Trees in RTW

[Oaty]

The only part that bothers me about trees in MTW is you have to use the pause button or chances are likely the comp will maul you. Now I ca'nt see what most of my units are doing and the comp gives orders instantaneously just like they are fight out in opn plains. Now I would'nt mind it so much if the comp was also hindered a degree. Also I think there should be a no pause option because I ca'nt turn it off in MTW and its a crutch I grab way too easily. The pause button should be there but it should lock the screen and disable orders, sometimes the phone rings or whatever the case may be.

The other part about trees they have very little effect in hindering an armies movement in MTW. I remember playing agincourt (historical campaign) and tried to have my flanks protected by the trees. Yeah right the French cavalry went right through those trees and came around on my flanks. Now the trees were the reason the English army did'nt get outflanked in reality but MTW you ca'nt do that. I watched the Timecommander videeo of Watling street and remembered how they were in that nice defensible position. Although neither of the historians there said nothing about the Romans being unflankable IIRC throughout the whole program. I read up on that battle and the reason the Roman general picked that position was because the woods were very thick and were nearly impenetrable. This prevented queen Boudica from doing a mass flanking maneuver through the woods. I forget the name of the other battle but it was with Hannibal against the Romans who crossed the river. The ambush they setup came right through the woods with cavalry. What I'm wondering is there going to be different levels of forests, so that some are passable but allow you to hide troops while others are just plain impassable.

[Colovion]

I doubt any will be impassable - but if they do incorporate a system of forest density hindering troop movements like that then it'll probably just slow the troops down to an Nth degree when you have X troops in there.

Or that's my guess.

[Knight_Yellow]

I handle forests perfectly fine.

Infact i seemed to bo the only MP person able to fight and win in them.


Militia seargents in the woods vs. armoured horses

muhahahahhaha

[a_ver_est]

Quote[/b] (oaty @ May 24 2004,21:27)]The only part that bothers me about trees in MTW is you have to use the pause button or chances are likely the comp will maul you. Now I ca'nt see what most of my units are doing and the comp gives orders instantaneously just like they are fight out in opn plains. Now I would'nt mind it so much if the comp was also hindered a degree. Also I think there should be a no pause option because I ca'nt turn it off in MTW and its a crutch I grab way too easily. The pause button should be there but it should lock the screen and disable orders, sometimes the phone rings or whatever the case may be.
Pause button with orders enabled is a must, I don't understood your concerns, if you don't like this feature don't use it ... if the phone calls then pause the game, nobody force you to give orders.

I don't want battles like startcraft where wins the faster mouse. AI hasn't vision problems and can give orders faster than you.

From my point of view give orders with the pause option equals the human interface with the AI interface.

[dessa14]

yeah but the ai is stupid, and can see a flanking maneuvour as well as a needle in a haystack at the middle of the night on a new moon.
thanks, dessa

[Shahed]

It's funny how the AI on expert seems to see "hiding" troops.

[ziphnor]

I never give orders without pausing the game first. I feel that the interface is too troublesome to give orders while units are moving. Just clicking the right unit can be a daunting mission even while everyone is standing still

I really dont feel that i "cheat" when pausing, if the level of control should be more realistic then we should be seeing things from the eyes of the general, and orders should take time to propagate etc.

[Kraxis]

I certainly understand oaty.

The pause button while a choice of the free will is less so than you think. I used to play MTW a lot online, and for a while I was able to keep myself from the evil 'P', but as time went by I got sucked in... Eventhough I wanted to be able to fight on without.
And the AI IS quite a lot superior to us in the woods. That is the only place where I fear the AI.
So to a degree I will support oaty.

But I do not want to remove the pause.
People keep mentioning 'options'... Well eventually we will have pages and pages of options where we can't make anything of it.

So I think an option of 'Ironman Game' could be added. No pause (with a true pause though), only general's view and other rules like that.

[Oaty]

Well for me the pause buttton takes the intensity of the battle away. But a lot of times if I do'nt use it especially in wooded areas I get units getting hit in the back.(nothing like watching your feudal me at arms getting chewed up all because they got hit in the back by some loser militias) And you ca'nt even think of hitting the A.I.'s units in the back because as soo as you target them they turn around. How many units can a human give an order to individualy in 1 second 2-3 where the comp has full control of all 16. All I'm saying is I think the comp should only be able to give orders to so many units per second and the delay should be longer if they are in the woods.

Now the reason for the no pause option is its a crutch thats way too easy to use but if they tweak the A.I.'s command ability the human could make a joke of the comp using the pause button.

As for the trees noone has made any comments about that. Is there going to be different thickness of forest so that some are impassable for flanking maneuvers.

[shingenmitch2]

Hehe Zephinor,

You don't play online do you? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
Those games will force you to learn to control the troops on the fly. Once you get the hang of it, it is amazing the level of control you can have during a battle.

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As to the first issue.

1. No, trees do not hinder movement enough in TW. I think there might have been a fear by the designers of units getting "stuck" or having trouble pathfinding.

2. The trees in MTW/VI are worse than the trees in STW/MI becaues the camera can't get above them enough to give you a good angle to see what your guys are doing. It used to be that the player had a good "look down" on his units. In MTW/VI the trees were enlarged and now there are times when you have to try to look through a tree to see a unit -- and obviously that doesn't work so well.

[Somebody Else]

I have a suggestion regarding the difficulty in addressing orders to troops within trees - when giving an order, a small area around the mous ecould have the trees leveled to stumps or something, perhaps with a darker shade of terrain as well. Just a thought.