Muslim Melee #2

[Doug-Thompson]

What's the Catholic factions' greatest strength? Armored melee troops, especially knights. What type of unit is designed specifically to kill armored troops, especially knights who are pinned in melee? Javelins.

Almohads get the best javelin unit in the game -- Murabitins -- and the other two Muslim factions get access to Slav Javelins as soon as they overrun the Byzantines and get to Serbia or Bulgaria.

These troops are difficult to use. However, once mastered they can be devastating. See froggy's unit guide or this thread. (http://www.totalwar.org/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=15;t=17452;hl=javelin)

I like javelins in combination with Muwahid foot soldiers. I spread Muwahids out in a thin line two ranks deep and set to engage at will. This maximizes their considerable charge bonus and better melee value, compared to regular spears. It also shortens the throw for the javelin men behind them.

Muwahids, Murabitins and Slav Javs are all fast, which means that any combination of them will be able to move at the same quick pace. In addition, Murabitins have decent melee. Have them charge into the melee once their javelins are thrown.

[Blodrast]

nice insight, Doug-Thompson. It might be worth adding that the AI is incapable of making use of javelin troops, except (to a small extent) from jinettes.
however, this does require quite a bit of micromanagement during the fight, eh ? but it's all very useful, and while so far i haven't really been attracted to any of the muslim factions, i might just try once...

[Leodegar]

i love using javelines, too. it's just lovely to watch so many knights getting mowed down at each volley...

another good possibility to kill engaged armoured units is to use naphta throwers instead of javelines. i think you get even higher kill rates, especially if you can manage to get the naphta throwers in the rear of the enemy unit. although they seem not to aim too good, i normally blow up more of my own soldiers... and i love it, when these idiots blow up themselves... well, shit happens

[Doug-Thompson]

Quote[/b] (Leodegar @ June 29 2004,16:18)]another good possibility to kill engaged armoured units is to use naphta throwers instead of javelins.
You know, Muwahid spears may be just the right unit to use with Naphtha throwers, and all the Muslim factions get naphtha throwers.

Muwahids are spears with good melee, which means they can hold knights, swords or spears for at least a few seconds during the long naphtha wind-up. And they'd be only two ranks deep, shortening the throw for the naphtha guys and losing fewer of their own units in the explosions.

Dhoh Why didn't I try this before?

[IrishMike]

Kerns are another good javelin unit due to their cheapness and the ability that after you use up the ammo they can charge in from the rear and maybe if your lucky rout a unit. Unfortunately they are like every other peasant unit; cheap and only good for rear attacks if used in melee.

[Sarnaen]

Finally, people recognise the strength of the Almohad, with their great skirmishing capability. Whittle down with desert archers and disrupt with Faris, pin with AUM, surround and javelin to death with Murabitin. Chase with Saharan cavalry.
In MP, it's a little tedious, with no pause function, and generally fighting more varied armies...
In SP, against simpler, more standardised armies, the humble Almohads are awesome.

[Papewaio]

It is rather sweet to see one launch of javelins kill 5 Royal Knights.

After seeing that I went...hmmm AUM, disciplined spear and an anti armour missile unit... gotta love those Elmos.

[Spartiate]

I found the Mongol Javelin unit in STW much more effective than any in MTW.While i like the effect it has when done properly i just feel the Javeliners need too much baby-sitting by other troops(especially the slavs).The Murabatin Infantry are probably the best in MTW but still not as effective as tougher standard infantry like the ALMO Urban Militia.OF course this is only IMHO http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

Hasta la pasta

[Maeda Toshiie]

For the elmos, spanish jinetes are easily within reach. Those guys rock when used properly.

Personally I seldom use javelins, concentrating on mounted archers far more. Probably thats due to my love for turkish tactics.

[Ludens]

Quote[/b] (Maeda Toshiie @ July 05 2004,08:19)]For the elmos, spanish jinetes are easily within reach. Those guys rock when used properly.
Sorry, but Spanish jinettes are Catholic and Orthodox only. Muslim factions cannot build them (and neither can the Byzantines).