Europa Barbarorum Map and Google Earth

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Greetings fans!

This is something of a special mid-week update, but it's not of a faction, and it's not entirely official even mostly because a lot of our members don't have the program that is needed to run it and they haven't downloaded it yet. We have released our map already, but in our attempts to fine tune everything from the province boundaries, the locations of the capital cities (of 272BC, remember), the mountains, the rivers, the coastal regions, etc., some of us have created a file for the Google Earth (http://earth.google.com/) program to mark all of the locations of our ancient cities. If you have downloaded and are running Google Earth, you may download our file for the program and keep it as a folder in your Google Earth location categories.

https://img287.imageshack.us/img287/1192/earth15nu.th.jpg (https://img287.imageshack.us/my.php?image=earth15nu.jpg)

We have tried to be as precise as possible, and for some cities we can be exceedingly precise: Athenai is centered on the Akropolis of Athens, Roma is centered on the Forum Romanum of Rome, Persepolis is centered on the remains of the ancient city on the side of a low mountain, Marakanda is exactly over the ancient city in the middle of its oasis, found by space shuttle photographs the ancient citadel of the lost city of Ubar is located on the edge of the Rub al Khali or “Empty Quarter” in Oman. But for some “cities”, especially of nomadic peoples and dispersed populations, we have been forced to either use a central or important (in terms of resources, rivers, topography, etc.) location for the “city”. These are limitations that any game such as RTW has to deal with, and we have made the judgments we thought best.

The purpose behind the release of the Google Earth EB file is mainly to allow our fans to experience some of the absolutely amazing vistas that the program allows. It is an incredible opportunity to see the location of Alexandreia Eschate on the Jaxartes, looking out towards the west to Marakanda and Sogdiane. From the citadel of Akrokorinthos, above the ancient city of Korinthos, you may look down at the isthmus and across the Saronic Gulf to Athenai. You might look across the straits of Gibraltar from ancient Tingis to Gadir. Or follow the Danube from its mouth north of Kallatis past Buridava and Naissos to Singidunum and further north. Pass through the Dardanelles and the site of ancient Troy to the Bosphoros and follow the coast around the Euxine to see the nearby cities of Byzantion and Nikomedia, then Sinope, Amaseia, Trapezous, Kotais, Pantikapaion and Chersonesos on the Crimea, and then Olbia and down to Kallatis. The most recent map changes in the game have not yet been incorporated on our large jpg map that is being presented again here, but the map is very close (95%?) to being up to date (coastal changes in the Netherlands and Turkey, river branches in Pakistan, other changes in Arabia, have not yet made it to our map here).

The map here is almost a megabyte, so it may take some modem-users a while to download, but of course Google Earth itself requires a speedy connection and probably has trouble with more ancient computers also.

https://img168.imageshack.us/img168/2738/mapgoogleearth8pi.th.jpg (https://img168.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mapgoogleearth8pi.jpg)

The Google Earth file itself, is downloadable here and it's very small actually:
ftp://europabarbarorum.org/EuropaBarbarorumSites.kmz

And Google Earth (the program) is downloadable here:
http://kh.google.com/download/earth/index.html

We hope those of you out there who have Google Earth can enjoy this mini-presentation. If you haven’t tried it out yet but have a good connection and a pretty good computer we would heartily suggest taking a look at it. And don’t forget to zoom in close to the sites and then change the angles to better appreciate the terrain differences. I would personally suggest (additionally) that you accompany the tour with appropriately “ancienty” music. I’m somewhat fond of the Vangelis Alexander score right now myself, especially for viewing pretty much anything east of Pella.

For those of you who can't run Google Earth, here's a little sample of three sites:

https://img175.imageshack.us/img175/9384/googleearthsample0ip.th.jpg (https://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=googleearthsample0ip.jpg)

Thanks for your interest in our mod again and hang on just a little longer for the regular preview (which will *not* be preempted by this presentation) this weekend!

[Big_John]

this is pretty cool.. are there any special layers to be turned on, or is this just the locations of ancient cities?

[Teleklos Archelaou]

this is pretty cool.. are there any special layers to be turned on, or is this just the locations of ancient cities?Just locations. They've been useful in trying to make our map more accurate, and since the map has been released, there's no real reason this shouldn't be released as well. I tried making a layer, but there's no way to make it match up properly given the deformation that a flat map vs. a globe winds up with.

[Big_John]

oh ok, it's still cool! ~:cheers:

btw, i must have been asleep or something, but when/where did you guys release the map?

[Krusader]

If you're talking about the campaign map:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=50614

Enjoy!!

[Big_John]

oh, i thought you meant you've released the map for people to play. did you just mean you "revealed" the map, so to speak?

[Spitful]

COuld you add the cities on the map themselves reathre than just a location flag

[Quietus]

Wow, that's a huge map.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

COuld you add the cities on the map themselves reathre than just a location flagI really don't understand this at all. You want us to draw the ancient cities out on the Google Earth program? Could you rephrase this?

[cunctator]

Thank you very much! Thats fantastic. I`ve started to add placemarks of ancient sites to google earth by myself and now I`ve got a giant colletion to go sightseeing over night.

[Ptolemy I Soter]

Oh Teleklos!
I agree with you so Much!
I am A Vangelis fan as well!
My favourit is Accross The Mountains.... Its such a hearttouching music

I LOVE YOU EB! This google thing is fantastic!
I CANT WAIT FOR THIS MOD

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Glad you liked it. I haven't played around with it much lately, but it still is tres cool. ~D

[BDC]

That's amazing.

I never realised quite how big Alexander's empire was... Wow.

[Seleukus I Nicator]

I managed to Find the ruins of Babylon. Took long enough, and just looking at the ruins and thinking Alexander triumphantyl entered there just amazes me.

[Greek_fire19]

Interestingly I went to see the ruins of emain macha (the ancient capital of Ulster in Ireland - just a big mound really: looks like this): http://www.mc.maricopa.edu/~tomshoemaker/celtic/EmainMacha.jpg

But they just reopened the visitor centre there and...yeah, it's good, they've got some interesting artefacts and so on from the time, it was cool. It's nice at lleast that we've got a precise location, and it's not just another legendary celtic site.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

A little bit of a "bump" here. :laugh4: (it's interesting to see those guys who posted in this thread before - pretty much gone now)

It's not final yet, but here is a vastly updated file for Google Earth with all of EB's towns and most all of the "unique buildings". The volcanoes EB has were included too because I had them handy on my Google Earth program.

ftp://ftp.europabarbarorum.org/EuropaBarbarorumSites.kmz

A lot of these will take you right down to where the ruins of the city are. Some are so totally covered by modern towns that you can't see anything though, and for those it's hard to tell if the marker is on the part of the town where the most ancient remains are. Harder still are those places where the map has very poor resolution - there is some guesswork and reliance more on the Barrington Atlas for those. For some (generally where there are more than one question mark) we don't know where the town was, like often with the nomadic peoples, but we are showing where we located the town on the EB RTW map.

If anyone has corrections, please post proper coordinates here that can be easily plugged in.

Thanks to foot for the URL fix btw.

[Shifty_GMH]

I had no idea you guys had done this before. Thank you for bringing it up again. Well done TA, Foot, and whomever else had a hand in it.

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

I had been trying to find all of the towns on Google Earth myself, but couldn't find Buridava. Of the two most likely guesses I made, neither of them was in the correct spot. :laugh4: I was right on for all the other ones I had marked, though.

I couldn't find Dalminion, it doesn't seem to be on this either...

[Lucius Valerius Sulla]

Awesome that you guys did this, I was working on it myself and I'm pleased that so far all of my locations are quite close to all of these. Just wanted to say that for the Sparta location, if you look to the hill just north of your marker you can see ruins along with what must be a relatively new picture that you can click on showing them. Obviously not a big deal but just wanted to point it out although I'm probably only stating the obvious. Just in case though here is the coordinates: 37° 4′ 55.75″ N 22° 25′ 25″ E

Also Sardis I believe to be 6 Miles west of the location given, based on the wikipedia article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sardis) which puts it near the town of Sart, which must be Sartmahmut on google earth. I put it south against the mountains since it is at the foot of Mount Tmolus. Unforunately there is no high resolution in the area to know for sure. I put it at 38° 29′ 08.00″ N 28° 01′ 50.50″ E

Not trying to be critical just wanted to share this.
By the way, great mod, since I started playing I have been unable to play any other version on Total War.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Glad you mentioned it Sulla. I thought I had that centered on the agora for Sparta, but now I've got it right.

You should see my "Lakonia" set of thumbtacks. :grin: It's got every minor site and temple and village marked for all of Laconia. A ton. Pretty much anything that Pausanias mentions at all in his account.

edit: those coordinates are right in the orchestra of the roman theater. I'd put the marker in the middle of the agora, or up the hill from the theater, at the temple of Athena.

Thanks for the Sardis tip. Will look into it. Dude, don't apologize - I asked for help in getting these just perfect. :2thumbsup:

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Yeah, those pictures help a lot too - they weren't a part of google earth when I first did this, but they help figure out precise locations a lot better now.

[Maeran]

I really don't understand this at all. You want us to draw the ancient cities out on the Google Earth program? Could you rephrase this?

I know that was a long time ago, but this could now be done with SketchUp.

I might possibly use it to have a 3d version of my street on there, but entire cities are a bit much.

I do love Google Earth. And I've used it in conjunction with Livy to try to get an idea of the difference between Latium and the hills. It didn't really work, but the thought was there.

[Lucius Valerius Sulla]

Yeah the pictures are very helpful, and great to look at as well. Hopefully people will keep adding lots of good ancient site pictures to google earth. Just another update, at Salamis, a mile up the coast are a substantial amount of well preserved ruins. Being that it is only a mile north these ruins could easily be the outskirts of the city since your location seems more logical on top of what looks like an old river delta. There are also several less intact ruins spread out on the open area between the two sites. The photos that have been tagged at the ruins are great too.

*Edit* The pictures weren't there when I was looking for these cities either, but I guess now that they are there I probably don't need to point out these small differences. Most markers are within 1 to 3 miles which is really accurate. I will make a list of updated coordinates for all the locations that have picture tabs showing the exact location though in case anyone wants it.

[Grim Fiddler]

Google Earth is amazing. I cannot figure out how to also show the modern names for the EB places. Can this be done? It's the main things I've been wishing for, mapwise.

[Maeran]

In the layers, go to 'borders and labels' and toggle 'populated places' and 'alternative place names'. That will bring up the modern names; if they are in Google Earth anyway.

[AqD]

Thanks..... But I feel frustrated to see all the modern buildings and stupid cars in those spots.. :no:

IMO google should re-make the earth in 270BC, with great ancient walls, tens of thousands pezhetairoi marching and Kataphraktoi running around, and celtic warriors and romans ........ ! :idea2::smash: