View Full Version : Army Movement: a little secret
Dionysus9
06-19-2002, 01:40
Ok, this little secret isn't even at the Academy, so consider yourselves lucky that I am bored during my lunch break (if you didn't know it already).
As you know, you can hit CTRL-A and then G to lock-group your entire army. Then when you ALT-RIGHTCLICK your entire army will 'wheel' to face your click (retaining their original orientation to one another). This 'wheeling' motion can take quite a while (especially if your army is spread out).
Ok, the little secret is that you do not have to wait for your army to complete the facing change before you order them to advance/retreat. You can go ahead and ALT-LEFTCLICK where you want the army to end up, immediately after you order the facing change.
So lets say you want to attack the left flank of your enemy. CTRL-A, G, ALT-RIGHT CLICK to your right (army will spin to face right), then immediately ALT-LEFTCLICK to the left of the enemy army. Then I normally hit G again to unlock the group. So when your army arrives at its new location it will be facing to the right, perfectly oriented to smash your opponents left flank.
Of course you can wait for the facing change to be completed but this telegraphs your plans to the opponent--much better to spin, then quickly advance to the position you want to take up, before he gets to see the result of your facing orders.
heh, well, I hope that is useful to someone.
BOOOOORRRRRREDDDDDD!!!
JeRrYgArCiA
06-19-2002, 01:49
Yes!thanks you bach!
Now i know how to turn my army! FINALLY!
woohhoo!!!
-majestickokeno
Most of the information found in the Academy was previously only known by the small circle of veterans around...thanks to Tootee everyone can know these very important things.
Thanks Dion for this info, I am sure Tootee will add it http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif Nothing new for the experienced player though, don't get too excited http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif hehe.
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka).
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
RageMonsta
06-19-2002, 02:15
did Tera say 'circle'?!?!?!
Muwhahahah...you're bright Monster http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka).
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
Nice one,but FasT already knew this http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gifLOL
There r more secrets too...hhhmmmmmmm i go find the link brb http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Ok here is some more help!
This is a post a found by FearofNC
Enjoy! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
ok...ok....here are some of best tips ever. ive been meaning to write a long winded reply but i always seem to lose the time. so ive condensed it and here are some of the major points....getting "undesired effects" is a problem that i struggled to overcome ( and finaly amp started training me )...there are 3 absolute rules to follow in order to keep order
BIG RULE #1 (begginer)- when you are moving while grouped...u MUST wait until at least 1 unit has come to a stop at its finial destination in order to click on another map point and maintain formation. if you "jump the gun" by not waiting you will notice that your units will not maintain the original formation.
BIG RULE #2 (advanced)- when you want to rotate you army in another direction ( alt- right click ) you MUST wait until all units have stoped. or they will not maintain formation.
BIG RULE #3 (expert)- if you do decide to rotate your army ( in grouped formation )((after all are at a complete stop)) you do not have to wait for ANY unit to stop after you rotate before you give new marching directions. if you use alt instead of ctrl your army will move to the new selected map point and arrive in the direction you told them to face before you gave marching order.
advanced tip that is a must know for up and coming great players-
sometimes the need arises to compleatly redraw your army-example- when you have just finished off an oppenent and need to aid you ally in a hurry but he is not close...follow these steps instead of simply ctrl clicking.
1. redraw army asap. ( as close as possible to your current location )
2. when compleatly done with #1 goto #3
3. after all your units have been issued orders and you can view the new formation with the space bar wait for 1 unit to compleatly stop...then group them.
4. after the group is estiblished...u must wait for the lag....or it wont work....(wait for the units to all move close at the bottom of the screen) use alt double left click. your units will run like the wind towards your ally.....but the cool part is they will "form on the fly" .....meaning they will arrive in the pretty formation u just drew....but the longer they march distance wise the closer they will begin to look like the new formation..also....they will all be marching very quickly.
i see so many players waiting for all there units to stop in the new formation before moving wasting a ton of time. on the other hand i see some just mindlessly ctrl click in a direction and create a mob of mixed up units will are easy to defeat.
a good idea wich i hope most of you that didnt know would have thought of after reading this post is to use a unit a cav as the 1 unit at rest...when redrawing the army do the cav first...by the time you are done giving orders to the rest of your troops the cav should be at rest if you chose a spot close by to redraw.
i have trained a few players with these tecniques who are now very good. this info is impossible to find because most who know it want to keep it that way. it may sound complicated but once practiced it becomes easy and will improve your play 100% welcome to the big leagues..
Hope this helps........Anymore ppl willing to add a few more here???
Dune Daidoji
06-19-2002, 04:18
nice post fast . good info . wish the server was up
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Hard pressed on my right .
My centre is yielding .
Impossible to maneuver .
Excellent .
I am attacking .
MARSHALL FOCH .
That info has been well known ages by the experience...Tootee please add them to the Academy...they're v v important!!
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka).
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
LittleGrizzly
06-19-2002, 05:40
thnx for info my tips is .........
spears beat cavarly http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/markuk/MTW/Custom_sig.gif
Dionysus9
06-19-2002, 06:47
Thanks for violating the rules of the circle and distributing this information.
It will be very useful in our battle against the circle.
LittleGrizzly
06-19-2002, 07:42
yes the final battle!
its coming no longer shall these evil cir... ive said to much http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
Circle...Stop mentioning it! Gosik will be furious...
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka).
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
MajesticWolf
06-19-2002, 19:42
GAH THE CIRCLE!!!!!! i think i know too much...someone is going to kill me.....i think it will be krast. *glares at krast*
MagyarKhans Cham
06-19-2002, 19:47
Our GWIS already noted that Tera mentioned The C...e
I am curious how this is gonna work out. What u think Monsta?
MajesticWolf
06-19-2002, 19:50
well, im pretty sure someone ha already given this tip but who cares. if you want to march your army in formation and keep them from accidentally turning every which way, hold alt and click on destination. i do this alot.
I'd better set up barricades...
But anyhow the KIS informed me that the Circle armies are weaker compared to a year ago...
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka).
evil is within us... http://www.totalwar.org/site/emomalta.gif
GAH! What is The Circumference?
Circle of truth http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Back on topic plzs.......
Krasturak
06-20-2002, 14:22
Quote Originally posted by MajesticWolf:
*glares at krast*[/QUOTE]
*glares at MajesticWolf*
Gah!
*grabs axe*
*exits into OT*
theforce
06-20-2002, 15:54
Is shall be useful for those 4v4 in flat maps http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif
(sometimes the enemy mitght start at some distance from your flank).
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I cannot return l presume so l will keep my name among those who are dead by bows!
Quote Originally posted by Terazawa Tokugawa:
Most of the information found in the Academy was previously only known by the small circle of veterans around...thanks to Tootee everyone can know these very important things.
Thanks Dion for this info, I am sure Tootee will add it http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif Nothing new for the experienced player though, don't get too excited http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif hehe.
[/QUOTE]
Yes, this will work with any grouping, not just group-all. The purpose of Shogun-Academy is to teach to basic skill, and all masters only pass on 90% of their skill, so go figure out why its not there http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif
It's no fun when everything is taught and not learnt http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Quote Originally posted by Terazawa Tokugawa:
That info has been well known ages by the experience...Tootee please add them to the Academy...they're v v important!!
[/QUOTE]
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif
ok I will add a line encouraging everyone to try out the different combo of control keys. I think most are mentioned, just need more experimentation *just like Bachus did* with the basic controls, but essentially nothing new. One new control to try is
[ctrl]+[alt]+left_click_on_enemy, then while holding them, press [del]. The enemy unit will be killed instantly. Work in SP only http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif
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tootee the goldfish,
headmaster of Shogun-Academy (http://shogun-academy.tripod.com)
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Justy_SG
06-20-2002, 19:25
To be honest, I never use those tactics & never know how to till today !! hee hee
Couldn't figure out so I gave it up ... lol
Till now, I still stick to the manual deployment. Cos enemy formations are usually different. Most of the time, I do not wait for my entire troops to settle down after facing them in other direction. Thats cos I send them to hell ..... hahaha
Wasnt all this and much more in an old faq that someone put out last year or even farther back? That FAQ was nice.
Quote Originally posted by FasT:
BIG RULE #1 (begginer)- when you are moving while grouped...u MUST wait until at least 1 unit has come to a stop at its finial destination in order to click on another map point and maintain formation. if you "jump the gun" by not waiting you will notice that your units will not maintain the original formation.[/QUOTE]
You can if you use ALT+Left_click. ALT+left_click always infer maintaining selected units formation and facing (whether they in free, locked or keyed group), whether all are still on the move or not.
Quote
BIG RULE #2 (advanced)- when you want to rotate you army in another direction ( alt- right click ) you MUST wait until all units have stoped. or they will not maintain formation.
BIG RULE #3 (expert)- if you do decide to rotate your army ( in grouped formation )((after all are at a complete stop)) you do not have to wait for ANY unit to stop after you rotate before you give new marching directions. if you use alt instead of ctrl your army will move to the new selected map point and arrive in the direction you told them to face before you gave marching order.
[/QUOTE]
This principle is the same as (1). Using ALT always infer maintaining selected unit formation and facing.
Quote
advanced tip that is a must know for up and coming great players-
sometimes the need arises to compleatly redraw your army-example- when you have just finished off an oppenent and need to aid you ally in a hurry but he is not close...follow these steps instead of simply ctrl clicking.
1. redraw army asap. ( as close as possible to your current location )
2. when compleatly done with #1 goto #3
3. after all your units have been issued orders and you can view the new formation with the space bar wait for 1 unit to compleatly stop...then group them.
4. after the group is estiblished...u must wait for the lag....or it wont work....(wait for the units to all move close at the bottom of the screen) use alt double left click. your units will run like the wind towards your ally.....but the cool part is they will "form on the fly" .....meaning they will arrive in the pretty formation u just drew....but the longer they march distance wise the closer they will begin to look like the new formation..also....they will all be marching very quickly.
[/QUOTE]
On (3) and (4), grouping is unnecessary. You can just select the desired units, or select-all without [G]ing to form group, and use ALT. Its the same principle as before - For selected units, using ALT+LEFT_click anywhere on ground, the formation and facing is always maintained. One point to note is that the 1st time you ALT+left_click on a point, and check the ghosts you'll see them at the spot. ALT+left_click at same spot again, and check the ghosts. Now they are twice the distance away.
FYI.
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tootee the goldfish,
headmaster of Shogun-Academy (http://shogun-academy.tripod.com)
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[This message has been edited by tootee (edited 06-20-2002).]
One thing that still puzzles me is how u can get ur units to line up like this?Yes i been to the academy http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
So how u get then like this?
MK YS MK YS MK YS MK plzs xplain?
I tried with no look as i want my LEFT YS to be on my left in the panel at bottom of screen etc
Which order u pick them and how?
Azzamain
06-21-2002, 02:37
Whats this circle and whats yoru connection to the Area 51 cover up?
Quote Originally posted by FasT:
One thing that still puzzles me is how u can get ur units to line up like this?Yes i been to the academy http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
So how u get then like this?
MK YS MK YS MK YS MK plzs xplain?
I tried with no look as i want my LEFT YS to be on my left in the panel at bottom of screen etc
Which order u pick them and how?[/QUOTE]
On defense, I have to draw my army line up before start the battle so the unit appears in the left of the panel will be on the left side of the battlefield. This way I can remember where my units are, so I don't send a unit on the left side of the field charge an enemy unit on the right side of the field.
Typical defense formation (16 units):
------SA-SA-SA-SA------
--WM--YS-YS-YS-YS--WM-- (WM or ND)
HC--WM---Taiso---WM--HC (any Cav; WM or ND)
-----------YC----------
On attack, I also have to redraw my army in the same way before engaging.
Typical attack formation (16 units):
----------YS--YS----------
--YS--WM--CA--CA--WM--YS-- (WM or ND)
--HC--WM---Taiso---WM--HC--(any Cav; WM or ND)
--NC--------YC--------NC-- (any Cav)
The text didn't line up well, neither the troops in the battle field.
[This message has been edited by pdoan8 (edited 06-22-2002).]
Krasturak
06-22-2002, 08:41
For getting the units to line up in sequence by type, you have to select them in a sequence.
Some people did a test of this, and it is very strange.
Try selecting four different units and line them up; you'll get them into line something like this:
--C--A--D--B--
Then change the sequence of selection, and they come like this:
--D--B--A--C--
So mess around with it and you'll maybe find the right way to get spears and monks to alternate.
Not sure if it is worth it; maybe it's easier to place them manually at first and then [G]-group them or something.
another disadvantage of this is that it tends to force the user to be rigid, i.e. unwillingness to forego the nice formation when battle unroll. A dynamic battle calls for fluidity and your troops should move like flowing water, not maintaining a nice looking formation. In a static battle, and you are more of reactive then proactive, maybe it will be useful.
K i will do some testing on this..... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Orda Khan
06-22-2002, 17:51
By using alt+l/click on any given group the units in that group march to new point as a group but using this method to turn, your units all turn but as seperate units ie you end up with staggered ranks. The advantage of group-alt+r/click is your formation wheels as one unit. In other words all your neat rows stay the same.
By the way, nice post. These are the little tips that help rookies become seasoned campaigners, thus keeping the community alive.
None of the above tips help much when you cock up your deployment in a 4v4 and end up facing the wrong way!!!!!
What was I thinking of?
........Orda
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" Send us your ambassadors and thus we shall judge whether you wish to be at peace with us or at war..if you make war on us the Everlasting God, who makes easy what was difficult and makes near what was far, knows that we know what our power is."
LOL I remember when the first few times I play ObakeHorseland I have orientation problem and kept deploying facing the wrong way.
Krasturak
06-22-2002, 22:18
Krast has seen generals deploy facing the wrong way as a lure; they turn their army to face the rush faster than the rush arrives, and then have the benenfit of defending with an organized force against a hasty attack.
Quote Originally posted by Krasturak:
Krast has seen generals deploy facing the wrong way as a lure; they turn their army to face the rush faster than the rush arrives, and then have the benenfit of defending with an organized force against a hasty attack.[/QUOTE]
Gah Krast! You give it away! Ssshh.. no more words.. the Circle is watching.
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tootee the goldfish,
headmaster of Shogun-Academy (http://shogun-academy.tripod.com)
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Orda Khan
06-24-2002, 06:24
Try this FasT....
Ctrl+ select the YS and deploy in a row.
Then keep ctrl key down and select the monks,
you now have all YS and monks selected.
When you deploy in a row the monks slot in between the YS.
...........Orda
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" Send us your ambassadors and thus we shall judge whether you wish to be at peace with us or at war..if you make war on us the Everlasting God, who makes easy what was difficult and makes near what was far, knows that we know what our power is."
i been doin a few tests etc......
i can get my guns as u see them in the bar..
Also the same with monks and ys etc
Then draw a line and they appear as in the screen below http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
But u must pick then in a certain order though......
Dionysus9
06-25-2002, 05:50
Ok, Fasty, you better tell me the trick!
Please?
MizuKokami
06-30-2002, 06:40
yes...i wanna hear it too http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
Quote Originally posted by FasT:
i been doin a few tests etc......
i can get my guns as u see them in the bar..
Also the same with monks and ys etc
Then draw a line and they appear as in the screen below http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
But u must pick then in a certain order though......[/QUOTE]Ok very hard too xplain..i can give u a very basic idea here,as like i said u got to pick them in certain orders and depends which unit u pick also...
My advice is test and try in custom battles..Took me many hours of testing+ u gotta remember in which order u pick them...
K pick 4 guns 1#h2 2#h2 3#h2 4#h2
Pick them in this order and draw a line;
1#h2 then 4# then 3# then 2# ok they will be as u see above........
Next pick 4 ND 1#h2 2#h2 3#h2 4#h2
pick in this order 3# then 2# then 4# then 1# they will line as in that order thus right is right left is left..
Many ways u just got to test them
Dionysus9
07-02-2002, 11:38
Thanks FAst!
BarryNoDachi
07-02-2002, 17:22
i think if you look for a post by someone called shoko he explains this aswell http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
can you do other units not guns fast?
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Clan Kenchikuka (http://www.totalwar.org/kenchikuka)
Quote Originally posted by BarryNoDachi:
i think if you look for a post by someone called shoko he explains this aswell http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
can you do other units not guns fast?
[/QUOTE]Yes i can do ND and Monks etc and all others m8...but is a little hard to xplain though,just try it out in Custom battles.
Takes many hours though...what i did it write them down.Then try different pickin orders to see which results i got.
But so many ways too pick them m8..list would be too long..+ the ones i mainly use r up in me head http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/eek.gif
I only use hotkeys.....and never really group my units only if i need to turn whole army http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
anymore ways u can add here?
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