Space Strategy Game

[Divinus Arma]

Okay guys. Help me out here.

Consider the following titles as a point of reference:

Freelancer,
Hegemonia,
Homeworld 2,
X2: The threat,
Eve online


Do you see the similarities? I want an involved high quality space strategy game that combines economic management, diplomacy, fleet battles, trade, visuals, planetary relevance, manufacturing, and etc, all in one game.


I loved the feel of freelancer. Fun, but too narrow in that you can only pilot one ship.

I love the idea of hegemonia. Heroes? Planetary seiges? Cool! Poorly implemented.

I love the giant fleet battles of homeworld 2, but ultimately too limited with no economic management at all. Also, very little control. And no ability to expand.

X2: The threat. I thought I had finally found teh perfect game. I had mutliple complimentary factories and little trade ships zipping around everywhere. Just when it started to get good those dman unbeatbale aliens come in and ruin in for everyone. WTF?

Eve online: Too slow. Snore. Couldn't get into it. I liked it for a month and then... I fell asleep.


So, any ideas here folks?

[Kraxis]

Heh... I'm not even sure if there are any game of your preference, in fact I would have loved to play one such game.

But if you liked Homeworld 2, I suggest trying the old Homeworld.
Sure it is far outdated now, but it is far better balanced, in that corvettes and fighters are much stronger. You need them to survive, you can't just build the big ones and push through.
Think in terms of gameplay Homeworld 2, just better (I wonder how that can be).

The story of course is simply breathtaking, but that is another matter.

[Reverend Joe]

I have the perfect game for you. Unfortunately, it exists only in my head, and odds are, it shall forever remain there.

If it's good strategy you're looking for, I would go with "Master of Orion 2." Then again, I'll bet you already have this one... but it's just so damn good! So far, I have not played another space strategy game equalling it, although Galactic Civilisations 2 will probably at least level off.

[Zenicetus]

Woof... that's a lot of different game concepts. I think the best current game that lets you actually fly a ship (as well as control fleets of ships), and also includes an economic component, is X3. Nobody else is doing this right now. See my mini-review in the X3 thread here, for why I bailed out after just a few months. I don't regret spending the money, and if nothing else, it does look really nice if you have the hardware to support it. It just didn't seem to go anywhere or have much of a goal, after I got to the point where I had a fleet of capital ships. As a sandbox game it has a problem with the endgame, since it's not really based on conquering territory.

The best pure strategy space sim I've played is the new Galactic Civilizations 2. It's loads of fun, but there is no tactical combat at all. You build your empire, place your fleets stragically, and watch the battles without any personal interaction. I thought I'd miss that level, but the strategy and diplomacy are so interesting that I'm still having a lot of fun with it.

Get GalCiv2 for the "big picture" game, or get X3 if you'd rather jump into the cockpit while you're building an empire.

And get Independence War 2, if you want the best cockpit-level space sim ever made (but with no real economic/strategy component). It's just linear missions.

[Divinus Arma]

The problem with both MoO2 and GC2 is that I can't fly the damn ships.

Played freelancer yet? I like to sit in the ockpit and buzz around in a giant battle. But I also want to do this with giant starcruisers surrounded by an assortment of ships to aid. And anyway, MO2 is just, so, just blah. Yay. Let's look at menu options for five hours straight, Gah. And GC2 jsut looks... unsophisticated.


I want to fly in a solar system and orbit planets in my lone ship. I want no background article to be too far away and just visual. In both freelancer and X2, every star and planet is accessible with time. Although in X2, you cnnot land on a planet, in freelancer you can.

*Sigh*


Maybe CA will create a new engine just for this. The concpet would actually work, with family members, planets and colonies instead of cities, and the campaing map could be a 3D starchart. But, of course, the game would have to be semi-realtime throughout. Which would get interesting.

Imagine... Starting the game with your little fighter, just recruited out of a space flight military academy.... or starting by taking over your fathers little trading business.... Or acting as a dignitary for your government on a diplomatic mission to a neighboring planet...

In the end, your characters become generals, powerful corporate leaders, or governmental authorities... But even better, as they progress, you attain additional characters who also progress in different ways... a career ladder with VnV. Post managers in your factories. Assign field grade commanders to manage a fleet division in battle... expand and Manage your empire...

Start by exploring new territories, colonizing them, and running into neighboring "factions" that hold their own colonis and planets...

War erupts. Take your small fleet into skirmishes- You control the character involved... order formations, order specific manuevers, delegate control...

Manage your cities, produce weapons of war or global improvements, unite local governments into global governments- global governments into interstellar governments...

And while I'm dreaming... land your infantry. Fight First person in epic land battles with hundreds or thousands of NPCs, control land craft, atmopsherically-restricted surface fighters... trikes, tanks, quads, turrets, strongholds.


It would be the ultimate game. I would pay $500 for a game with that much.

*sigh*

:Goes back to daydreaming:

[Divinus Arma]

Woof... that's a lot of different game concepts. I think the best current game that lets you actually fly a ship (as well as control fleets of ships), and also includes an economic component, is X3. Nobody else is doing this right now. See my mini-review in the X3 thread here, for why I bailed out after just a few months. I don't regret spending the money, and if nothing else, it does look really nice if you have the hardware to support it. It just didn't seem to go anywhere or have much of a goal, after I got to the point where I had a fleet of capital ships. As a sandbox game it has a problem with the endgame, since it's not really based on conquering territory.

The best pure strategy space sim I've played is the new Galactic Civilizations 2. It's loads of fun, but there is no tactical combat at all. You build your empire, place your fleets stragically, and watch the battles without any personal interaction. I thought I'd miss that level, but the strategy and diplomacy are so interesting that I'm still having a lot of fun with it.

Get GalCiv2 for the "big picture" game, or get X3 if you'd rather jump into the cockpit while you're building an empire.

And get Independence War 2, if you want the best cockpit-level space sim ever made (but with no real economic/strategy component). It's just linear missions.

X3 huh? Didn't know it existed. Did you play X2? If so, do you remember how the game basically stopped with the invasion of the turdy little alien race that is completely unstoppable and quickly destroys everything you took hours and hours to build?!?!?!? YAARARAGAHGAHARAHGAH!!!!!

I'm assuming, hoping rather, that X3 does not have this, hmmh?

[Nikpalj]

How about trying out the Battlecruiser series, if you can live with the bugs, that is... it's pretty strategic like when you get a few pirates teleporting aboard your cruiser and you have to manage your security personnel (over a rather spreadsheat like interface) around the various decks of your ship and try intercepting them before they damage your systems or kill any of your crew...

Working with the various galaxy route-plotting maps, managing different aspects of your ship, trading, fighting, if you get attacked if you want just jump into one of your own fighters and dogfight it out with the opposition... there's so much going on in this game but it's pretty hard to learn - something like Europa Universalis of space sims...

[The_Doctor]

Star Trek: Starfleet Command 2.:2thumbsup:

[GoreBag]

Star Trek: Starfleet Command 2.:2thumbsup:

I'll second that. Unfortunately, the manufacturing bit isn't there, but it sure is cool.

I'm still having a blast with GalCiv II, though..

[TinCow]

I do not have the game that meets your requirements, but I do have one that meets some of them. Escape Velocity: Nova. This is the third in a series from Ambrosia and was originally only for Mac until it was ported a few years ago. Think of it as a 2D top down version of Freelancer (I personally think it's far better than Freelancer, even though it's a good 5+ years old now).

[BelgradeWar]

Hmm, this Escape Velocity seems interesting...I'll give it a try...can't be bothered with something as grand as GalCiv 2, because CK and Victoria are coming too...not to mention the Rome campaign in RTR...

[ChaosLord]

Divinus Arma, have you played some of the mods for Freelancer? Many allow controlling capitol ships as well as adding tons of new ships/weapons/etc... and improving the AI. Check www.lancersreactor.com for mods, and for big battles surrounded by allies check around and find a good pvp server for Freelancer. There some good modded ones out there.

I'd also recommend Independence War 2 for a great space combat engine, and of course the FreeSpace series. Also for the scale your talking about you might want to try Conquest: Frontier Wars. Its an RTS centered around space combat. You control planets and mine resource fields, but it allows combat over multiple systems. So you can secure one system and move onto the next in the same map and continue the fight against the enemy. In addition to this the game is pretty hard, I still haven't managed to beat it.

That is an older game though, so it might not be up to your level of visual standards and theres also no diplomacy involved. More recently theres Star Wars: Empire at War. Which involves developing planets, grand scale(conquering an entire galaxy), space combat and land combat. All that combined with excellant visuals. It is an RTS though, so no piloting individual ships or anything.

Aside from those there is one you could try. Its not a space sim but it is a sim. Mechwarrior 4: Mercenaries lets you control your own mercenary mechwarrior unit choosing which missions to take and customizing your mechs. While dated visually it really is quite fun to control a big mech and experiment with various customization options. It also allows you to pick sides in the ongoing war or try and keep your mercenaries neutral in the conflict.

[Crandaeolon]

Space Rangers 2 is another one that might fit the bill. It has most of the ingredients of a space epic, such as warring factions, technological development, trading, space and ground combat, heroes and villains, etc. But, none of the aspects are very deep, and the player can affect some of the things only indirectly.

For example, the player can provide the funds for a military operation, but alliance command will dictate the where and when. The player can participate of course, and even give limited commands to the battle group, but mostly the ships will do their own thing. And so will everyone else; probably the best selling point of the game is that the universe feels quite alive.

I do consider it one of the best games of last year, but I'm willing to bet that some will regard individual aspects of the game too shallow or simply not like cross-genre games like this. It also doesn't take itself seriously, so you'll need a sense of humour too. ~;)

[TinCow]

Here's the Escape Velocity: Nova website. You download the game from there, they don't sell it in stores.

http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/evn/

You can play without paying up to a certain point, so go ahead and and try it out for free to see if you like it.

The game also has a very large number of fan-made mods.

A few screenshots:
http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/evn/images/battle.jpg
http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/evn/images/shipyards.jpg
http://curmudgeongamer.com/images/articles/20030916095120945_2_original.jpg

[Crandaeolon]

Come to think of it, Escape Velocity and SR2 probably have a lot in common. Here's a quick Googled link: http://www.octopusoverlords.com/frontpage/node/29

It's a SR2 review, but it has some stuff about both games.

[Phatose]

Wow. You want a lot. Sounds like MoO2 with homeworld battles. If you find it let me know, been looking for a game like that for a while.

[BelgradeWar]

Here's the Escape Velocity: Nova website. You download the game from there, they don't sell it in stores.

http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/evn/

You can play without paying up to a certain point, so go ahead and and try it out for free to see if you like it.

The game also has a very large number of fan-made mods.




Ok, thanks.

[BelgradeWar]

Ok, I've got the game...full version...I started it, started the tutorial, but after some things done, I accidentally jettisoned the cargo and the tutorial-guy with it:)

Never mind, I've got the grip of the game, it isn't that complicated, I just want to know is there any plot-line, and if there is how do I start it? For now, I just go around transporting passengers and mining asteroids...

[TinCow]

Yep, there are actually many different plot lines. They all start under various circumstances and from various planets or stations. You can even jump back and forth between a few of them depending on the choices you make. IIRC these are all of the main plotlines in the game:

Vell-Os
Federation
Rebellion
Polaris
Aurura
Pirates

There are also minor plotlines with the Wild Geese and the Bounty Hunters along with a ton of side quests. Each main quest allows you to eventually get a unique powerful ship not otherwise available in the game. I always found the Pirate and Polaris plotlines to be the most fun. The big Polaris ships are without a doubt the most powerful.

If you want to figure out how to start a specific plotline, you can look here:
http://www.ev-nova.net/walkthrough/

However, I had a lot of fun the first time just flying around getting better ships and fighting pirates. Eventually you will stumble on a plotline and off you'll go.

[Divinus Arma]

If we have "space wars", don't you think by then that much of it will be artificially controlled?


BTW, thanks for all the suggestions thus far. Keep 'em comin'. :2thumbsup: