Anniversary of John Lennon's death

[Devastatin Dave]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051208/ap_on_en_mu/lennon25th;_ylt=AhlTw_yvhQCxtMWv_kyLGmKs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3b2NibDltBHNlYwM3MTY-

I didn't like his music or politics much, but he seemed like an OK guy and he was friendly to the folks he met and talked to and he was great to his fans. Its a shame that some no name bastard shot him just for his fame. Rest in peace John.

I put this in the backroom because I'm sure there might be some discussion on his politics or fame worship in general.

[yesdachi]

I didn't like his music...
Music… humm I thought he was an actor. I liked him best in Forest Gump.~;)

[Hurin_Rules]

Imagine

Imagine there's no heaven,
It's easy if you try,
No hell below us,
Above us only sky,
Imagine all the people
living for today...

Imagine there's no countries,
It isnt hard to do,
Nothing to kill or die for,
No religion too,
Imagine all the people
living life in peace...

You may say Im a dreamer,
but I'm not the only one,
I hope some day you'll join us,
And the world will be as one.

Imagine no possesions,
I wonder if you can,
No need for greed or hunger,
A brotherhood of man,
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world...

You may say Im a dreamer,
but I'm not the only one,
I hope some day you'll join us,
And the world will live as one.

[drone]

If Chapman had been sane (and a true Beatles fan), he would have shot Yoko that night. The world would have been a much happier place.

[Devastatin Dave]

If Chapman had been sane (and a true Beatles fan), he would have shot Yoko that night. The world would have been a much happier place.
I'm sure that was tongue in cheek. No one deserves to be shot just for being annoying.:bow:
Now if you had said, "If Chapman had been sane (and a true Beatles fan), he would have shot Yoko when John first met her", then i might agree.~D

[drone]

Now if you had said, "If Chapman had been sane (and a true Beatles fan), he would have shot Yoko when John first met her", then i might agree.~DWould have been nice. Sorry about the original post, should have put a smilie in there. ~;)

I place the blame on Yoko with the other band members. They should have sabotaged that relationship as soon as they realized what she was like. ~D

[GoreBag]

Ugh. Death anniversaries irk me.

[DemonArchangel]

John Lennon was infinitely cooler than the guy that shot him. If I was a jury, I would have rejected Chapman's insanity plea and sent his ass straight to the chopping block.

[Byzantine Prince]

Phew... I'm glad no one mentioned me in this thread... ~:)

[Geoffrey S]

Slightly contradictory, BP?

[lars573]

Ugh. Death anniversaries irk me.
Seconded. Making a big deal out of the death of a famous guy is stupid. On a sode note he would have been 65, an old man. ~D



I didn't like his music or politics much, but he seemed like an OK guy and he was friendly to the folks he met and talked to and he was great to his fans. Its a shame that some no name bastard shot him just for his fame. Rest in peace John.
Most ok guys don't leave a wife and toddler to shack up with a new chick once they get famous.

[Ronin]

i don´t really like his music and he allways struck me as one of those people that tried way to hard to be a hippie.....anyway...RIP.

[Devastatin Dave]

Seconded. Making a big deal out of the death of a famous guy is stupid. On a sode note he would have been 65, an old man. ~D



Most ok guys don't leave a wife and toddler to shack up with a new chick once they get famous.
That's more on the lines of what I really wanted to say, but i was trying to be respectful.~:)

[Adrian II]

Most ok guys don't leave a wife and toddler to shack up with a new chick once they get famous.That was only a symptom. Lennon was a vain, emotionally empty little man.

Meanwhile, back in the sixties, other people were making real music.



https://img523.imageshack.us/img523/631/stones9nw.th.jpg (https://img523.imageshack.us/my.php?image=stones9nw.jpg)

[Beirut]

Lennon was one of those artists that, whether you loved him or hated him, you knew he was beyond the ordinary. Like Dylan, Sinatra, Elvis, and others.

You can go on and on about how (fill in the blank) they were, but a generation from now, people will still be listening to their music and talking about them, so there must be something special about them.

[lars573]

Lennon was one of those artists that, whether you loved him or hated him, you knew he was beyond the ordinary. Like Dylan, Sinatra, Elvis, and others.

You can go on and on about how (fill in the blank) they were, but a generation from now, people will still be listening to their music and talking about them, so there must be something special about them.
Probably true, but he was still an egomaniacal arse hole. I won't show people like him respect ever, living or dead.

[GoreBag]

Good call. Sucks to your death anniversary, Lennon.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Most ok guys don't leave a wife and toddler to shack up with a new chick once they get famous.

Yes he needed to be famous to attract such a wonderful woman as Oko, LOL.

He got married at a very young age.


That was only a symptom. Lennon was a vain, emotionally empty little man.


Emotionally empty . You have got to be kidding, By the way I was a few blocks away the night he was shot. In fact me and my friend had just been pulled over by some cops when they got the call and left us. As a huge Beatle fan I can only say I was in shock when I found out moments later what had happened. John was always my favorite Beatle.

[Quietus]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051208/ap_on_en_mu/lennon25th;_ylt=AhlTw_yvhQCxtMWv_kyLGmKs0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3b2NibDltBHNlYwM3MTY-

I didn't like his music or politics much, but he seemed like an OK guy and he was friendly to the folks he met and talked to and he was great to his fans. Its a shame that some no name bastard shot him just for his fame. Rest in peace John.

I put this in the backroom because I'm sure there might be some discussion on his politics or fame worship in general. The guy actually claimed that 'God' instructed him. Also, there are theories abound saying that John Lennon's murder (or assassination) was a result of a conspiracy.

One good point is that Chapman met Lennon about 6 hours earlier and asked for an autograph but he didn't kill him.

[Soulforged]

One good point is that Chapman met Lennon about 6 hours earlier and asked for an autograph but he didn't kill him.Did Lennon give the autograph?~;)

[Devastatin Dave]

Did Lennon give the autograph?~;)
Yes he did.

[Quietus]

The guy actually claimed that 'God' instructed him. Also, there are theories abound saying that John Lennon's murder (or assassination) was a result of a conspiracy.

One good point is that Chapman met Lennon about 6 hours earlier and asked for an autograph but he didn't kill him. edit: Sorry. The plea was God's decision (his claim) but not the Murder. At least not from what I've read.

[Franconicus]

Guys, you miss the points.

John was a great artist (not only musician) and a great man. He wanted to change the world and did the best he could but he never joined a political party or org. He never was a communist, socialist or whatever. He was always John Lennon, the human being.

He gave us hope and direction - and good rock and roll.

Thank you, John. So sad you left us. We need you more than ever!


NOBODY TOLD ME by John Lennon

Everybody's talking and no one says a word
Everybody's making love and no one really cares
There's Nazis in the bathroom just below the stairs

There's always something happening and nothing going on
There's always something cooking and nothing in the pot
They're starving back in China so finish what you got

Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Strange days indeed - most peculiar mama

Everybody's running and no one makes a move
Everyone's a winner and no one seems to lose
There's a little yellow idol to the north of Katmandu
Everybody's flying and no one leaves the ground
Everybody's crying no one makes a sound
There's a place for us in movies you just gotta stay around

Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Strange days indeed - most peculiar mama

Everybody's smoking and no one's getting high
Everybody's flying and never touch the sky
There's UFO's over New York and I ain't too surprised

Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Nobody told me there'd be days like these
Strange days indeed - most peculiar mama

[Ja'chyra]

I've been wondering what to write in this thread and I've decided that it's best to seem callous than to be a hypocrite so, who cares.

[English assassin]

I'm afraid I don't care either. John Lennon and the 60's changed the world, did they?

(Looks around at the world)

:no:

[doc_bean]

I'm afraid I don't care either. John Lennon and the 60's changed the world, did they?

(Looks around at the world)

:no:

[backroom mode]
That bunch of tree hugging hippies probably did more damage to the planet, and to family values than any other generation. Whether you're left or right, hippies suck !
[\backroom mode]

Working class hero is still an excellent song though ~:cheers:

[lars573]

Yes he needed to be famous to attract such a wonderful woman as Oko, LOL.

He got married at a very young age.
Most likely because he couldn't keep his pecker in his pants.



Emotionally empty . You have got to be kidding, By the way I was a few blocks away the night he was shot. In fact me and my friend had just been pulled over by some cops when they got the call and left us. As a huge Beatle fan I can only say I was in shock when I found out moments later what had happened. John was always my favorite Beatle.
Egomanical was the term I'd choose. John Lennnon onnly cared about the wants and needs of one person, John Lennon. It was always the vibe I got off him in interviews.

[Adrian II]

He wanted to change the world and did the best he could but he never joined a political party or org.He didn't even look after his own kid, he was too busy screwing around, taking LSD, writing bad songs and sucking up to an Indian in a skirt.
Change the world?
Please... ~:rolleyes:

Meanwhile, back in the sixties, real men were making real music.



https://img390.imageshack.us/img390/4364/vanmorrison3ck.gif (https://imageshack.us)

[Strike For The South]

wow the idociy in this thread is surprising this man truly defined a generation https://img281.imageshack.us/img281/8535/hankwilliams3zf.jpg (https://imageshack.us)

[Adrian II]

wow the idociy in this thread is surprising this man truly defined a generation.Hank Williams? 'Why don't you all f-f-fade away!'

I mean, here is a group of fine young lads who really defined their generation.



https://img42.imageshack.us/img42/9848/thewho6io.jpg

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Great artists are rarely great people, and people who accomplish great things are usually vain and egotistical.

He made some good music, that's what he'll be remembered for.

[Byzantine Prince]

You are prick AdrianII. What can I do though, I cannot stop you. I can only join you. Here's the group that defined MY generation:


https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/9881/manson9wb.jpg

[Adrian II]

You are ***** AdrianII.I beg your pardon?

[Reverend Joe]

I have never been a fan of the Beatles. However, I can say that, whilst Van Morrison and the Rolling Stones were making unlistenable trash (I would still choose the Beatles over the *shudder* Stones any day), OTHER people were making good music. People such as

https://img346.imageshack.us/img346/2352/creedenceclearwaterrevival0ra.png

and

https://img215.imageshack.us/img215/6614/ironbutterfly5ol.png

also

https://img441.imageshack.us/img441/5808/janisjoplin9no.png

not to mention

https://img212.imageshack.us/img212/1214/floyd50ao.jpg

but, most of all,

https://img211.imageshack.us/img211/9461/jimihendrix26sr.png

The Voodoo Child. He will be missed.

Also, John Lennon, however much you may hate him, was not an evil man. Besides, he was shot. Show some respect for the dead. Hell, I don't like him, but I will still show a little respect.

[Soulforged]

WOW ~:eek: !! This is great...I mean when somebody dies (here at least) people only sais good things about him, no matter his mistakes.

It's funny to look at an aniversary thread degenerate into criticism and flames.

[Reverend Joe]

WOW ~:eek: !! This is great...I mean when somebody dies (here at least) people only sais good things about him, no matter his mistakes.

It's funny to look at an aniversary thread degenerate into criticism and flames.

Yeah... I should calm down about this. :embarassed:

But I AM going to leave my post up, so that people can see what good music was all about during the 60's... actually, that was what I was really pissed about- Adrian referring to the Stones and Van Morrison as good music. Ech. :tongue:

[Adrian II]

WOW ~:eek: !! This is great...I mean when somebody dies (here at least) people only sais good things about him, no matter his mistakes.You should have been here when Jacques Derrida or Yasser Arafat died. There was little sympathy shown, no quarter given. This is the backroom, Soulforged. If you can't stand the heat...

Oh, and I totally agree that Hendrix was a great musician. I was going to mention him next as one who made real music in the 60's.

[Adrian II]

(..) that was what I was really pissed about- Adrian referring to the Stones and Van Morrison as good music. Ech. :tongue:At least you weren't 'fab'... :charge:

[Proletariat]

That was only a symptom. Lennon was a vain, emotionally empty little man.

Meanwhile, back in the sixties, other people were making real music.



https://img523.imageshack.us/img523/631/stones9nw.th.jpg (https://img523.imageshack.us/my.php?image=stones9nw.jpg)

'ello, Nail. Meet my friend, Hammer.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Wow, who are all those medieval musicians in those black-and-white pictures?

And who is that Lennon-guy?

[Adrian II]

'ello, Nail. Meet my friend, Hammer.Apart from their excellent music (although these days I'd wish they would disappear into the sunset with their wheelchairs and zimmer frames) there is an honest quality about them. Unlike in a guy like Lennon with all his self-involvement and intellectual pretense, what you see of The Stones is what you get. Bastards to a tee, all of them, but honest bastards.
~:cool:

[Adrian II]

Wow, who are all those medieval musicians in those black-and-white pictures?Well, they all had different names and styles, but what united them was that they played musical instruments. A musical instrument -- unlike your modern rhythm box with on/off switch and menu for slow, fast and annoyingly persistent boom-boom -- is a device used to produce tones in accordance to preconceived notions of harmony. They used to play these with their hands, feet (Townsend) or teeth (Hendrix). Funny stuff, eh?
And who is that Lennon-guy?Dunno, he never belonged to them. ~:handball:

[Devastatin Dave]

You should have been here when Jacques Derrida or Yasser Arafat died. There was little sympathy shown, no quarter given. This is the backroom, Soulforged. If you can't stand the heat...


Well, there is a difference between John Lennon and a filthy terrorist bastard like Arafat, even you have to agree with me on this, but then again...

[Reverend Joe]

Wow, who are all those medieval musicians in those black-and-white pictures?

And who is that Lennon-guy?

:stunned: *erk* :skull:

[Byzantine Prince]

Wow, who are all those medieval musicians in those black-and-white pictures?

And who is that Lennon-guy?
Just some Nobodies.

[Strike For The South]

You are prick AdrianII. What can I do though, I cannot stop you. I can only join you. Here's the group that defined MY generation:



https://img220.imageshack.us/img220/9881/manson9wb.jpg


see now thats just sad. A bunch of homos who scream the definig band. Thank god for country and bluegrass and TEXAS

[Adrian II]

Well, there is a difference between John Lennon and a filthy terrorist bastard like Arafat, even you have to agree with me on this, but then again...See what I mean, Soulforged?

Thanks for the object lesson, Dave. ~;)

[Adrian II]

see now thats just sad. A bunch of homos who scream the definig band. Thank god for country and bluegrass and TEXASYup, I'll take the Bluegrass Clodhoppers over Manson anytime. ~:cheers:

Yeehaw!

[Soulforged]

You should have been here when Jacques Derrida or Yasser Arafat died. There was little sympathy shown, no quarter given. This is the backroom, Soulforged. If you can't stand the heat...
Oh but I can...that's what I said this was funny. However you'll have to agree that this is an aniversary thread.
If you want criticism then I shall say to you that the best band of those times was Deep Purple, by a long shot, that improvised song...I think it was "Speed King", WOW, I mean I've seen actors improvise, but musicians, at that level?~:eek:

Well, there is a difference between John Lennon and a filthy terrorist bastard like Arafat, even you have to agree with me on this, but then again...Is there? No seriously...~:confused:

[Adrian II]

*pictures Arafat playing the ukulele*

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Egomanical was the term I'd choose. John Lennnon onnly cared about the wants and needs of one person, John Lennon. It was always the vibe I got off him in interviews.


This is the biggest load of crap ever posted on these boards. Lennons big care was for humanity. He cared for everyone in fact it seeemed to be his purpose in life to try to make things better for the average man. Just listen to the lyrics of his songs. There wasnt a more caring man on the face of the earth.

Some people here should be ashamed . Bashing a man who cared so much for humanity and gave us the greatest music in the history of the world.


He didn't even look after his own kid,

Yes the kid grew up poor and neglected. How about all of Jaggers kids? Is there even a counting of them and the women who had them? The guy was a friggin mucscian during the 60s. They all more women than they knew what to do with.


he was too busy screwing around, taking LSD, writing bad songs and sucking up to an Indian in a skirt.
Change the world?
Please...

Meanwhile, back in the sixties, real men were making real music.


Bad songs? And what Indian is this? The beatles are the greateest group in history and Lennon was their leader. If not for the Beatles many of the groupd you mentioned may well never have made it. You really need some musical history lessons here. The Beatles were musical geniuses and are compared today to Beethoven and other great classical composers. Many of you here it seems lack class and taste. Other than that I love all the other groups you mentioned but they dont hold a candle to the Beatles.

[Byzantine Prince]

Yup, I'll take the Bluegrass Clodhoppers over Manson anytime. ~:cheers:

Yeehaw!
WOW, you really hate talent don't you?

You are sad. First Lennon and now M.Manson. Who's next ? Elvis?

[Seamus Fermanagh]

This whole thread has me humming Don MacLean's signature song. ~:rolleyes:

Thanks a lot...now I'll never get to sleep you collective pack of twerps!

~;) D

[Steppe Merc]

John, RIP. While I hate Yoko, he was a great enough guy to get around the fact, and his music is incredible. I just hope people will realize what a great musician he was and stop listening to evil music...

~:grouphug:

[Proletariat]

This is the biggest load of crap ever posted on these boards. Lennons big care was for humanity. He cared for everyone in fact it seeemed to be his purpose in life to try to make things better for the average man. Just listen to the lyrics of his songs. There wasnt a more caring man on the face of the earth.


Unfreakingbelievable.



Some people here should be ashamed . Bashing a man who cared so much for humanity and gave us the greatest music in the history of the world.


Alot of people care about alot of things. If I don't agree with the second part of your statement, why would I care about the first? I personally would rather listen to a guitar being hit with a cat than to the Beatles.



Yes the kid grew up poor and neglected. How about all of Jaggers kids? Is there even a counting of them and the women who had them? The guy was a friggin mucscian during the 60s. They all more women than they knew what to do with.


So Mick is being used as the standard role model for fathers these days? At least Jagger wasn't sanctimonous about his role. Sheesh.



Bad songs? And what Indian is this? The beatles are the greateest group in history and Lennon was their leader. If not for the Beatles many of the groupd you mentioned may well never have made it. You really need some musical history lessons here. The Beatles were musical geniuses and are compared today to Beethoven and other great classical composers. Many of you here it seems lack class and taste. Other than that I love all the other groups you mentioned but they dont hold a candle to the Beatles.

I don't understand how someone like you could get so emotionally charged over something so obviously subjective.

This reminds me of all the imbeciles in my middle school who wore black for months after Kurt Cobain died. Yeah, Teen Spirit was catchy, but so is Sherri Lewis's Song That Never Ends.

If you liked his music, say you like his music. Let's not pretend this is the anniversary of Mother Theresa's death.

[Steppe Merc]

Cobain didn't help folks. Lennon did. So did Harrison, with his Concert for Bangladesh. I fail to see how it is so alien for you people to realize that musicians can help, and many do.

Damn it, you've made me return to the backroom. I thought I had escaped... ~:mecry:

[Adrian II]

Yes the kid grew up poor and neglected. How about all of Jaggers kids?They didn't. And even if they did, he wouldn't be a sanctimonious closet revolutionary about it.
And what Indian is this?My, I can see you know your classics. Ever heard of the Mahareshi?
The Beatles were musical geniuses and are compared today to Beethoven and other great classical composers.So is 50 cent, depending on who you believe. ~:rolleyes:

[Adrian II]

Unfreakingbelievable.You better freakinbelieve it, my lady, Lennon liked to think he was more popular than Jezus... BTW I see we simultaneously used the word sanctifreakinmonious whilst opposing Jagger to Lennon. ~;p

[Proletariat]

You better freakinbelieve it, my lady, Lennon liked to think he was more popular than Jezus... BTW I see we simultaneously used the word sanctifreakinmonious whilst opposing Jagger to Lennon. ~;p

I was about to type the same before I read this. Pretentious seemed to carry too little weight for a musician with this ego.

If you'll excuse me, I have to go calm myself down with Chopin's nocturne op.55 (personal favorite) and another shot of Patron.

[lars573]

Cobain didn't help folks. Lennon did. So did Harrison, with his Concert for Bangladesh. I fail to see how it is so alien for you people to realize that musicians can help, and many do.

Damn it, you've made me return to the backroom. I thought I had escaped... ~:mecry:
Musicians don't "help", they just manipulate others in to "helping". It's called the power of celebrity. Also Cobain killed himself/was murdered before he was 30, where as Lennon was 40 when he died. Cobain never had a chance to get to 30 and start to evalutate his life the way Lennon did.

I never really disliked the beatles or Lennons music. What turns me off is the personalities, especially Lennons. He was an asshole, his bigger than Jesus crack was his assholery showing through. Ever see the clip of his apology, his tone and body language are of a man who really didn't want to do it. And that though his remark was nothing.

[Adrian II]

WOW, you really hate talent don't you?

You are sad. First Lennon and now M.Manson. Who's next ? Elvis?I am so sad.

Speaking of Elvis, yeah, I love the old Elvis when he was mean and lean and... clean. Did you ever hear his Devil in disguise or Guitar Man? The intense energy he exudes, and passes on to his band.
:bow:

[Adrian II]

If you'll excuse me, I have to go calm myself down with Chopin's nocturne op.55 (personal favorite) and another shot of Patron.May I suggest the 3rd part of Dvorak's 8th Symphony for further restoration of one's inner peace? The Allegretto grazioso. Nearly made me cry the day before yesterday. Just a waltz, but so. freakin. perfect. Me big lump in throat.

[Quietus]

Lennon's music is sure great.

Lennon's better than McCartney, Prince, Stevie Wonder and just slightly over Marvin Gaye.
Lennon's equal to Jimi Hendrix, James Brown, EWF, and Fela Kuti
Although still short of my favorites.

Anyway, the Chapman guy got his autograph then he killed him 6 hours later but didn't flee.

[Devastatin Dave]

See what I mean, Soulforged?

Thanks for the object lesson, Dave. ~;)
You're welcome...

[Tachikaze]

I come back from a trip to Seattle, and I can't believe what I'm reading here. I showed more respect for that bastard Reagan at his death than most of you are showing for Lennon now. Unbelievable.

This is one of those rare circumstances when I'm going to side with Gawain.

From what I'm reading, most of you know very little about John Lennon, and your opinions don't count for much. It's true about some of the faults you listed, but your attacks were much stronger than he deserved.

While I'm at it, I support Yoko as well. I'm not sure I would like her in person, but I don't blame her for the breakup of the Beatles, and I don't think she's "evil".

So many of you have no idea what world Lennon came out of. He grew up in a sad, drab, twisted society, the same one that produced Roger Waters. His parents both abandoned him. He spoke for the other young people who grew up in that era, the victims of neglecting or over-restrictive parents and a repressive society.

He faced his faults and made strides to rid himself of them. He was evolving into an extremely devoted father with Sean in the years before his death. He was maturing into a very good man. I respect anyone who goes through pain to rid themselves of their old demons.

Shame on you people who bad mouth him out of your own ignorance. I could say equally bad things about almost all the other musicians you have mentioned.

By the way, the musical world disagrees with you as well. The music of Lennon and McCartney is considered the work of geniuses, only rivaled by Dylan in that era. There are university courses built around studying their work.

[lars573]

I didn't say anything about that idiot Regan when he died, I didn't care. Lennon is an ass who was undeserving of all the abulation he gets to this day. I don't believe in not speaking ill of the dead, they don't care there dead.

[doc_bean]

This reminds me of all the imbeciles in my middle school who wore black for months after Kurt Cobain died. Yeah, Teen Spirit was catchy, but so is Sherri Lewis's Song That Never Ends.


In my last year of high school (that would have been '00) there was a girl in my class who still wore a Nirvana T shirt everyday, and wrote poetry, about Cobain, and once showed a documentary about his death for some project...

Cobain worship has put me off of idol worship for good.

[Adrian II]

So many of you have no idea what world Lennon came out of. He grew up in a sad, drab, twisted society, the same one that produced Roger Waters. His parents both abandoned him.Neglecting or over-restrictive parents?

I may have a better idea than you. Lennon grew up in Mendips among doctors and lawyers. Yoko recently bought that old house because John claimed that it had been his only real home throughout his life. His aunt Mimi and uncle George took care of him very well and the relationship with his mother, who did not abandon him but took rather good care of him, was excellent. She was actually the first who taught him how to play the banjo. His father was a dead-beat Dad, but John did not grow up in a drab, twisted atmosphere; he was better off than the other three.


"I was a nice, cleancut suburban boy, and in the class system I was about a half an inch in a higher class than Paul, George and Ringo, who lived in subsidized government houses. We owned our own house, had our own garden. They didn't have anything like that. So, I was a bit of a fruit compared to them in a way."

John Lennon in Imagine John LennonApart from which, I think you missed Proletariat's reference to Yoko's most famous 'Painting to hammer a Nail'. Just as Gawain apparently missed the entire Mahareshi episode; John literally left Cynthia behind on a train station in Wales as he and the others went off to see the fat man. My dislike for The Beatles is not rooted in lack of knowledge about them, or in a dislike of rock music, blues or soul, something I tried to demonstrate by posting pics of other, superior bands and musicians.
The music of Lennon and McCartney is considered the work of geniuses, only rivaled by Dylan in that era. There are university courses built around studying their work.Considered by whom? That would be the old fallacy, the 'appeal to authority'. There are courses built around all sorts of nonsense. I would rather take a degree in astrology, so sorry. If pushed, I could write a thesis on musical genius about Elvis or Van the Man. About Lennon -- not.

[Soulforged]

I didn't say anything about that idiot Regan when he died, I didn't care. Lennon is an ass who was undeserving of all the abulation he gets to this day. I don't believe in not speaking ill of the dead, they don't care there dead.
Many people receive more adulation than they deserve, it's called the history of society. The process is very simple, do something new, not very good, but just original, make it public, keep on feeding in the same BS, and in years you're respected by everybody, they follow your gossip and they even praise to you. Later the propaganda closes the job. It happened many times really, but with Lennon who cares? Really.
I still agree with Tachikaze in one point, if you don't have nothing good to say then don't start an aniversary thread or don't enter the thread once started...or don't put it in the Backroom.

[Adrian II]

... or don't put it in the Backroom.Yah.

If this thread had been in the Frontroom, I would merely have written that Sergeant Pepper's has an intro that rocks. Since this is the Backroom, let me add that it is the only Beatles piece that does... ~D

[doc_bean]

Yah.

If this thread had been in the Frontroom, I would merely have written that Sergeant Pepper's has an intro that rocks. Since this is the Backroom, let me add that it is the only Beatles piece that does... ~D

You don't even like Hey Jude or Yesterday even a tiny bit ?

[Adrian II]

You don't even like Hey Jude or Yesterday even a tiny bit ?Fool on the Hill is, um, singeable. I will grant you that. ~:handball:

[Soulforged]

You don't even like Hey Jude or Yesterday even a tiny bit ?
At the same point that the Beatles aquired undeserved fame, a lot of bands did a better job and only achieved honorific prizes. Now the themes from the Beatles are not that bad, but they're not great...they're called rock n' roll with out rocking anything.

[Adrian II]

At the same point that the Beatles aquired undeserved fame, a lot of bands did a better job and only achieved honorific prizes. Now the themes from the Beatles are not that bad, but they're not great...they're called rock n' roll with out rocking anything.Good idea. Let's call their music 'Roll'. Just like that. As in:

"Well, Bob, that's a generational thing. I've always been into popular music, you know, Andy Williams, Mantovani, Roll..."

[Soulforged]

Excuse me but I must post this:

Take on Me (http://rds.yahoo.com/l=VDP/SIG=12c5v1hqm/EXP=1134322993/*-http%3A//waxy.org/random/video/family_guy_-_take_on_me.avi)
Can't Touch Me (http://rds.yahoo.com/l=VDP/SIG=12p9an103/EXP=1134323419/*-http%3A//timbervideoworks.com/Family%20Guy%20-%20Can't%20Touch%20Me.avi)

This Rocks them all!!

This are links...I've to clearify with this new interface.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Just as Gawain apparently missed the entire Mahareshi episode

Hows that. Someone mentioned he had his head up some Indians skirt? I should figure thats what their talking about?


Many people receive more adulation than they deserve, it's called the history of society

In this case its the opposite. It seems the younger generation has no idea of what the 60s were really like and how much the Beatles meant to our generation. 40 years after their break up they still hold just about every sales record. In rock theres the Beatles and then theres everybody else. They stand head and shoulders above the rest. No one has ever disputed their place in music other than a few nitwits on these boards.

[Adrian II]

No one has ever disputed their place in music other than a few nitwits on these boards.That's because it is and always has been easy listening, every housewife's safe choice.

There's nothing you can do that can't be done.
Nothing you can sing that can't be sung.
Nothing you can lie that can't be told.
Nothing you can do that can't be sold... :san_rolleyes:

[Reverend Joe]

In rock theres the Beatles and then theres everybody else. They stand head and shoulders above the rest. No one has ever disputed their place in music other than a few nitwits on these boards.

Damnit, Gawain, just because I have different taste than you do doesn't make me wrong. It doesn't make me right, either.

I will not lie to you. I cannot see the appeal in the Beatles. However, I cannot see the appeal in any record produced after 1979, either (with the possible exception of the Beastie boys, the only psychedelic rap group in history.) It is all a question of taste. The majority of people prefer certain kinds of music for certain reasons.

As for their place in history, that is highly subjective. In my opinion, Pink Floyd was a lot better than the Beatles, especially under Syd Barrett, becuase they were a lot more psychedelic. I also would argue that Hendrix had a lot more influence on modern music than the Beatles- he reinvented the way in which the electric guitar was used. The Beatles were just really popular. And don't give me that "on par with the classics" crap- have you ever heard "Echoes"?

So open your eyes and don't try to put the Beatles above everybody else, just because they were so damn popular. Real musical influence and meaning don't come from incredible sales records and popularity alone.

[Proletariat]

In this case its the opposite. It seems the younger generation has no idea of what the 60s were really like and how much the Beatles meant to our generation. 40 years after their break up they still hold just about every sales record. In rock theres the Beatles and then theres everybody else. They stand head and shoulders above the rest. No one has ever disputed their place in music other than a few nitwits on these boards.

I think the 60s produced the most degenerate generation bestowed on America. Thanks to you guys, we now have women breast feeding in public, boca burgers and 'Happy Holidays!' instead of 'Merry Christmas'.

Once again, if you like his music, fine. Go ahead and listen to elevator music. But your arguments here have been ridiculous so far.

'Everyone likes them except you idiots!' and
'They used to rewl!'

These points could be used to defend that song about humps and lady lumps that's so popular right now.

Can we stop putting musicians and artists on these ridiculous pedestals? They're singers, for God's sake. You don't ever hear this foolishness about CEOs or entrepreneurs.

Btw, I'm loving the new smiley set.

:san_laugh: :san_lipsrsealed: :san_kiss: :san_kiss: :san_kiss: :san_smiley: :san_shocked:

[Reverend Joe]

Btw, I'm loving the new smiley set.

:san_laugh: :san_lipsrsealed: :san_kiss: :san_kiss: :san_kiss: :san_smiley: :san_shocked:

Those christmas smilies scare me. :hide:

[Proletariat]

The hats always remind me of those characters I read about while studying the French Revolution.

[Byzantine Prince]

Can we stop putting musicians and artists on these ridiculous pedestals? They're singers, for God's sake. You don't ever hear this foolishness about CEOs or entrepreneurs.
That's actually a great point. Same goes for actors.

[doc_bean]

Can we stop putting musicians and artists on these ridiculous pedestals? They're singers, for God's sake. You don't ever hear this foolishness about CEOs or entrepreneurs.


You occasionally hear it about politicians though :san_smiley:

[Louis VI the Fat]

The hats always remind me of those characters I read about while studying the French Revolution.:san_laugh: Lol, they do resemble un 'bonnet phrygien', don't they?
http://www.liberte.ch/histoire/ddhc/bonnetphrygien.gif




And here's a painting of Marianne wearing one. She's from aproximately the same time period as Adrian's and Gawain's favourite musicians: :san_kiss:
http://www.ac-grenoble.fr/jmace/euro/images/marianne2.JPG

[Adrian II]

She's from aproximately the same time period as Adrian's and Gawain's favourite musicians.Chopin was a little later, Tchaikovsky a lot later. Don't know about Gawain's.

[Louis VI the Fat]

I mean, here is a group of fine young lads who really defined their generation.



https://img42.imageshack.us/img42/9848/thewho6io.jpg

Yo Adrian! I found a drawing of the young Pete Townsend! Here he is, in 1767:
http://www.lastoria.org/protagonisti/immagini/billaud.jpgHe never did change his hair or that thingy around his neck, did he? :san_tongue:

[Adrian II]

He never did change his hair or that thingy around his neck, did he? :san_tongue:Billaud was deported as a terrorist; don't get me in trouble with the CIA, will ya?

BTW I found the oldest known picture of John Lennon:



https://img222.imageshack.us/img222/7523/lascaux10qw.jpg

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Damnit, Gawain, just because I have different taste than you do doesn't make me wrong. It doesn't make me right, either.

Youtr quite right . Taste is a matter of opinion . However the vast majority of people and especially musicians agree with me and not you.


As for their place in history, that is highly subjective.

Not accordding to any authorities on music it isnt. Find me one who doesnt rate the Beatles as the number one rock group of all time. By every measurable means we have they blow away the competition. Im not saying your taste is any worse than mine but you cant deny the fact that most people consider thm the best. And this is akmist 40 years after they broke up. Mc Cartney is probably the most respected man in the bussiness today.


Pink Floyd was a lot better than the Beatles, especially under Syd Barrett, becuase they were a lot more psychedelic

Well I love Floyd but I like later floyd better. Heck I even worked for them.


I also would argue that Hendrix had a lot more influence on modern music than the Beatles- he reinvented the way in which the electric guitar was used.

Wrong again. He got that from Townsend. Who do you think had the first song with intentional feedback on it? Would you believe it was the Beatles? You seem to forget who came first.


So open your eyes and don't try to put the Beatles above everybody else, just because they were so damn popular. Real musical influence and meaning don't come from incredible sales records and popularity alone.

Again Im in the music bussiness. Not only do I do work for rock groups as a roadie.Ive been doing it since 1968. I also work as a sales rep for a cd distributor. I was there when all this music came out. I lived the 60s. Something most of you here can only read about. My eyes arent closed. I love all types of music. The best musicians dont even play rock. They play Jazz and Fusion. But when it comes to who is the greatest rock band ever there is no contest. My second favorite is the Who.


I think the 60s produced the most degenerate generation bestowed on America. Thanks to you guys, we now have women breast feeding in public, boca burgers and 'Happy Holidays!' instead of 'Merry Christmas'.


I totally agree with you and have apoligised for it many times on these boards. Damn hippies. To think I was once one.

Oh just for some others thoughts on the matter. From VH1


To start with the obvious, they were the greatest and most influential act of the rock era, and introduced more innovations into popular music than any other rock band of the 20th century. Moreover, they were among the few artists of any discipline that were simultaneously the best at what they did and the most popular at what they did. Relentlessly imaginative and experimental, the Beatles grabbed a hold of the international mass consciousness in 1964 and never let go for the next six years, always staying ahead of the pack in terms of creativity but never losing their ability to communicate their increasingly sophisticated ideas to a mass audience. Their supremacy as rock icons remains unchallenged to this day, decades after their breakup in 1970.

Most of you seem cluless on how innovative they really were and how they set the stage for all of the rest

LINK (http://www.vh1.com/artists/az/beatles/bio.jhtml)

From wikopedia


The Beatles were a British pop and rock group from Liverpool, England. The group shattered many sales records and charted more than 50 top 40 hit singles, including 20 #1 hits in the USA alone, becoming arguably the most famous musical act of the 20th century. EMI Records estimates that the band has sold over a billion records worldwide[1]. The band's songs covered many genres, from ballads to reggae, and from psychedelic music to blues to heavy metal, and opened the door for many new musical styles. The Beatles influence extended beyond music into the social and cultural revolutions of the 60s.



LINK (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Beatles)

And their influnce went far further than music. It was they who were the first to make the young realise what power they had.

[Adrian II]

Who do you think had the first song with intentional feedback on it? Would you believe it was the Beatles?Ah, the famous ‘firsts’ with which The Beatles are often credited. Creatively, these ‘firsts’ were not all that clear. They were often a technician’s feat rather than that of a musician. Studio technicians were crossbreeding all the time in those days.

Anyway, some of those ‘firsts’ belong to others. The Who claimed to have used intentional feedback first. Johnny Burnette already used it in his records in the late fifties. Others credit Lowman Pauling of the ‘5 Royales’ with its invention (I have no Pauling recordings, so I couldn’t say). Jimmy Page used the sitar (when he was in The Yardbirds) before any Beatle did. As far as I know, Page used distortion first as well. Etcetera.

But I think the point is that many such innovations were ‘in the air’ at the time, just like Elvis’s body movements or the habit of musicians growing long hair. As they each went solo after 1970, none of The Beatles was particularly innovative either. If you want to credit The Beatles with anything in particular, it must be that they popularised rock & roll and brought it into the cultural mainstream. The musical genre itself has Godfathers who were really… different. I mean, look at the following pictures and tell me who is the odd one out. And why.


https://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8554/littlerichard5oz.th.jpg (https://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?image=littlerichard5oz.jpg) https://img465.imageshack.us/img465/1593/fatsdomino2kb.th.jpg (https://img465.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fatsdomino2kb.jpg)
https://img221.imageshack.us/img221/3729/chuckberry1uc.th.jpg (https://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chuckberry1uc.jpg) https://img221.imageshack.us/img221/203/johnlennon7es.th.jpg (https://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?image=johnlennon7es.jpg)
It was they who were the first to make the young realise what power they had.What power? The power to sing ‘Love, love, loooove’? This is just more deification, Gawain. Compare that to the raw power of Midnight Rambler and you see the essential difference. One reason why I like The Stones better is that they never watered down their blues origins and never gave in to ‘family audiences’ to the point when they completely lost their inspiration. The Stones were a counter-culture within the counter-culture as well. They were disheartened souls, reflecting a planet torn by war and drugs and street fighting.

The contrast couldn’t have been clearer by the year 1969. In 1969 The Beatles were so messed up they could hardly pull off a rooftop concert. John Lennon was busy writing his third book, a diary called John’s Diary – The Diary Of A Working Man (Lennon of course had never been a working man in all his life), as well as divorcing Cynthia and rediscovering heroine. Two years earlier All You Need Is Love had already been a sort of good-bye, really, a tasteful ballad but extremely middle of the road. On the other hand in 1969 The Stones released Let It Bleed and did a legendary concert at Madison Square Garden on two consecutive nights. No feel-good cr@p, no funny uniforms. They were telling it like it is. The lyrics are still haunting today. You can’t. Always get. What you want…

[Reverend Joe]

Okay, let's begin again...

Again, you use a baseless argument of "everyone says I am right". A majority in opinion does not automatiically denote truth. Hell, not that long ago, we thought the Earth was the center of the Universe. Then, it was the Sun, which was still incorrect. But most people still agreed that it was...


Wrong again. He got that from Townsend. Who do you think had the first song with intentional feedback on it? Would you believe it was the Beatles? You seem to forget who came first.

My ass it was. Intentional feedback was invented by the Bluesmen, long before the Beatles were playing.

And I did not mean that Hendrix was the creator of his style- he was the fulchrum. He adopted his style from the bluesmen he played with, and listened to, from an early age. However, he was still an incredible innovator, combining multiple styles and methods, and creating completely new out of them. THe base was blues, but the result was undeniably Hendrix.

Show me, if you will, someone else who managed to create songs such as Purple Haze, Voodoo Child, and Machine-Gun (The Berekely version, not the studio version) at the same time as Hendrix. You can't. He used the old to create something new, and no music after his was the same.


Not accordding to any authorities on music it isnt.

Again, this argument is meaningless! What law, what basic fact, sets the "authorities" apart from any other idiot? If they were educated, what is there to say that they just throw all of this away mentally, and choose the Beatles- only to back this up with a certificate of knowledge they do not use? Drop the majority/authorities argument, it means nothing.


Again Im in the music bussiness. Not only do I do work for rock groups as a roadie.Ive been doing it since 1968. I also work as a sales rep for a cd distributor.

Ooh, a roadie, that really qualifies you automatically... Sorry, Gawain, but being a roaide gives you no more authority on music than being a line grunt does on warfare. (Actually, that is not fair- grunts get a better atuomatic eduaction on warfare than roadies do on music.)

And as for sales rep, I have three names for you: Kid Rock, 50 cent, and Britney Spears. Really influential, those three. Yet each, in their own time, was a superstar, especially 50 cent.

[Reverend Joe]

https://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8554/littlerichard5oz.th.jpg (https://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?image=littlerichard5oz.jpg) https://img465.imageshack.us/img465/1593/fatsdomino2kb.th.jpg (https://img465.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fatsdomino2kb.jpg)
https://img221.imageshack.us/img221/3729/chuckberry1uc.th.jpg (https://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chuckberry1uc.jpg) https://img221.imageshack.us/img221/203/johnlennon7es.th.jpg (https://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?image=johnlennon7es.jpg)

Hey, man... where's Muddy? Or Mississippi Fred? Or Lightnin' Hopkins? Or Robert Johnson? For a list of godfathers, that is awfully incomplete.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

Ah, the famous ‘firsts’ with which The Beatles are often credited. Creatively, these ‘firsts’ were not all that clear. They were often a technician’s feat rather than that of a musician. Studio technicians were crossbreeding all the time in those days.


No they werent. They were the ideas of the Beatles themselves. Much of their inovation was in the music itself.

Here check this out. Maybe you will learn something.


In many ways the songs of the Beatles are exemplary for the musical innovations the British beat explosion wrought onto the domain of popular music in the sixties. With their music the British groups forged a highly original combination out of the erstwhile separate elements of other musical styles, which quickly evolved to become a full-blown style of its own: the music we nowadays know as pop or rock music. The Beatles stood at the front-lines of this artistic movement and their songs offer worthwhile material for those who want to know more about the musical characteristics of rock music. And, there's help for those who want to study these songs. Since 1989 everyone can look for assistance on the internet in the Notes on ... Series, written by the American musicologist Alan W. Pollack on each and every Beatles' song.

LINK (http://www.icce.rug.nl/~soundscapes/VOLUME01/A_Beatles_Odyssey.html)


Again, this argument is meaningless! What law, what basic fact, sets the "authorities" apart from any other idiot? If they were educated, what is there to say that they just throw all of this away mentally, and choose the Beatles- only to back this up with a certificate of knowledge they do not use? Drop the majority/authorities argument, it means nothing.


The facts are no matter whether your musically educated or just a poor schlep on the street the Beatkes come out on top by the vast majority of people. Their music is timeless. It still is selling well today. Its not like a car. People buy music because they like the way it sounds. Certainly there are better musicains technically than the Beatles. Its their song writting talents and their chemistry that set them apart from the rest. Again I doubt that anyone who wasnt there can ever appreciate the effect the Beatles had on my generation. Unfourtunately its strange as Prol said. My favorite group wound up standing for most of what I hate today. Man those guys were certainly liberals now werent they.

[Tachikaze]

I may have a better idea than you. Lennon grew up in Mendips among doctors and lawyers. Yoko recently bought that old house because John claimed that it had been his only real home throughout his life. His aunt Mimi and uncle George took care of him very well and the relationship with his mother, who did not abandon him but took rather good care of him, was excellent. She was actually the first who taught him how to play the banjo. His father was a dead-beat Dad, but John did not grow up in a drab, twisted atmosphere; he was better off than the other three.
I've heard this, too. But John said differently in his song, "Mother". He exorcized his demons by screaming how he really felt about his mother giving him up to his Aunt Mimi. John's dark years were the result of his perception of his life, not ours or his mother's.

The drab, twisted atmosphere I was referring to was not his family in particular, but postwar England. If I had grown up in that place in that era, I would have been dark and moody or unstable, too, like so many British musicians of the '60s. Many of these guys had serious issues, including Pete Townsend and Keith Moon, Roger Waters and Sid Barrett, Jimmy Page, etc. Actors and comedians were afflicted as well.

There was nothing wrong with John's aunt.

[Reverend Joe]

Man, I give up. I don't even know what we are arguing about. I thought we were arguing about how good the Beatles were, but now it sounds like you are aruing about how popular they were. I feel freaked out and confused, like I just spent three sleepless days and nights searching for the American Dream in Las Vegas, only to find myself in the center of the Circus-Circus, high on Mescalin, and talking calmly with a half-crazy man who, only minutes before, witnessed an old man being killed by a berserk ape. And I found the American Dream, right where I least expected it: the owner of the Circus-Circus, who ran away to join the Circus as a kid, and ended up owning it. From humble origins, he grew to a mighty man, a man capable of swindling thousands of poor Rubes in a single night. The epitomy of capitalism, the dream of Adam Smith and Spiro Agnew, personified. What a beast.

[Tachikaze]

My favorite group wound up standing for most of what I hate today. Man those guys were certainly liberals now werent they.
It's four against one. Maybe you should change!:wink:

[Gawain of Orkeny]

It's four against one. Maybe you should change

Obviously I did. I aint no hippie no more thats for sure :san_grin:

[Adrian II]

Hey, man... where's Muddy? Or Mississippi Fred? Or Lightnin' Hopkins? Or Robert Johnson? For a list of godfathers, that is awfully incomplete.Yeah, and you are forgetting John Lee Hooker ... Boom-boom-boom-boom! :san_cool:

We both know there are many others. I just picked those four. To be honest I could have added Buddy Holly who wasn't just white, but who wore spectacles as well. Ha!

I was just making a point about The Beatles, The Stones and many other white groups reaching across a divide that black musicians, until the early '60's, couldn't reach across on their own. As for many innovations like fuzzy distortion, feedback etcetera, maybe a certain Lester William Polfus should really be credited.

@Gawain, you are just repeating the 'everybody says so' argument.:san_wink:

[Adrian II]

I've heard this, too. But John said differently in his song, "Mother". He exorcized his demons by screaming how he really felt about his mother giving him up to his Aunt Mimi. John's dark years were the result of his perception of his life, not ours or his mother's.

The drab, twisted atmosphere I was referring to was not his family in particular, but postwar England. If I had grown up in that place in that era, I would have been dark and moody or unstable, too, like so many British musicians of the '60s. Many of these guys had serious issues, including Pete Townsend and Keith Moon, Roger Waters and Sid Barrett, Jimmy Page, etc. Actors and comedians were afflicted as well.

There was nothing wrong with John's aunt.Now that is what I call arguing from a position of strength. :bow:

I think you are right, maybe not so much about John's personal circumstances, but certainly about the general culture. What convinces me is that a surprising number of them had 'issues' as you call them. Even squeaky clean Cliff Richard and part-time fascist David Bowie had them. Heck, if you look close enough even George Formby had 'issues', didn't he?

If you could see what I can see
When I'm cleaning windows :san_cheesy:

[KukriKhan]

I leave the critique of Lennon's musical genius to you wiser guys. I liked some of his stuff, ho-hum about the rest.

I heard a story a couple days ago on the radio about how, in Cuba (which once denounced Lennon and The Beatles as decadent capitalist pigs) they had made a statue of Lennon, for the tourists. Shortly after its unveiling, someone stole the eyeglasses from the statue. So now (and as a career) this woman's sole job is "custodian of Lennon's glasses"
http://www.theworld.org/images/extra/lennon/pop/1.jpg

She hangs out near the statue - when a tourist approaches, she scurries over there and places the glasses atop John's nose - then retrieves them when the tourist departs. A workers' paradise, indeed. :san_laugh:

More photos and the full story at http://www.theworld.org/

p.s. I thought we yanks still couldn't travel freely to Cuba. Seems like Lisa Mullins (the radio host) did.

[Adrian II]

Look Mom, no glasses!

https://img483.imageshack.us/img483/1549/statuejagger5zt.jpg

[Gawain of Orkeny]

@Gawain, you are just repeating the 'everybody says so' argument

Theres no other way to rate musicians. I never said they were the best musicians ever but the greatest and most infuential group of all time. There are not many who argue that point.

PS even the Beatles themselves credit mostly old Black groups for inspiring them. After the Beatles most groups credit the Beatles for inspiring them. They are an Icon that shall never be replaced. Trash them all you like. I doubt any group will ever have as big an effect on the world around them or any where near the success of the fab four.

[Strike For The South]

https://img261.imageshack.us/img261/964/cash0uy.th.jpg (https://img261.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cash0uy.jpg) this man did more for rock and country

[Adrian II]

https://img261.imageshack.us/img261/964/cash0uy.th.jpg (https://img261.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cash0uy.jpg)
this man did more for rock and countryMore than Hank Williams, that's for sure.

[GoreBag]

https://img343.imageshack.us/img343/2517/folder8qw.jpg

Sucks to your so-called innovation.

[KukriKhan]

Okay, we've devolved to: "my favorite artist is better than your favorite artist", which is Frontroom fare. But, because it contains some Backroomtype content (examining the socio-political impact of pop music in general and Lennon & Beatles in particular, we'll keep it parked here.

Closed. Thanks to all contributors. :bow: If you have other content to provide, please PM me, and we may reopen.