Where's Mori?

[Dooz]

I'm at year 204 B.C. in my Casse campaign. I noticed a few years back that I can no longer train Mori Gaesum in any provinces. I think it may have to do with a barracks building that showed something reforms in the units list that it makes available. Are there Casse reforms? If so, do they not add any units and instead take away the ability to train Mori Gaesum? If so, this is quite troubling as they were what I was relying on heavily for my war to the east. The Minahlt can only be trained along the western shores and it makes for difficult resupply. Is this a bug or a feature?

[Moros]

Mori Gaesum are helvetian right? So they would be in what now is called Switzerland. Btw the mori form gaesum isn't a place i believe. I thought it was Celtic for sea of spears. So I guess mori would mean sea, since it resembles Mari : sea in latin.

[Dooz]

Hmmm... not exactly having anything to do what I asked, but sure! :2thumbsup:

The thing is I used to be able to train them in specific provinces but now those same provinces don't have the option to anymore.

[Antagonist]

Well first of all, I've only ever been able to train Mori Gaesum in one settlement, Aventicos. Did you change the government type? I'm not sure since the government descriptions for the Celtic factions are a little confusing, but I think "regionals" like the Mori Gaesum aren't available under certain government types.

Antagonist

[Moros]

yes, just told you where you could recruit them...
Can you train calawre?

[Dooz]

Yup I can train Calawre in most of my European provinces. I have type 2 gov's installed wherever possible. Once again, the problem is that I used to be able to train the Mori Gaesum in certain settlements and after some point was not, so it leads me to believe something happened to make it so. I still have a hunch it has something to do with reforms or something because there is a Ryecalawre unit that I've never seen yet in my campaign but saw in some other thread.

[LorDBulA]

Wasnt it so that you could train them when you didnt have gov building build? Its bug in 0.7.2, you shouldnt be able to build units with no gov building, but right now you can build any unit withought gov building.
But when you build gov building you cant recruit as many units (and this is how it should work).

[Dooz]

I thought it might have been that, but I doubt it. Reasons being I don't think I recruited without gov. buildings because I'd read about it in other threads and plus, I think now even if I destroy the gov building, they're still not recruitable. So I shall go test that and return with an answer.



-edit-
Aha, I can build them without a gov. building, but here's what happened. I used to have type 3 gov'ts in place in those areas, and I could train them. I recently converted all my holdings in Europe to type 2, so now I can't... which brings me to my next point. Why not? Withy type 3 gov'ts in place, I could train Mori Gaesum, with type 2 I instead can only train Calawre? They're more expensive and I can't have armies of many of those units. Is this intentional? If so, does it mean I have to have at least one province under type 3 gov't in order to train them? Is this realistic? Curious as to the reasons behind it.

[QwertyMIDX]

Type 3's and 4's allow more native control and thus allow you to get access to native units. Type 1's and 2's are the core of your empire, and allow for more of your faction troops to be built. Each gov't also has it's own set of law/happiness/trade/etc bonuses and penatlies.

[Dooz]

I see, I see. Then a type 3 gov. would make sense to have in mainland Europe. But it seems the benefits for 2 and 3 were pretty much the same, other than the available units. One is 10% public order the other is two 5%'s and they both have increase in tradable goods. Is there a difference in the amount of tradable goods between the two?

[QwertyMIDX]

Not sure, I didn't do the bonuses for the Casse. There is probably some difference. +10% to law is better than +5% to law and +5% to happiness, law reduces corruption too. It's best to put type 3's in places with regionals, but type 2's are better if there aren't any good regionals in that province. At some point in the future a script will make type 3's and 4's have a chance of deserting you if certin things happen, but that's not going to be ready anytime soon.

[Dooz]

Oh I see, never knew about law having extra bonuses on the side. Thanks for the info Qwerty! Wasted a bunch of time and money on those damn type 2 gov's, now gonna' have to revert some of them.


-edit-
Also, I see the Casse reforms in the military buildings. Is there a set time for that or are there certain requirements to fill?

[Dayve]

I'm playing as the Aedui and i notice that i can only recruit Mori Gaesum in one province... I've forgotten its name but it's the province that is just north-west of Mediolanium... I can't recruit them yet but when i right click the level 4 barracks (which i can't afford yet) it says: Mori Gaesum: Teutarix(sp)

Teutarix is the level 1 Aedui government building which takes 20 turns to build... And i need a level 4 barracks to train them... It'll be a long wait but worth it in the end... I'm so used to playing as the Romans that i hate having to pause and charge my first line of infantry against the enemy as they close in... I'd rather just leave them stood there on guard mode which can't really be done with barbarians.

[PSYCHO V]

Yes, futher to comments already made:

* By investing in setting up type 1 & 2 governments you are enforcing your social, cultural, economic and military system on the indigenous natives. Thus you'll loose native nuances but gain more direct control and thus management benefits.

* Type 3 & 4 governments keep control but more from a distance and allow varying degrees of native autonomy.

* The system in the beta is still very rough with many wholes. We hope to polish this in future releases.

* From the next build on, you'll start to see a whole swagger of regionally specific troops types representing the various tribes and peoples that inhabited certain areas. So hold onto your hats, the barb lands in particular will become very colourful..if not occasionally scary for the unwary adventurer. ~;)

[Dooz]

Holy crap, I can't wait.

[jebes]

Yes, futher to comments already made:

* From the next build on, you'll start to see a whole swagger of regionally specific troops types representing the various tribes and peoples that inhabited certain areas. So hold onto your hats, the barb lands in particular will become very colourful..if not occasionally scary for the unwary adventurer. ~;)

That makes my current problem worse. Is there a way to tell what units can be built in each of the 4 governments before they are built? I have a hard time choosing because I don't know what I am missing by going to other way.

In regards to the current recruitment problem, would it be possible to make the recruitment costs for units obscene, but give the gov buildings a huge minus to the recruitment costs for all units? That would stop people from recruiting before they have a government.

[Dooz]

When you look at the building descriptions for the military training buildings, you'll see the gov't types that allow the troops next to the troop type. If there is no gov't type, then I think any kind will do. This isn't official, just my observation so an official word would be nice.

[Moros]

well for now you can build units when there is no government building. But when the recruitment system is in place units will only be avaible if you have the correct government building built. Some units will be avaible with more than one government and some might even be avaible with all governments.
So builing a government will be more important and a must-do in the final version. It's just that the recruitment system wasn't finished and completed yet with this version.

[Dooz]

I must ask again in search of the answer.

Is there a set year for Casse reforms or are there certain conditions to be met? Or perhaps more importantly, are there Casse reforms?

Oh and what exactly do they entail?

[Malrubius]

I think currently most Celtic and other 'barbarian' reforms are tied into 107 BC. The more dynamic reforms aren't done yet; this is very much a work in progress.

[Dooz]

Oh no... I'm only just at 200 B.C. and I've been playing since the dawn of time. Well then, can't wait for those dynamic reforms to start kicking in!

What exactly will I be looking forward to at the reforms? What units will be added, what will be removed if any? Any other details?

[PSYCHO V]

There are suppose to be three Celtic reforms reflecting the dynamic nature / changes in Celtic society over the three hundred years. But like many things I think it was missed and you only have one as previously mentioned.