Flaming Pigs

[Fearless]

Just seen the Videos at IGN. Not the best quality but give a general over view on what's in store.

The flaming pigs can be seen quite clearly and I'm not sure if I like the idea of how CA have brought them into the game. I can accept quite happily 3 or 4 but we are talking herds with Roman Soldiers as pig herders.M-M-mmmm i just don't know on this one I leave it for you lot to judge http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-no.gif

[The_Emperor]

Well its Historical

The Romans fought Pyrrhus war elephants with Flaming Pigs... So like it or not it was a valid tactic used in history

[Catiline]

Actually it's not historical for the Romans. They only used raw pigs to frighten elephants. They relied on them doing sufficient squealing once loose to scare the Elephants. The Megarians refined the tactic somewhat when they were fighting Antigonus Gonatus, they set light to the pigs. But it was simply a method of ensuring good squeals were produced.

[Barkhorn1x]

As I've stated before - Flaming Pigs are just dumb I mean did you see the herders running along with them - and their flames?? Com'on http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

Barkhorn.

[Nelson]

Having the pigs in the game will enable players to employ them far more than we have any right to believe they were in fact used. That said, the tactic DID exist. Besides, it is just WAY too irresistible to pass on if you're a designer.

Presumably, the pigs will have little effect against units other than elephants. Hungry soldiers could be tempted to break ranks to catch them though (Judeans excepted http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif)

[RisingSun]

The herders running with them looked absolutely silly. And there were like a hundred That's stupid.

[Leet Eriksson]

lets say you won't find any quality squeels out of 4,so peeps aimi at quantity to produce quality,100 pigs ain't bad becuase you'll be fighting elephant units,not individual ones http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

100 pigs-40 elephants(for example)

So thats 3 pigs for every elephant...not bad me thinks...

[Oaty]

While on a similar subject. What would soldiers do if they saw a flaming faggot coming at them.

[Dwimmerlaik]

You better be talking about wood... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-furious3.gif

[Leet Eriksson]

I'd run,but i hear if an army is deprived of basic desires for a long time,they'd grab anyone even if it was a flaming faggot http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-furious3.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

[Dwimmerlaik]

Homophobes to the left of me, homophobes to the right... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-argue.gif

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (Dwimmerlaik @ May 13 2004,19:34)]You better be talking about wood... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-furious3.gif
I guess he ain't... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-laugh4.gif

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (Dwimmerlaik @ May 13 2004,19:40)]Homophobes to the left of me, homophobes to the right... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-argue.gif
My, my Does that worry you? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-rolleyes.gif

[Dwimmerlaik]

Of course it f***ing does or else I wouldn't have said it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-furious3.gif

[octavian]

sheese, chill down a little, offensive as it may be to you, you dont have to flip. last thing we need is another flame war http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif

[Fearless]

C'mon guys lets get back to these pigs
If they have to be in why can't it be just 3 or 4 which can be aimed at the elephants. At the moment it appears we have a small farming community which doesn't sit well when battle lines are being drawn up. That's my view anyway. Can't wait to see the wailing women for the barbarians http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Rosacrux]

Wailing women for the barbarians? And what will the Roman countermeasure be?

Perhaps a unit called Incontinentia Buttocks would be the answer A devastating butt-attacking, horney-as-hell, sassy and lustful, incredible to resist, sex-hungry Roman lass, running havoc among the ranks of the poor and eager to prove their masculinity barbarians... and when they are broken (exhausted and all) there comes the other Roman uber-unit, Bigus Dickus, and finishes them off in a rather... ahem... Greek way http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Rocket_Boy]

Hopefully we won't see uprisings of nothing but 1000 pig herders Amusing as that would be.

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (Dwimmerlaik @ May 13 2004,23:36)]Of course it f***ing does or else I wouldn't have said it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-furious3.gif
LOL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif My, my Aren't you an extremelly sensitive chap... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-angel.gif

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (Rosacrux @ May 14 2004,04:15)]Wailing women for the barbarians? And what will the Roman countermeasure be?

Perhaps a unit called Incontinentia Buttocks would be the answer A devastating butt-attacking, horney-as-hell, sassy and lustful, incredible to resist, sex-hungry Roman lass, running havoc among the ranks of the poor and eager to prove their masculinity barbarians... and when they are broken (exhausted and all) there comes the other Roman uber-unit, Bigus Dickus, and finishes them off in a rather... ahem... Greek way http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
ROTFL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-laugh4.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-laugh4.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-laugh4.gif

Talk about a bizarre imagination http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-thumbsup.gif

[RisingSun]

Quote[/b] ]Quote (Dwimmerlaik @ May 13 2004,19:34)
You better be talking about wood... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-furious3.gif

I guess he ain't... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-beam.gif

Yeah, he's obviously talking about... Cigarettes. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif

[Swoosh So]

Great i can see it now one of totalwars most innovative units easily blocked by a silly herd of flaming pigs :\ Goodbye elephants in multi http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/angry.gif , i can tell my games will be hosted as


NO PIGS/ART actually maybe i should call my vi games that too http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[Spino]

Take a look at the latest gamestar video posted at legiontotalwar.com and you'll see why flaming pigs will be necessary. Elephants are ridiculously powerful So much so that it's safe to say they are outrageously overpowered. In the video a unit of Seleucid elephants (complete with mahout and archer towers) simply plows through and flattens two units of post-Marian reform legionaries without stopping What happened to the elephants I saw in the Raphia and Trebia episodes of Time Commanders? The power of those elephant units seemed perfectly balanced. What the hell??

Elephants were never used as 'tanks' in the ancient world and yet that is exactly how they were used in this E3 video I was expecting to see the tight formation of legionaries forced open by the elephant charge, thus making their formations vulnerable to exploitation by infantry or cavalry. I was not expecting the legionaries to be ground into dust http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

[Trax]

I dont think that many of the knocked over lagionaries actually died, i believe theat most of them will get up and continue fighting.
Tightly packed heavy infantry is a death trap as the Romans saw on Bagradas plains in 1st Punic War.

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (Spino @ May 15 2004,13:49)]Take a look at the latest gamestar video posted at legiontotalwar.com and you'll see why flaming pigs will be necessary. Elephants are ridiculously powerful So much so that it's safe to say they are outrageously overpowered. In the video a unit of Seleucid elephants (complete with mahout and archer towers) simply plows through and flattens two units of post-Marian reform legionaries without stopping What happened to the elephants I saw in the Raphia episode of Time Commanders and Trebia? The power of those elephant units seemed perfectly balanced. What the hell??

Elephants were never used as 'tanks' in the ancient world and yet that is exactly how they were used in this E3 video I was expecting to see the tight formation of legionaries forced open by the elephant charge, thus making their formations vulnerable to exploitation by infantry or cavalry. I was not expecting the legionaries to be ground into dust http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif
Neither did I. It was like if they weren't there. You're right about Elephants. They cannot be that powerfull. If this is final, then 20 elephant unit armies will be standard in MP.

[TigerVX]

The elephants are probably not as powerful as they look. Alot of those legionares where probably just knocked down, and would get up soon, CAs not that stupid to make elephants that powerful oO.

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (TigerVX @ May 16 2004,12:58)]The elephants are probably not as powerful as they look. Alot of those legionares where probably just knocked down, and would get up soon, CAs not that stupid to make elephants that powerful oO.
In fact they might have done that to increase the impact of the released videos. That might not be true in the final release.

What bugs me is not just the elephant's power, but the cavalry power and the exploding http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-stunned.gif catapult projectiles. All of them too powerfull.

In those days, the cavalry only became powerfull after the invention of the foot support (what's the name?? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-thinking.gif ). Then real impact cavalry became available. In the time period of the game, shock cavalry was very weak.

[katank]

I also think it's only in the videos.

the guts and glory of cav or elephant charges are simply more spectacular than swords hacking at something.

Personally, I think the cav are still going to be more or less for charging only and will get owned by legionnaires once melee starts.

Elephants are likely actualy counters to swordsmen but will likely be eaten alive by pikers or just heavy spears.

Does it seem like there are elephant archers?

on some screens, there are men holding bows riding on the elephants.

if so, that would be interesting.

they would be even more amusing than berber camels.

[Kraxis]

Quote[/b] (katank @ May 16 2004,14:17)]Does it seem like there are elephant archers?

on some screens, there are men holding bows riding on the elephants.

if so, that would be interesting.

they would be even more amusing than berber camels.
Elephant archers... well I have already toyed with the idea when I saw the screenshots of them. But I think the archers are just the normal compliment of elephants. They elephants with towers often had archers or javelineers in them.

I'm looking forward to a Parthian army made up of mostly horse archers, some heavy cavalry and then a handful of elephant archers. Shoot then plow.