The Jews

[antisocialmunky]

I'm just curious.

1. Is there anyway to increase the Jewish faith in a province?
2. Has anyone besides me seen a Jewish general?
3. Can there be Jewish revolts?

Being one of the two religions with no benefactors, does it behave like the other religions if you for example modded in Rabbis and Greater Rabbis or another priest-type unit?

[Eternal Champion]

I have seen a Jewish General and a Jewish revolt. The revolt then teamed with another and then invaded Poland destroying a pretty decent Polish army.

[NodachiSam]

I've wondered the same thing. Sadly they always seem to become extinct near the end of any game I play. I've never seen a few general or revolt myself.

Perhaps a mod somewhere has a faction that is jewish but I don't think that would be too supported by history in that time period and region, maybe the sinai....

The pagan religions are encourage by the mongols by the way.

[NodachiSam]

Eternal Champion, I'm really curious, how and where did jews revolt against the poles? :book:

[Crusader4thepeople]

Ive also seen jewish revolts, but it was crushed quickly. In the description for Khazar Royal Cavalry it says something about the jewish kingdom of Khazar. Maybe somwone could put these into a Mod (if its correct of course)

[Crusader4thepeople]

Infact I found this about the Khazars and found the following

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars

This means that maybe someone will Mod the Khazars as jews. I know BKB did but he made them muslim

[littlebktruck]

The pagan religions are encourage by the mongols by the way.

I think the other of the two religions he was referring to was the heretical Christian sect.

[edyzmedieval]

I've never seen a Jew general or even a jew unit!!!!

Only the Khazar Royal Bodyguards from Khazar which I bribed ~D

And BTW, I don't trust the fact that the Khazar Kaganate was Jewish.... Impossible.... Pagans perhaps.....

[antisocialmunky]

Yeah, same here, the Khazars seem to be the only real JewJew Beans.

[Crusader4thepeople]

Edyz read the link i gave, the Khazar kaganate converted to judaeisam

[King of Atlantis]

Being one of the two religions with no benefactors, does it behave like the other religions if you for example modded in Rabbis and Greater Rabbis or another priest-type unit?

It and pagan both can be modded and they have the same effects as regular religions.

Actually though their are three religions with no benefactors, heritics. They can behave like the other relgions too.

[Crusader4thepeople]

Pagans have benefactors in the form of the Golden Horde, he meant jews and heretics

[King of Atlantis]

Pagans dont have benefactors with out viking invasion. Sure it is the religion of the horde, but they cant build temples/priest.

I guess i read that statment wrong, i thought he menat religion without priest/religious buildings, and again i was not thinking about viking invasion.

[Crusader4thepeople]

hmm im probably forgetting both BKB and XL add Golden Horde playability and Pagan Buildings and Pagan Agents

[King of Atlantis]

Yes they both did add that.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

The pagan religions are encourage by the mongols by the way.
Not exactly. Large parts of eastern Europe were pagan at the time.

[Patron]

I fiddled around and the first time I changed the code it worked out.

SetReligion:: FN_ENGLISH REL_HERETIC

https://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y206/asdasdasd2/Heretic.jpg


imma try jews now

[EatYerGreens]

Infact I found this about the Khazars and found the following

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars

This means that maybe someone will Mod the Khazars as jews. I know BKB did but he made them muslim

Well, chasing up that link must have cost me a good hour of posting/gameplay time tonight but it was interesting to read about all the historical goings-on, east of the edge of the MTW campaign map.

I particularly liked one piece of speculation - that the Khazars converted to Judaism because they were geograpically sandwiched between the Christian/Orthodox to the west and the Muslims to the east. Conversion to a faith which favoured neither side but was respected by both - as a distant root of their own beliefs - allowed them to maintain neutrality and thus avoid getting crushed on two fronts.

Also a comment, described as only half in jest, relating to a motive for wanting to steer away from their previous pagan faith, where the Khagan's rule was granted by favour of a particular deity, so tradition held that a failed Khagan was out of favour and had to be ritually executed...

Some interesting word etymolgies there too - eg the Romans' reference to Turks as 'Scythians', from which, I presume, the word scythe derives - the curved blade being the common factor.

Also, through side references, got to find out where the Alans come from, plus about 6 different spellings for where the Kwarazmiams come from.... ~;)

[Patron]

SetReligion:: FN_ENGLISH REL_JEWISH

Correct^

I'm not sure how to add a new faction though, you would need to skim through the entire starting position .txt and add in your positions, values and statistics for FN_KHAZAR or something.

Maybe you can add your own religions, but I can't find where the religious icons are and the chances are something will go amiss.

[Meisterdieb]

@Patron
Now that the faction is changed , how do the religious agents behave? Are you at all able to build "churches" and agents?
And is the religion in your provinces changed or changing to heresy also?

Isn't there a mod out there with Jews, Pagans and Heretics as Faction.
I think being able to play as the Katharer (which were considered heretics) would be fun.

[King of Atlantis]

You have to make new religious agents and buildings, BKB would probably be the best to ask this...


The BKB mod does alot of what you ask

*Certain countries can build heritc churches/priest/and train heritic units
*Italian nations can make jewish merchant buildings and jewish merchants that increas judiasm and trade.

BTW, welcome to the org ~:cheers: !

[Azi Tohak]

I read a book (the only one I could get my hands on) about Khazaria. It was really pretty neat. The first time I heard about the Jewish Empire was Thomas Harlan's Oath of Empire Series (historical fantasy).

The book was called 13th Tribe: the Khazar Empire and its Heritage by Arthur Koestler.

I read it hoping for more about the empire itself, but there just are not many sources from that period of time covering anything north of the black sea. Lots of thoughts about how the Jews of Khazaria would have affected the Pale though. That part was interesting.

And because it is not well known, there are not many books in English. Heck, there are not as many books as I would like about Byzantium, so Byzantiums forgotten cousin would receive far less attention.

Azi

[Crusader4thepeople]

Ive just fiddled with the campmap/startpos/Late Xl.txt file and changed the Bohemian religion to heretic, in accordance with the Hussite War

[edyzmedieval]

I love modding MTW.....

Changed the French to heretics... ~D
I saw a French general with maximum heretic piety :laugh:

Currently adding factions to make it much more interesting ~D
Including the Jewish Khazar Kaganate, which is going to be anihilated by the Mongols..... ~D

[King of Atlantis]

I love modding MTW.....

mtw, is much more modder friendly.

[Crusader4thepeople]

MTW is the most modder friendly game i know

[antisocialmunky]

Halflife 1/2 and Counterstrike 1/2.

[voo]

start an early campaign - look at the eastern edge of the map theres a province called "Shazarenreich" (sry germ only) those Shazars r jews and got a exclusive hvycav unit (comparable to mongol hvy cav) that u cant play in multi ...

[edyzmedieval]

start an early campaign - look at the eastern edge of the map theres a province called "Shazarenreich" (sry germ only) those Shazars r jews and got a exclusive hvycav unit (comparable to mongol hvy cav) that u cant play in multi ...

Khazar is the name of the province and the Khazars are the people....

They have the Khazar Royal Cavalryman, a very good heavy cavalry unit.... I bribe them every time at the beginning of the game, so I can have an exclusive unit......

[Condottiere]

Here's a page about the Khazars and links to two other sites: http://www.geocities.com/egfroth1/Khazars

It should be noted that by the start of the game, 1087, the Khazar Kaganate had ceased to exist for about a century.

Out of curiousity: How does the Jewish faith contribute to the game? In the beginning there's a small percentage of Jews in Constantinople, but they disappear from the game.

[Crusader4thepeople]

Well the Game still has Khazar royal cavalry men, which would be incorrect, however if so then we can take a liberty with the Khazars (though at this time the Volga Bulgars ruled the area [as in XL] if only to make a jewish faction

[antisocialmunky]

The Jews are there because they were spread around the world, it's really just for flavor since it's a religious game.

[EatYerGreens]

In my current campaing as the Byz, you'd be inteested to know that the Khazars are doing rather well for themselves, give or take my limited reconnaissance capabilities. It's 1121 and I'm somwhat strapped for cash, since I'm now at war with FOUR other factions (Turk/Eggie/HungarySicily) and haven't had much opportunity to raise agents.

Now I could have attempted to bribe them at the start of the game but wasn't sure what to do about that situation where the stack is split into two portions, one garrisoned in a fort and the other in the field. In other words, do you only get half of them and immediately have to do battle?

I've seen those Royal Cavalrymen and they looked reasonably impressive, so I've not gone over my border to mess with them yet - not ready/not enough men/too busy on other fronts. Just glad they haven't come my way yet...
Worth noting that the RC's were in the garrison, so the bribe would have got the smaller half of the split force so, in spite of quality, I wouldn't have been able to acquire them without a certain amount of casualties (lots of HAs in the field army).

I got an inkling that something was up when I noticed that they'd been building stuff - most unusual for rebel stacks, in my experience. I sent a daugher up to Novgorod for a mosey and the port she arrived at (Baltic) was rebel-held, or worse - rebel built! Further inland, the Novs looked rather moribund, in terms of troop numbers.

Though I could barely afford them (really needed 1 or 2 VG units instead), I built the two ships required to link the capital to a Polish port (Moldavia?) and a Khazari port in Crimea. However, before the pair were even ready, the Polish province was taken - by the Khazars again - and its port destroyed. To make matters worse, a lousy rebellion on Rhodes (100 BI vs my 100 spears, which I autoresolved just to get it over with) now meant I was at war with *all* rebels. Since the Khazars share a border with me in Bulgaria and Georgia, I cannot disengage from this 'war' and the trade income I so desperately needed is now just a pipedream. Sicily will blockade me everywhere else, even assuming I could afford the number of ships required.

This is my first go at Expert level and already I'm finding it challenging. Nicve to see the rebels actually doing something for a change and this lot are looking to be more successful than some of the principal factions, at the moment.

Incidentally, when I've played as tyhe English, the Byz always seem to end up collapsing and confined to Rhodes. In this campaign, the French have just grabbed Wessex, so it looks like the boot is on the other foot this time. Why is it that some factions just totally crumble, so long as the AI is in charge?

[NodachiSam]

SetReligion:: FN_ENGLISH REL_JEWISH

Correct^

I'm not sure how to add a new faction though, you would need to skim through the entire starting position .txt and add in your positions, values and statistics for FN_KHAZAR or something.

Maybe you can add your own religions, but I can't find where the religious icons are and the chances are something will go amiss.


That's awsome, I'm going to set everyone to jewish to see what happens, I predict lots of rebellions and the quick downfall of the Germans. How do you change it though? ~:confused: I'm looking through the MTW file and I cannot find anything so far.

[NodachiSam]

Oh nifty, I am sure I found it now :D I think I figured out how to add a faction too ~:cheers: Its a lot of work, but doable. :book:

[NodachiSam]

For those that don't know, you go into the main MTW folder, go into campmap, go into startpos and then you see the text documents for the eras. About six tenths of the way down you find a listing of each faction and their religion. ~:cheers:

[Patron]

I tried adding a new faction, by renaming the swiss, but it doesn't work. I must have missed something somewhere.

So I just modded EARLY and resaved as mod and activated the swiss and put them as heretics in wales.

I started out with longbowmen as the king unit and struggled for a while to kick the English out of Britain. Though later I managed to kill the entire french royal family in Flanders and am currently pillaging France and Germany.

I think I will change the mod again, except change the swiss king unit into gallow glasses and put the swiss in Ireland. Also make another crusadeunits file and allow the swiss to train gallowglasses anywhere, but unable to train knights and make a weird Irish with german names heretic mod.

[Crusader4thepeople]

What you need to do is add a FN_FREE21 Faction. The article by starkhorn in the lab should helpp