Ballista tactics

[qmark]

Just wondered if anyone has more success than me with anti-infantry/cavalry ballista? I find they get overrun very easily and don't do a great deal of damage before they do. I'm sure I'm just setting them up in the wrong place but any advice would be welcome.

I found placing artillery in Nap TW pretty easy, the cannisters went between 2 units of line infantry, each covering the other. It worked a treat from a defensive position. However trying the same in RTW just doesn't yield anywhere near the same results.


Anybody got any suggestions?

[SpencerH]

I've used the repeating ballistae between units of my defensive line quite effectively. The trick is to micromanage what unit it's firing at and focus on anything that looks like it will attack the ballistae unit itself. Often the attack will break up before it comes too near the 'guns' but I also try to keep arcani or gladiators behind (just in case).

[qmark]

So you're saying you have a fast, hard heavy infantry unit as close support? That makes sense. I'd previously used them as flanking, shock troops but maybe holding them back as cover might be an idea.

Cheers dude.

[derF]

I only use ballistas and other siege weapons on attacks. That way, i can punush the enemy for holding their ground. In defence, theyre much less useful.

[Productivity]

So you're saying you have a fast, hard heavy infantry unit as close support? That makes sense. I'd previously used them as flanking, shock troops but maybe holding them back as cover might be an idea.

Cheers dude.

Two sets of ballistae, out wide, firing in on the main battle.

ie.

**______________________________**
_________MAIN BATTLE LINE__________

With a unit of support for them. That way if they don't send anything in to attack the ballistae, you can flank them anyway.

[mfberg]

I put them in line with my hastati/princepes and back them with velites. As the enemy advances they get larger morale hits until they run (usually at about 3m from my line).

mfberg

[Somebody Else]

Was playing RTR 5.2, I had an army slaughtering people at a bridge (as one does). The Romans eventually fielded an army with ballistas. I now have had to change my tactics completely. The first time, the AI completely mauled my troops with ballista fire.

[SpencerH]

So you're saying you have a fast, hard heavy infantry unit as close support? That makes sense. I'd previously used them as flanking, shock troops but maybe holding them back as cover might be an idea.

Cheers dude.

The fact that they are a small units helps too. They dont take forever to move through the balistae crew.

[SpencerH]

Was playing RTR 5.2, I had an army slaughtering people at a bridge (as one does). The Romans eventually fielded an army with ballistas. I now have had to change my tactics completely. The first time, the AI completely mauled my troops with ballista fire.

Seige weapons (especially onagers) are the number one target for me in almost every battle. I'll sacrifice cav units to take em out (if necessary) and they are the primary focus for my onagers once they are in range.

[Oaty]

Well the simplest one is using a rock formation to protect them. Unfortanately not too many fields have this opportunity. I've used them behind my infantry on flat ground just make sure you place them a decent distance behind them. But the best is if you have a favourable slope behind your infantry, you can place them almost directly behind your line.

If the enemy is weak/no cavalry I'll place them on a flank.

The biggest problem I have with ballistas is that they try to aim at the center of a unit and this is why leaving a gap in the main line wo'nt work because they wo'nt always fire through that gap but to the side of it hitting my own guys.

[SpencerH]

The biggest problem I have with ballistas is that they try to aim at the center of a unit and this is why leaving a gap in the main line wo'nt work because they wo'nt always fire through that gap but to the side of it hitting my own guys.

Yes they have to a part of the front line.

A trick that I use is to move the camera down to ground level to sight-in the emplacements to make sure they have the best LOS (just as you have to do with real heavy weapons).

[Sam Adams]

remember, historically field artillery was pretty useless before gunpowder came along. artillery pre-gunpowder tended to be used for seiges and fortifications.

if your going to use artillery in rtw, it has got to be behind a line of infantry. They absolutly cannot protect themselves.

ballistas are a poor choice... archers are much better unless you are firing upon very heavy armor.

[Es Arkajae]

I use ballistas very rarely.

For battlefield use they (aswell as scorpions) are almost completely worthless, you'd be better off investing in an extra unit of archers. They're good only for the cool factor of seeing enemy troops impaled and flung screaming backwards~D

The only reliable use for ballistas or scorpions

1)Battering down wooden gates (ballistas)
2)Picking defenders off of stone walls (both)
3) Defending camp forts and some barbarian settlements (they have internal elevations) where they can be placed high enough to shoot over the walls properly even then its usually only in a sally by yourself that they'll be of much use as the enemy will just stand there. (both)

Other than that they're all but useless.*shrugs*

If one could mount them on walls or towers they'd be far more useful. I myself am hoping this is put into the expansion.:)

[tai4ji2x]

in RTR you get extra ballistae for every unit. four instead of just two.

[Somebody Else]

I find them very useful in RTR5.2, scorpions are very good for dislodging heavily armoured troops, and going up against archer heavy armies. Arrowfire is kind of useless against Roman legionnaires, but these things just cut swathes through them. Likewise phalanxes - slow moving, easy targets. Plus, I do like seeing enemy soldiers (especially faction leaders) being skewered and flung back by giant metal bolts.

[Craterus]

i've never had a successful attack with a ballista (by this, i mean they never do enough damage to be deemed successful but more a waste of time)
i odn't use them because i dont use them effectively and i would "invest in another unit of archers" or more appropriately CHARIOT ARCHERS

[RollingWave]

In vannila RTW the only real decent use of ballista is attacking wooden wall settlements so you don't need to wait and build a ram.

[Zorn]

Yesterday I got badly mauled by ballistas. I was attacked by a huge senata army. I formed my shield wall, wich has given my several heroic victories against other romans. Then 4 ballista units started firing from behind their lines. I modded ballistas, so that each unit has 8 machines. That really hurt. Soon the area behind my phalanx was littered with dead bodies (I love it how those arrows push men back). So I was forced to leave my position to take out the crews. I suceeded in doing so, but that was due to the AI weakness.
In this game I learned that ballistas can fire over units, which makes them actually usefull (I`d say especially for greeks, who are pretty weak in the archer department).

[Craterus]

but the greeks can usually recruit cretan archers..
- has anyone noticed that when you click on a unit of Cretan Archers in battle and they say the name of their unit, they sound like a bloke from northern england

[Dutch_guy]

only use balista's when attacking wooden walls ., to takew out teh towers and of course the walls.

[Es Arkajae]

I modded ballistas, so that each unit has 8 machines.

Great idea Zorn ~;)

I've now modded it too now, 6 men to a ballista meaning 8 engines on the unit size I've set it.

Now they actually do make a difference on a battlefield. ~:)

[Cardinal]

Must say I prefer the Scorpions. Nice long range, which is something the ballistas don't have. Often find that when the enemy comes into the range of ballistas, my men (as if they were mine :dizzy2: ) are allready being punded by enemy archers by then, and I have other things in mind than micromanaging ballistas.

[Es Arkajae]

I believe in this thread 'ballistas' is being used generally to refer to ballista type weapons mate, that includes ballistas, scropions and repeating ballistas.

[Benny Moore]

Their real life counterparts had double or triple the range. Also, they actually had longer range than onagers. I modified my game to reflect that, although I didn't go as far as doubling the range.

[SpencerH]

The ranges used for all the seige weapons are abysmally low compared to some of the archer ranges.

[Craterus]

yea, i always thought they were quite low!

[Benny Moore]

Well, one web site stated that onager crews were often in range of arrows from the walls, but who knows if that's true or not. It's the ballistas that got really nerfed.

[Cardinal]

I believe in this thread 'ballistas' is being used generally to refer to ballista type weapons mate, that includes ballistas, scropions and repeating ballistas.

Aah!

[imdWALRU5]

i've never had a successful attack with a ballista (by this, i mean they never do enough damage to be deemed successful but more a waste of time)
i odn't use them because i dont use them effectively and i would "invest in another unit of archers" or more appropriately CHARIOT ARCHERS

I agree with that. I sometimes use them just to see people get killed and their pretty good against wooden walls and the other weak wall type

[Marcus Maxentius]

The only way I could use them in a field battle was to attack a mostly stationary target such as a huge clump of warbands trying to break through my line. I had one ballista unit and it took out an entire line of troops which still wasn't a lot considering I had to do it from close range and ended up getting charged. But 16 is better than 1,2, or three. I figure you have to aim for soliders trapped in natural bottle necks or against a wall of men rather than of stone. It would be stupid to wait for the enemy to stay in one place.

[zambol]

In my roman standard legion I use an artilleristic support unit of
2 scorpions: long ranged support weapon for early openig fire
2 modern ballistae : short ranged support where the heat is on
1 or 2 onager/heavy onager

this artillery department is used on one flank, massed and not split up.
I always concentrate fire, the onagers in infantry masses, the scorpions on specific targets ( other archers, cavalery, generals....), the rep. ballistae giving close support before engaging to brake up infantry masses.
especially against rebels or other underdeveloped armies artillery can be decisive before the battle( close combat) even has begone.
even at the end of the game scorpions where quite useful because of there long range, which compensates the lower firing rate very well in my opinion.