Dacian Falxmen

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

What do you think?

I personnaly like it.

[Basileus]

I like it, falx looks sweet heh

[The_Emperor]

Ahh another nice unit... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif

[shingenmitch2]

Yes this unit looks good. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/bigthumb.gif

I'm still a little unsure why every barbarianesque unit refuses to wear a tunic http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wacko.gif

[nightcrawlerblue]

This thread has a horrible lack of links...

[Aymar de Bois Mauri]

OKOK I thought that everybody had .COM bookmarked...

Total War (http://www.totalwar.com/)

Just press 3D Unit Profiles... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-wink.gif

[Spino]

Ok I guess. Nice falx and pants. But he looks exactly like a Celt. Same face and moustache as other Celtic units seen in the movies.

[The Wizard]

I had imagined the falx to look a little less naginata-like...

Then again, that could just be my imagination speaking http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wacko.gif



~Wiz

[Leet Eriksson]

Seems like a good unit,but i'd rather wait and hear from the Dacian experts in these forums(cough*nowake*cough).

[Ragss]

yay That falx look so badass. Itll probably have real high attack, but like -2 defence, my kinda troops hehe.

[Mablung]

Nasty Could be fairly unwieldy though. Could see why they would want some room to swing http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif

[Colovion]

I thought the falx would be bigger, that looks more Japanese.

But it's a cool unit I guess....

[Nowake]

Quote[/b] ]cough*nowake*cough)
Thanks faisal, but I don't consider myself an expert, just that I read intensively about thracian and dacian history.

Dacian Falxmen

Falxmen are used to carve a path into enemy formations. They are superior, but somewhat ill-disciplined warriors who are willing to charge into a fight without orders. They wear no armour, partly as a sign of their bravery and partly because it would interfere with the free swinging of their falxes.

A falx can cut a man in two lengthways in the hands of a skilled user. It is a frightening weapon: a curved scythe-like blade on the end of a long handle that is sharpened on the inner curve of the blade. The damage from any blow is done with a pulling motion, meaning that any blow that lands will hack off a limb or decapitate a foe at least. Historically, this is one of the few weapons that made the Romans change their standardised armour, as they added reinforcing bars to Legionary helmets after encountering falxmen.

Superior
Impetuous
Expert at Hiding in Woods

I my opinion, the overall unit looks good, but it still has flaws that rule it out of the dacian army. The description forgot to mention that the romans changed their greaves too and used an older type of armour in the second dacian war, as it resisted better to the falx. They introduced the manica (segmented armguard) - the manica was issued to during the Dacian Wars as an added protective measure against the falx; this armour was worn on the sword arm of the legionary, protecting him while thrusting with the gladius. The roman occra (greaves) were quickly adapted to the dacian falx, which was capable of reaching beneath the legionary's scutum and hitting the vulnerable lower leg.


In an excerpt from Fronto, there was a quote (allegedly taken from the lost book of Trajan, "De bello dacico") saying that the roman triarii used by Trajan in the parthian war were despising the parthian horse archers, after they were faced with the horible effects of the dacian weapons; I'll look for it and post the exact translation later.

The first thing that caught my attention were the trousers: the stripes makes them look very .. celtic, and it is a known fact that the dacians wore baggy pants, which one would expect to see for this 3D model.

The moustache, as Spino said, it is also of celtic origin: the dacians had big very rich beards, there are almost no depictions of them wearing only moustache.

Mitch raised another problem: the fact that they have no leather tunic or something: some time ago I would have said the same thing, but in the last months I studied intensively Trajan's column: in many places you can see the falxmen wearing only trousers.

A plus is the fact that the unit is not tattoed or anything: the dacians only tattoed their slaves. Another good thing is that he does not wear a pileus, that was reserved only for dacian nobility.

Funny thing: these units are expert at hiding in woods, while all others were expert at hiding in forests; what does this mean I wonder?


Btw, I think I found CA's source (http://www.amazonminiatures.com/youandwhosearmy/weapons.asp) for depicting the Falx. Just scroll down the page. A bit dissapointing, they just hit copy and paste

[ah_dut]

Great info Nowake, looks great but may just have been copied off STW (lazy gits) however, Nowake, how would we be able to show that a falx is not so useful against the Trajan style armour?

[Nowake]

Quote[/b] (ah_dut @ June 12 2004,17:19)]Great info Nowake, looks great but may just have been copied off STW (lazy gits) however, Nowake, how would we be able to show that a falx is not so useful against the Trajan style armour?
Take a look then:

http://www.geocities.com/richsc53/RD0603/S_DSC00503.JPG

http://www.geocities.com/richsc53/RD0603/S_DSC00509.JPG

http://www.larp.com/legioxx/falxcut1.jpg

http://www.larp.com/legioxx/falxcut2.jpg

http://www.larp.com/legioxx/falxcut3.jpg

[The Blind King of Bohemia]

Jesus, hate to be one of legions having that coming at me http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-stunned.gif

[The Wizard]

Meuh, as you see, he doesn't succeed in hacking through, for the boss of the scutum is too strong for the falx.



~Wiz

[Colovion]

Quote[/b] (The Wizard @ June 13 2004,06:37)]Meuh, as you see, he doesn't succeed in hacking through, for the boss of the scutum is too strong for the falx.



~Wiz
He probably didn't grow up learning to use the Falx to the best ability either.. plus he doesn't really look like the epitome of a Dacian soldier

[Nowake]

Yes, he is an englishman. He describes that he didn't put to much force into the blow, prefering to rely on the weapon. Just imagine that being used by an enraged dacian.


Plus, this is the scutum, the main defense of the legionary, not the armour. The legionary would be sliced if not for the scutum. What did you expect, to cut the scutum tin two? There would be numerous occasions on the battlefield for the falxmen to catch the legionaries off-guard.


The tactics used by the dacians were not the ones described by CA. The falxmen would not be the first to attack. The dacian army would absorb the shock with massed infantry and then charge the flanks with the falxmen. Many heads cut off.


Btw, for the CA's experts in latin, the plural for the falx is falces, not falxes http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/ceasarno.gif




Btw, a dacian helmet (http://www.geocities.com/cogaionon/large/l96.htm)

[The Wizard]

Meuh, this is good enough for me.

And you devise the tactics, CA devises the units you use, Nowake. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif



~Wiz

[The_Emperor]

Anyone else think that one of them could be useful in bringing down an Elephant?

Looks like a real mighty weapon. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/ceasaryes.gif

[Spino]

Love the 'Campbell's Chunky Legionary' paintjob on the scutum. Nice to see a re-enactor with a warped sense of humor. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif

If these photos are any indication of the falx's power then a scutum provides little protection against a well placed blow. Take a look at the location of the lateral slice. Any lateral strike in the middle section of the scutum has to potential to maul the arm of some poor legionary as it cuts through the shield. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif

The saving grace of the falx is that its wielder, being a farmer full time farmer and part time warrior, is probably a mediocre melee fighter. This unit should possess a fearsome charge and armor piercing rating with a low defense rating.

[ah_dut]

Nowake, you appear to have misunderstood me. How would it be possible for CA to represent this? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-help.gif

[RisingSun]

I think we are nitpicking a little on this one, as in the beard, etc. It's a perfectly historical unit besides minor appearance discrepencies, but nothing near the MC Hammer-hair of the Nubian spearmen, so I think we are all good with this unit. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/ceasaryes.gif

[Nowake]

Quote[/b] (The Wizard @ June 14 2004,11:42)]Meuh, this is good enough for me.

And you devise the tactics, CA devises the units you use, Nowake. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif



~Wiz
Indeed, but many people commented that falxmen would be used as shock troops, the first to engage the enemy, hypothesis with which I disagree.

The falxmen would not charge directly into a shieldwall, they would not be able to swing their weapons at full force besides the first blow.

The falxmen were flanking the enemy forces, cutting them down more easily and eficieanetly.

[PaolinoPaperino]

Maybe only Nowake will care about it,

but this site(all in romanian) has some nice image and description:

http://www.gk.ro/sarmizegetusa/index_files/index1.htm

on the left select Armata> Armele dacilor
or Armata> Razboaiele dacilor

btw: Dak-sha = the gods land? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-stunned.gif

[sergiusdacian]

soo nice

[sergiusdacian]

imagine this coming at you: http://www.geticagame.com/index.php?section=art&art=14&lang=en

[Quintus.JC]

Nice picture. But is it really necessary to resurrect a 5 year old thread? :sweatdrop:

[Ibn-Khaldun]

I have seen people resurrect 2-3 year old threads but .. 5???

Wow.. this must be the record or something! :dizzy2:

[Catiline]

Better a relevant 5 year old thread than a new one if it's here.