Extent of the Medieval World

[lugh]

Reading about the Crusades made me realise that the Medieval era was not nearly as euro-centric as I had thought. The way the Ca;iph in Baghdad and much of the Islam world wasn't too pushed about the first crusade drove it home, they way the Caliph especially, was more concerned with pressure coming from further east etc etc.

What I'm wondering is, if, say for a MTW II, how far should the map extend? And since it's Medieval Total WAR, we'll restrict it to those areas that engaged in serious military action. So the Americas, Australia etc are out, but what about Africa? I read somewhere about a Coptic Kingdom in Somalia, did that ever agitate against the Fatimid Caliphate or the Almohads or Almoravids etc? In the east, what was the story with other Muslim Sultanate that was putting pressure on Baghdad? Was India or China involved?

It's not exactly a precise definition, but basically, from the west coast of europe, how far east and south into Africa and Asia did military interactions occur?

[Vykke]

I don't know all that many specifics in most cases; I'm sure someone else here can fill you in better on them.

I know that Nubia and Ethiopia fought the Arabs quite a bit in the Dark Ages. I'm not sure if clashes between them were still common in the Middle Ages; I'm under the impression that those two nations were much weaker by then. Also, Ghana attacked North Africa at least once that I'm aware of, and the Almoravids originally came from an area near Ghana as well, and conquered their way north.

On the eastern side of the map, Baghdad certainly played a huge part in the events of the Middle East. I was rather disappointed that it wasn't included on the MTW map. Iran and Transoxania also fought a lot with Baghdad and other regional powers, and also with Central Asian conquerors, etc. Really, it's hard to draw a good boundary around Europe because you had non-European powers that affected Europe, then more distant powers that interacted with those, and still more distant ones interacting with those, etc., all the way to China.

As far as I know, India didn't fight much with Iran and company, though that may just be my ignorance speaking. Assuming it's not, then I think the Iran-India border might be the best place to put the eastern edge of the map, with the Central Asian invasions simulated by faction-generating events like the Golden Horde of MTW. On the soutern border, I'd be content with the Sahara. Sub-Saharan Africa did interact militarily with the factions on the map somewhat, but other than the Almoravids (who could be simulated with another faction-generating event) I'm not sure their impact was great enough to warrant en extension of the map.

[lugh]

Really, it's hard to draw a good boundary around Europe because you had non-European powers that affected Europe, then more distant powers that interacted with those, and still more distant ones interacting with those, etc., all the way to China. Yeah, that's why I suggested only major military interaction, maybe we could rule out China, the only major activity was the Mongols invading, and that was inward wasn't it? I mean there were no Chinese invasions of the steppes or into Iran/Pakistan/India in the period?

Maybe with the new mechanisms in RTW there would be a way of including Bedoiun tribes and stuff like that. I think I read something about nomadic people being facilitated.

Thanks for the info!