Flags at half staff fo King's wife?

[Devastatin Dave]

I'm walking into work this morning and I see the flags at half staff. I'm thinking, "Man, who died?". Well i ask a passerby and he said, "It's for Colletta, Corretta, you know, King's wife". I was like, "You're ****ing kidding me".
Look, its sad she dies, after all she stuck by her man when he was doing the marches and the white women, but flags at half staff for her? I'm all about kissing black ass for a month and pretending to be sorry for what my forefather's did, even though its a bunch of crap, I never owned a slave. Anyway, could someone explain to me why we have the flags at half staff for the wife of King? Would we put the flag at half staff if a former President's wife dies? I don't think we have. I'd prefer to put the flag at half staff for all those poor people that died in that ferry accident in Egypt, i believe that would be more deserving for mourning and respect. King's wife just doesn't measure up. Could someone explain to me where I'm wrong on this? Looks like Bush is trying to score some political points with blacks. :wall:

[KukriKhan]

Would we put the flag at half staff if a former President's wife dies?

We did for Jackie O/Kennedy. And the Pope. And bunches of other folks. My workplace puts the flag at half-staff about a third of the time.

Simple respect.

[Devastatin Dave]

Simple respect sure, but if you do it for every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has remote celebrity status it looses its significance. My question is why is it not flown for the 1000's of pilgrims that dies in the ferry and instead flown for someone's only contribution to the world was living off the name of a womanizing civil rights activist?

[rory_20_uk]

Because to do so is a lot cheaper than most other plans that black activists are pushing for.

Flags at half mast, or try to sort out intter cities? Tough one that... :laugh4:

~:smoking:

[solypsist]

is this another one of those threads where everybody is just going to bash dead people?

[Ronin]

is this another one of those threads where everybody is just going to bash dead people?

well...they do put up the least amount of struggle. ~;p

[rory_20_uk]

I find that a bit harsh. I was hoping that we could go beyond the "who" into the "why". One could argue that it is obvious, but then that goes for most things, doesn't it?

~:smoking:

[Tachikaze]

I feel the other way. I wouldn't display the flag at half-mast for anyone. It discriminates. I believe it flies in the face of egalitarianism. There will always be a line drawn between those that are so recognized and those who aren't. I say make no official separation.

[Don Corleone]

Based on Tachi's post immediately above, I know I'm on the right track. I didn't want to disagree with Brother Dave in so public a fashion, but if by doing so, I draw yet one more line of distinction between the distinguished Marxist from California and myself, I'm all for it.

Personally, I say anybody who spent as much time working for equality and improving the lot of others in life as Mrs. King deserves a little recognition for a life well lived.

[Devastatin Dave]

Based on Tachi's post immediately above, I know I'm on the right track. I didn't want to disagree with Brother Dave in so public a fashion, but if by doing so, I draw yet one more line of distinction between the distinguished Marxist from California and myself, I'm all for it.

Personally, I say anybody who spent as much time working for equality and improving the lot of others in life as Mrs. King deserves a little recognition for a life well lived.
And that's the answer i was looking for. Thank you Don and I am now taking your opinion with much consideration...:bow:

[Devastatin Dave]

Well, they've turned this into a Paul Wellstone Democrat political rally. I knew this would happen. One guy even got up and said something to the effect of, "There were no weapons of mass destruction!!!". Unbelievable.:furious3:

[Papewaio]

Dev Dav and the seniors convention... with Doctor on standby in case of heart attack. Just noting who has been posting, Senior members, mods and Dr Rory.

As for half mast... if the person touched the lives in a positive manner of those who lowered the flag then I'm all for it.

[Xiahou]

Well, they've turned this into a Paul Wellstone Democrat political rally. I knew this would happen. One guy even got up and said something to the effect of, "There were no weapons of mass destruction!!!". Unbelievable.:furious3:
Yeah, I saw that too. It's sad- Carter and Clinton had to engage in race baiting as well. Carter in dragging out Katrina as evidence of racism and Clinton by saying that the county was full of rich whites (the 2nd most in the country). What the hell does that mean?

[rory_20_uk]

I am sure that some politicians have wistfully hoped that some figure would die at the right time so they can reiterate whatever political message they've got in front of the coffin - and then be shocked if anyone dares say that they are making a political point.

I hope that the focus remains on Mrs King, and flag or no flag the politicians leave the family alone to grieve in peace.

Any particular reason for noting who'se posting, Pape?

~:smoking:

[Major Robert Dump]

I was under the impression that the order to fly at half mast has to come from the president or the governor, am I right or wrong about this?

[Watchman]

...
...uh, are you saying it can't be done without the go-ahead from above ? :inquisitive:

[Proletariat]

Yes, Watchman. He's asking if he's correct in thinking that if anyone here in the US dares to raise a flag half staff without the written permission of the POTUS or the Governor of the state, they better be willing to pay the price (execution).

[Major Robert Dump]

My question isn't really meant as anything more than a question

I was wondering because I had this issue at work once where some folks flew the flag at half staff because the son of the owner died; I told the them that is was rather tacky to do it without it coming from the president or the governor, and I went outside and raised the flag to the chagrin of the others.

[Proletariat]

When is it permitted to half-staff the U.S. flag?

Only the president of the United States or the governor of the state may order the flag to be at half-staff to honor the death of a national or state figure. Unfortunately, many city, business and organization leaders are half-staffing the flag upon the death of an employee or member. Instead, it is suggested to half-staff (if on a separate pole) the city, business or organizational flag. The federal flag code does not prohibit this type of half-staffing.

http://www.gettysburgflag.com/FlyFlagHalfMast.html

Guess you were right, MRD.

[Watchman]

Yeesh. And I thought those 1500s pig-sales decrees haunting remote and rarely visited pages of *our* legal code were somewhat absurd...

[Proletariat]

Erm, it's not illegal or anything, just a tradition.

[Watchman]

Sure didn't sound like it.
:shrug:
But it's your flag anyway. None of my beeswax.

Out of curiosity, did the late Mrs. King do something particularly noteworthy or just general "good stuff" ? I'd guessed the connection to the long-late Martin inside ten seconds of seeing the name, but she's otherwise a total white zone in my map.

[Major Robert Dump]

A total white zone? That's an interesting way to refer to her........

She did a lot of civil rights work and raised her kids proper in the face turmoil and personal loss. Not going to argue whether or not half staff was deserving, but if Strom Thrumond got it maybe she should too.......

[Watchman]

A total white zone? That's an interesting way to refer to her........I kinda like the irony. Besides, the alternative was "Here There Be Dragons".

...Strom Who ? :help:

[Devastatin Dave]

but if Strom Thrumond got it maybe she should too.......
Now that hit home...

Mods please lock this thread, I am ashamed of myself for what I've said about Mrs King and she is much deserved of this honor, especially if that bastard Strom had this honor for his racist ass....

[Papewaio]

Any particular reason for noting who'se posting, Pape?

~:smoking:

A potential powder keg and it didn't explode made me review who is posting... I was looking at future senior member nominations... I missed oppourtunity to lobby for a few good ones in the last round because I didn't keep a running list of people, so I am now noting people for next time.

[solypsist]

Well, they've turned this into a Paul Wellstone Democrat political rally. I knew this would happen. One guy even got up and said something to the effect of, "There were no weapons of mass destruction!!!". Unbelievable.:furious3:

So, politicians politicised the funeral of a woman heavily involved in political movements? Naaaaaaaaaaaaah, can't be.

[Incongruous]

I know, absurd isn't it?
You would have at least thought them to posess common decency...
Well better start planning the assasination of Ronald Macdonald.
Hah politicise that!

[Major Robert Dump]

I kinda like the irony. Besides, the alternative was "Here There Be Dragons".

...Strom Who ? :help:


Strom Thurmond was a career US Congressman who did just about everything he could to stymie civil rights in the 70s. He was still in office at a ripe old age (something like 137 i believe) and borderline senile yet somehow managed to keep getting elected

before he died i seem to recall him having a ceremony where he said he was handing the reins over to "the younger folks" and the guy who replaced him was like 78 or something lol

And before he died, an illigitimate, half black half white love child came forward and told the story about how this negro hater didn't quite hate negros enough to keep him from having premarital sex with and impregnating his black house servant when he was in college,
of course he and his white family denied at first until she published letters and proof that he had been providing her (her=the child) subtle, medoicre financial support part of her life.
And the black house servant? she died a painful death of a common, curable cancer. Strom Thurmond, not a class act.

[rory_20_uk]

Sadly the best way to be seen to live a good life is to die. Suddenly all your sins are forgiven en masse, and it's a brave person who draws attention to what the person was really like. I imagine as the people at the top have an eye to their own demise and how they'd also like to be venerated.

In the UK I felt particularly bad about the death of Mother Theresa. Nothing really hit the papers or the news as Dianna, Princess of Wales a.k.a. The People's Princess etc etc had died.

If Dianna had the intelligence to compare her part time charity efforts of ones that were extremely "safe" compared to the largely Mother Theresa she might have blushed. But then one who coldheartedly ditched over half of the charities she was head of when she divorced Prince Charles isn't one given to remorse in any case.

No, she wasn't a bad person, merely in most ways a very average person who came from an exceptionally spoilt background. I am only being harsh in response to the extremely mawky display that was out in place when she died. I hope that Mrs King was more deserving of national grief.

~:smoking:

[Watchman]

Ah. So that's Strom Thrumond. The whole illegitimate child thing acutally made it to the newspapers over here, so now that you mention it it starts ringing some bells.

[solypsist]

Awwwww....Pity the poor conservatives who hate being reminded that they’ve been on the wrong side of every civil rights struggle in our nation’s history. And in case there’s any doubt about whether these sentiments were in line with the beliefs of Mrs. King, here’s part of an interview she gave shortly before the Iraq war began :

BLITZER: Mrs. King, thank you so much for joining us. Let’s talk a little bit about the legacy of your husband. How much has the racial situation in our country improved since his death, if you believe, indeed, it has?

KING: Yes, I think it certainly has improved tremendously, but we still have much more to be done. Martin defined the evils and the injustices in our society in three areas — poverty, racism and war. And he said that we cannot solve one problem without solving the other, working to solve the other one. And I think we have remnants of all of those. We’ve made some small progress in some areas more than others, but we still very much have poverty. We still very much have racism. And we still very much have a threat of war.
. . .
BLITZER: You raised the issue earlier of war. Where do you think [your husband] would come down on the whole issue of possibly going to war with Iraq?

KING: You know, my husband always believed that there should be peaceful negotiations, and he believed in nonviolence. He was committed to it totally, and he believed that conflict should be handled through the United Nations, so strength in the United Nations, and let the United Nations take the leadership. And I believe that Martin would, if he were [alive] today — although I don’t normally speak for him, but I know what he was saying at the time of his death — is that war cannot serve any lasting good toward bringing about peace. If you use weapons of war to bring about peace, you’re going to have more war and destruction. You cannot have peaceful means — peaceful means will have to be used to bring about peaceful ends. If you use destructive means, you’re going to bring about destructive ends.

While civil rights heroes like the Kings were leading a non-violent struggle for equality, your political heroes were finding new ways to court southern racists away from the Democratic party.



Well, they've turned this into a Paul Wellstone Democrat political rally. I knew this would happen. One guy even got up and said something to the effect of, "There were no weapons of mass destruction!!!". Unbelievable.:furious3:

[Xiahou]

Awwwww....Pity the poor conservatives who hate being reminded that they’ve been on the wrong side of every civil rights struggle in our nation’s history.

[I]While civil rights heroes like the Kings were leading a non-violent struggle for equality, your political heroes were finding new ways to court southern racists away from the Democratic party.
Wow, that's just so sad. :no:

[Devastatin Dave]

Awwwww....Pity the poor conservatives who hate being reminded that they’ve been on the wrong side of every civil rights struggle in our nation’s history. And in case there’s any doubt about whether these sentiments were in line with the beliefs of Mrs. King, here’s part of an interview she gave shortly before the Iraq war began :

BLITZER: Mrs. King, thank you so much for joining us. Let’s talk a little bit about the legacy of your husband. How much has the racial situation in our country improved since his death, if you believe, indeed, it has?

KING: Yes, I think it certainly has improved tremendously, but we still have much more to be done. Martin defined the evils and the injustices in our society in three areas — poverty, racism and war. And he said that we cannot solve one problem without solving the other, working to solve the other one. And I think we have remnants of all of those. We’ve made some small progress in some areas more than others, but we still very much have poverty. We still very much have racism. And we still very much have a threat of war.
. . .
BLITZER: You raised the issue earlier of war. Where do you think [your husband] would come down on the whole issue of possibly going to war with Iraq?

KING: You know, my husband always believed that there should be peaceful negotiations, and he believed in nonviolence. He was committed to it totally, and he believed that conflict should be handled through the United Nations, so strength in the United Nations, and let the United Nations take the leadership. And I believe that Martin would, if he were [alive] today — although I don’t normally speak for him, but I know what he was saying at the time of his death — is that war cannot serve any lasting good toward bringing about peace. If you use weapons of war to bring about peace, you’re going to have more war and destruction. You cannot have peaceful means — peaceful means will have to be used to bring about peaceful ends. If you use destructive means, you’re going to bring about destructive ends.

While civil rights heroes like the Kings were leading a non-violent struggle for equality, your political heroes were finding new ways to court southern racists away from the Democratic party.

Hey Soly, do me a favor, instead of jumping around tiptoeing and trying to do something subtile, just call me a racist. That would save you all the time wasted on quoting and trying to be cute. Just call me a racist. I don't need the hints. Thanks...:bow:

[rory_20_uk]

Not that I can think of one myself, but I can see how one could have a hero who also happens to be a racist. Many great men were also womanisers; although this is not something to applaud, I don't feel that it should detract from the differences that they made.

I believe that Cecil Rhodes was a great British subject - but I readily admit he is far from perfect and would be locked up if he tried those tricks these days.

Come on guys... ~:grouphug:

~:smoking:

[Watchman]

You don't need to be a "great man" to be a womanizer. Money and/or power tends to be quite enough.

"He looked quite dashing with his pockets on," as one of those old British authors put it. :eyebrows:

[Papewaio]

How many people here are actually take 100% the ethics of a party's platform?

None.

Why not?

Because even within parties there are different beliefs and ethic sets. There are hard right, hard left and moderates etc.

So instead of assuming that a person is behind every part of the entire platform of a party over a period of decades, and that platfrom in itself will have contradictory stances at different times... and sometimes at the same convention,... lets actually look at what the people themselves believe.

By painting someones beliefs based on their religion, race or creed, with such a broad brush that we assume the worst (which would include preffered party) we only assume a prejudiced stance ourselves.

It is not the hardcore never change their attitudes voters that change the world. It is the ones willing to talk and communicate differences of opinion and then vote... often referred to as fence sitters, these are the very ones breaking down boundaries and also the demographic that politicians will pork barrel the most to sway.

Charity of thought is a decent thing to do.

[Gawain of Orkeny]

All I can say is the democrats have no shame.

[Beirut]

Dev Dave,

If I may I jump in where I'm not wanted - was that a spelling mistake in your title or a "play on the language"?

[Watchman]

All I can say is the democrats have no shame.And Republicans only pretend to. :martass:

[Gawain of Orkeny]

And Republicans only pretend to

The republicans behaved themselves at the funeral. It was a disgusting display of partisn politics . I thought they were there to honor the woman .

[Don Corleone]

Hmmm, this seems to be an all too common theme for me these days, the complete inability to follow threads...

Let me see if I have this one down:

-Dave asked an honest question if it was appropriate to honor Mrs. King with flags at half staff.

-A discussion ensued over whether or not it was appropriate.

-Dave concluded that she should be honored and felt a bit sheepish for asking the question in the first place.

-Dave, Xiahou and a few others noted that the funeral was turned into a political Bush-bash, even though the President made it a point to come, and that as this was supposed to be a funeral for a historical figure and therefore inappropriate?

-Soly decides to up the ante by introducing his view that all conservatives are rascist and supposedly supports that view with an interview conducted between Wolf Blizter and Mrs King.

Just want to make certain I'm getting it all here.

[rory_20_uk]

"Best say nothing and people think you are stupid, rather than speak and for people to know you are..."

~:smoking:

[Devastatin Dave]

Dev Dave,

If I may I jump in where I'm not wanted - was that a spelling mistake in your title or a "play on the language"?
It was a spelling mistake, could you fix it for me? I don't think Soly will do it for me because I'm a racist and all.:laugh4:

[Major Robert Dump]

The entire thing was setup. If Bush didn't go he would be criticized, and loudmouths saw this as their chance to blabber to a captive audience. At least at the Wellstone funeral attendance was "voluntary" so to speak.

I wish more Republicans would die so we could see if the same thing happened (kidding).

That funeral really needed to God Hates Fags people to show up so the Democrats would look LESS bad