I need info

[Kraxis]

Given the GAH about the Egyptians and people going full speed ahead on a MOD to correct them, I thought about going against the flow. I want to create MOD that contains nothing but mythological and/or different period states, units and such.

I have considered calling it Mythological: Total War.
And before I begin explaining I must ad mit I have been influenced by AoM.

The factions I have a somwhat good knowledge of are: Egypt, The Norse, Troy, The Minoan Empire and Greece/The Mycenean Empire, a combination of Assyrian and Hittite empires I like to call Kingdom of Gilgamesh as well as The Aeneid Dynasty.

As you can see these factions are greatly different in timeperiods and cultures. But here we don't care... It is mythological, but it must still be fairly correct.

I need a number of other factions. Such as a Briton faction (thinking of Albion or Camelot with a mix of Irish units), a Hispanic faction, Gaullish faction, North African one and possibly one in eastern Europe or the Steppes.

Egypt I will leave pretty much as it is. Remove any Hellinistic influence from them, remove the scythes and possibly give the chariots of two archers four horses (if possible), remove cavalry and basically make them chariot dependant as the infantry will be unarmoured beyond their shields.

Troy will have the fastest cavalry. And basically be the most balanced faction in terms of heavy and light infantry and archers.

The Minoan Empire will be like the Turks without the horses. Lots and lots of archers of various types and some javelineers and heavy infantry.

The Norse... Well, they will be the heaviest of all given their rather modern armour and equipment, but their cavalry while capable will not be great. They will have the stout Shieldmaidens.

Camelot will be the only heavy cavalry faction, obviously. Their infantry will be rather crappy, but at least able to stand their ground.

Greece will be quite similar to Troy, with effective javelin light cavalry and strong infantry, including a couple of very special units such as Myrmidons, Heroes and Amazons (I syppose it will be possible to copy the screaming women).

The Kingdom of Gilgamesh will be a mix of Assyrian cavalry (with the only horse archer, but those can't shoot on the move) and infantry with Hittite chariots (scythed). Horse archers, armoured spearmen, archers and chariots. A fun faction I should think.

The Aeneid Dynasty will be the Romans, at least geographically. They will have good swordsmen (basically copying the Romulus & Remus period) and heavy javelineers.

So are there anyone who could help with info on other mythological or good factions I could use?

[Oleander Ardens]

Interesting idea...

Hm you could include a Nibelungen faction, although I don`t know if your Norse faction is compatible with it.
Heavy heroic cavalry, heavily armored infantry but with just some javs as ranged weapons...

A Gerrae faction, the mythological tribe of the Sarmantians - practically an all archerfaction with strong cavalry and only some non-archer spearmen.. I will check Scythian myths later on...

I will look for some more http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Rosacrux]

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Kraxis, you are just too unfriggingbelievable Good luck with your mod, CA is doing it's best to assist you.

BTW why not include Asterix Gauls in it? Mod the rabid dogs to look like Idefixes, create an Obelix heavy infantry type and an Asterix light infantry, change a tad of the druid appearance to look like Panoramix and replace the screaming women with kakophonix... et voila Les Gauloises

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Dead Moroz]

Where is Atlantis? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif I want Atlantis http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/angry.gif And Huns With mighty immortal Attila http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (Dead Moroz @ June 11 2004,04:53)]And Huns With mighty immortal Attila http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif
Tooooooooooooo HISTORICAL for Kraxis... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-wink.gif

[Sociopsychoactive]

But the atlanteans is a good idea.

LOTS of naval options, specifically Krakens and the like, medium infantry, some ranged but not much, very little cav but some heroic infantry units, names taken straight from AOM (I like it to).

On the others I think you know more than me...

[RisingSun]

Isn't this the wrong forum?

[ah_dut]

no it's the perfect forum with what CA are doing at the moment

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (ah_dut @ June 11 2004,12:26)]no it's the perfect forum with what CA are doing at the moment
ROTFL http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif

[ah_dut]

Aymar what about Jedi knights, Urak hai or even the minotaur, or even Aliens oh and also the people from Dune The Sardaukar and their laser beams, don't forget ringwraiths http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif

[lonewolf371]

I'm not sure Atlantis would work too well as it was supposed to be right smack in the center of the Atlantic Ocean but some sort of Iberian Empire containing Iberia and Western North Africa would be nice. Charlemagne ruling over Gaul and Germany would be interesting too. Attila the Hun could take over the empty vastness of Russia. Camelot would obviously have England Scotland and Ireland, and possibly some of northern Gaul to make it more balanced.

I'm also afraid ah_dut forgot to mention Predators, Centaurs and Captain Spocks.

[Kraxis]

Thanks guys.

The reason I have posted here is not really to talk MOD but to secure helpful advises on mythological factions and such. And the people here are certainly the best I know of when it comes to that.
Also I don't do this to either provoke the HA (Historical Accuracy) people or something like that. The discussion about the Egyptians just awoke something in me...

Oleander, the Nibelungen, Germanians I expect? They would naturally fit better than Norse, but a little more explaination. And please explain more about the Gerrae...

Atlantis, well they would be pretty similar to the Minoans, and Atlantis itself isn't available, so I have opted to keep them out. Too hard simply.
The Huns, they are actually too historical as Aymar mentions. But not because I have something against that. The Minoan and Egyptians aren't exactly mythological but they are easily made so as we known very little of the Minoans' military on land and the Egyptians have this popular mythological feel to them (so do the Minoans but generally only known to more learned people).

At least two other empires need to be created, placed from northern Gaul southwards through Iberia and into North Africa. So if anybody have any knowledge on any mythological units or such it would nice. Aymar, here is your great chance to give us a piece of your knowledge of such things in Iberia.

[ah_dut]

sorry lonewolf371 but I also forgot the minatour (sp?) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Sjakihata]

What about gods? they could take up the role of the senate/pope? would be cool.

[Leet Eriksson]

Do an arabia faction,specialising exclusivly on light cavalry(not horse archers,but much like saharan cavalry and faris,with a lance,no bows)and javelinmen,also average swordsmen and crap spearmen warbands.Oh and don't forget the camels http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

[lonewolf371]

You could do the Empire of Vanya for Gaul and Iberia.

Main units will be: Flaming pigs, Flying sumo wrestlers, platypuses, Ringwraiths, and F.A.R.T. squads.

[Kraxis]

Come on people, please be serious.

For instance faisal, if you have knowledge on ancient Arab myths then I would love to hear about it, and then an Arab faction might be fitting (but with the Kingdom of Gilgamesh closeby it might be a tough position).

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (ah_dut @ June 12 2004,08:54)]Aymar what about Jedi knights, Urak hai or even the minotaur, or even Aliens oh and also the people from Dune The Sardaukar and their laser beams, don't forget ringwraiths http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif
Copyright infringment... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-wink.gif

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

Quote[/b] (Kraxis @ June 14 2004,07:16)]Aymar, here is your great chance to give us a piece of your knowledge of such things in Iberia.
In the Iron Age, I think you should investigate Celtic natural divinities.

In the Bronze Age, Dolmen cultures divinities, like the ones of the builders of Carnac and Stonehenge. Try to read about Halstatt civilization's divinities.

As for Iberia, most divinities I know of relate to the worship of the Sun, animals and natural fenomena, just like some of the Celts worships.

BTW, the Viking's Norse Mithology should keep you busy.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

[Leet Eriksson]

Quote[/b] (Kraxis @ June 15 2004,10:33)]Come on people, please be serious.

For instance faisal, if you have knowledge on ancient Arab myths then I would love to hear about it, and then an Arab faction might be fitting (but with the Kingdom of Gilgamesh closeby it might be a tough position).
I know for instance a Rakh is a giant bird,tied to alot of arab mythology you also have Ifrit or Fire Djinn and the run of the mill Djinn tied to the air element,Dune Djinn,these are only conserend with their bottomless guts(they frequently appear at night time),and Sea Djinn towering green humanoid biengs(green giant hehehe)with incredible intelligince,they do have nothing to do with water however,they prey on travelers using a coastal route.Then there is a legendary Pink 3 eyed horse(wich runs at incredible speed) and Giants that live atop marble towers(don't ask how they got the marble).

There are other less interesting mytholigical creatures like cannabilistic women,they cannabilise men exclusively by chopping them up and boiling them,Night Beasts(they hang out at Oases and prey on anyone sleeping there),Large Snakes,they also call them dragons(not your stereotypical dragon)that only attack when your guard is down.

I can't think of any more than these,my source of these mythical creatures is based mainly on Khaleeji Folk Stories(Folk Stories of Bahrain,Qatar,Oman,Saudia,UAE and Kuwait written in both Local Accent and Arabic).

[ah_dut]

Quote[/b] (Aymar de Bois Mauri @ June 16 2004,00:47)]
Quote[/b] (ah_dut @ June 12 2004,08:54)]Aymar what about Jedi knights, Urak hai or even the minotaur, or even Aliens oh and also the people from Dune The Sardaukar and their laser beams, don't forget ringwraiths http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif
Copyright infringment... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-wink.gif
No it's not

[Kraxis]

Ohh... That is pretty hard to create faisal. Could possibly create a unit called Djinns, but I would like to keep gods and beasts out of it.

[scooter_the_shooter]

well i could help with the trojans as a geeky reference guy i am going to read the illiad soon


also i thought about making an lotr vs hellenic/roman mod that would be cool but i will only do one at a time i am dong the historical so i can learn about the new engine and it will be fun

[scooter_the_shooter]

also here is a greek myth site for ya have fun http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif this mod looks like one i can relaxw with when i play take away the seriousness of the historical one http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif


edit lol forgot the link


http://www.mythweb.com/



got it with google so dont know how good it is

[Leet Eriksson]

Hmmm mytholigical arabian stories mostly involved Djinns,like Kaleela and Dumna(Story based on Djinn story tellers).There are historical heroes that reached mythical status(Antarah,Banu Hilal,Kusai Ibn Kilab...etc),although pre-islamic,they are not in the Roman timeframe of the game.I could provide more information if you could elaborate on what info you need.

[Lazul]

about the The Norse.

They should be Very Raider like and not expansionists. In real life they where good colonisers but this was to be mythological. So why not add the world tree in the north of scandinvia, the Ygdrassil (ok, im not sure about the spelling)
Also the vikings most effective shock troop should the Valkyrians
The best melee unit should the "bärserki" (in other words, berserkers, well theere are like hundreds of ways to spell that word).
Also, in Norse mythology spear throwing is an important part, and archery, so a good spear throwing unit would be nice. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/medievalcheers.gif

[Kraxis]

faisal, I pretty much want to create a MOD where the factions have units like now (I doubt it would be easy to create mythical beasts or creatures). So something like what kind of cavalry they would ride, their infantry and so on. Since I have planned on creating a Greek Hero unit (small unit of great power), then an Arab unit could be possible too.

Lazul, right now I'm waiting for the Nibelungen to be explained more thoroughly, they sound better for the time than the Norse.
But yes, the way you have presented them is how I wanted them to be. Ygdrasil will not make it, the same reason as the beasts and creatures.
Valkyries... Perhaps, but they were the flying female Ase warriors that collected th dead warriors that were good enough and brought them to Valhalla. No, the main shocktroops would be the Einherjar (those said warriors), basically the best warriors the living had produced.

[Leet Eriksson]

Ah well lets see,its pretty easy have Pink Horses,just a photoshop to the skin of a horse and your done,they could be the fastest cavalry http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif might look ehurm a bit...gay http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

Cannabalistic women are a variation of screaming ones,they fatigue slower however,but poorly armed,mostly fear unit.

For Djinns,they are humanoid afterall,they look human most of the time,particularily the Ifrit and Air and Sea Djinn(however sea djin cannot fit becuase they are huge to start with),the rest are not so humanoid.Ifrits of course are shorter than ordinary humans,good at hiding and play with match sticks alot.. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif,Air Djin have nothing to do with air,but they are tied to them becuase they can take gassy forms and also transform into objects,they are a bit taller than humans,use their bare hands,since thats all they need to kill humans.

As for Heroes,i'll check on roman era ones,as for now,i only know about Khalid bin Sagr,hes historical,gathered the tribes in northern arabian to invade roman territory but was terribly defeated,becuase they lacked proper seige equipment http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif.

[Kraxis]

I would prefer to keep the mythological creatures out (meaning in this Djinns, and case of the Greeks Pegasus and such). It would be a dead end for me I think.

And heroes, well, named heroes will not be good. Can you imagine having five units of Odysseus and three units of Achilleus in your army? No, they would need to be just 'Heroes' or something smilar in name, a generic term.

So let me guess, Arabs would be light cavalry and light swordsmen? A few archers perhaps? Or were they only later?

[Leet Eriksson]

Yep arabs are mainly light infantry and light cavalry,arabian longbows were not invented yet,so they relied on javelins(herba and rummh,the herba is heavier,and can be used as a spear,the rummh is lighter and usually thrown).Archers were mainly mercenaries,from Greece,Abbassinia and Persia,but Abbysinian archers were more available.The nobility(heavy cavalry)were no heavier than numidian riders,they had the best in leather armour(sometimes only wore tunics),got the best swords available,and the best lances.The swordsmen were not really "true" arabs,but were syrian(tribal syrians not to be confused with Bedu),arabs called them "cousins" or "brothers",the swords are flung on their back,they had no shield,and no armour,just tunics,sometimes leather armour,depending on the soldiers wealth.the Spearmen are basically warbands,decent armour,and crap spears.Usually pre-Islamic Arab army organisation had the Cavalry at the back,archers in the middle and spearmen at the front,flanks had swordsmen and javelins,bulk of the army and main strength was in the middle,wich explains why we lose alot of times in wars in the roman era http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

This hopefully covers up the arab units and organisation.


Now the easy part,the buildings could be based on the egyptian ones,the walls in particular are a popular design in arabia.

[Kraxis]

Hmmm... Should prove doable. Does any of these troops have a mythical counterpart? I'm just looking for a name really, like I have to invent a few things for the other factions, but a few Arab names would be good.

[Leet Eriksson]

Mythical names?yeah alot but mostly sound silly,you have Jawareh,Fawaris,Kawaser..etc.Fawaris(Knights,exaggeration of Fursan the Plural of Faris),Jawareh(some sort of eagle or hawk,literally means "hurter" or "limbs" depends on the form of the word,noun,verb...etc),Kawaser(literally means "breakers" also form of naming a bird).There are also Zeer(warlord,overlord,cheiftian),Shiekh(old man,wiseman,generally it has something to do with Old and Wise,before it became an official name of an aristocrat),Musha'with(illusionist,necromancer).There are alot of mytholigical names,or tied with mythology generally,but these are most common.

I have an idea,i will ready a list of Unit names and give them each a mythological name.I'll post it up soonAfter that you can review it and post changes as you see fit.

[scooter_the_shooter]

i hope you put the mymidrons in the mod http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-blush.gif

[Oleander Ardens]

Hey Kraxis, sorry for the delayed answer which is a promise: I will give you as much info about the Nibelungen and others when I've finished my exams

Cheers

OA

[Kraxis]

Quote[/b] (ceasar010 @ June 18 2004,08:48)]i hope you put the mymidrons in the mod http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-blush.gif
I most certainly will. They will be the heavy elite shocktroops of the Greeks.

OA, I'm waiting with great expectations. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif