civil war

[Jeanne d'arc]

I was playing with the HRE for quite some time now, i started in high with the goal to keep the provinces i already had and to attack provinces of oppertunity(rebels).As the time past by a few super powers started to emerge, there was the mongol horde in the east and the almohads in the west, in the south there was the papacy.I was at war with the almohads untill suddenly a civil war came out of nowhere splitting my german kingdom in half?????
The mongol horde creamed some of the rebel provinces in the east and the almohads kept doing there part in attacking my own provinces in the west.My kingdom at this point is completely broken into pieces making it impossible to get some troop movement going on.At this point i gave up so game over.
I wonder how this is possible when having garnissons of almost 600 men in every border province and like 200 men in the center provinces??Loyalty was 200% in almost every province and taxation was set to high.The loyalty ratings of the governors and generals was high enough.Bug in the game????

[Rowan11088]

Often it's heir loyalty that plays a big part...If for whatever reason your heirs have extremely low loyalty, they will be more likely to encourage a rebellion...But I can't say much, as I've never actually HAD a rebellion...

[Jeanne d'arc]

damnit i just checked, the loyalty of all my generals was reduced to 2 or 3 loyalty http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/angry.gif , very odd cause many turns back i had generals with almost max loyalty with exception a few heirs.The civil war started when all the generals in my kingdom had 2 to 3 loyalty including some heirs.
Note to myself , always check the loyalty of your generals in the future http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-oops.gif

I wonder what caused the loyalty decrease in the first place?
New king?
A failed crusade?
A failed attack?

[katank]

could be new king.

if an heir is suddenly no longer in direct line for throne, huge loyalty drop. they have royal blood, so incite civil war.

BTW, HRE is really prone to this.

[ichi]

Could be a new King, with low Influence or other vice.

Could be your king got cut off from the empire - on an island blocked by enemy navy or trapped in a castle siege.

Were you excommed? Lose a couple of crusades? Too many toes?

What year is it, and how close are you to the 60% victory?

Don't quit, fall back to the best places and try to win it despite the set back.

ichi

[Imperial Buffoon]

New king is a big candidate, if you build up at all, you usually get some "builder" virtue, which increases loyalty and disappears as soon as he kicks the bucket...has happened to me before.

Also, if one or two of those 2-3 loyalty generals have large armies, it can ignite a civil war.

One option is (cheesy tactic alert) to have them in a small stack followed by a large stack with the really important troops (cheesy tactic ends). Yes, it's cheesy, and yes, it works http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Otherwise bring them closer to your king, more realistic but also more dangerous

IB

[Bodew]

I just recently had my first civil war as the Spanish in a high/GA game. It happened pretty early in the campain. I had moved most of my army from Castile to (provence in the nort west...can't recall name) to fight off an Italian invasion, and Aragon invaded Castile. Next turn 1/2 provinces reblelled under a disloyal prince.

I was able to defeat the Italians and retake Castile from the Aroganese the next turn, but was at war with the Arogonese, Italians (in Portugal) and lost 1/2 of my provinces to rebels while having the English on the north and Elmo Heads to the south.

It could have gotten real ugly real fast. Fortunatly no one attacked again and I was able to retake all my provinces and CRUSH the rebellion, executing all rebels.

This increased my kings dread considerably while also gaining him a few stars from all the battles. My future heirs also seemed to be better after this. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif

[Senta]

Quote[/b] (Jeanne d'arc @ Mar. 02 2004,01:00)]I wonder what caused the loyalty decrease in the first place?
New king?
A failed crusade?
A failed attack?
probably all of the above, new King can be a royal pain in the butt, especially since your previous one had something like magnificent builder virtue, and you took loyalty for granted... losing seems a sure way to lower loyalty as well...
remeber, keep your friends close, and enemies closer...
and well placed spy will almost always give you a heads up about unloyal generals http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

[katank]

to improve loyalty, place him in stack with king. This is not always feasible.

a better way is to have spies execute disposable generals for treason(merc generals great for this in being also low loyalty). After a couple of executions, they all take loyalty far more seriously. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

yet another way is to separate the great general from the troops. that way, he will command any battles fought but not have a stack to lead into civil war. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif