Log in

View Full Version : Fantasy Total War



Poison Arrow
04-04-2004, 11:30
Ok, first off resource management would be the same. No need to muck around with that. Of course you could add some fun modifications to exactly what they produce, but the model would not need changes.

The catagories of where differences would appear are:

MAGIC

Along the tech tree there would be magic research facilities. These could range from primitive and shamanistic for some cultures to refined for advanced races. With these you could train battle wizards (similar to kensai) and wizard agents. The agents could effect the political game by giving you insight into your enemies movements or other actions. Many styles of agents are possible. You could even go so far as to have control over what spells the agents learn, or give them a set list based on their type. The latter seems more wise. I will address battle spells in the BATTLE section.

RACES

Now you could go the standard boring route and have the typical fantasy races. Humans, Dwarves, Elves, Gnomes, Half Elves, Orcs, etc. but I would recommend something different. I would recommend only humans. A fantasy setting with unique cultures based in magic not science. This would give the developers the leeway to create something never seen before. Namely a world of their design not the standard fantasy one. Or, of course you could use the standard races, that would be cool, just not unique.

Each culture, be it human or other would have its own flair of course. From dark to light, brutal to kind.

MONSTERS

These could be found and trained as units or groups. Along the tech tree you could have things like horse breeders that control the use of different creatures within your force. The creatures could be bred, or found in specific regions. Making the control of certain areas vital. I would recommend all creatrues have a size that would be manageable on the battle field. The elephants from RTW come to mind. Many different creatures could be conceived, but their battle use needs to be considered when thinking about size. No five story towering dragons. I see dragons as at most the size of the elephants, and in groups of one or two. Also, I see the standard fantasy races as monsters. Some good some bad. Mercenaries basically. I think their addition as rare groups like this would make their inclusion stand out more actually.

Also mosters could be used in glorious achievments. To rid the north of the dredded hill giants, slay the dragons that lives in the east. Many possibilites.

BATTLE

The only real thing to consider in battle is the use os magic. The monster units would simply have attributes that the standard model could handle just fine. They just would something new on the field. Now magic would be handled by battle mages. I see a kensei type wizard atop a fast moving horse. Right click on him and he has a list of spells to cast. Prepared before battle this list could have whatever you wanted on it, giving the choices tactical meaning. Healing spells, buffing spells, attack spells, etc. In so doing the mages would all be unique to the generals command style. Now the mage would not have to be as invulnerable as a kensei, it's just I see that a battle mage would learn some shielding spells before he goes into battle as he doesnt intend to engae in melee. So he would need to be repreented as having some sort of protection against the undoubted scores of arrows that will be launched his way.

Ok, I'll stop here, I could say more but this is good to start a convo. Any thoughts anyone?

Axeknight
04-04-2004, 12:30
So...Everquest Total War? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif lol

Try to find a mod who'll move this to the modding forum. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif

*EDIT* Typoes... Taking over... Can't... Stop them...

Poison Arrow
04-04-2004, 12:34
The Apothocary? How does this have anything to do with tech issues? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif

And I've never played Everquest, and from what I've heard about it, never will. I have played NWN though. I am curious if you intended that comment as a good thing, or bad.

Axeknight
04-04-2004, 12:38
Oops... Wrong forum. Sorry http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif What's the modders forum called? I forget

Good idea. The Everquest thing was just a joke http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

How would you work the factions? You say they'd all be human, but what would you call them?

Poison Arrow
04-04-2004, 12:39
Well, I dont think this would be moddable. The addition of magic would require whole new elements. Area of effect spells, Knowledge from wizards about enemies in far off lands. Entirely new (larger) models.

It would be a major departure in alot of ways but could use the root system without mucg difficulty. The magic is the main big thing I dont think could be modded. You could maybe make monster models and animations. But to code the use of magic is a bit beyond modding I think.

Axeknight
04-04-2004, 12:44
Ya could just have a unit of say 60 magicians who fire 'magic' arrows. So just change the appearance of the archers.

But I know nothing about modding.

Poison Arrow
04-04-2004, 12:46
As for the factions, you could call them whatever you like. That would be the beauty of it. You could create unique cultures within a fantasy setting. Think of say the Conan world. Hyborians, Stygians, Cimmerians, etc. Now these are all based on real world cultures sorta. So, I would recommend trying to be a bit more creative. The Elric Saga races are better. I would definitely not recommend using a set book list though as that would not be unique.

Think of any movie or book series that has a number of humman fantasy cultures and you'll see my point. You could craft them after some monster type cultures too. For example a human society that looks like orcs and feels like orcs but is still human. Black armor, dirty, brutal, heavy on attack magic, etc.

Poison Arrow
04-04-2004, 12:56
Yes you could create the factions and there look through modding. You could color them rename to your hearts content, basically creating the standard unit feel. However, mages would have the ability to say buff units with protection spells that would need a visual representation. A glow of some kind or something. Modding can only add so much, basically change the already existing parameters, not add new ones.

The use of the mage sin the political game has such scope and potential I don't think you could add it through modding. How would you add say a mage being able to send a curse of madness at a faction leader? Or on the battle field, summon a unit of undead behind enemy lines.

Granted, I welcome the idea of trying to mod it. I just am reacting to the feasability of it. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Next post in 90 seconds if you are still around and respond. I'm flood controled. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-inquisitive.gif

Bigwig
04-04-2004, 16:30
While we're sort of talking about converting fantasy novels into games, don't you think that, for those who've read it, George RR Martin's a Song of Ice and Fire would translate REALLY well into a Total War game?
Instead of different countries you'd control one of the houses and advance through war, bribary, alliances, trade, assassination, or subterfuge (plenty of examples of that in the book, red wedding anyone?). You've got your religions, the Old Gods (Pagan), the Seven (Catholic?), the Drowned God, and and the Lord of Light - which could be the heretical cult that pops up half way through the game. You've got a little magic, like shadow assassins (available to the Lord of Light religion), the Warlocks of Quarth, Wights and Others on the other side of the wall, and Dany's dragons which could pop up one day Golden Horde style to lay waste to everything. You've got princesses, faceless men and shadow assassins, priests for all religions, rebels, alliances, provinces, mines, trading, mercenaries, politics, heirs, fire boats, huge battles, etc. It's almost as if the book was made to be a total war game http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

And now I have a sudden urge to read the books again.

Poison Arrow
04-04-2004, 16:33
Ahah, the first mod idea for the FTW title, excellent. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-smile.gif

Apocalyp$e
04-04-2004, 18:26
Have any of you played this old game called master of magic before? A cross of MTW and a modernversion of Master of Magic would rock...

octavian
04-04-2004, 18:38
this topic really belongs in the dungeon, im sure gregoshi or another mod could move it there for you, or you could just redo this topic there. there are also a lot of modders just hanging around there.

ps, i doubt this work well if at all with MTW, Rome TW might have the ability do stretch into a fantasy game though.

Poison Arrow
04-05-2004, 00:53
Actually, I don't think this belongs in the mod forum. The reason being, as I stated in my previous posts, I don't think this is moddable. I am trying to have a conversation about the idea of a title for TW after RTW.

Granted the first thing one would think with this is MOD, but I think it is a bit beyond that. I am not trying to be disagreeable, just my view of what kind of topis this is. A discussion of a direction TW might go after RTW. Whether or not it is feasble is not is secondary in mind to the fun of discussing the possiblities and peoples views about how they think it may work.

Perhaps there is another better suited forum, but not the Dungeon. Any mod desiring to move this thread, feel free.

Gregoshi
04-06-2004, 08:05
We can keep it here for now. If at such a time it takes wings into something approaching reality, i.e., actually working on the mod, we can move it to the Alchemist lab.

Poison Arrow
04-06-2004, 17:42
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-wall.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-stunned.gif What mod?

octavian
04-07-2004, 02:44
my bad, sorry, i made a wrong assumption about your statements. my opinion, however, is that an official middle earth total war should be made. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

Poison Arrow
04-07-2004, 04:48
Now that would indeed be cool. It would require CA to arrange a license agreement with whoever holds the rights however. Which is something they have not had to do so far. If a specific world were to used Middle Earth would indeed be a wonderful choice. However I have seen a Silmarillian thread as well. In terms of epic battles, this setting would be very grand.

And as for misinterpretations, no worries. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Poison Arrow
04-07-2004, 05:28
However.....

In making a, as of yet unseen fantasy setting, CA would have some advantages. By doing so they would able to draw on the whole fanasty literature a source inspiration. They would not be boxed into a specific series of books and their setting. Up until now CA has recreated things, Japan, Europe, and now they are doing Rome (basically, ancient europe). They set themselves as acurate depictors of real world time lines.

RTW will be a success, we all know that. A perfect chance to make something that is a slight departure from their current line of recreations. A sidestep into fantasy, which is a concept that so many people love, and then back to recreations. Asian TW for example. Including Japan of course, so we can go full circle and command samurai again, hehe.

If they did so, by keeping the fantasy setting unique to their own concepts, they would not be testing the loyalists of any particular book. We all know how many readers of Tolkien were just waiting for LOTR to be wrong and bad. The same would be true here. It could derail the TW line. That's why I recommend a unique world. They would also gain the chance to bring to us gamers something we havent been able to see in the TW series yet, magic. After RTW to see a title that allowed you to blast a unit with magic would be awesome. The lightshow of this title could be very impressive.

Don't get me wrong, I don't suggest a high magic world, where mages have endless earth shattering spells. On the contrary, I would recommend a rather low physical magic world in favor of higher magic in the strategy map side, through agent mages. Battle Magic would need to be balanced for mage unit effect on the field, he should in no way dominate the field, just be a factor.

Poison Arrow
04-09-2004, 05:30
Been doing some thinking and am going to agree with Carsolan in terms of which existing fantasy world should be recreated. Middle Earth would be great fun.

This opinion is still secondary to the idea of them creating their own world however. I just think if they go another route I would also throw my vote in for Middle Earth. ALOT of middle earth fans out here CA, it could REALLY boost the old bottom line..... thiiink about it.

octavian
04-09-2004, 06:01
another interesting fantasy author is Guy Gavriel Kay, not exactly pure genious like tolkien, but he helped in editing the sillmarilion (sp) and has a number of his own books published.