Tokugawa Ieyasu / IMAGAWA clan

[Draksen]

First I want to say that I have had difficulties to connect on this forum.
I have seen often this message :
"Internal Server Error
The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was unable to complete your request.
Please contact the server administrator, admin@gagames.com and inform them of the time the error occurred, and anything you might have done that may have caused the error(...)"

??? I have tested to connect from two different computers... sometimes I can log me in, sometimes I can't. Is it normal?
Have you the same problem ?

And now, back to Tokugawa.
1 - What do you think in general about Tokugawa Ieyasu as an Imagawa general?
(Tokugawa was a hostage of the Imagawa clan, no?)
2 - When you play Imagawa, do you attack from North Kyuushu and central Honshu at the same time?


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[Hosakawa Tito]

Draksen,I am also having a hard time logging on this site.I get the same error message as you.When I play as Imagawa I attack Oda first
in Owari to cripple his troop production and capture his rich provinces first.I try to reinforce the island I share with Shimazu to hold him off,make an alliance with him if I can.
Tito

[Zen Blade]

Yup, I have also been getting every so often. Which internet stuff do you guys use? I usually use netscape.

-as for the Imagawa, I most often like to move into the west, while holding some of my eastern provinces. However, I think doing either that, or attacking in the east is an acceptable decision, so long as you do either decision in an intelligent and efficient manner.

in summary, I advise abandoning either the west or east and concentrating your forces in the other place, while hoping to hold the "abandoned" side with a minimal number of men.

-Zen Blade

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Zen Blade Asai
Red Devil
Last of the RSG

[Shiro]

Internet Explorer here and I get that problem all the time.

As Imagawa I find it hard to concentrate on those two places at once. I try and make one base in one place have defenses that are just enough to hold that area until my army can break through and connect the two areas.

[solypsist]

internet explorer here also but it's only been happening the last two days. I hope Dan checks it out

[Draksen]

Konnichiwa Minna-san !

Thanks for answers !

I use IE5.5 Netscape : same thing for both !!!

I have read somewhere that playing as Imagawa is hard... is it true ?

Zen_Blade suggests to abandon either the west or east... and keep the abandoned lands with minimum defense.
IMO, good idea.
I have tried with Takeda to fight on two fronts at the same time ... nearly impossible on normal level (IMO of course).

Is Tokugawa Ieyasu a good general ?
(rank/honor ?)
Never fight with or against him before.

Dewa mata
Sayoonara,
Draksen


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[Hitodama]

I get that error too. And very often. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif

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[Soapyface]

I'm in the middle of an Imagawa campaign right now - first I attacked Owari ASAP and killed Oda there, turning all his lands Ronin. Then I sent an army with majority archers into the monk province next to it - is it Ise? The neighbouring Ronin came in to help the monks sieged in the castle, and all got wasted leaving empty land in the middle of the map. I've now taken Oda's old provinces up to and including Kawachi. I might move my archers in on Yamashiro to rationalise my borders.

I'm keeping only the lightest garrison in Chikuzen/Chikugo and Shimazu hasn't attacked yet - i can't think why? - dumb AI!

Uesugi was being a little slow off the mark, so I've exploited his weakness and just taken Shinano. What should I do next? I'm tempted to continue eastwards to hit Hojo and finish off Uesegi before they get too big.

[Draksen]

If I understand well, you, Soapyface, you start attacking in the west (Oda, Uesugi and western ronins), ok

And Zen_Blade has said :


I'm sorry, Soapyface-san, I can't help you : never tried IMAGAWA before.

hey You, all Imagawa experts !
How should we play ?
(and how can we win ?!)
And what about Tokugawa ????

Thanks for comments and answers.



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[BanzaiZAP]

And here I thought trying it out for yourself was part of the fun! Besides, we could give you all kinds of advice on where to attack and when, but one of the most famous quotes about war - No matter how good the decisions, all plans go out the window upon contact with the enemy. Besides, how "easy" it will be will largely be dependent on how good you are in the battlefield. People who Autoresolve tend to have a harder time than people who are very good at the battle engine. It becomes a VERY different game - you need vast numbers of troops for autoresolving, but a good taisho can consistently defeat large armies with only a few good men. I did manage to win with Imagawa (on normal mode) and it was great fun, but I can't tell you How to Win Your War. Fight the good fight, don't open up too many fronts at once, and KILL KILL KILL.

I did it the same way as mentioned above - attack Oda, and loosely hold onto the lands by Shimazu. Shimazu is one of the only people who will actually KEEP an alliance, so making a treaty is a good way to keep green off your back. Besides, if you conquer the green provinces, they don't have much in the way of koku. Get the richer farmlands in central Japan instead.

-- B)

[ShaiHulud]

I'd suggest being prepared to give up Suruga and Totomi, holding Shinano, Mikawa and heading West. The East, while lucrative, also has the largest armies to face. While you bash those the treacherous Mori WILL attack you from the West and, allowed time, will do so with WM. If not he, then Takeda will come and Shingen is a tough nut to crack.

If you decide to go East, Take everything to the Kii coast, secure the West with high ground and bridge defense provinces up to the Mori borders. Oda's lands are very properous and can offer income equal to the East.

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Wind fells blossoms, rain
fells steel,yet bamboo bends and drinks

[Anssi Hakkinen]

On the server error matter: as far as I've been able to figure out, it's what is says it is: a server error. It may go away by refreshing the page sufficiently many times. (If you try that three dozen times and it still won't display the page, do like I didn't do and give up.)

One point about playing the Imagawa: you have a river province in each end of the map. These are very defensible with the help of Totomi archers. Castles are always useful when camping: build one in every Western province and Shimazu will usually find Môri or Shikoku Rônin easier prey, even if you have only negligible garrisons.

(Edit: oh yeah, Ieyasu. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif He's a very good general: rank 6 initially, equal to Shingen and Kenshin [and better than Nobunaga, which is outrageous http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/mad.gif]. However, considering the pace of your average STW campaign, he appears too late . Most games are almost over and done with by then.)

([B]Edit 2: the following message appeared during my previous edit. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/redface.gif)

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"Learning is to a man as the leaves and branches are to a tree, and it can be said that he should not be without it."
- Takeda Shingen

[This message has been edited by Anssi Hakkinen (edited 02-07-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Anssi Hakkinen (edited 02-07-2001).]

[Matsudaira Motoyasu]

When fighting for the Imagawa clan, first attack Owari. The objective is to conquer it and kill Oda or to cripple his production capabilities. You will have to crush a few rebellions in the begining. Also try to protect the two provinces bordering Shimazu as they are vital for you at the begining and he has a nasty habit of attacking them at at the worst time. Try to increase production of your western provinces and Owari. For troop development use Totomi as your primary province and protect it. Also, build a spear dojo in Hizen (western province with port) but don't develop it any more. Try to maintain Suruga as it serves as a buffer bettween Totomi and Takeda's provinces and don't lose Mikawa. After this try to build an army large enough to attack Sagami (Takeda province) either through land (more difficult) or sea (it has a port). It will be though to maintain it as Takeda and Hojo attack constantly in the begining. Next, try to train enough troops to invade Musashi or Mutsu (Uesugi province in the northeast with port). Some people don't like to invade by port. In my opinion, this isn't a cheat. The AI just isn't smart enough to use that feature.
Regarding troops, concentrate on training shock troops (monks and no-dachi), archers and yari samurai. Don't bother with cavalry in the begining. Develop Totomi to train Geisha as you may need it latter. Also, don't train ashigaru as they are very weak cost as much to maintain as other troops.
All these tactics are to be undertaken during a timespan of at least 20 years so be patient. You may not succeed at first but don't quit. Remember, patience bears good fruits, as Tokugawa Ieyasu has shown us.

As for Tokugawa Ieyasu (my favorite samurai), he is considered top rank, along with Uesugi Kenshin and Takeda Shingen, with an initial rank of 6. As for the historical accuracy of having Ieyasu as an Imagawa general, it is conceivable (sorry for any spelling mistakes) as by 1582 all of former Imagawa domain was his and if Yoshimoto had not been killed, he would probably have continued fighting on Yoshimotos' side.

[Kokueater]

I cannot advice you for Imagawa, I always fail at even when I take Owari and trounce Oda in the first season. No way at hard or expert level!

Concerning to Tokugawa Ieyasu you can find a comprehensive biography here:
http://samurai.bigsitecity.com/ieyasu.html

[Draksen]

I have noticed that you often suggest an expansion from the east (Totomi...)

Could it be a little easier from the west ?

The thing I hate the more is the game, is keeping two fronts at the same time.
The problem with the middle Honshu provincies is that you have 3 dangerous neighbours : Oda, Takeda, and Uesugi.
You must keep always 3 or 4 armies ready.
And if you succeed in defeating these clans, you must then win against Hojo...

If you start your expansion from the west, after having destroyed the Shimazu clan, you can concentrate your energy on one front, against the Mori clan first, in direction of the east.

Starting from the west provincies is then like playing with the Shimazu clan, no?


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[Soapyface]

Thanks for all the advice guys! I've had to let chikuzen and chikugo go to Shimazu, but I'm holding onto Hizen as a re-entry (oooer) route onto Shimazu's island (is that Kyuushu?) and its got a spear dojo and 20% farms which I don't want to give up. I've taken all of Oda's old lands up to Mori, and I'm going to strike Eastwards from Shinano. Totomi and Aij (? the province with the ninja bonus and iron deposits) are my main production centres.

Let's kick some Hojo Butt!

[Tenchimuyo]

I suggest that you take good advantage of Totomi since it gives archers +1 honour. Very useful when you have a famous or legendary archery Dojo and a high ranking general. If you are lucky, you get honour 5 archers right off the back.

[Slyspy]

I have probs connecting to the Org as well. Server error etc. Always have. Seems to be worse with Netscape than Explorer.


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"Put 'em in blue coats, put 'em in red coats, the bastards will run all the same!"

[Tenchimuyo]

Yeah, I've experienced this problem, too. I'm running on internet explorer.

[Doragon_Ajidrik]

Yeah I get the error message once in a while but it seemed to happen more times the last few days.

First thing you do is take Owari from Oda and abandon Suruga to reinforce Totomi. Go on and take Mino once Owari is secure. Withdraw your army in the west and reinforce your eastern lands. Using the army that you withdraw from the west, attack Shinano. If Suruga is still yours, then move the army that was guarding Totomi into it. You will need to guard Shinano, Suruga, Owari and Mino. If your lucky and managed to kill off Oda in your Owari attack. Then you wont need to place too much troops on the western front. take out Takeda next by attacking Kai with your army in Shinano and attacking Izu with ur Suruga army. Retreat your army attacking Kai since you dont want to leave Shinano open to attack. Takeda would let Izu go or just leave a few defenders. Repeat this Process by attacking Kai and Sagami. Again dont attack Kai, your goal is Sagami and the isolation of Takeda from his western army. Use Shinano as a platform to attack other provinces.