View Full Version : Is Texas a Part of the South?
Del Arroyo
12-31-2005, 18:47
I would argue that it most definitely is not. Texas is geographically and culturally distinct, both historically and in the present day. Heck, the accent isn't even close.
Other thoughts?
DA
Leet Eriksson
12-31-2005, 19:03
American Civil War
Texas contributed alot to the south generally, and geographically they are in the south of the united states as well.
just my opinion based on what i heard from SFTS when talking about texas in the chat room.
Kanamori
12-31-2005, 19:24
There is a Texan mind-set that is culturally quite different from the rest of the "South," which is not a purely geographical thing, for instance, Arizona and New Mexico are "south" but they are very, very different from the old-South. Also, the fact that Texas was a country before it joined the Union has been a large influence culturally between what I have experienced in the Southern states (with a capital 's') and in Texas. There is also a very noticable difference between the "deep south", e.g. Alabama and Mississippi, and other Southern states like North Carolina, South Carolina, and Virginia. Bottom line, Texan culture is very different from the traditional Southern culture.
Strike For The South
12-31-2005, 19:49
The culture is very different but still somewhat the same. If you had to put Texas in a region it would be the south.
Proletariat
12-31-2005, 19:51
How on Earth is Texas geographically distinct from the south?
KukriKhan
12-31-2005, 20:11
I remember Sister Mary Lucia in 4th grade geography class explaining that "The South" was south of the Mason-Dixon line & east of the Mississippi River. She turned out to be a crackpot on some other subjects, so I'm not surprised that many folks disagree with her (including Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_United_States ).
Seems opinions are divided, but there's general agreement that "The South" is (at least) the original 6 confederate states + Texas.
Strike For The South
12-31-2005, 20:21
In many ways Texas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas) has one foot in the South, and one in the Southwest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southwest_United_States), though most Texans would probably claim that both feet are planted firmly in their own boots. Its major cities have a very culturally diverse population, including Hispanic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hispanic) and Asian Americans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_American). Many Americans from other parts of the U.S. have also moved to the state in the last four decades. Generally, East Texas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Texas) maintains a southern influence, while the rest of the state tends to be influenced by the southwest. In terms of regional identity, however, a vast majority of residents would identify themselves as Texans rather than Southerners or Westerners.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas
solypsist
12-31-2005, 20:26
i would argue that Texas is more part of the SouthWest than the South. but that's just me.
/edit: ninja'd by SFTS
Texas is compared to Quebec often just because of this. People don't mean Quebec when they say 'Eastern Canada', but jography is jography.
Kaiser of Arabia
01-01-2006, 21:15
Southwest. Not the South Proper. I like the Southwest. Good climate.
Texas is Southwest. Culturally, it just doesn't fit in with the American South.
Red Harvest
01-02-2006, 20:55
Having just moved from Texas to part of the Old South I would have to say that Texas is not really part of the South as folks generally think of the South. The large spanish speaking population alone really changes the flavor of Texas.
Texas is so large that it is very difficult to classify. In the north down to Dallas it has more of a plains flavor from what I've seen. In the North East it is more southern midwest with a mix of northern Louisiana influence. In the Southeast it has a cajun flavor. Then there is the Hill Country. While West and South Texas are more of a Tejano/Southwest style. Texas is big...so it won't fit conveniently in any box (can you tell I've done a lot of packing and unpacking recently?)
To put it simply Texas is Texas. Its like Red Harvest pointed out - a great intermixing of the different cultures of the South-West, South, and yes even the Plains. Add into it the the flavor of Mexico which is also part of the history of Texas - and you will discover it really doesn't fit into any one niche, but is truely one of its own.
Teleklos Archelaou
01-02-2006, 22:57
This is easy: the east part of Texas can be considered part of the south. The west and central parts are too different. Best map of what is "the south"? Just look at a map of sweet tea preference distribution. It's as easy as that:
http://www.math.clemson.edu/~rsimms/neat/tea-usa.jpg
The_Doctor
01-02-2006, 23:37
sweet tea
What is that?
Tea with two sugars?
What is that?
Tea with two sugars?
Iced Tea made so sweet that it gives you a sugar rush.
The_Doctor
01-02-2006, 23:53
Iced Tea made so sweet that it gives you a sugar rush.
Interesting. And I thought 3 spoons of sugar in tea was bad.
Red Harvest
01-03-2006, 00:39
What is that?
Tea with two sugars?
Iced tea with ANY sugar is sweetened tea. Haven't had mine that way since I was about 12. The problem is that you never can get the sugar level *just right.* Much easier to stop using sugar: less fuss, consistent taste. For those that want it sweetened...you can always put sugar in their glass of tea, but it is hard to get it back out.
Teleklos Archelaou
01-03-2006, 02:07
Iced tea with ANY sugar is sweetened tea. True. It may be "sweetened tea", but it's absolutely not "sweet tea". I'd have called "Blasphemy!!!" if you had said "Iced tea with ANY sugar is sweet tea." :shame:
Haven't had mine that way since I was about 12. The problem is that you never can get the sugar level *just right.* Much easier to stop using sugar: less fuss, consistent taste. For those that want it sweetened...you can always put sugar in their glass of tea, but it is hard to get it back out.
This is what northerners/midwesterners/west coast types don't understand: the tea tastes totally different when you put sugar into it hot vs. cold. When I ask for sweet tea and they say "the sugar's right there" (pointing on the table), I want to hold them down and pour it in their eyes. :laugh4: Really though, you can put a pound of sugar in a gallon of tea and if it's already cold it won't break down the same way and it won't taste nearly as good. Gotta get it in there when it's hot. I put one cup of sugar in a gallon of tea when I make it. Got two gallons in my fridge right now actually, and a large glass of it on my desk here right now too - with lots of ice, and about 1/8th of a cup of lemonade mixed in too. Absolute perfection. :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup:
Major Robert Dump
01-03-2006, 10:38
Oklahoma is windy because Texas sucks.
True. It may be "sweetened tea", but it's absolutely not "sweet tea". I'd have called "Blasphemy!!!" if you had said "Iced tea with ANY sugar is sweet tea." :shame:
This is what northerners/midwesterners/west coast types don't understand: the tea tastes totally different when you put sugar into it hot vs. cold. When I ask for sweet tea and they say "the sugar's right there" (pointing on the table), I want to hold them down and pour it in their eyes. :laugh4: Really though, you can put a pound of sugar in a gallon of tea and if it's already cold it won't break down the same way and it won't taste nearly as good. Gotta get it in there when it's hot. I put one cup of sugar in a gallon of tea when I make it. Got two gallons in my fridge right now actually, and a large glass of it on my desk here right now too - with lots of ice, and about 1/8th of a cup of lemonade mixed in too. Absolute perfection. :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup: :2thumbsup:
The tea definitely needs to be brewed with the sugar. You can dissolve more sugar in the hot water to create a supersaturated solution when it gets chilled. I can't get the stuff proper here in northern Virginia (I should though, this is "the South"), but they serve it in restaurants all through the south. Nectar of the gods, just don't try it if you are diabetic.
I'm sure the Brits on the forum are all wondering, "What is this iced tea the Yanks are going on about?" I made the mistake of asking for iced tea in England once, they looked at me like I had a second head growing out of my shoulder. :laugh4: And no, we don't put milk in ice tea...
Red Harvest
01-03-2006, 20:01
You can dissolve a lot of sugar in water/tea at room temperature (~40 grams per 100 grams/water.) It is not until it is chilled that solubility is an issue. Even at 5 C you can still make it 10% sugar or so.
The_Doctor
01-03-2006, 20:35
That much sugar cannot be healthy.:no:
Seamus Fermanagh
01-03-2006, 21:04
The tea definitely needs to be brewed with the sugar. You can dissolve more sugar in the hot water to create a supersaturated solution when it gets chilled. I can't get the stuff proper here in northern Virginia (I should though, this is "the South"), but they serve it in restaurants all through the south. Nectar of the gods, just don't try it if you are diabetic.
Northern Virginia hasn't been part of the South for quite a while now. It is the scene of many of R.E. Lee's triumphs, and has been part of Virginia since the founding, but it hasn't been part of the cultural South since the 1950's.
Why? Government. Washington DC and the Beltway communities swamped the Southern Locals -- and shoved many of them further South -- when government exploded in the late 1930's and onward. The NOVA counties don't vote, tax, govern, think like, drink like, or connect well with the rest of the Old Dominion (and yes, I speak from direct residential experience in both regions). Northern Virginia is a Mid-Atlantic enclave that occasionally uses the word "ya'll" or honors a Confederate general when naming a high-school.
At best, Northern Virginia has become an extension of Washington, D.C., a place best summarized by John Kennedy when he said is was a combination of "Southern efficiency and Northern charm."
As to "Swee-Tea," adding the sugar at near boiling temperatures does allow you to super-saturate the solution. Classic Sweet Tea literally makes my teeth ache as I drink it -- and I'm the kind who puts three sweeteners in my coffee and actually likes the taste of a Krispey Kreme Vanilla-filled.
Byzantine Prince
01-03-2006, 23:08
I think of Texas the same way I think of Florida. It has a metropolitan feel in the big cities and hicks in the bush. By the way I love both these states for the simple fact that their cities rule.
You get iced tea here. I always thought it was a French thing...
At best, Northern Virginia has become an extension of Washington, D.C., a place best summarized by John Kennedy when he said is was a combination of "Southern efficiency and Northern charm."
I've never heard that phrase before, hilarious.:laugh4:
It's not very southern but as a DC extension it's still better than Maryland. I do miss Atlanta though, the sweet tea was good there...
I always thought it was the part of Mexico where all the really clever gangsters live!
InsaneApache
01-04-2006, 16:09
Of course if you really wanted to be refreshed by drinking tea, then it absolutley has to be hot. After all it was invented in hot climates. Had this discussion many times with 'Mom' who just can't get her Yank head around us Brits drinking piping hot tea when it's 40 centigrade outside*. Crazy Englishmen she calls us.
Yes Texas is in the South, it fought with the South in the ACW.
*this is in Greece btw :juggle2:
Ja'chyra
01-04-2006, 16:22
Is Texas a Part of the South?
Is it in the south? Guess so then. :idea2:
Red Harvest
01-04-2006, 17:13
Yes Texas is in the South, it fought with the South in the ACW.
That is not really the question. "Part of" not "in" was the question. There is a difference.
Second, which side Texas fought on in the ACW has only a small bearing on the matter today. Look at Florida. I wouldn't classify it as part of the South, yet in the ACW it was very much so. And it is as far south as Texas.
This is a cultural/political question, not straightforward geography.
InsaneApache
01-04-2006, 18:03
That is not really the question. "Part of" not "in" was the question. There is a difference.
Second, which side Texas fought on in the ACW has only a small bearing on the matter today. Look at Florida. I wouldn't classify it as part of the South, yet in the ACW it was very much so. And it is as far south as Texas.
This is a cultural/political question, not straightforward geography.
Good point. However, my Step-mom comes from Jacksonville and she swears that Florida is as 'South' today as it ever was.
So how far north do they eat chitlins? :inquisitive:
Good point. However, my Step-mom comes from Jacksonville and she swears that Florida is as 'South' today as it ever was.
So how far north do they eat chitlins? :inquisitive:
North Florida (Jacksonville, Tallahassee, etc.) is still pretty Southern (some might say redneck ~;) ). But south Florida is just a Northern US retirement community, or as I like to call it, God's Waiting Room. :skull:
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