here comes the cavalry..

[Cras]

I am playing a campeign, and I have to much money and was upgrading some legions where I replaced light cavalry with heavy cavalry.
I put all the left over light cavalry in one army and just for fun sake I complemented the army with more light cavalry, since I didnt know what to expect I didnt add a general in case the all cavalry legion would show a poor performence.

This army was attacked by the huns, the light cavalry legion was spread out like a line with a diamond square in the middle. I decided that since some of the other units had spearman I would attack the units in teams of 2 cavalry units, working my way from the hun's outside inwards. I found that I could attack a lot of their army this way... well to cut things short... I massacred the huns, in seconds.. it was incredible, I didnt even had big losses.

After crushing this army the second hun army attacked me... they were given the same fate in also a very short time... the same went for their 3rd army... it was unbelievable.. so easy, so fast and for them,.. so devestating.

yesterday I tried the same thing with only 4 heavy cavalry against about 2/3 of a full legion (yes there were a.o. 6 peasant units in it and only one general) and that too was defeated using the same tactic, two pair of 2 units attacking them from the ouside working inwards... I was SO suprised, never realised the power of cavalry... that is different now...

Of course this doesnt work for attacking a city, but as a back up support legion... they move quite fast over the map, distance in a battle or fighting uphill seems to have a lesser effect, and if you loose some men, merge the units and just add 1 or 2, the legion is easily replenished.

try it... and it's an awesome site to engage all that cavalry 20 x 108 + 1 in a battle... pity they didnt have a special sound file for a fight like that... the sound mustbe defning!

enjoy....

[aw89]

You can do the same to an infantry heavy army with one unit of heavy cav, not two units to one, but just galloping past its flank and charging before it can turn. General units are perfect for this. it is cheesy though

[Dutch_guy]

this reminds me of MP cav. spamming :skull: , which I don't really like to say the least.

I don't use all infatry/archer/cav. armies, just don't like them. I prefer balanced armies with a solid heavy infantry core.

I do agree that Horse heavy armies in the hands of a competent ( read: Human ) player is practically unstopable.

:balloon2:

[x-dANGEr]

Yes they are, a box shaped phalanx (R: TW) or Shield Wall (BI) would stop them..

[A.Saturnus]

Hmm, did any of the armies you tried this on have some anti-cav in them like heavy spearmen?

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

I did something like this. I had moved my bounderies as the WRE up into Dacia and was fortifying the border with watch towers using a young General. On impulse I highered some Sarmation Armoured Archers and some Alans, ling and heavy and went rebel hunting. Its a bit harder with a mostly infantry enemy but its still great fun.

After all, how do the think the Huns got so far?

[Cras]

@ Asaturnus

yes they had many spearman. But taking a frontal charge of 2 Cavalry units is painful for any unit. what also happens is dat a lot of units rout,... which has a cascade effect... they al start to route.
such a nice site... all those little white flags and nearly 2000 horseman to kill them all off...

[Deus ret.]

indeed it is possible to achieve impressive results when deploying cav-only armies, mainly due to cavalry being seriously overpowered....too large units and far too cheap. combined with the appalingly low morale of most units even the better ones often rout if they are already engaged and cavalry threatens to charge (read: THREATENS, not charges) their flank. quite ridiculous. even if the AI fields such an army it can get nasty because since BI it has actually discovered the meaning of 'flanking'....

[A.Saturnus]

@ Asaturnus

yes they had many spearman. But taking a frontal charge of 2 Cavalry units is painful for any unit. what also happens is dat a lot of units rout,... which has a cascade effect... they al start to route.
such a nice site... all those little white flags and nearly 2000 horseman to kill them all off...


Well, from what you tell you were fighting Hun hordes, right? Hun hordes have usually quite a lot low spearmen like Steppe Spearmen or Runaway Slaves. However, these can hardly be considered anti-cav. What I mean is, were there any Heavy Spearmen in that armies? I'm asking because in my experience, a frontal charge with light horses against heavy spearmen wouldn't leave with enough horses to do it a second time.

[Cras]

Well, from what you tell you were fighting Hun hordes, right? Hun hordes have usually quite a lot low spearmen like Steppe Spearmen or Runaway Slaves. However, these can hardly be considered anti-cav. What I mean is, were there any Heavy Spearmen in that armies? I'm asking because in my experience, a frontal charge with light horses against heavy spearmen wouldn't leave with enough horses to do it a second time.


yesterday I was attacked by roman rebels, approx 2500 men. I was with 5 cavalry units and a general, approx 550 men. I didnt have light cavalry. just the heavy and better.

I used the same technique, I attacked their wings first (they were light cavalry, then worked my way inwards. The light cavalry was no match, neither were the peasant units, of course archers and slingers were killed swiftly and fast too...

then, with all the previous mentioned routing, I attack the heavier units who all have problem with their position since I attack from 2 sides.



Off course my Cavalry units attack the heavy spearman and heavy infantry from the sides or the back. Yesterday I used my general as a lure to make their infantry turn to him as my cavalry units decimated them.

the battle started with a numeric advantage of 5-1 in their favor, it ended with 50-60 loss on my side and their army was swept of the sandy planes of the middle east..

[antisocialmunky]

Yes they are, a box shaped phalanx (R: TW) or Shield Wall (BI) would stop them..

And pray they don't hit the corners.:inquisitive:

[amir]

when on defence simply make a circle with phalanx and archers in the middle.
invincible. no horses can pass through it. (that also applies to any other unit that is foolish enough to attack the formation. most units will rout by just seeing this formation :P)
oh and if youre on attack put the phalanx in like half a circle with archers in the middle for same effect. the rest of your cavalry at the edges of the circle, ready to flank those who tries to rear your phalanx formation or to flank the enemy troops once his formation is lost. aamof I think that cavalry aren't the stronger portion of the armies, but rather the heavy infantry, phalanxes and roman infantry.

[antisocialmunky]

*Onager*

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Phalanx defence should ideally be a square, or better still a triangle. A circle never gets proper intersection between the formation. On attack your phalanx should be a line so that when the enemy begins to wrap around you your cavalry have an easier time of it.

[Watchman]

A square still has its corners. That's where Napoleonic cavalry preferred trying to demolish infantry squares too. The problem is bigger with a triangle, as the flanks of the units at the extreme ends of the sides are even more starkly exposed.

Putting some suitable bunch of spearmen (or any heavy infantry really) inside each corner to block attempts to breach the formation will probably go a long way to prevent unpleasant "corner ruptures."

[antisocialmunky]

There's a reason why there aren't cubular snails.

[Watchman]

Besides Momma Nature having a fairly absolute hatred of 90 degree angles and flat surfaces ?

[Celt Centurion]

Like Dutch Guy, I prefer a balanced army of heavy and light infantry, archers, and both light and heavy cavalry. Sometimes though, I have to win or lose a battle entirely with cavalry, and I intend to win.

Examples are when I sally out against a besieging army, and as soon as I start battle, they all move out of range of my archers.

I counter by sending my infantry out the gate facing them and cavalry, usually heavy on one side, and light on the other. When in BI, you will notice that the Barbarians like to sit back from a distance and shoot at your infantry with cavalry archers. Obviously, the infantry cannot catch up with them unless they stop somewhere to shoot, (which sometimes they do) so that is where the light cavalry comes in, as they tend to move faster than heavy cavalry.

I prefer the heavy cavalry to break up the infantry formations, thus using both heavy and light. The heavy cavalry are also good for backup once the light cavalry has the cavalry archers "Held down." Light catches them, heavy cuts them up.

As for the "horde" armies in BI though, keep in mind that those fellows are armed with little better than chared poles for spears and leather armour. I see very few horde armies with even "orange" grade armour and weapons.

If they should get into a city with a foundry, and get out there with "silver" grade, or even worse, "gold" grade armour and weapons, you will find routing them to be much more difficult.

I was moving a reinforcing army, 1 heavy cavalry, and two spear with "orange" armour toward a besieged city, and they could not quite make it in one turn. There was a "neutral" hun horde army close by, so I hoped for the best. On their turn, the Huns attacked them. The Captain in the Cavalry unit routed when overwhelmed but the spearmen formed into one large Schiltron formation, and actually held out routing the entire Hun army. By the time it was over, I had less than a third of what I started with and got back about 30 or so cavalry. I do believe that had the Captain not routed, there would have been a "man of the hour" event. I also believe that had the Huns been equipped with the same armour I had, or if my units did not have the armour, there would have been a disaster. Fortunately, when my turn came up again, the besieger was gone, and I moved them on in and retrained them, and recruited more. Massilia is now solid, and the greatest threat now is a revolt, but presently the happiness level is good.

Strength and Honor

Celt Centurion

[antisocialmunky]

The schiltrom is round, that's why :-p

[Cras]

I started a new campaign as the sassanids, tiued the cavalry thingie again!

their light camal cavalry sucks!!

:(

[The historian]

Firstly i don't think cavalry is overpowered it's just that the ai is to dum to mount a proper defence try to flank a human and then tell me how it went.
Indeed against the ai you can break with some efort almost any army.
In my recent campaign as the dacians i defeated massive phalanx and armored phalanx army with barbarian cav and barbarian noble cav plus generals.
I usually split a phalanx or 2 from the main formation and strike'em both from front and rear with a cav unit.First i destroy any supporting troops the phalanx have so as to lower their morale and if possible go for the general first,then simple hoplites and then armoured.
It's very time consuming but it works.Haven't faced spartan's yet but i'm kind of thinking to abandon the campaign as even though i killled 10's of thounsand's of them i'cant manage to take their cities since always when i manage to siege a city(ussualy with a big garrison) i'm attcaked by at least one full stack of phalanx's and naturally i take losses and have to pull back my few armies.I'haven't got an empire yet so i don't have enough money for more.I'm in sort of in a stalemate. Any suggestions?

[Cras]

got an empire yet so i don't have enough money for more.I'm in sort of in a stalemate. Any suggestions?

eh? cheat? add_money 20000?

[Cras]

playing the sassanids now.. made 3 all cavalry armies there too....

even more devestating, they can shoot arrows as well. Works wonders on fleeing enemies :-)