Jihaad vs Crusade

[Inuyasha12]

Anybody ever had a Jihaad and a Crusade Fighting for the same province?

I really want to know
That would be like so awsome http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif

[bighairyman]

Who wins? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif , it will depend on alot of things, like other battles- then number of men, quality, and the general. Did you meant if they are about equal size? http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-inquisitive.gif

[amir]

Jihads easily,
I once activated like 20 Jihad marker in a turn it was like 6000 troops without adding units OR passing thorgou friendly muslim province, that was awsome and it was almost on the beggings so I like doubled my army() in a turn(the only down side is the sudden -5000 that was my florin after a few turn(and still going down))
























OMFG I am an israeli jewish man and i just sayed I like Jihad, i must be going nuts

[Papewaio]

Just think of it of a mass exodus of violent people away from Israel...

[Darth Binky]

It would actually be pretty hard to pull off such a thing.

Considering that you can only Jihad for a territory that has been conquered by a non-Muslim, and you can only Crusade for a territory held by non Catholics.

The only scenario I can think of would be, let's say Palestine (or any other Muslim held territory) gets conquered by the Byzantines, Russians, Mongols, Rebels or excomm'ed Catholics. Then both a Jihad and Crusade could go for it. The likelihood that they both arrive at the same time isn't good.

If they did make it at the same time, it would work just like any other battle... the number and quality of the units contained in each would determine who wins. If the Crusade is just a few Order units and a ton of peasants, and the Jihad has Janissaries, Kwarazmians (sp?) and other good units, then the Crusade's gonna lose. You get the idea.

Cheers
DB

[The_Emperor]

Jihad will win.

The reason? Well next time you place down that marker, check out your troop content (especially in high zeal provinces).

Yup Jihads get half decent units thrown in as soon as they appear. Crusades on the other hand tend to attract mostly peasants and a few depelted units that they have managed to strip out of armies along the way...

So yeah Jihad should win.

[Chimpyang]

Quote[/b] (Darth Binky @ June 27 2004,09:44)]Considering that you can only Jihad for a territory that has been conquered by a non-Muslim, and you can only Crusade for a territory held by non Catholics.
Well that not entirely ture, you can Jihad against a muslim country as long they have taken one fo your provinces, my best tactic for Turkey High is to force retrat the egyptians using toms of men. Purposefully lose it at once and sned like 5 jihads against it.

[amir]

Quote[/b] (The_Emperor @ June 27 2004,12:39)]Jihad will win.

The reason? Well next time you place down that marker, check out your troop content (especially in high zeal provinces).

Yup Jihads get half decent units thrown in as soon as they appear. Crusades on the other hand tend to attract mostly peasants and a few depelted units that they have managed to strip out of armies along the way...

So yeah Jihad should win.
yep... usually even with hashshin, nizaris and all other late game units.

[Papewaio]

Quote[/b] (Inuyasha12 @ June 27 2004,07:55)]Anybody ever had a Jihaad and a Crusade Fighting for the same province?

I really want to know
That would be like so awsome http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif
Playing Turks... Eygpt has just done a surprise attack on my border.

Now it has declared a Jihad at Constinapole.

Italy likewise has declared (another) Crusade and it is targeting Constinapole.

Both are on the border... I think they may hesitate given that the 5* General has a fully stocked army made of a previous Jihad Horde... plenty of Fatwaas, a heavy Jani etc.

[Sarnaen]

In my experience, a Jihad beats a Crusade hands down. The only real reason to delcarea Crusade is to get your hands on those nasty heavy cavalry. The rest of the crusading army is just a delayed upkeep cost.
The Jihad, on the other hand, is filled with good quality troops, and a good mixture of them too. The only limitation is the fact that you have to own a province and lose it, before you can declare a Jihad. this is why a naval force is handy - raid unprotected enemy homelands, capture them, then withdraw and let them be recaptured. Then send Jihads into them. They may not reach their destination, but they will knock holes in the enemy's defences, allowing your more organised regular armies to pour in and rip them a new one...

[The_Emperor]

Exactly,

The strength of Jihads is one of the reasons why a Muslim army can very quickly field a large force.

All it takes is one decent army with a good general to go around besieging castles and the following year you can declare Jihad. Also given the cheap cost of Jihad markers (a bargain at 200 Flr each, given the units you can get from them) you can quickly raise a fighting force.

Another thing I noticed is that when i was running low on Generals in my Turk campaign (lots of low command heirs only a couple of really decent generals). When i declared Jihad I often got a 3 star general commanding it.

All he needed once his Jihad succeeded was the governorship of a province like Serbia, Bulgaria, Rum, Terbizond for Constantinople, throw in a State office such as commander of the fleet and you have yet another great general to add to your ranks.

[dessa14]

crusades get good troops too.
just send them through provinces with lots of good troops in them.
thanks, dessa

[King Edward]

From what i have seen, Crusades do not get as good troops from provinces as Jihads. I'm not talking about the ones from armies but just form the general populous. Exception to this is if you crusade through nothern Germany you get tutonic units for free

[{TL}Lord_Krutz]

ok, i'm all for euros in this game, and i rarely play the moslims, but i can tell u Jihad wins indefinately. why? well ask urself who now controls the present day middle east...

[King Edward]

Quote[/b] ({TL}Lord_Krutz @ June 28 2004,14:34)]ok, i'm all for euros in this game, and i rarely play the moslims, but i can tell u Jihad wins indefinately. why? well ask urself who now controls the present day middle east...
very valid point {TL}Lord_Krutz

Welcome to the .Org by the way http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

[ah_dut]

also you can launch 20 or (in my case) 50 jihads at a time http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif that showed the horde http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-party2.gif

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

Quote[/b] ]ok, i'm all for euros in this game, and i rarely play the moslims, but i can tell u Jihad wins indefinately. why? well ask urself who now controls the present day middle east...

We're working on that right now... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/gc-jester.gif
Just kidding.
*must... control... urge... to talk politics...*

I've never used a Jihad, though I've occassionally seem them in action.

I don't trust Crusades to get to their target by going through other Catholic provinces if I can help it; I just send the Crusade with its 1 unit of cav and the 2 fanatics to the target along with my own *large* army separate. It allows for flexibility (my good, hard earned units don't get stuck with the Crusade and I don't have to wait 15 years for the Crusade to reach its destination).

Yeah, a Jihad and Crusade meeting and fighting would be cool, though rare. Who would win depends on what units are in each. If its a dud Jihad (peasants and Ghazi only or something) vs. a really good Crusade (cav, order foot soldiers, plenty of good recruited units), the Crusade will win.

[{TL}Lord_Krutz]

thx edward, it's nice to finally check out all this good info/discussion on these forums. and as for working on it...we're not really using a Crusade, though they may be using a Jihad, lol, w/e, like u said, no politics here, let's keep it fun and mtw-related.

[Chimpyang]

Quote[/b] (Alexander the Pretty Good @ June 28 2004,17:17)]I don't trust Crusades to get to their target by going through other Catholic provinces if I can help it; I just send the Crusade with its 1 unit of cav and the 2 fanatics to the target along with my own *large* army separate. It allows for flexibility (my good, hard earned units don't get stuck with the Crusade and I don't have to wait 15 years for the Crusade to reach its destination).
You can always pour merc units into the crusade, they upkeep cost's dont apply until the province is capture completely so you can disband them as soon as the crusade finishes.