New forum for mod ideas?

[King of Atlantis]

I was thinking there should be a seperate mod forum section for mod ideas. That way the forge wouldnt get croweded and people would feel more free to post their ideas. ONce the mods get going then they could be moved to the forge.

Anyways just an idea!

[Epistolary Richard]

It's a nice idea, but I think separating them off would just make it far less likely that they would ever gather a team and actually get moving as fewer people would see them. If you don't want to post an idea in the Forge, then you can do so in the General forum. I can remember at least one example of a one-line mod idea that was posted here which snowballed.

And I'm not too worried about the Forge getting crowded (so long as they're relevant and not threads that should be somewhere else). The mod threads that have activity on them pop back to the head of the list pretty regularly, and those which are moribund slide away to subsequent pages.

[Duke John]

The problem is some people who have little to no moddings skills propose ambitious projects, and they just shouldn't do that. You need to be a very charismatic person if you can get other people to make your idea become reality. It also happens at game-engine forums, there are countless people who come up with an idea for a MMORPG and then expect the programmers and artists flock under their banner.

I think it might be a better idea to make an informative "How to start a mod" that shows all the hardships of starting a mod. But then few will read that...

[Epistolary Richard]

Didn't some talented (and modest) modder already do that (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=35969)? :wink:

My approach has always been to only start a mod that I knew that I could finish single-handedly if I had to. Then, if others joined that would be great, but if they didn't it could still get done.

The other thing to do if you only have very specialised skills or limited time is to help out in a larger modding team. Then, when that's complete, experienced members will be far more inclined to help out in your personal mod as you'd already worked together.

[Duke John]

:grin: Perhaps it needs an update it isn't that informative IMO, something that makes it a bit more clear that having an idea isn't enough to start a mod. And indeed as you say, one must be capable on their own to create a mod. And some links to the most used tools, which should also lessen "Help me start modding" threads.

:bow:

[Myrddraal]

The problem is some people who have little to no moddings skills propose ambitious projects I woudn't call that a problem, since thats exactly what I did...

My idea varies a bit from u guys, anyone can create any mod, they just need the determination and will to do it. My first mod ever was WoT for VI, a full conversion and a very ambitius project, I had absolutely 0 modding skills. Throughout the entire period, I worked alone on that mod. If Rome hadn't come out, maybe I would have finished it, and now I know a fair bit about modding. Everyone has to learn at some point, and the way you learn is by trying.

[Epistolary Richard]

Well, I found it interesting, but you're right in that links to the most vital tools and tutorials could only be of benefit. Perhaps it could do with an update to address the changing focus of the community from starting lots of new mods to completing the mods that have already been long in development. We're already talking about some ideas about how to help new modders get up to speed quicker so if they have the inclination they can contribute at a higher level in a shorter time.

Perhaps also couple this with something that helps the smaller mod teams who want new members in recruitment. I know many mods (including my own) are a personal labour of love for their creator but others who are interested in having new members might be reinvigorated by having new blood.

[Epistolary Richard]

My idea varies a bit from u guys, anyone can create any mod, they just need the determination and will to do it.
Oh, I agree. Anyone _can_ create a mod. I was completely new to modding of any kind with Rome and all my mods released to date have been solo efforts. But they've only been completed because I've known that I had the ability to finish them myself as they were all just text editing changes.

And while they were great experience for me, in all honesty they were of little benefit to the community - no one plays them. And that's because they weren't fully polished products that delivered a complete gaming experience and because they weren't compatible with other mods that did.

I think at the moment there is a great emphasis on starting your own mod - it appears to be the only way to progress as a modder. I don't think that it would do us any harm to illustrate that as well as starting your own mod, you can also develop by looking to help out with a mod that's already in development, to highlight the mods that have a core team and which have undergone significant development but are still interested in recruiting. Also, to highlight the advantages of having worked with an experienced team when it comes to founding your own mod projects.

[Duke John]

The problem is some people who have little to no moddings skills propose ambitious projects
I woudn't call that a problem, since thats exactly what I did...
Well, I started with no experience too, but instead of proposing a Lord of the Rings mod, I made an Uruk-hai unit and showed that the project was possible and that I could contribute.
What I meant to say is that people have an idea of an ambitious project and then wish to see others helping them in creating it; "Hey I have this great idea of a SciFi mod with 10 factions and 100 new units, but I need coders, modellers and skinners!" And of course they immediately make a teammembers list with theirselves as Mod Leader.

[Bwian]

DJ has a VERY good point there, and I agree 100%

There are a lot of people who have an idea and then want people to come along and make it happen for them. They have not done the basic thinking about how the mod would be realised, don't have any concrete plans for units or lists of what they want, have no concept art or source material, and generally have just had a 'WOW...wouldn't that be good in RTW' moment.

This is a recipe for failure both in terms of recruiting supoprt and in retaining the interest and enthusiasm of anyone that might be recruited.

If someone has ZERO mod experience, they can make a mod. They can learn some of the skills. Anyone can edit text files with a bit of determination and effort. Most people can modify faction names and banners with a few simple tools. The more you can do yourself at the start, the more likely your mod is to get finished. And as far as anyone else using it goes...personally, I don't care!

I am making 2 mods currently...my Robotic 'Terra-Wars' and the Hyborean Age. I am making them for me, and for the enjoyment I would get from it. I would hope anyone who offered to help did so for the sdame reason and would be a welcome addition.

Anyway.....thats sliding away from the topic ;)

What we need is a clear and concise guide to the steps of getting started:

1) What you should do between having the inspiration and posting the 'idea'
faction list, banners, unit lists, weapons, etc.
2) Assess your needs. What skills do you have or could you learn. Modelling is a bit specialised...and may not be for everyone, but you should do more than just 'co-ordinate' and design a website or forum.
3) PLAN, PLAN, PLAN
work out the best utilisation of units, models that can be re-used, a campaign map etc. My Hyborean mod is a mass of unit lists and sketches. I have outlines for every faction, reference pics etc. The robots mod has a huge pile of concept sketches, work on sjkeleton layouts etc.
4)Think of every problem with bending your mod to the rules of RTW andwork on ways to solve it. If you cover all the bases, you can give coherent answers to any prospects who doubt your mods feasability.

It's hard work, but anyone CAN do it. Just not many people bother....

[Sundjata Keita]

Well the way I started the Zulu mod was by telling people that I was a modeller and I did not yet have any mod to work on, quite a few people wanted me to work for them (as modellers were and still are in short supply). One offer I got was to help the WASP project and then maybee later do a Zulu mod which they wanted to do. I had originally wanted to start this but did not think people would be that interested and also was put off by the fact that guns then seemed impossible to implement. So anyway me and Dclare4 started work and then announced the mod only when I had made the main Zulu unit. People liked something easy on the eyes and although interest remained pretty low we got a team together and now we have a full team at work and our own sub-forum at TWC (even though they are now giving them away like candy). A couple of tips I would give to people with ambitious plans

1. Don't beg for help, this often gives an immature feel to the project and can put people off joining (don't use this smilie :help: :help: :help: )

2. Make sure you can do something, there are many people who say "I will be the manager and will have the job of compiling all the work and telling people what everything should look like" Many modders see this and think, I am a better modder than he is and he has his own mod!

3. When you show your plan in the forum try to get a screenshot even if it means asking other people to do you a favour and do one model or texture

4. Have the energy but don't aim to big. Right now it may seem like an easy task WW1 mod *cough* ~;) but don't promise too much. As Epistolary Richard says if you start low, when more people join up you can aim bigger and bigger

Regards,

Sundjata Keita