininland" you could get your map to play.


If you don´t want to replace a map and only want to add one, then give it a number fitting to the existing maps: So if you have a flatmap and MTW has 24 flatmaps in the Maps-folder, then give your map the name "flatinland25" and you will not replacing any map of MTW and have added one.



Antalis

[ShadesWolf]

Excellent work Antalis:: http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-2thumbsup.gif

[PseRamesses]

Antalis, you´re a fountain of knowledge. I´m stunned and amazed. This is exactly the kind of inormation I need. Thanks a mill http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-stunned.gif

[Antalis::]

Ok a bit more http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif :


This I have written in the NTW forum about creating a new maps folder (without the need of replacing the maps in the MTW folder):


"Do you plan to replace all MTW maps?
Thats a huge work, but its worthing.

If you don´t want to replace all maps in the maps folder, you could create a new maps folder:
It must have the name, which you have defined in the startpos.txt:
You have written in 2.09 beta there: SetMapTexturesSubdir:: "nap".
This nap-folder has to be in the Maps folder.

So: "Battle/Maps/nap.

Put in this new folder the NTW landscapes.
For every definition in the startpos.txt (like hilly, FLT2HLL, MOUNTAINS ...) put some landscape-maps in it.

But you need also a nap-textures folder in Battle/MapImage.
So Battle/MapImage/nap .
There you have to put every mapimage you need for your new maps and put them in the right folders.

You must create there:
If you have lush and temperate definitions, you need a lush and temperate folder there and so on.

Only problem is that if you´ll release a new beta/version the maps will be doubled in the mapslist in custom-battles and map-editor list (problem is that MTW allows only 1000 maps there).
So if someone has two campaignmap.txts of two different NTW versions installed: For example v2.00 and v 2.09, then that happens.
But that is no problem, if you have lesser then 1000 maps what I know.

So you could tell the people than to delete the old campaign.txt(s), or you could replace the old campain.txt(s) with exact the same name of the new campaign.txt.


Put the castles in the normal Maps folder (you must replace every castlemap there.
It depends on the definitions you have made in the startpos-txt-file (in the castlepart there) which castleseries you need to replace. If you don´t have plains-castle definitions you don´t need to replace the castleplains, what I know).

For hilly thats 5 series to replace."


Antalis

[PseRamesses]

...moore, mooore, moooore... my preciousssss http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-greedy.gif

[Antalis::]

Ok more, but not from me:

This thread is thought as collection of knowledge about maps, the map-editor, landscapes, castles and definitions:

Everyone can post in here to share his knowledge about creating maps and everything surrounding it.


So here is something "Norseman" has posted in a thread in the topic "Castles and maps (http://www.totalwar.org/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=26;t=13311)" (started by ShadesWolf) and should also be posted here I think:





Zitat[/b] ]CastleHilly02_2_1

First in the name is "Castle". Second comes the terrain(in this ex. Hilly, but could also be either "flat" or "plain").

The 02 means the second map serie with a hilly landscape; in other words a map-serie with almost identical terrain, but with different castle levels and upgrades. The most series CA has used for a given terrain-type is 5.

The _2 tell us it is a keep => _1 is a Fort,_2=Keep, _3=Castle, _4=Citadel, _5=Fortress.

The final _1 indicates "Curtain Walls" upgrade => _
0=No upgrade to the castle-level, _1=First upgrade, _2=Second upgrade


2) Open the startpos file you want to use. Find Brittany under the header
//========================================
//Region Attributes
//The special characteristics for a region
//========================================

Here the region architechture, landscape, starting culture etc. is specified. For brittany you will find the landscape to be "HILLY".
Notice the column "MAPGROUP". All regions have the
number -1. This is the number that ties a battlemap to the region. -1 simply means random, that is; the game selects a random map among the castlemaps that have the correct landscape (Brittany:Hilly) and castle-upgrade(15 levels: Fort,Fort Motte, Fort Motte with Bailey, Keep ... and so on).

3) In the startpos file: Edit the mapgroup-nr. for Brittany to for example 7 (instead of random number -1).

What you then have to do is to make a map serie for your brittany castle; 15 maps, one for each castle upgrade. It sounds harder than it is, because what you do is to make a single landscape-map and just build a larger and larger castle while saving the map with the correct name at each castle upgrade. The names of the 15 maps must now be in this form:
castlehilly07_*Castle-level*_*Upgrade-level*

The reason for using 7 instead of 6 (as CA has used the 5 first ones) is to prevent the game from selecting your brittany map for another region with mapgroup-nr set to random(-1). Apparantly, if there is no nr.6 the game will not be able to select the nr.7 randomly. Only when you instruct the game to use map-serie nr.7 for a given region in the startpos-file will it then be able to select it.

Thanks Norseman for those very good informations: You helped me very much with that, when I read it some months ago.


Antalis

[PseRamesses]

Yeah, Norse showed me that one and some other stuff a while back but it´s good that it gets posted here... real good info. How fortunate I am to have two mentors in mapmaking. Maybee I´ll play the lottery this weekend... if my luck doesn´t run out until then.

[Antalis::]

How to make new ground textures:


Here the basics about making new ground textures: I never used new one in my maps, because I thought the one in MTW are ok.

But here the knowledge about making them:


Open your Textures/Ground-folder:
There you will find all used MTW ground textures seperated from each other in different clima-folders .

Choose one clima, where you want to add a new texture:

As an example "Arid": Open the Arid folder and you will find 181 textures there.

If you want to add a new texture to arid, open one of the textures there or make a absolutly new one with your graphic editing software.
I use Paint-Shop pro 8.

It must have the resolution: 256x256 with 16 million colors and it must have the tga-format.

Ok, make your new texture and save it in tga format outside of MTW with a new number (as example "182").
Then open your texture again with IRFAN VIEW and save it again as tga-format and put it into your Arid folder (Textures/Ground/Arid).
If you use your tga of Paint shop pro 8 it will crash when you´re loading your map or map-editor.
I don´t know if another graphic software can save it as tga and it works except Irfan View (try it).

Now you can choose and use a new texture in the map-editor.


You can also change the existing textures if you want.


Is it possible to make a new unpassable area: No.
It seems that it depends on the number of the texture and every new texture will only be a normal texture.


And never forget that if you will add a new texture to a clima folder also the other folders in the Ground folder need it in it (changed if you want to lush style and so on) if you want to play your map also in other clima zones.

btw: You can also change the water texture: Its texture nr.: "000".

http://max45.250free.com/new.jpg


Antalis

[Antalis::]

The castledefinitions:


Open your campmap/startpos folder: Open as example your "Viking.txt" and search the castledefinitions:


//========================================
//Castle Map Groups
//specifies the number of castle map groups
//available to this start pos.
//This is needed for determining which
//castle maps are to be used for each region
//in siege battles.
//========================================

example:
SetAttributes:: ID_LANDREG_27 "Middel Seaxe" 0 CATHOLIC_CULTURE LUSH AT_DARK_AGE_EUROPEAN -1 120 "Bilmiga" INLAND FLAT NO_RIVER TRUE



Maybe you have asked yourshelf sometimes, why there are also definitions for landscapes:


Well in this definitions for the castles is defined what landscape-type will be used, if in this province where the castle stands, is a rebellion, or if troops trying to break a siege.


In this example from above a flatinlandmap will be be used if there is a rebellion.

Also a castleflat-map will be used too, if there is a castle assault.


You cannot find all landscape types there:
Only:

flat
plains
mountain
hilly.


Look into your Maps folder (Battle/Maps): You will find three different castlenames there:

castleflat
castleplains
castlehilly

Which castlemap will be used depends on the castledefinitions: If plains is defined , then a castleplainsmap will be used and so on.

If mountain is defined the castlehillymap will be used what I know, also if hilly is defined.


Also: What landscape-type is written, if you click on a province, depends what you have defined in the castledefinitions.



Antalis

[PseRamesses]

He he, Antalis my friend. Either you´ve been waiting for this thread to start for a veeery looong time, or you are on a serious educational tour? Keep´em coming... you´ve got one serious fan atleast.

[Antalis::]

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif I worked about several months very intense with the map-editor and the definitions and I thought that I should share my knowledge to everyone that is interrested.
So the time was right when you started the thread.

[PseRamesses]

Antalis,
Either I´m getting old, am a slow learner or I´m getting tired. Explain to me the following:

1. Can I pre-determine specific province maps for specific provinces or do I stand the risk of them popping up somewhere else with the same attributes?
2. I can pre-determine a specific castle-map to a specific province, can´t I?
3. Can I pre-determine which province-map that will be used weather the attack comes from? Example:

Sea
Pomerania Prussia Lithuania
Poland

I want to be able to make a shore-map for the "sea-attack", a coast-map for the "Pomerania & Lithuania attacks" and finaly a inland-map for the "Poland-attack". All linked and only used for Prussia.

[Antalis::]

Defining a specific map to a specific region:


To your questions:

1. Well: Yes and no.

You can define a specific custom battlemap for a specific province: But the problem is, that you only can have about 15-20 such working provinces (maybe a few more).


All you need to do is: Give your specific map a unic name, which no other map has: like: "mountaininland01" (delete all other mountaininlandmaps in your folder or invent a new name that fits to the definition rules. Read the post above).
Only one map has then such a name in the Maps folder and only this map will then be used for a specific province and its definition:


As an example:

If you want to have a specific battlefieldmap only in Hungary appearing:

So search every province which has a connection to Hungary:
Thats the following provinces:

SetBorderInfo:: ID_BOHEMIA ID_HUNGARY 17696 10656 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND HLL2FLT NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_AUSTRIA ID_HUNGARY 16888 12264 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND FLAT RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_CROATIA ID_HUNGARY 16912 13496 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND HILLY NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_SERBIA ID_HUNGARY 18304 13600 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND HILLY RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_BULGARIA ID_HUNGARY 19320 13600 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND HLL2FLT NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_WALLACHIA ID_HUNGARY 19920 13392 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MNT2FLT NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_CARPATHIA ID_HUNGARY 20368 11104 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND HLL2FLT NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_POLAND ID_HUNGARY 19144 9992 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND HLL2FLT NO_RIVER



Now change theire definitions to mountaininland:
like this:

SetBorderInfo:: ID_BOHEMIA ID_HUNGARY 17696 10656 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_AUSTRIA ID_HUNGARY 16888 12264 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_CROATIA ID_HUNGARY 16912 13496 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_SERBIA ID_HUNGARY 18304 13600 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_BULGARIA ID_HUNGARY 19320 13600 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_WALLACHIA ID_HUNGARY 19920 13392 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_CARPATHIA ID_HUNGARY 20368 11104 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER

SetBorderInfo:: ID_POLAND ID_HUNGARY 19144 9992 0 LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER


Like you can see, all this FROM - TO definitions have now INLAND + MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER defined.

So if you only have one single map with the name "mountaininland" (so mountaininland01) in your Maps-folder, then you will always get your specific custom map, if you´re attacking Hungary from any province surrounding it.


But you must also change the castle definition to get the specific map also in rebellions when they are popping up:

like this:
SetAttributes:: ID_HUNGARY "Hungary" 0 CATHOLIC_CULTURE LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN -1 575 "Hungary Castle_xzy" INLAND FLAT NO_RIVER TRUE

Change it to:
SetAttributes:: ID_HUNGARY "Hungary" 0 CATHOLIC_CULTURE LUSH AT_EASTERN_EUROPEAN -1 575 "Hungary Castle_xzy" INLAND MOUNTAIN NO_RIVER TRUE

You see the problem?

You can only have as many specific maps for specific provinces as you have working unic/single names for maps.

So I guess about 15-20 provinces will work in this way (maybe a bit more).


2. I fear no.
You can, if your castle has no ubgrades but with more not really.
You can name it like a landscape and define it (like above with the specific landscapes for a specific province like in answer 1).


But I never had tried to solve this problem:
Norseman wrote:
"number -1. This is the number that ties a battlemap to the region. -1 simply means random, that is; the game selects a random map among the castlemaps that have the correct landscape (Brittany:Hilly)."

So maybe its possible.


But it is possible for three maps with the single name: castlehilly01, castleflat01, castleplains01 and if they would be defined like that (hilly, flat, plains) in the castle-definitions (look the post above) and in the Maps folder would not be anozher castlemaps with higher numbers (so no castlehilly02, castleflat02, castleplains02....)


3. Yes, same problem like in point 1 and same method.
But here you must define every province different, which is linked to prussia.
But same problem with to less names also here.

[Antalis::]

Map making is also very linked to Historical Battle creating:

Someone who wants to make a historical battle will need also a new map for it.

So here is the best guide of Historical Battle making which I know:

Its The Modders guide from the Clan Doragon website, made by Barroca. Thank you for this masterpiece of a guide http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif :



Zitat[/b] ]
The Modders Guide
21 August 2002

This Document is a compilation of all the modders notes I have at hand, and the result of numerous trial and error experiments,
written by (in no particular order) DrNo, TosaInu, the Count of Flanders, Choco, Tarrak/Kraxis, ShadesWolf, 96mgb, Swoosh So, Target, Siena72, Emp. Conralius, verysoon, Target, GilJay and all those others I have forgotten, or just as important those whose questions inspired us to try (oh yes, and me - barocca)

If anyone has anything to add please contact me at The Org's Modding Forum
- where you will also find all of the wise men I have listed above.
or contact me at Clan Doragon's forum - doragon.cjb.net,
or email me at barocca_x@hotmail.com, and I will gladly include all new information

Advice before we start editing

Backup the Contents of the Backdrops Folder
..\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Textures\
and the ..\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\batinit folder

Backdrop Enhancement

Location
..\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Textures\Backdrops

To minimise Errors place the BackDrop batch file (download) in this folder
..\Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Textures\Backdrops\
and then run it.
All it does is copy backdrops from folders that have them to folders that do not. - to minimise the number of steps required some overwriting occurs, BUT the files are being overwritten by copies of themselves.

If it will not run in your system simply open the batch file in notepad and copy manually (use windows explorer to copy and rename the folders)
the format for each line is
(command "from directory" "to directory" /switches)
So copy the needed "From" directories to the "To" directories
Overwrite where requested

WARNING - Your backdrops folder is about to change - backup a copy first, and be aware it will go from 7.46MB to 64MB - allowing any combination of Demo map, terrain, season and weather - all explained in this document.






Introduction BDF ADF Unit Types and Other


Barocca




Battle Description/Definition File (the bdf)

Locations
../Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\batinit\Historical Battles
../Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\batinit\Tutorial

The Battle Definitions File (ie Jaffa.bdf) lists all the parameters for the battle.
Here is a explanation of all the fields in the bdf that can be edited and what values(keys) work, and some that don't
(Edit the bdf file using notepad)

The first section of the bdf file, descriptions and movies seem to be disabled for the demo, at least i can't find where to place appropriate files to force a change.

//Map - Terrain - Weather

(sample)
MapName::"Jaffa"
Architecture::AT_ISLAMIC
Terrain::LUSH
BattleType::BATTLE_TYPE_HISTORICAL
Deployement::true
Season::spring
WeatherSequenceId::0

MapName::"Jaffa" - obvious - the map


Valid Demo Maps are :-
FlatInland01
Jaffa
antioch_castle
antioch_practice
bulgaria
bul1_practice
bulgaria2
hillyinland06
sicily
Agincourt

MTW Maps that work - some with minor glitches
Ridges2

Architecture::AT_ISLAMIC
//Architecture::AT_WESTERN_EUROPEAN
//Architecture::AT_SOUTHERN_EUROPEAN
These are building types. Choose the style that suits your Mod.

Terrain::LUSH
//Terrain::ARID
//Terrain::ROCK_DESERT
Terrain Type - unsure of effect on weather

BattleType::BATTLE_TYPE_HISTORICAL - set this key to avoid tutorial messages
//BattleType::BATTLE_TYPE_TUTORIAL - leaving this key in this field for a Mod on a Tutorial may have unforseen consequneces.
These consequences include the tutorial instruction boxes appearing, and no battle results display at the conclusion of battle

Deployement::true
not enabled?, could find no function for this field.

The Next 2 fields in combinataion are supposed to determine the weather,

Season::spring - valid choices spring, summer, winter, autumn
//Season::summer
//Season::autumn
//Season::winter

WeatherSequenceId::0
0 - very sunny
1 - sunny
2 - stormy - fog - rain
3 - cloudy - fog - snow - even in Season::summer
numbers above 3 work, but produce same weather as 3,
also we don't have the correct tile sets or backdrops to give a realistic background/terrain portrayal, but at least we can fight in the rain and snow.
Try different combinations of season and weather.
REMEMBER, unless you have used the Backdrop batch file you may see various error messages when you try to run a game with altered weather.

//Player Descriptions

The 'player' description line, each army/faction (adf) in the battle will need it's own description line.
(sample)
Player::"Richard Coeur de Lion" 5 5 LOCAL "richard" 0 false 19588 28226 180 CHRISTIAN_CULTURE

Fields and values of the Player line

First number after player name is the faction. i.e. 5 Second number is the alliance it belongs to. again 5.

Faction Table
Number, Name and Flag 1
Almohad
2
Byzantium
3
Danish
4
Egypt
5
England

6
France
7
HRE/Germany
8
Italy
9
Poland
10
Russia

11
Castile
12
Turkey
13
Aragon
14
Burgundy
15
Golden Horde

16
Hungary
17
Novgorod
18
Papal states
19
Sicily
20
Switzerland



Six alternate faction sets with Flag and Shield Icons, the Lithuanian set also has Unit Commander names, Both Welsh sets (Updated) come with 2 flags, to replace Turkey or Italy
For use in creating 'fresh' faction's for the Mod. For more information see the "Unit Types and Other" section of this guide. Siena's
Lithuanian Faction Patrick's
Scot's Faction Barocca's
Welsh Faction 1 Barocca's
Welsh Faction 2
NEW
Lithuania
NEW
Scotland
NEW
Welsh set 1
NEW
Welsh set 2


(Click any Image to Download all six in one pack)


LOCAL/ARTIFICIAL is Human or AI,
(I set 2 armies to LOCAL and ended up with waiting for deployment to end. i.e. no other human connected to deploy the other army.)

"Richard" is the army definition file name.
(the Demo will look for Richard.adf)
You can change the names of ALL the adf files to suit yourselves, as long as the bdf has the correct names for them.

Not sure what the 0 is for. I have seen different numbers in different bdf's - best to leave alone,
IFF, however, you do find out what this field does, please let us know.

true/false dictates if you are attacker/defender.

The coordinates (maybe) for initial camera postion (Will have to check that one) seems to be both for when you first enter the map, and camera returns here when you press "Continue"

Next is direction of facing. (in this case 180 degrees)
It would be wise to have opposing armies facing each other

And then culture lastly. Possibly tells the demo which names to use for units without a defined InitialLeaderName(an adf parameter).
CHRISTIAN_CULTURE or MUSLIM_CULTURE or CATHOLIC_CULTURE
There could be many more of these, possibilities could be PAGAN, ORTHODOX, JEWISH, GERMAN, FRENCH etc. etc. - untested

//Triggers (Victory Conditions) (sample)
Trigger::1, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 5, LABEL "Keep King Richard alive.", INVERT_CHECKBOX

The Combination of Triggers results and groups determine the victory conditions, and to which faction/army they apply

//triggers
Trigger::1 - 2 - etc.
Simply Trigger number, needed for victory/defeat calculation
there are 2 Triggers avaiable to us for Demo
BT_GENERAL DIED - general died
BT_INCAPACITATE - all army routs

factions - faction/s this trigger applies to

LABEL "Insert any appropraite text here"

INVERT_CHECKBOX
This applies to Human Defeat Triggers,
It Means - If this event has NOT occured then Mark the Checkbox as Sucessfully Completed

//Results

Result::1, - Result ids number - simply an index number
alliances 5, - alliance this result applies to
style DEFEAT/VICTORY, - Outcome
battle "Jaffa" - Defeat Message to be displayed - cannot change this message - not required for VICTORY result.
(sample)
Result::2, alliances 5, style VICTORY
self explanatory now

Additional Notes
In a multi army battle to ensure ALL enemy factions(armies) MUST be defeated a trigger like this is required
(sample)
Trigger::2, BT_INCAPACITATE, factions 4,1,12 LABEL "Defeat the Enemy."

Factions 4, 1 and 12 must rout or be eliminated If all enemy factions are not listed simply routing or eliminating ONE faction completely will cause victory

//Groups

This is the list of events generated by triggers,
and which results to display for each trigger,
THE Group:: tag itself seems to have little actual meaning, other than a 'pointer' or marker,
changing the order of the tags OR which Group contains which result seems to make no difference.

Group::1, - First Item in Battle Summary screen (? not always?)
PRIMARY - Demo only allows PRIMARY triggers, meaning absolute conditions.
triggers 1 - Trigger number
result_ids 1 - Which result to use for this trigger

(sample)
Group::1, PRIMARY triggers 1 result_ids 1
Means if Primary Trigger 1 occurs display results 1

And thats all there is for the Battle Definition File.

Examples of Trigger sets

Kill The General

//triggers
Trigger::1, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 5, LABEL "Keep King Richard alive.", INVERT_CHECKBOX
Trigger::4, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 4, LABEL "Kill Saladin."

//results
Result::1, alliances 5, style DEFEAT, battle "Jaffa"
Result::2, alliances 5, style VICTORY

//groups
Group::1, PRIMARY triggers 1 result_ids 1
Group::4, PRIMARY triggers 4 result_ids 2

In this trigger set Defeat Occurs if the AI General Survives the battle, even though the AI was routed from the field
(You will have to escape out if Your army routs and your general was not killed - automatic defeat,
If you fail to kill enemy General, and his army routs you will also have to escape out - again automatic defeat, but then the goal was to Kill the general after all)

Kill the General combined with a standard trigger set
//triggers
Trigger::1, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 5, LABEL "Keep King Richard alive.", INVERT_CHECKBOX
Trigger::2, BT_INCAPACITATE, factions 5, LABEL "Don't Let Your Troops Rout.", INVERT_CHECKBOX
Trigger::3, BT_INCAPACITATE, factions 4, LABEL "Rout or Kill Saladin's Army."
Trigger::4, BT_GENERAL DIED, factions 4, LABEL "Kill Saladin."

//results
Result::1, alliances 5, style DEFEAT, battle "Jaffa"
Result::2, alliances 5, style VICTORY

//groups
Group::1, PRIMARY triggers 1 result_ids 1
Group::2, PRIMARY triggers 2 result_ids 1
Group::3, PRIMARY triggers 3 result_ids 2
Group::4, PRIMARY triggers 4 result_ids 2

In the example above
Trigger 1 OR 2 will result in defeat,
Trigger 3 OR 4 will result in victory,
Triggers 1 and 4 will result in an Instant Result, if the general is killed the game ends



Army Description/Definition File (the adf)

Locations
../Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\batinit\Historical Battles
../Medieval - Total War (Demo Version)\Battle\batinit\Tutorial

The adf contains a list of all the units in a faction/army, Each adf must have a line in the bdf player section in order for the units to be deployed.
Each unit listed in the adf must have a seperate Unit Parameter Set.
Each Unit Parameter Set defines all the information needed by the demo to deploy am individual unit. (unit parameters are located between UnitStart:: and UnitEnd:: )

You can place as many units as you wish in an adf file, the Demo will read and initially deploy only the first 16 units in the list at their specified locations, the remainder will arrive as reinforcements after units are withdrawn, destroyed or routed completely from the field. You will be given an option to select a rally point for reinforcements.

You can optionally specify units in the adf as reinforcements with a time delay option. See Reinforcements.


Sample adf file


UnitStart::"Unit"
InitialLeaderName::"Richard"
IsGeneral::true
Position:: 19000 29500
Direction::180
GeneralRank::4
LeaderHonour::4
UnitMon::1
TroopType::LateRoyalKnights
TroopNum::20
TroopHonour::4
Columns::5
CurveRadius::1
FormationType::FORMATION_CLOSE
MeleeMode::ENGAGE_AT_WILL
FatigueLevel::FRESH
HoldPosition::true
GeneralIsDaimyo::true
ArmourLevel::1
WeaponLevel::2
Reinforcements::180
UnitEnd::

UnitStart::"" and UnitEnd:: are the begin and end of each unit description
(Edit the adf file using notepad)


UnitStart::"Unit"
- Seriously, unsure of requirements for this field, Unit works for me, I also use this as a 'name' for the unit to help me create my mods, ie spearmen1, spearmen2 etc.

InitialLeaderName::"Richard Coeur de Lion" - optional parameter
Does NOT have to match the name given in the bdf file
I have seen identical Leader names work AND crash demo
- recommend different names each unit


IsGeneral::true //IsGeneral::false - optional parameter
Is the General of this army - the Demo will select the first unit found in the list with this parameter as the general, If no units with this parameter the first unit in list is the General
- if he flees army morale suffers.
However in order to get the Honour/Valour boost All units within an adf need this parameter I recommend setting your General to True and all subsequent units to false.
Omitting this parameter from any unit in the adf will simply mean no units in his army, including his own unit, gain an honour boost from the Generals Rank.


Position:: 19668 29556
Start location on map
Selecting an area beyond the edge of the map will force that unit (or army) to march onto the field before they can be controlled. The further off the map the longer it will take them to march into play.
You can only use positive numbers, meaning you can only place them beyond the edge of the map on two side of the field of the field. You can start an army at locations as low as 100 on the other two sides, but they will appear on the field almost immediately.
Often when you place an AI controlled army on the map as soon as the battle starts they will move somewhere else. If they are supposed to be protecting your flank this can be a problem. You can place them a select distance off the map and force them to arrive a little late, and thus delay them moving to an undesireable location.


Direction::180
direction of facing on map


GeneralRank::6 - optional parameter
Rank - Each 2 ranks generates an additional Honour point to all units IF this unit is the actual general of the army AND the IsGeneral parameter is included int the Unit parameters of all units in the adf.
not sure of upper limit


LeaderHonour::10 - optional parameter
The Generals personal Honour - applies to him only
not sure of upper limit


UnitMon::1 - optional parameter
may not be used by Demo - other numbers have no effect


TroopType::Archers
unit type, do not use space's,
upper or lower case work for most units,
but the best bet is capitalise individual words
for example : ItalianLightInfantry


TroopNum::180 - optional parameter
- if omitted default is 9 men
how many men in unit


TroopHonour::9 - optional parameter
- if omitted default is 1
with the addition of generals rank bonus some astronomical numbers can be reached
upper effective limit is 16


Columns::60 - optional parameter
- if omitted default is 3 coloumns
how many columns from left to right,
a unit of 60 men in 20 columns will be 3 ranks deep


CurveRadius::1 - optional parameter
do not know - plain and simple.


FormationType::FORMATION_CLOSE - optional parameter
- default is Close
initial unit formation
FORMATION_LOOSE also works
FORMATION_WEDGE does not


MeleeMode::ENGAGE_AT_WILL - optional parameter
- defaults to engage for foot and cavalry or skirmish for missile troops
initial melee mode
SKIRMISH works for missile units
HOLD_FORMATION does not seem to work


FatigueLevel::FRESH - optional parameter
- deafult is Fresh
TIRED produces units who are Quite Tired, and will never recover to any state above that
EXHAUSTED produces Exhausted unit, again no recovery,
other fatigue levels crashed Demo.


HoldPosition::true - optional parameter
do not know - plain and simple.
changing value had no noticeable effect


GeneralIsDaimyo::true - optional parameter
The General of this Unit is the King of this faction,
again the Demo finds the First such List in the adf and ignores subsequent references


ArmourLevel::4 - optional parameter
- default is none
Additonal Armour Bonus (upper limit not known - possibly 4)
(similar to Armouries from STW)


WeaponLevel::4 - optional parameter
- default is none
Additional Weapon Bonus (upper limit not known - possibly 4)
(similar to SwordSmiths from STW)

Reinforcements:: (by Target) - optional parameter
You can force units to act as a reinforcement and delay the time when they become avaiable.
so, if you want a unit to wait 5 minutes before coming on as a reinforcement,
set this parameter to Reinforcements::300
This can be applied to any unit, so you can set up scenarios where you start the battle with only 4 units and then eventually another 12 turn up.
Unfortunately, this also highlights a bug in the demo (which, under normal circumstances you'd never see, so I don't feel really guilty about it) that if your 4 units get crushed before the other 12 turn up, you'll have to twiddle your thumbs until the rest of your army turns up. (Target)


UnitEnd:: - end of this units parameters


The Absolute minimum required for an ADF is

//
// Army description file
//

UnitStart::"Unit"
Position:: 23000 44500
Direction::180
TroopType::Housecarle
UnitEnd::

This will give a unit of 9 Housecarle's of honour 1 in 3 columns,
The unit is a General's unit, although the General has no rank and no honour (possibly his personal honour is One)



Barocca

[Antalis::]

Textures:


A few mistakes that were often been made:


There are not only one texture for a texture: Every texture has 1 main texture and 4 other textures, which make the main texture going smooth into an other main texture:

You have to rotate the texture so long till it fits.

The shadow of the road texture should fit to the other road texture: If they don´t fitting rotate the texture or use another one that fits to the texture.



Here two of the main mistakes, that can happen, when placing textures:

http://max45.250free.com/textures2.jpg


Try to avoid this mistakes: The map would look not very good, if you don´t do so.

[PseRamesses]

Yup And by using the "flip-button" u can make textures fit together that otherwise don´t by just using "rotate".

[Antalis::]

Yeah and again if anyone else also wants to write about his expiriences with the map editor and wants to share his knowledge with us please do so.

btw: I will not tell how to make something asthetically: Everyone has another way to be creative: Someone needs a plan to make something, an other one has another method.

Some like mountains more, other plain-maps and so on.


This thread is only for technical questions and answers in mapediting.

[[{LgtDiv}] Lord Thindigital]

Hello everyone,

We have also made some maps for the Lordz NTW mod, many of the tips we found have been mentioned already here so sorry if i repeat. Thanks to Antalis for that info about the startpos. - very useful....and historical battles - at last a guide



so, to make an 'unorthodox' castle - ie. no keep - different shaped walls - fortified city.

1.start with a working, 'normal' castlemap .....
--------------------------------------------
We found that a 'normal' castlemap must have the following...

Continuous walls with no gaps and gates for entrance and exits,

A keep inside the castle wall - although i think a keep tower will suffice...

The line 'CastleMap' entered in the .inf file of the map....(check out the original castlemap files you'll see what i mean...) you must do this after every time you have saved the file in the editor..

ie, so it looks like this....

Terrains:: LUSH ARID ROCK_DES TEMPERATE

Architecture:: LUSH W_EURO
Architecture:: ARID S_EURO
Architecture:: ROCK_DES ISLAMIC
Architecture:: SAND_DES ISLAMIC
Architecture:: TEMPERATE E_EURO

Game_Types:: SP_BATTLE CUSTOM MP_LAN MP_INET

MP_Styles:: LMS KOTH CTF

CastleMap


this should produce a working map for you with the men deploying inside the fort...
--------------------------------------------

2. Once your castlemap is working you can then edit it again - removing the keep - making the walls into any shape you like...

be sure to add the 'CastleMap' line in the maps .inf file each time you edit your map.

3. This way ensures no chance of 'broken' castlemaps - by which I mean maps where units cannot pass through destroyed walls, missing 'damaged wall' graphics and broken deployment zones (units dont deploy inside the castle correctly)

hope this is of some help

regards

Lord Thindigital

Lordz Mapping Team

[Antalis::]

Yes very usefull informations: But one point is interresting:

You wrote that this is needed:

----
Terrains:: LUSH ARID ROCK_DES TEMPERATE

Architecture:: LUSH W_EURO
Architecture:: ARID S_EURO
Architecture:: ROCK_DES ISLAMIC
Architecture:: SAND_DES ISLAMIC
Architecture:: TEMPERATE E_EURO

Game_Types:: SP_BATTLE CUSTOM MP_LAN MP_INET

MP_Styles:: LMS KOTH CTF


CastleMap
----

Yes, thats the way also in MTW castlemaps are defined, but in my maps is written:

Terrains:: LUSH ARID ROCK_DES TEMPERATE

Architecture:: LUSH W_EURO
Architecture:: ARID S_EURO
Architecture:: ROCK_DES ISLAMIC
Architecture:: SAND_DES ISLAMIC
Architecture:: TEMPERATE DA_EURO
Architecture:: DARKAGE_LUSH DA_EURO

Game_Types:: SP_BATTLE CUSTOM MP_LAN MP_INET

MP_Styles:: LMS KOTH CTF

And they´re working perfect as castlemap without that castlemap is written.


So is it only an information that "castlemap" is written, or is it something essential, but I don´t believe so.
That´s the question.


About needing a keep: I made a map without ever using a keep and its working, so I don´t believe its nessassary.
Thats my expirience about one castle-series.



Antalis

[Norseman]

A lot of good info here now, nice work Antalis http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif

Just think I should clear up one thing though:


Quote[/b] ] Quote from PseRamesses:
2. I can pre-determine a specific castle-map to a specific province, can´t I?



Quote[/b] ] Quote from Antalis:
You can, if your castle has no ubgrades but with more not really.


You can pre determine a specific castlemap to a specific province. Not only that, you can pre determine a castle-mapgroup, that is; a castle with all upgrades and castle levels.

English is not my first language, and I'm afraid I can't explain it much better than I have already done in the thread mentioned(Link (http://www.totalwar.org/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=26;t=13311)). Read it, and try to do as it says. If you can't make it work, please post a question here specifying what the problem is, and I'll do my best to guide you until you succeed.
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-balloon.gif

[[{LgtDiv}] Lord Thindigital]

Hey all,

Antalis http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif - the above was a 'failsafe' method we developed, as we made our castleseries for NTW - - indeed some maps we made didnt seem to need the .inf edit - but sometimes we built a large castle only to discover that in testing, the castle was 'broken', sometimes the .inf edit fixed this, http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-smile.gif

regards

LTD

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/thindigital/lgtdiv/screenshots/castleflat252.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/thindigital/lgtdiv/screenshots/Fort2-opt.jpg

--hey, Moderators-- how come Antalis is still just a 'Member' here - I think he deserves more credit for his contributions ....

[Lord Zimoa of Flanders]

Quote[/b] ]--hey, Moderators-- how come Antalis is still just a 'Member' here - I think he deserves more credit for his contributions ....



Justice please Gentleman..... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif

CZoF

[Kaatar]

I'm making a historical campaign and I need to know where to place my troops. This is done using the x and y axis. e.g.
x:34645
y:24587

Is there any way to find out what the numbers should be to have a unit on a certain place on the map? I thought it might be possible using the level editor so I posted here.

[Antalis::]

It exists a grid, made by Doug Barnett, with coordinates on it: It was made for Shogun, which had smaller maps then MTW.
But it gives you a rough overview.

You will learn, where to place something, with the time.


You can download it here:

NewMapGrid (Scenario Tool) (http://www.3ddownloads.com/strategy-gaming/totalwar/Tools/NewMapGrid.zip)


Or try this older version:
mapgrid2 (http://www.3ddownloads.com/strategy-gaming/totalwar/Tools/MapGrid2.ZIP)


Antalis

[Kaatar]

Thank you, Antalis::. You da man.

36 minute wait for something that will take me roughly 4 seconds to download .... I just love 3ddownloads ... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-confused.gif

[Antalis::]

Making starting coordinates for units in normal battlefieldmaps?


There is no way to set startingcoordinates on normal battlefieldmaps.

The only thing you can do is: Well, the attacker starts in the north and the defender in the south and you could design the map like this.


A rule is, that the units try to have a hill at the beginning and deploy there. But thats not always so.


But you can set starting coordinates for Historical battles.

[Antalis::]

How to create a HISTORICAL CAMPAIGN:


Ok what will you need:

1. A new folder for your Historical campaign.
2. Historical battles and theire landscapes and mapimages.
3. A HCF file.
4. A changes file, where the descriptions of your used battles are.
5. A HistCamapaign.txt-file
6. A TGA with a portrait (or two).
7. A BIF file.


First of all you need some Historical battle maps for it and theire landcape-maps and mapimages.
The landscapes for the used historical battles should be in the: "Battle/Maps".
The mapimages should be in the right "Battle/MapImage" folder (depends on the definitions of the for the hist campaign used historical battles in which terrain folder the mapimages are).


I will use the "Barbarossa" Historical campaign of MTW as an example here:


Ok, create a new folder in "Battle/batinit/Historical Campaigns" with the name of your new Historical campaign:

Put the used historical battles in it.
Put also a HCF-file (the main file for Hitorical campaigns) in the new folder of your Historical campaign (open one of the already existing Historical campaigns of MTW and copy one of the "HCF"-files there into your new Historical campaign folder).

Open this HCF-file (as an example the Barbarossa HCF file with the Editor from Windows):

------------------
//
// Barbarossa
//

CampaignStartpos::"early"

NumBattlesInCampaign::5

BattleName::"Siege of Milanese border fort"
BattleName::"Carcano 1160"
BattleName::"Campaign Milan 1161"
BattleName::"San Romano 1161"
BattleName::"Legnano"


Predefined::true
CampaignName::"Barbarossa"
Description::"Barbarossa_Description_Label"


SortOrder::3


----------------------

Ok, rename the HCF to the name of your new historical camapign.

Then set the correct used campaignmap-startpos for the historical battles (look into the hist. battles of your campaign which startpos.txt is used: In this example "early"):

In Barbarrossa "early" is used:

Then set the number of battles:

Barbarrosa has 5.

Then list the used battles in the order they be will listed in the hist. campaign:


BattleName::"Siege of Milanese border fort"
BattleName::"Carcano 1160"
BattleName::"Campaign Milan 1161"
BattleName::"San Romano 1161"
BattleName::"Legnano"


Then: Set the campaignname.


After that define where to find the description for the Historical campaign (not for the historical battles: You have to put them for the hist. battles in the "changes".txt in the LOC/Eng folder):

You have to copy your description into the "HistCampaigns".txt (LOC/Eng):


Create a new decription and define this in the HCF file:

Description::"yourHistCampaignName_Description_Label



--------------------------------------------------------
//
// This contains the translated campaign startpos text.
//

//
// Notes to translators.
//
// i) Only those things between
// {""} need to be translated.
// and the
// {""} should be left in.
// (Unless otherwise specified.)
//
//
// ii) If an untranslated string will have
// (ENG) (FRA) (DEU)
// (ITA) (ESP) (JAP)
// (SCH) (TCH) (KOR)
// at the end of the string.
// This is so we can detect untranslated stings
// easily and can see that they have no been
// translated when the program has been run.
// Once the translation has been done acceptably
// they should be removed.



// iii) The data is organised as follows
//
// ["this is a label"]
// {"This is the translation"}
//
// ["This is another label"]
// {"This is another translation"}
// etc

SetShowTransOn // Do not translate.
//???? Remove when localised.

["StartposData"] {"StartPos data."}



["Barbarossa_Description_Label"]
{"Frederick Barbarossa was the King of Germany and Holy Roman Emperor for nearly 40 years. Like all Emperors, he dreamed of bringing the Empire back to its former greatness, which meant bringing Italy back into the Imperial fold and making sure that the Papacy was under Imperial control too. These two strategic aims were to take Barbarossa into Italy at the head of his armies, and lead to the his excommunication by Pope Alexander III in 1160. In return, Frederick simply chose to regard another churchman as the 'real' Pope and ignored Alexander Barbarossa also launched many attacks into Northern Italy but was eventually forced to realise that he couldn't retake the Italian parts of the Holy Roman Empire by force. It is some of these battles that make up the campaign here. In 1177 he and Pope Alexander came to an agreement and his excommunication was cancelled. Frederick Babarossa drowned while leading his crusading army across the River Saleph (in what is now Turkey), but during the later middle ages he was believed to be sleeping beneath the Imperial castle of Kyffhauser, waiting to rescue his people from dire peril"}

["England_100yrs_War_Description_Label"]
{"The Hundred Years' War was fought by England and France from 1337 to 1457, although warfare was by no means continuous during this period. English kings felt that they had good claims to much of France and even to the French throne. Most of the fighting took place on French soil, but there were occasional attacks on English coastal towns by French raiders. When there was fighting, it was bloody and often merciless. The French nobility regarded war as their vocation, and were horrified to be confronted and beaten by lesser - but more professional - English soldiers. The three battles in this campaign show the differences in warmaking between the English and the French. By 1420 the English, under their finest warrior-king, Henry V, had very nearly achieved their goals. But even victories at Crécy, Poitiers and Agincourt would not be quite enough. As an historical aside, the English owe their traditional two-fingered gesture of contempt to the Hundred Years' War. The French threatened to cut off the first two fingers of any longbowman they captured, thus crippling the man as a warrior. Waving two fingers at the French thus became a way of defying them and daring them to come and make good their threats of mutilation"}

["France_100yrs_War_Description_Label"]
{"With the death of Henry V of England in 1422, the French were spared the humiliation of an English King on their throne. King Charles of France, although irredeemably mad, did his country one last service by just outliving Henry, and the French crown never passed to an English monarch. The English, for their part, were too busy with political in-fighting for control of the child King Henry VI to wage another effective campaign. The tide of war was almost turning in favour of the English until, that is, the appearance of a charismatic young woman, Jeanne d'Arc, who was to lead French armies to new victories and drive out the hated English. This was to be the end game of the Hundred Years' War, and the time that defined France as a unified nation. The battles presented here reflect this period of French resurgence."}

["Richard_Description_Label"]
{"Richard the Lion-hearted, or 'Coeur de Lion', is one of the great warrior kings of English history, although he spent only six months in England during his ten years on the throne - and even that was just to squeeze more money out of the country The rest of the time he was doing what he enjoyed and did best: soldiering. Richard's fame as a warrior was well earned, as he was personally brave, a formidable strategist, a master castle builder and seen as the embodiment of chivalry. His skills eventually gave him command of the Third Crusade, and while he failed to take Jerusalem, it was not for want of trying. His battles were conducted with a good deal of military skill and political 'savvy', as he alternated attacks on the Saracens and negotiations with Saladin. Richard came to an appropriate soldier's end after his crusading days. He died after being shot by a crossbowman while besieging a rebellious vassal in France. Despite his personal wish that the crossbowman should not be harmed for carrying out his duty, once Richard was safely dead his lieutenants captured and flayed Richard's killer in revenge."}

["Saladin_Description_Label"]
{"Saladin, or Salah al-Din Yusuf ibn Ayyub, was the founder of the Ayyubid dynasty in Egypt and the eventual conqueror of the Crusader kingdom of Jerusalem. He brought the city back into Muslim control in 1187 and then defended it against the attacks of, among others, Richard the Lionheart during the Third Crusade. Before this, however, he fought many successful battles against the 'Frankish' Crusaders, always being sensible enough to let the Crusaders' own weaknesses work against them before he moved in for the kill..."}

["Golden_Horde_Description_Label"]
{"'The horde of the Tartars is numberless. When one is killed, another ten spring from the hell whence he came. Each of them has the head of a dog, and carries with him sufficient weapons for three or four warriors.' So wrote Benedict the Pole, and he had every reason to be fearful, even if he had confused Tartars and Mongols. The Golden Horde were more terrible than anything he could have wished to see: cruel, uncompromising and the most efficient military force since the Caesars. They erased cities, slaughtered thousands, and enslaved any survivors. That they turned aside from reaching further into Europe is one of the quirks of history, and due to one death. Their Khan, Ogadai, drank himself to death and a replacement had to be selected from among the Golden Family by the Horde. If Ogadai had not died, who knows where the Horde would have stopped. They could easily have camped in the ruins of Paris, Rome or Cadiz. The battles in this campaign show how efficient their military machine could be with the right leadership."}

["yournameofthehistcampaign_Description_Label"]
{"yourdescription"}


//******************************************************************************************










*************
//******************************************************************************************










*************
//
// MEDIEVAL ADDON TEXT BEGINS HERE:
//
//******************************************************************************************










*************
//******************************************************************************************










*************


SetShowTransOff // Do not translate.
//???? Remove when localised.


----------------------------------------------------------


As you can see: MTW+VI has 6 Historical campaigns: Your campaign would be number "7": So define it like this:

"SortOrder::7"


Now, you can play your campaign, but you never would be able to play the next battles in it, only the first one:

To avoid this: Open the first historical battle of your campaign and define in the BDF file of it (as example from the Barbarossa Campaign):

//results
Result::1, alliances 7, style DEFEAT
Result::2, alliances 7, style VICTORY, battle "Carcano 1160"

This means: If faction 7 (the player: depends which faction the player plays in the battle) wins, then the battle: "Carcano 1160" will be next to play and is unlocked.

Make the same definitions for all following maps and define always the next map there of your campaign.



Ok, that you can win the whole Historical campaign you need to open the BDF-file of the last used battle for the Historical Campaign:

//results
Result::1, alliances 7, style DEFEAT
Result::2, alliances 7, style VICTORY, end COMPLETED_UNLOCKED

and define it like this (remember to set again the players faction right, like in every battle in the hist. campaign):
"style VICTORY, end COMPLETED_UNLOCKED"


If you also want to change the portrait there: Change it with a graphic software and save it as tga format.
Save it after that again also with (as I remember right) "IrfanView" as TGA-format with the Historical Campaigns name.


I´m not sure for what the BIF file there is: Its also a portrait:
But copy one of this BIFs of a MTW campaign into your new folder and rename it to campaigns-name.


Antalis

[Antalis::]

The "setup informations" for custom battles:


Every map has two files: The JJM-file, with all the landscape settings, like which texture is used and so on.

And the "setup informations".txt file.

You can change this second file: So what terrain and architecture style can be choosen, if you want to start a custom battle:


As an example Agincourt:

--------------
Terrains:: LUSH ARID ROCK_DES TEMPERATE

Architecture:: LUSH W_EURO
Architecture:: ARID S_EURO
Architecture:: ROCK_DES ISLAMIC
Architecture:: SAND_DES ISLAMIC
Architecture:: TEMPERATE E_EURO

Game_Types:: SP_BATTLE CUSTOM MP_LAN MP_INET

MP_Styles:: LMS KOTH CTF

--------------


You can change every defition of terrain and architecture there.
Or you can delete some definitions.


If I want to have only arid with South european, then I change it like this:
But I doupt that this will also work with lush.

----------
Terrains:: ARID


Architecture:: ARID S_EURO

Game_Types:: SP_BATTLE CUSTOM MP_LAN MP_INET

MP_Styles:: LMS KOTH CTF

-------------

But don´t be afraid, if your definitions will not working probably like this, if you have only "one" map (the one with the changed definitions) in the SaveMaps-folder or better put the changed map into yout Battle/Maps folder to test if only one terrain and architecture will be used.

Your map should be at least the second there to work, so that only arid south european can be choosen.


If you have another expieriences in this case, then please reply.



Antalis

[Lord Of Storms]

Wow I am impressed on how this thread is developing, keep up the good work all, special thanks to Antalis for his many contributions cheers mate well done http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cheers.gif
P.S. Antalis just to note the info gleaned from the Doragon site relates to the orignal demo for MTW , I think this may be relevant to point out. LOS

[Antalis::]

Yes, you´re right LoS: Thats true, that it was written, when the MTW demo was out, but its the best guide for creating Historical Battles also today that I know.

So I decided to quote it and don´t write another guide.

[Kaatar]

Holy crap, Antalis::. You really went all out. Thanks for the guide :)

[Dirk]

Hallo to all,

Question to fellow mapmakers: Am busy at the moment to 'create' a map for the War of the Roses mod (battle of Barnet) and have run into a perculiarity.
Playing a 'try out' custom battle I noticed that certain parts of my forests were cut off like with a knife (?)
That looks quite odd (as odd as when all of a sudden a hole would appear in the air). My troops who walked into this area simply disappeared...only to emerge a little further on as if they materialized. Does this game offer the option of 'matter transmission' ?
Anyone familiar with this ?

Another thing although this might not be the right forum for it: Reworking an old battlemap into a new set up I was busy removing walls and towers when all of a sudden my screen went black and I crashed back to the desktop. Trying the same thing again all went well. This has never happened before. Any Ideas ?

[Antalis::]

Well thats new to me.

I never had this disappeareing.


To the second problem: It can happen that the map crashes to desktop, if you press too often, in a too short time, the panels on the left side above (like trees-button, texture-button and so on there).
So, if you press in the first second this and in the next second another thing, then again the first thing again there and so on, than it can ctd.

But your map isn´t damaged because of this.
So save sometimes.

[Dirk]

Antalis,

As to the second problem: You are right, that is exactly what I did....so it's not uncommon. Well that's solved. As to the first problem. I don't have a clue as to the cause. maybe someone else will respond with a 'I had that happening and found the cause'. We'll see.
Thanks anyway for your reply

Cheers

[Norseman]

Quote[/b] ]
Question to fellow mapmakers: Am busy at the moment to 'create' a map for the War of the Roses mod (battle of Barnet) and have run into a perculiarity.
Playing a 'try out' custom battle I noticed that certain parts of my forests were cut off like with a knife (?)
That looks quite odd (as odd as when all of a sudden a hole would appear in the air). My troops who walked into this area simply disappeared...only to emerge a little further on as if they materialized. Does this game offer the option of 'matter transmission' ?
Anyone familiar with this ?


Dirk, you don't happen to still have the version of the map with this problem?

If so, could you maybe mail it to me so that I can have a look at it?

e-mail: hjar_randREMOVE@hotmail.com

[Dirk]

Norseman,

Of course I can.
Stupid question though: Looking at your e-mail adress I notice the REMOVE in it. Lately I sent someone else a message who had the same letter combination and I got my mail back as being undeliverable. I guess I need to use the adress without the REMOVE in order to get through...don't I ?

[Norseman]

Quote[/b] ]
Stupid question though: Looking at your e-mail adress I notice the REMOVE in it. Lately I sent someone else a message who had the same letter combination and I got my mail back as being undeliverable. I guess I need to use the adress without the REMOVE in order to get through...don't I ?


Correct.

[Antalis::]

@Dirk:

I have seen this bug now the first time in one of my maps: Really strange.

Like an invisible wall that covers other units behind it.

Then I loaded MTW and the map again and it worked.
Wiard.

I guess that it has something to do with graphiccarddriver: I have an ATI 9600XT and I don´t know if I have the latest driver, but a very new one.

[Dirk]

Antalis,

Yes, although I suspect it's a driver issue, I also found that when answering the question about playing the same battle again with yes it's gone. However when you go back to the main menu and than start with the same map it happens again.

[PseRamesses]

Same thing happened to me when I was fiddeling around with a heavily forrested battlemap. Reloaded the map and it was gone. Later when reloading it again the same thing happens to the same tiles as before.
What I did, that seems to solve the prob in my case, was to delete all forrest around the problem area with a new type of terrain, saved, then re-pinted the forrest - prob gone

[Norseman]

Dirk, when I tried to answer your PM I got the message that your inbox was full. I'll answer here instead:


Quote[/b] (Dirk @ Mar. 19 2004,07:58)]Norseman,
I've tried to send you some files and used the following variations of your adres:
hjar rand@hotmail.com
hjarrand@hotmail.com
hjarand@hotmail.com
No matter waht I tried, they just keep coming back.
What am I doing wrong ?
Dirk

It is a "_" between "hjar" and "rand". It doesn't show very well when it becomes a hyperlink.
Maybe I should write it as this instead, with "AT" replacing "@":

REMOVEhjar_randAThotmail.com

Norse

[Norseman]

Sorry Dirk, I forgot one thing. You need to zip the files, as hotmail thinks one of the map files is a potential virus and won't deliver it.

Sorry for the trouble.

[Antalis::]

The pics in this thread are not working at the moment: My website provider has some technical problems.

If they will not be solved, then I will upload them to another place.

[Antalis::]

I have a question: I´ve never found a "steppe" definition in the startpos file.

How to define steppesmaps?

[PseRamesses]

Quote[/b] (Antalis:: @ April 14 2004,11:06)]I have a question: I´ve never found a "steppe" definition in the startpos file.

How to define steppesmaps?
Didn´t you answer this yourself on a previous post in this thread?

[Antalis::]

Yes I guess you´re right.

Thats the only definition, which I havn´t tried to define, but I guess its simple.
I guess I have to define: INLAND STEPPES NO_RIVER.

Have to try it.

But look in the startpos.txts: There is no such definition.


edit: No it doesn´t work like this in this case.


Any comments?

[Antalis::]

But here a new information:


About the Historical battles:


Look in the BDF file:

Player::"Alexander the Great" 1 1 LOCAL "Alexander" 0 false 38000 15000 0 CATHOLIC_CULTURE
Player::"Darius III" 14 14 ARTIFICIAL "Darius" 0 true 28822 5742 0 MUSLIM_CULTURE

38000 15000 are the coordinates where the camera is at the beginning.

0 = The direction of the camera.

[PseRamesses]

Quote[/b] (Antalis:: @ April 15 2004,06:19)]But look in the startpos.txts: There is no such definition.
Maybee CA intended it to be like this so you must be able to change it to anything you´d wan´t. I looked in the start.pos file and yes there´s no definitions. That´s why I think that you don´t have too define them.

[Antalis::]

Well maybe, but how will MTW knows when to use it?

Thats the question.

Maybe MTW uses it like using the plains definition.
So it would not matter if you name it plainsinland01 or steppesinland01, but I doupt so, because why making two different names for one landscape type.

[PseRamesses]

Could it be that steppe is arid climate then?

[Antalis::]

No, also plains lbms exists in arid, also in temperate and lush.

[PseRamesses]

This topic deserves some serious contemplation since the potential for using this "undefined" map could prove unlimited. Why not turn this issue to the CA-team?

[Antalis::]

Yes the possibilities would be huge.

[SaintVitus]

OK, I have read this relatively old thread through, but I have a question.

I made a very large castle for my castle map. Flat land around it, very plain, several levels to it. I always use the snap to corner, center etc thing and my walls are unbroken and look very nice. It works as a castle map, but I would like to edit it some more. As it is, if I were to raise ground like I want to, I would have wall sections seemingly isolated on a mountain side. So, I want to shorten the walls to they don't connect all the way around. Then I can raise mountains to cover some of the area a wall section otherwise would. What I mean is something like this:



(pretend this is a top view)


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
/ \
\ / btw, the ^^ things are mountains,
\ / the \ and _ are walls.
\/


I hope you get the idea. As already stated, there are a few things a castle needs in order to function like one, namely unbroken walls that connect, gates, and perhaps a keep. Can I get around this? In a previous post someone said that writing castlemap in a certain file in a certain place would fix it so you could play around with it. This has not been my experience. I did that after getting the map to work, then I edited it to the way I originally hoped to get it, saved, wrote in castlemap, and tried to play a battle. I wasn't deploying inside the fort. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


Another question, how do I get gates in my custom maps to work? I have not been able to make working gates so far, and I have absolutely no idea how to make them or even if that is possible.


One more thing, can I edit some files or something so that I can get towers that won't fire any missiles?

[Antalis::]

You need indeed a castle with walls running all around.
There should not be a gap between the walls.

So if I get your idea right, it isn´t possible.

Mountains are no walls.


About the gates: Use working gates: There is one gate: "locked gate", don´t use it.
Other then that it should work, if you have a closed wallsystem.

[SaintVitus]

Thanks, I guess. You gave me an answer, but I am dissapointed. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif I was going to use texture to make the mountain impassable so that it sort of continued the wall and in play you couldn't march up a vertical height to get in the inner ring. I was hoping that I could trick the program somehow to think it was a castlemap without all the requirements.

Anyway, can I send you my map? see if you might understand why the gates won't work?



I am asking this to save time, because my map takes a while to load, and editing it, saving, loading a try out battle and redoing it is tedious. OK, pretend I made a square castle, connected walls, a working castlemap. If I were to raise ground in front of a wall section to sort of hide it, and create an illusion that the wall is built into the mountain, the section will not be at the same height as the others. Will it still be recognized as connected by the program?

I could also connect the first wall, the outer wall, and leave the others open ended and looking built into the mountain. BTW I have five or six seperate walls, each built inside of one another. With the other requirements, will it be recognized as a castlemap?

[Antalis::]

You need a ringsystem.
Thats all.
Then the gate will workingt.
The MTW engine is very limited in that case.


And to try to build the walls inside the mountain doesn´t working at all: The walls would fit to the heights.

And yes, if you try to hide it with hills in front of the walls and its a wallsystem it should work.
Try it.
But it looks not very well.

---
If it will be recognized as castlemap?
Guess so, but you have to test it.


Maybe remove the seperate walls and use only closed wall systems as ringsystems.

If that really doesn´t working then I can send you my e-mail addy with PM.

[DragonRider]

Hello Antalis & others interested in the map editor, I am new to this site, but have a question that nobody can answer in the total war forum. You & the readme text describe how to use the river, but I cannot find it to use in a map, even in the textures. I know about raising sea levels, and have built some interesting moats, but where r rivers, and is there another way to add a coastline besides paintng sand on a hill & raising the sea level to suit? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-help.gif

[PseRamesses]

Quote[/b] (DragonRider @ July 03 2004,23:18)]You & the readme text describe how to use the river, but I cannot find it to use in a map, even in the textures. I know about raising sea levels, and have built some interesting moats, but where r rivers, and is there another way to add a coastline besides paintng sand on a hill & raising the sea level to suit? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-help.gif
If I understand your problem correctly you have a problem placing rivers? Well, you can´t "place" rivers with a terrain button. What you need to do is to lower the terrain into a trech/ canal. By rising the "sealevel", even on an inlandmap, this will fill your river with water. Don´t forget to make the river run from one corner of the map to the other. To answer you secon question there is no other way to create a river or a coastline. Good luck

[DragonRider]

Thankyou PseRamesses, for your response. I have dug trenches/canals & filled them with water, but my point was that it looks nothing like the rivers in the actual game battles. The readme says that the bridge will fit from bank to bank once I use the map in a custom game, I am yet to try this, but find it hard to believe. But at least I now know that I was looking for something that is not there at all. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-wall.gif

[PseRamesses]

Quote[/b] (DragonRider @ July 06 2004,05:34)]Thankyou PseRamesses, for your response. I have dug trenches/canals & filled them with water, but my point was that it looks nothing like the rivers in the actual game battles. The readme says that the bridge will fit from bank to bank once I use the map in a custom game, I am yet to try this, but find it hard to believe. But at least I now know that I was looking for something that is not there at all. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-wall.gif
No problem Dragonrider
Everything will look ok when you play the map. Belive me the bridge will fit and the river will look like the ones in the game. You can actually elaborate with bridges and rivers quite a bit. Ex; shore-bridge-sanddune-bridge-shore. No matter how long the crossing the bridge will be stretched to fit from shore to shore. However be careful not to place more than one river to avoid oddities. I actually made a map with a river and a trench around the castle away from the river and it worked but I belive I´m pushing the programming this way. I´ve also made playable island maps, completely surrounded by the sea with just a tiny land in the north and south connected to the edge to allow routers and reinforcements. Good luck

[DragonRider]

Thanks a lot http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-smile.gif

[AmbrosiusAurelianus]

[QUOTE=PseRamesses]Using the map editor to create a custom battle map leaves me with some questions:
1. How do I determine startingpoints for each army on the battle-map?

Somebody responded that 1 was not possible. If so can one swap the CPU and Human positions around, because I want to play Hastings as the English on top of the hill. In Custom games I can either get it to make the English on top and attacking(?), or below and defending. This seems crazy to me and frustrating, because I want to defend the hill. It is also annoying that the Huscarl/fyrd units from the VI game aren't in the historic battle, only the early period stuff. Does anyone know how to put huscarls and the like in the early period so that I can have them against fuedal knights.

I'm sure this is a forlorn hope, but thanks if anyone responds. :wall:

Regards,
Ambrosius.

[saundersag]

I hope i can be of some use. Firstly you should get a program called dragon editor, you can find this on the org downloads. You also need to have windows service pack 1. Then open up dragon editor you will have to set it in the total war directory. Then load up the early period startpos section. Set go to viking huscarle and frydmen then go across to end and where it says no faction type FN_ENGLISH. Now you will be able to use these units for custom battle games for the english.

N.B you will not be able to play multiplayer with this total war if you do this.

[AmbrosiusAurelianus]

[QUOTE=saundersag]I hope i can be of some use. Firstly you should get a program called dragon editor, you can find this on the org downloads. You also need to have windows service pack 1. Then open up dragon editor you will have to set it in the total war directory. Then load up the early period startpos section. Set go to viking huscarle and frydmen then go across to end and where it says no faction type FN_ENGLISH. Now you will be able to use these units for custom battle games for the english.

Thanks, but I still have to find a way of getting the Human player to defend the hill as the English at Hastings. I heard that someone did a mod for the demo in which you could play as Harold, so I guess it is possible.

Cheers for the help anyway. ~:)

[Weebeast]

I didn't know I could post here. o.O


How to create a castlemap with a river:
The castle has to be in the south of the map on the other side of the river.
That's not the case with Orleans map, is it? The castle is in the south but it's not on the 'other side.'

Comments..?

Btw, I thought it didn't matter so I made one in the south with its gate extending to the northern side of the river. It ctded. :( LOL

[Lord Ahrens]

Hi all, I know this thread is old as petrified crap, but im creating some pretty cool siege maps for Samurai Warlords and am having errors with a few things. The first is the gate, it seems to never open doors, attackers never assault, and there is always an annoying sound of hinges opening repeating when defenders go through it. I followed all guidelines but still the attackers seem to assualt walls and they don't destroy at all.
They just go through them magically after the message comes up they have been destroyed. Any veteran map maker please help me figure out whats going on, thank you!

[macsen rufus]

Hi Lord Ahrens,

You can still find some useful stuff amongst the coprolites ~D

Have you checked all the basic stuff three times over? Like all walls join, form complete rings, all placed the same way round etc?

Then have you done anything non-standard: edited textures, changes missiles etc?

I know I've had some maps that have done similar things a long long while ago, but for now can't recall the fixes. Although I think one of them was a wall that looked complete, but had a gap about a pixel wide between sections that stopped it being a full 'ring' - bceause I had placed one section without snapping to grid - it looked close enough by eye, but it wasn't close enough to work.

[Lord Ahrens]

Thanks Macsen Rufus, this really helped with the issue. I'll do all castle maps for them now and post them up in a month for the mod.

[macsen rufus]

You're welcome :bow:

Good luck with the project, but be warned - making castle maps can be addictive ~D