View Full Version : Why is the total war Series so popular?
Toda Nebuchadnezzar
03-27-2002, 04:04
Although not as popular as other games STW and MI/WE has been very popular.
Why is that do you think?
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Grand Master of
The Knights Templar
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Quote Originally posted by Toda Nebuchadnezzar:
Although not as popular as other games STW and MI/WE has been very popular.
Why is that do you think?
[/QUOTE]
They're popular coz you don't play them anymore. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
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BarryNoDachi
03-27-2002, 04:16
he did today http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka)
hey its only the best game ever but that wont affect popularity...
Toda Nebuchadnezzar
03-27-2002, 05:11
Er thanx guys.
Tera hopefully I will be able to view the battle soon, and then edit out the bits I want.
You will like it.
P.S. Tera keep it schtum oder will ich kicken diesen ass! (and they say I speak German http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/rolleyes.gif go figure! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif)
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Jaguara:"& http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/rolleyes.gif at Toda http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
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[This message has been edited by Toda Nebuchadnezzar (edited 03-26-2002).]
oldwarhorse
03-27-2002, 05:43
it`s simple really!
the sengoku jidai period is very interesting and appeals to a lot of people. everyone knows what a samurai is. everyone knows what a ninja is. everyone knows what a geisha is.
this and throw in some huge epic real time battles and you got a brilliant game on your hands!
i`m not sure if M:TW will have the same feel that S:TW does but i`m sure it will do just as good if not better!
Inti bahnan ja bicca hanzir l'art mahruq go bott...
Understand that Toda http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Tera.
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evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)
Toda Nebuchadnezzar
03-27-2002, 06:27
Tera you know I would if I could, but sadly im not a linguist and so have no hope of being able to translate that.
Is Maltese a dialect that is derived from Italian and Arabic?
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He is the Messiah
No i'm not the Messiah
Only the true Messiah would deny it.
Alright then I am the Messiah.
HE IS THE MESSIAH HOORAY!!!
I can make a thesis on Maltese actually, but here's a brief description.
The Maltese language is semitic-based, ie. derives from Arabic. However throughout its history it has been influenced heavily by Latin-based (Italian, French, Spanish) languages and Anglo-Saxon languages (English, German) thus Maltese formed.
The merge of many linguistical characteristics is easily seen - for example most Maltese words are Semitic but they're written like Latin languages, not Arabic style.
Tera.
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evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)
Toda Nebuchadnezzar
03-27-2002, 18:33
So arabic language writtien in latin form?
Fair enough. SO anyway Tera where is this little island of yours? http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
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He is the Messiah
No i'm not the Messiah
Only the true Messiah would deny it.
Alright then I am the Messiah.
HE IS THE MESSIAH HOORAY!!!
Not exactly - it's Semitic-based written like Latin.
Semitic = Arabic skewed to become many other languages/dialects
Arabic = one language, base one
And Maltese is not the same as Arabic but written differently, actually they're quite different.
Anyway, change subject to the original topic title :P
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Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/confused.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/confused.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/confused.gif
If Semitic is Arabic... why does the term anti-semitic refer to Jews???
On a similar note... You have one mouse and many mice. So why is it that you can have one house and not have many hice???
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/confused.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/confused.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/confused.gif
Toda Nebuchadnezzar
03-27-2002, 22:41
Woodlouse ----> Woodlice http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Dunno Van, just stupid English language. I would have been fine talking in my natural Gaelic language, but those bloody English came along, and what have they ever done for us Scots?
Draughted us into their army
Made us eat their stinking Yorkshire Puddings
Only let us use BT for ADSL which is exactly twice as expensive as other companies.
It be toime fur a wee revoluchon!
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He is the Messiah
No i'm not the Messiah
Only the true Messiah would deny it.
Alright then I am the Messiah.
HE IS THE MESSIAH HOORAY!!!
and dont forget to mention they didnt let us have our own parliament 'till recently
The Jewish language is also similar to Arabic Vanya. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
And if you want somewhere better, hotter, greater than UK, come here, we gotta space http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif (virtually...)
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Proud member of Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka).
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
Visit my resource site here! (http://terazawa.totalwar.org/)
Toda Nebuchadnezzar
03-28-2002, 02:21
Nah Malta is tiny, but then compared to other countries so is UK.
What you want to do is buy an island in Pacific, and setup your own country where everything is legal, except the usual. (murder fraud stealing deposing the king) Then rule the country and buy another island close to it, and have that island as your farming island. Obviously you import all your food so the only farming you will need to do is farming your cannabis crop http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Then build a nuclear bunker beneath your island, buy a hydrogen bomb big enough to kill everything on the earth, but not destroy the earth, and then wait for say 50 years come back out and rule the world.
AHAHAHAHAHAH cough cough splutter HAHAHAHA!!!
Tis my evil plan and Malta will be no more! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif
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He is the Messiah
No i'm not the Messiah
Only the true Messiah would deny it.
Alright then I am the Messiah.
HE IS THE MESSIAH HOORAY!!!
Kraellin
03-28-2002, 03:53
sorry to burst your bubble, but stw/we/mi isnt that popular. most strat games never even reach the 500,000 units sold mark. and i dont think this one has yet.
take a game like diablo2. i believe it sold over 1 million copies in the first month. i doubt this one will ever reach that mark. games like asheron's call have about 5 or 6 active servers going at one time and it's not that rare to see over 1000 folks on EACH server. wolfenstein in the first month had over 1000 active game servers going with 8 to 64 folks on each server, maybe an average of of 16 or 20 per server. that's 16,000 to 20,000 folks online at one time playing that game. baldur's gate, the original, was another with a huge online following.
so, saying stw/we/mi is popular is a bit off. doesnt mean it's not a great game, just means that most gamers dont play this type of game. we're sort of the 'intellectual' crowd of gamers :) relatively, at least.
K.
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The only absolute is that there are no absolutes.
Major Robert Dump
03-28-2002, 04:54
Well, aside from the historical significance, which makes any game a little more interesting, I just like the method of the game.
There are enough units to vary your army without having so many (like starcraft) that it becomes a joke. Also, the game speed (actionwise i mean)is just right -- not too fast (like a 1st person shooter), not too slow (like homeworld). It also lets me hold a beer in one hand as i play... I also like the graphics, but that is secondary to everything else because if u spend too much time enjoyingt the view youre gonna become part of the scenery.
Now if i could just make my joystick work on this game...
Quote Originally posted by Major Robert Dump:
It also lets me hold a beer in one hand as i play...
[/QUOTE]
No wonder you are having problem with your double clicking http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif
I've always like strat wargames, Close Combat, Steel Panzer etc. I agree with Major that STW unit types, game speed and graphics are better balanced compared to the rest of the strat games. But I think its relative success is also due to the japanese flavour.
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tootee the goldfish,
headmaster of Shogun-Academy (http://shogun-academy.tripod.com)
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Toda Nebuchadnezzar
03-28-2002, 18:09
The intellectuals play strategic games, the bums play shoot em ups??? No that can't be right?
But do you think that strategy games are sold to the intellectual market more than just selling it to anyone?
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He is the Messiah
No i'm not the Messiah
Only the true Messiah would deny it.
Alright then I am the Messiah.
HE IS THE MESSIAH HOORAY!!!
Krasturak
03-28-2002, 21:26
It is hard work to learn to play this game.
It isn't easy.
So, it isn't popular.
But, for those of us who made the effort, we're in luck ... it is (of course) a great game ...
it's even better than chess.
i definately agree Krasturuk,took me ages to master the arts of winning.lol
Anssi Hakkinen
03-29-2002, 09:12
To answer the topic's question I'm definitely going with Oldwarhorse-san - the game's samurai theme has certainly attracted rather than repulsed players. Of course it helps that it's a friggin' great game, with one of the only working syntheses of RTS and TBS.
How successful will MTW compared to STW/MI/WE?
1. At least twice better sale!
2. Somewhat better.
3. On par.
4. Not as good but not bad.
5. Oh man! What? No samurai? No game.
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tootee the goldfish,
headmaster of Shogun-Academy (http://shogun-academy.tripod.com)
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Quote Originally posted by Kraellin:
we're sort of the 'intellectual' crowd of gamers http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif relatively, at least.
[/QUOTE]
I give you a two-thumb-up.
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Pain is weakness leaving the body.
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Well to be honest,i fell in luv with this game the moment i plyd it.
And from the moment i met Kocmoc http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gifhe showed me how a few units work.Bah! then i was hooked and determind to join the GreY Wolves.If u like Strat games it 1 of the best,but as said above its not everbodies cup of tea http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/eek.gif
And alot of probs with balance and cheaters has caused alot of ppl to move onto other games.Or say the least only ply it from time to time.
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Grey Wolves
FastCub
Major Robert Dump
03-29-2002, 15:00
A buddy from another RTS showed me this game and told me i'd love it and sure enough i loved it. He started out as a real pro but soon enuff i beat him regularly and he switched addictions. I wish he's come back from time to time, but i think i discouraged him...and im not even that good. So yes, the people who practice regularly have a huge advantage over the others.
Sad that it isn't a popular game. None of my friends like STW, even those RTS freak.
I love STW for two reasons: a) its simplicity in strategy. b) One of a kind tactical battle.
I have to agree that STW isn't the game for everyone. My brother, who loves AOE serries, said STW is boring since it is too simple in strategy. My 15 year-old cousin, who loves C&C and Starcarft style of game, hate STW since it was too slow and too much thinking involved.
DeathOnaPaleHorse
03-30-2002, 12:10
I like Tw because there's real strategy and tactics involved, unlike Starcraft and C&C, which are basically just production races.
The most stategy you get in c+c is how to build as much units faster than your opponent. Other than that its just rock, paper, sissors for unit types.
[This message has been edited by grayd0 (edited 03-30-2002).]
u guys realy want many players?
many servers?
many unknown players?
i love this game, coz can invent new tactics u can play ur own style AND nothing isnt impossible, u can always win!
i dont want many many players like about 1000
NO!
i like to see guys wich i know well, stw its like a family, many friends since over 2 years now.
i dont care about units, i would play every unit, its just the machine wich count.
medivial will surely bring many new players for sme weeks or month, but at least we will see again 50 till 100 players, if MI didnt showed up, im sure we where the old guys around 70 till 90 peeps.
yes, the older players so caleld "vets" have a big advantage vs new players, but i saw many players wich improved in some weeks and month asnd are now real good players...
we should speak about the age...
how old are u guys, i bet we have an age-average over 25 years.
koc
You're to a certain point right Koc - but I don't want to play always the same people over and over again, I want much more players.
Tera.
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Proud member of Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka).
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
Krasturak,
I'll bet most of the people who do well with the STW tactical battles are good chess players because you have to be able to coordinate the 16 different units to a high degree, and chess is the same way. They both have the same number of units, and both have a "king" that is a fighting piece, but also has to be protected. You also have the offensive/defensive balance in the game. Both styles of play work in both games. Of course, any wargamer could play STW and do well, but I think it's a bit too abstract for most wargamers. STW has it all over chess in terms of epic scale and virtual environment. STW is also continuous play, but not so fast that you don't have time to think, and the coop battles with allies is a dimension that chess lacks except in some unusual variations of the game. So, I guess I convinced myself that STW is better than chess in many ways, but it's the same kind of thinking that's involved in playing both games. Also, drinking alcohol before or during a game doesn't help your play in either game. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
MizuYuuki ~~~
Clan Takiyama ~~
DeathOnaPaleHorse
03-31-2002, 02:07
You hit the nose on that one Puzz, I love chess.... My friends make fun of me becuase I read books about the subject. Not as good as I want to be though.
In many ways, Total War is superior, because it takes in to account the human qualities of battle, (fear, stress, energy, command radius), but for sheer replay value, chess wins.
Forward Observer
03-31-2002, 05:30
One of the things you have to remember when visiting a dedicated game site like the org. is that we do not represent a huge section of the populace. We come from all over the world, and it is rare that you see more than three or four forum members living within a couple of hundred miles of each other.
I would be interesting to see the regional and then world wide sales numbers for all of the games published in the last few years. I wonder if there is a site on the net that has this info? I am sure that this info is available to the gaming industry.
With all of people that I come in contact with daily, I have never met anyone who has ever even heard of the game of Shogun--let alone anyone that has ever played it, but I find the same is true for most of the games or sims that I play. I posted a similar thread to this on one of the flight sim forums, some time back, titled "Where are the people like us hiding?", and although I wasn't talking about Shogun in particular, the post still fits the subject.
Posted in part Jan 24, 2002 at Sim HQ------
I visit, read, and post at this site because much of the related subject matter here interests me. I do the same at the subsim site and a few other sim/game related sites that I visit. As a general rule I find that most of the other people who post here have a lot of the same common interests as me, but--hey, that why we are all here in the first place, isn't it.
Even as a child, I liked to play army, play fighter pilot, or make believe I was driving a tank made out of an old cardboard box. Most kids did this, but then I can also remember getting a Battle of Gettysburg board game that I could never find any other kids interested enough to learn to play with me. That game just gathered dust in my closet, but of course with the advent of the PC, I now have an A,I, opponent who is always ready and never tires of playing, no matter what the subject is.
I have built, and still build models of things military that I am fascinated with. I like military history and collect militaria.
What I am wondering is---how come I never, or almost never, come in contact with anyone else with these interests, other than at this and the other forums?
I work at a manufacturing facility with about 200 salaried people and over 1000 hourly. I interact with most of them constantly, and not a damn one of them has any interests in flight sims, tank sims, sub sims, wargaming, military history, or any history for that matter. About all I ever hear about is their interest in sports, and their damn golf game.
I go to lunch with the same bunch from my office each day, and we talk about things from myriad subjects. I can converse on just about anything except current sports events, and even then I will patiently listen.
Occasionally one or two of the group will show some interest in my favorite pastimes, but it seems that it is mostly foreign to them.
Usually about the same time each day during lunch, this same jerk comes up and shouts "how about them hogs", (U of AR football team), and I might as well get up an go back to my cubicle because it is going to be non-stop sports talk from then on.
Don't get me wrong, I am not anti-sports, it just doesn't interest me much. I also know that that it is the single most common interest of most male adults, but I refuse to believe that it all that they know or care about.
Fortunately, I am well adjusted enough that none of this gives me any insecurity complexes or such.
The point I am getting at is--that even with friends, family, co-workers, and just plain strangers, I just don't understand why I never meet anyone with similar interests as mine, other than on these forums. Am I, and are we, that rare?
Anyone else feel this way, or am I alone in this feeling also?
END EXCERPT
The bottom line is that I rarely even mention PC gaming at work anymore becuase I suspected most were beginning to think of me as a weirdo.
Cheers
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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.
[This message has been edited by Forward Observer (edited 03-30-2002).]
Shotaro Ikenami
03-31-2002, 07:36
At first I vould like to say that STW isn't that popular. Not all great games are popular: take for example System Shock 2 made by looking glass studios, a fine, talented group which dissapeared because of the lack of funds and because people didn't appreciate real good games.
Shogun has that cocktail between tactics and japanese history that just makes you play it and play it again. I don't think Medieval total War will be that good.
Foward Observer, as for what you have said I only have to say that I culdn't have said it better. It is true, what you say, but by what you have told me you seem to be quite older than me for example, I'm still in highschool. I don't know, but this passion you would call gaming also reached me, and it still does sometimes, but you see, if you have time, and sone money to do it you can go on with it, for me it is still a long way before I can do something useful and earn some money, have a decent internet connection ( cable ), and finally get back from time to time to something I really like: to play a game, a good game.
It is true, you can never find people with the same interests, especially gaming, and aspecially someone playing Shogun, but there'snothing we can do about it. We just have to let uourselves be swept by the wave and from time to time to retreat in the middle of that virtual community, made out of people which you are never going to see in your life, but which have the same interests as you.
That's all I have to say, hope you'll read it. I really have to talk about this subject more. Be reading your replies.
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Tenchimuyo
03-31-2002, 09:06
My mother board fried and I can't play anymore http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/mad.gif
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A great warrior rarely reveal his true skills....
DeathOnaPaleHorse
03-31-2002, 12:58
I don't find it so hard to find anyone to play Shogun with. All of the friends I had in high school keep in touch with ICQ, and 3 of them bought Shogun purely on my recommendation. All of them love strategy games, althought I've been trying to get them into turn-based games. i guess its just a question of your peer group (age group).
I am very interested in the different genres in gaming and what makes them popular personally i think this game is popular because of its mix of real time and turn based action with a brilliant three dimensional VERY Tactical system thrown in the history is exotic to some which also adds to this games allure
Shotaro Ikenami
04-06-2002, 05:49
Quote Originally posted by DeathOnaPaleHorse:
I don't find it so hard to find anyone to play Shogun with. All of the friends I had in high school keep in touch with ICQ, and 3 of them bought Shogun purely on my recommendation. All of them love strategy games, althought I've been trying to get them into turn-based games. i guess its just a question of your peer group (age group).[/QUOTE]
It's not about the age, it's about the game itself, it's too hard and boring for them, and even if they play tehy can't make good net players. It's NOT about the age group in this case, but simply a different look at the game.
I admit that I have only 1 friend that can make a good player on the net, but he plays it from time to time.
Age has little to do with what kind of game people like to play. It depends on the interest of each person and the game itself. Game has more sell (and becomes a success for the publisher/developer) when it provides the need to a larger group of people. STW isn't popular because it couldn't attract a large group of gamers. Gamers who like strategy games with a lots of micro management will not like STW since it lacks most of that. They will go for AOE kind of game instead. People who like fast pace RTS will not like STW since its tactical combat is much slower and much more complicated. They would play C&C instead. RPG and Action gamers will not likely to witch style neither. Even though, STW occasionally listed as Wargame, but it it won't be appealed since there is no tank and jet fighter. It is the reason why KOEI stop releasing their famous "Romance of the Three Kingdoms" series worldwide since it couldn't make enough profit (another reason is the series decline in quality). I truely hope that CA will maintain the style in MTW and not go for the larger group of gamers leaving us disappointed.
[This message has been edited by pdoan8 (edited 04-06-2002).]
I know maybe 5 decent STW players, none of them as good as me http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
but back on topic, most people I know who play computer games know STW, and a good amount own it (and own MI too!!!)
But I guess if its popular anywhere its popular in England...
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"Situation excellente. J'attaque!"
The only reason is that its the greatest real time strategy ever, and even though its quite old, its still better than everything new tht cums out in this genre (although, i think M: TW will be even better).
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Dali: The Artful Warrior
NagatsukaShumi
04-08-2002, 02:51
KOEI has not stopped these games you speak of, Kessen 2 and Dynasty Warrior 2 & 3 are about the book
Toda Nebuchadnezzar
04-08-2002, 03:44
Ok lets put things in perspective here:
Comparing STW to all the other games that fit into IT'S category it is the most popular...Why? because none of the other games come close to it.
Popular in Britain? Dunno why we scots are a blood thirsty lot and understand clan warfare, but the english just seem to like killing and taking over everything.(hence the ENGLISH empire)
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He is the Messiah
No i'm not the Messiah
Only the true Messiah would deny it.
Alright then I am the Messiah.
HE IS THE MESSIAH HOORAY!!!
Quote Originally posted by NagatsukaShumi:
KOEI has not stopped these games you speak of, Kessen 2 and Dynasty Warrior 2 & 3 are about the book[/QUOTE]
Kessen 2 is indeed about Romance of the Three Kingdoms, but it has too many strange characters which are not from the novel. Dynasty Warriors 2 & 3 are fighting games not strategy games. Good series, btw, and I had to buy PS2 just to play DW 2 & 3. The latest version of Romance of the Three Kingdoms for PC (strategy game) is now only available in Chinese.
1. koei...
i bougth the real old koei games, like bandit, nobunaga, khan, napoleon....
they puplished this games from 89 till 96
mstly ega graphics...
2. stw lives now since near 2 years, thats pretty good in my eyes!
we are still many players and i dont think that this game will died... last weeks we got more players again...
3. i dont need graphics, i would play this game still with ega grapics or monochrome monitor!
4. i see 1 big prob, many newbies play it online and loose badly, the most of them dont want to practice about 100 games to have at least a little chance...
there are so many possible ways to win a battle and so many things to know, that u need about 500 games to become a good player.
...but some of us played 5000 or 8000 games...
not many have the time and some lose activity and go to "easyer games"...
i said this on an other point already, but we have an very high age-average... about 30
sure we have some younger players...
5. i have no doubt that the medivial game will be a great succes, i just hope we can fix the units and create a good patch...
koc
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