CA/EA Please here this!

[Toranaga_Sama]

Hello,

I just wanted this to be voiced and heard.

Regarding the expansion pack, US version, apparently this will be available for existing STW owners for order online at EA's site.

Will you please make the expansion pack available for DOWNLOAD after "purchase" (, if purchase is necessary), in addition to delivery by snail mail.

Those of us fortunate enought to have xdsl/cable connections will appreciate this greatly.

Maybe I'm insane, but presuming the file size to be ~500 mb a 1.5 kbps s/b able to download this overnight.

EA will probably need to beef up its server and make the appropriate arrangements with a suitable host.

Dojo members please add your requests as well.

[ShadowKill]

hmm for me 500mb lets see here ummm yep after adding up the numbers it would take 32 hours nope not an option for me http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Fear not the sword to your front, but the blade at your back.

Clan Shades
Shades (http://www.geocities.com/shadesofshogun/index.html)

[Plant_head]

If that would make it free then I'm in.

[Anssi Hakkinen]

For the record, I'm all for Toranaga-sama's idea about having the expansion available for download at ea.com.

However, I think that won't happen (certainly not for free, you Plant_head http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif). And there's one major reason: they say that the *US* players who already have the original game will be able to buy the expansion online. The European and Asian/Australian players, on the other hand, will have to buy the CD from a retail store. What would be the point to that if Euro/Asian/Aussie users could download the game just as easily from ea.com?

I just realized what this means. It means that I will get the game at least two months later than the US gamers. I'll make a really useful moderator then... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif Sound like I have to make some special arrangements (mail order?).

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"Crystal clear, / Sharp and bright, / The sacred sword / Allows no opening / For evil to roost."
- Ueshiba Morihei O-Sensei

[The Daimyo]

Umm, it's not gonna happen, period. You will need the CD in order to play the game. Just like the present, where you legally need to have the CD-ROM for the full game in order to play.
The game will most likely have some sort of anti-copy scheme on it or at least a CD-ROM checking application to help keep the game from being pirated, which is what would happen if it was just a download.
This isn't like SWAT3 or Unreal Tournament where the add-ons were done for different reasons.
They are actually trying to make some money off of their 10 months of work on this expansion. Wouldn't you? Mmhmm... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
I'd personally like it if they sold it in the USA both ways, but I guess we'll have to wait and see.



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The Daimyo
Miaowara "Kakizaki" Tomokato
@ http://www.planettotalwar.com

[Doragon_Ajidrik]

I thought its gonna be sold as both an Expansion and Gold Edition? is it not?
It doesnt matter I am gonna buy the Gold Edition since I lost my CD case and cant reload the game

[Toranaga_Sama]

>>What would be the point to that if Euro/Asian/Aussie users could download the game just as easily from ea.com?>You will need the CD in order to play the game. Just like the present, where you legally need to have the CD-ROM for the full game in order to play.
The game will most likely have some sort of anti-copy scheme on it or at least a CD-ROM checking application to help keep the game from being pirated, which is what would happen if it was just a download.

[Dark Phoenix]

EA will not give it away for free. Why would they give it away for free in there biggest market and not in the smaller markets like Australia.

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DoragonPhoenix of the Clan Doragon

[Toranaga_Sama]

Answer this, why is the "add-on" only available at retail for non-US users and only available "online" for US users????

That is the question, answer please...somebody...anybody...???

[Anssi Hakkinen]

The answer: the Warlord Edition. If WE is published in the US (and Canada!), EA simply can't afford to publish another STW package that only has half the other one's content. Shelf space at retail stores is at a premium these days, and WE will likely make much more money to EA than the "plain" expansion. Thus, it's WE for North America and MI everywhere else, and selling MI online to North American users is just them being benevolent. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

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"Crystal clear, / Sharp and bright, / The sacred sword / Allows no opening / For evil to roost."
- Ueshiba Morihei O-Sensei

[Toranaga_Sama]

I've thought about the shelf space issue. If what your saying is correct, then in effect what your saying is that "shelf" space in North America cost more than "shelf" space in the rest of the world.

Interesting, thinking about this...so CA/EA is coming out with an "Add-On" Pack AND a "Gold Edition", both at the same time.

One wonders why the heck would they do that? Why not release the "Add-On" and three months later release the "Gold Edition"? That's more along the lines of how these things are normally done. Isn't it a little soon for a Gold Edition in any event?

Gold Editions are usually released encompassing, the original game, plus all "Add-Ons" (and often patches/fixes) at the very end of a game's shelf-life. An attempt to harness the last remaining sales and is most often done within months of a new release. Ala, Civ2 MPGE.

Something strange is going on....

[The Daimyo]

Yes Toranaga_Sama, something very strange is going on. You seem to have recieved some bad weed, and having smoked it all in one sitting have caused yourself to become paranoid and delusional, quite possibly MAD!!!
Seek Treatment Immediately!!! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

You are quibling over the meaning of the words and you are not seeing the picture that was shown to the rest of us that we seem to all understand yet it still eludes you after everyone has discussed this matter into the ground.
Someone mentions Add-on and you are thinking up the wrong tree. This is not a Mod or a collection of maps and skins that you might expect from other games.
This is a FULL BLOWN EXPANSION - and they are also (BTW) RERELEASING STW with the new Expansion in a specially labeled and often misunderstood name.

This is to cause mass confusion in the media and it serves their purpose greatly. By confusing everyone with the "speaking in tongues" that Richie is capable of doing when announcing a new project or development he essentially weaves a spell of black magic on us all.
Many AD&D officianados would call this an "Audible Glamor" spell, or perhaps it's just a simple "Befuddle" spell. I think it must be something more sinister.
Since the game's release haven't you all noticed that Richie has on many occassions DISAPPEARED!

I think he was sent of to a special school for PR and Q/A guys so that they could tech him the new ways of the black arts.

I could be over-reacting. Maybe I should just go and sit in the corner now and wait to see what happens next.
They mostly come at night, mostly....

http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif



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The Daimyo
Miaowara "Kakizaki" Tomokato
@ http://www.planettotalwar.com

[Dark Phoenix]

DId you have some of the weed as well The Daimyo. :lol

[The Daimyo]

Yeah maybe I did, but I never inhaled!!!

http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

LOOK here, If I bump into someone here at this time of day (1:30am here and I only got 3 hours of sleep yesterday) they are likely to get stuff on them or feel a slight discomfort. It's not like the situation with the dreaded Volkswagon, no-no! I mean It's very likely that I'm going to fling Moo's at you or ask for a toll fee for crossing my path.
are you http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/confused.gif yet?


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The Daimyo
Miaowara "Kakizaki" Tomokato
@ http://www.planettotalwar.com

[EA Raskal]

Relax, relax, relax. I can understand everyones concerns, because as a gamer myself I would not want to buy the same product twice. I am still not quite sure how it will be sold, but I highly highly doubt that it will be available for download. The only game I know of that was downloadable from EA was Front Office Football 2001. It was only 9mb. This is going to be much larger than 10 mb!

[Toranaga_Sama]

Great,"I am still not quite sure how it will be sold,...",

>>The only game I know of that was downloadable from EA was Front Office Football 2001. It was only 9mb. This is going to be much larger than 10 mb!

[Rob]

The problem with downloadable software is the perceived risk of software piracy. There are reasonably well-established systems for preventing CD piracy; the fact that they don't really work isn't the point. Putting something up for download on the 'net is an open invitation for someone to set up a mirror of the file.

Basically, this is the result of publishers/developers being unwilling to come up with new and creative solutions to the piracy problem, but in this respect EA are no different to any other major games publisher. I agree it's perfectly possible to make games downloadable - the argument that 56k modem users is true, but there are more and more people with broadband connections now. The problem is piracy and the fact that whoever becomes the first 'big name' publisher to make full games available for download is taking a big leap into the unknown.

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MizuRob Hojo
Honour to clan Takiyama

[The Daimyo]

Another thing to consider here, BANDWIDTH USAGE. I'm sure many are not acquainted with this subject, and it's something that's very big on the mind of anyone who runs a heavy traffic site.
It costs money.
It isn't cheap.
It's rather expensive in many countries.
Let us say that the expansion will be around 400 megabytes. If 1,000 people tried to download this file with their cable or DSL modems in one day how many megabytes would be transferred? (400,000 megabytes) How many T1, T3, or OC3 lines would be needed to handle that much data to be transferred in one day? How many would be needed to handle 10 or 20 times that amount? What does it cost to have an OC3 line for 1 month's service?

Would the download speeds be at their maximums? NO. Not unless everyone was allowed 100-400KB/sec of bandwidth to be alloted to EACH connection. Not bloody likely.

There's no logical solution for this that wouldn't cost 10's of thousands of dollars and there's not a single company out there, including Fileplanet, Conxion, or any other big name file server that would handle those kinds of drags on their systems for 1 game's files.
It would cost EA/CA no less than $3.50 per download at best just for the bandwidth. But as I said, it would cost a whole lot more to get all of the servers and dedicated lines to handle that kind of a pull. Why would they spend more to distribute their game by making it downloadable than it costs to go through the normal routes? That would cut into everyone's profit and make the whole venture unfeasible.

Think on this before arguing it further.

Most likely they will rethink their distribution strategy and we'll end up seeing both the Expansion and the Warlord Edition (full + expansion) in stores here in the USA and elsewhere.
They're still selling this game like hot cakes in places all over the world, and I expect the numbers to really jump as soon as the next advertising campaign gets launched.
Fear not.
We'll get more info on this matter soon enough.


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The Daimyo
Miaowara "Kakizaki" Tomokato
@ http://www.planettotalwar.com

[This message has been edited by The Daimyo (edited 01-15-2001).]

[Toranaga_Sama]

>>Another thing to consider here, BANDWIDTH USAGE. I'm sure many are not acquainted with this subject, and it's something that's very big on the mind of anyone who runs a heavy traffic site.>Why would they spend more to distribute their game by making it downloadable than it costs to go through the normal routes? That would cut into everyone's profit and make the whole venture unfeasible.

[The Daimyo]

Nice rebuttle, but you missed a few of my points. I applaud the effort, and I do agree that the form of distribution you are speaking of is LONG OVERDUE, but, we are still running into the technical and financial wall here.
The prohibitive costs of the servers and bandwidth (ie, all the cables and services plus all of the necessary hardware that is needed to run that down the line from host server to router to ISP to etc. etc.) is too much for the moment for any one product or GAME company (outside of Microsoft, if they can be referred to as that now). If EA.UK were to do this coming from England, foygeyd-aboud-it, they'd be eaten alive by Teleco expenditures alone just for setting it up. Even in the USA it would costs hundreds of thousands of $$$ dollars to even mount half of a good effort.
I'm not arguing that it isn't something they'd want to look into down the line, but that's a big project worthy of the entire company doing it in order to profit from it over a 3-5 year period.
The other factors we can look at involve the product distribution lines, from CA to EA to all those others to your neighborhood game outlet. If they chop out the middle men now, then chances for getting ad spaces, shelf spaces, or whatever - is going to take a kick in the groin and the backseat to the other games coming out through conventional channels (that pay the bills of all those related companies, I must remind you).
I'll give you a run down of the costs of making and shipping the games at a later date if you want me to, but for the moment all of this should suffice.
If you can, save me the time and go buy last month's issue of PC Gamer magazine, there's a great article that details who get's what and why in the gaming industry. A must read for all of us who are so concerned with matters like this.
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif
Now....How do we remedy this, or rather, How do we get the Game Makers to start doing this en mass?

hmmm...



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The Daimyo
Miaowara "Kakizaki" Tomokato
@ http://www.planettotalwar.com