View Full Version : Is this dishounarable?
cannon_fodder
04-13-2006, 11:50
Just wanted to hear your opinion on this. I joined a 3v3 game (vanilla RTW 1.5), with the combatants being a certain clan (mentioning no names) vs. 3 other people. Clearly, the clan members were likely to be more skilled than the normal players (and it was true, we were all beginners to intermediate). But then the clan members chose the Roman factions. I thought this to be dishonourable, as the Roman factions are incredibly easy to win with online, and my team already had the handicap of being less experienced. What do you think?
Well you see there is this faction match up thing, so the clan may have actually just used their knowledge to pick Romans. For more info and faction choosing visit a guide I did, it's on the clan I'm am ins website. http://www.leohonorius.com/whichfaction.htm (sort clue you in on it, but it's for BI)
So what factions did you have?
You can probably beat rome (well you can in bi) with factions who possess units with "effective vs armour". Barbar factions have it BI, perhaps same for vanilla I'm not sure. But in 1.5 Rome are really overpowered, I believe BI to be a more balanced game for multiplayer.
So to be honest as they're a clan they probably'd have teamspeak, ventrillo or some other communication that already puts them at a great advantage in team games, three Romes arn't really neccessary and whilst it may be the right decision, it wasn't a tourney game so little point really lol. Three Romes, pretty boring but I guess if they wanna win..
To sum up (lol), not really dishonoruble, just plain boring to be honest. Did you tell them you where new?
Also, I'm a curious guy, mind PMing me the name of the clan? I won't post it here or anywere else, I'd just quite like to know :)
FearofNC
04-13-2006, 12:21
in some ways yes... although i would personally classify it as childish.. taking weaker armies or providing a map with a nice hill is a good way to act with honor.. if they are just die hard rome fans... using less denari also works... however clans today lack the honor of old times... so your report is not shocking... its the norm...
honor cannot come from wearing a clan name... nor from a graphic like the coh.. true honor is earned from your peers after displaying it time and time again. those of us with honor will always look down upon those without... and those without honor will always try to earn it the wrong way.
cannon_fodder
04-13-2006, 12:40
Monarch,
Because I knew it was something of a "snowball's chance in hell" thing, I chose a barbarian faction (Dacia, or something similar) just for fun. I think one ally chose the Greeks, and the other also chose a barbarian faction. But this was after the clan members had joined and claimed most of the Roman factions, and I was the first non-affiliated player to join the game. By the way, my usual choice is out of Macedon, Greek Cities, or Egypt.
Yes, our team let theirs know about our experience. Didn't seem to have any effect on them though. If you're interested in the outcome of the battle, their team achieved a roughly 2 to 1 kill ratio over ours.
FearofNC,
Your mention of hills brings something else to mind. They chose "grassy flatland".
Monarch,
Because I knew it was something of a "snowball's chance in hell" thing, I chose a barbarian faction (Dacia, or something similar) just for fun. I think one ally chose the Greeks, and the other also chose a barbarian faction. But this was after the clan members had joined and claimed most of the Roman factions, and I was the first non-affiliated player to join the game. By the way, my usual choice is out of Macedon, Greek Cities, or Egypt.
Yes, our team let theirs know about our experience. Didn't seem to have any effect on them though. If you're interested in the outcome of the battle, their team achieved a roughly 2 to 1 kill ratio over ours.
FearofNC,
Your mention of hills brings something else to mind. They chose "grassy flatland".
Ah now you see I do have an objection to their actions more now. I thought they had chosen all Julii, but taking all the Romans so you guys can only play one Rome is a little rude.
x-dANGEr
04-13-2006, 14:33
Oh my god.. You can't judge a clan because 3 members of it chose a faction you think is too strong or a map you think it is not fair.. Who are you to judge them by those acts? You still had a 4th roman faction to use, and of course, through experience comes skill. So IMO, no, those actions surely show no dishonor. If I'm in a 3 on 3 with Romans, vs 3 'unknown (Non familiar) players', I really wouldn't care if they were new or not, both ways I want to train my certain tactic with my team mates, if they express their frustration of me being rome, I will gladly change my faction, otherwise not.
@NC: Sorry for today's game man, it's just that Nortun popped up in the wrong time, I apologize if I caused you any in-convenience.
cannon_fodder
04-14-2006, 15:05
Who said anything about judging this clan? The topic title is "Is this dishonourable?" in reference to what the clan members did. It's not like now I'll never play a game with that clan's members. I just wanted to know the opinion of the rest of the TW community.
Anyway, it annoyed me because it seemed pretty clear that the clan just wanted to win. Not gain experience (fighting noobs with weak factions), not have fun, not have a challenge, just win. Seemed a bit... pathetic.
Oh, and I don't think there's anything wrong with their choice of map, I thought nothing of it at the time. People play on that map all the time.
x-dANGEr
04-14-2006, 15:57
I'm sure they wanted to win, and improve their tactics in that faction. Well yea I can keep playing Numidia all the time, but when a tourney comes, will I gain much from it?
t1master
04-14-2006, 15:58
clannies should lean towards the disadvantage when playing three clannies vs three unknown or new players.. although there are some vets who like to play undercover.
give them a hill, more money, take a weaker faction... some of the best games involve overcoming huge obstacles, not steam rolling with uber factions.
x-dANGEr
04-14-2006, 15:59
But all that has got nothing to do with 'honur', at least IMO.
clannies should lean towards the disadvantage when playing three clannies vs three unknown or new players.. although there are some vets who like to play undercover.
give them a hill, more money, take a weaker faction... some of the best games involve overcoming huge obstacles, not steam rolling with uber factions.
Ye, and then wait for the noobs to start boasting about how they beat you...
When I'm playing a 1v1 with somebody I don't know to be good I will probably go for a faction that is at a disadvantage vs the faction randomer has picked (IE. if he's alemanni I go WRE, sine his axemen are good vs me) but only if it's a serious nooby.
BHCWarman88
04-15-2006, 03:27
I never Treat Noobs Nice. Nice,yeah,but in Game, I give them Hell
Proper Gander
04-15-2006, 08:47
to the OP, if you're interested in fair and fun games, go here. http://s10.invisionfree.com/FORUMITES/index.php?act=idx
anybody else is welcome too of course.
it's a small and friendly community who play RTW MP together or against strangers to enjoy it. not to make up for the obvious lack of masculinity or success in life by having the feeling of being superior for once.
some of those guys are very good. so good in fact that they sometimes play 2vs3, using the same budget as the 3 strangers, to make it challenge.... they still mostly win. heh
.
some of those guys are very good. so good in fact that they sometimes play 2vs3, using the same budget as the 3 strangers, to make it challenge.... they still mostly win. heh
Yes but they will get more money and thus better upgrades, so it's not as hard as it sounds :)
Proper Gander
04-15-2006, 10:05
Yes but they will get more money and thus better upgrades, so it's not as hard as it sounds :)
you completely misunderstood. they only use 66% of the budget they have. IE they use the same amount of money as the other 3 for their armies.
they don't use the extra money they have...
NihilisticCow
04-15-2006, 12:34
That's what we used to do, 2v3's, 2v4's, 3v4's, 3v5's where everyone's army only costs 12.5k (so we wouldn't spend all our money)... It's not though as hard as it sounds, as it generally involves co-ordinated rushing, which random players can't always deal with. It does though make the games more challenging which was the objective.
x-dANGEr
04-15-2006, 13:31
It really isn't that tough at all *me thinks*. Just a chain route and you're done with it :P
you completely misunderstood. they only use 66% of the budget they have. IE they use the same amount of money as the other 3 for their armies.
they don't use the extra money they have...
Oh ok, no need to be so snappy :)
But anyway, if you've got good communication like Ventrillo or Teamspeak vs a couple of randomers whose interteam communication will consist of "hi, any plans?" "nope, il see what happens" :P, you already have a huge advantage.
PS. Cow, I'm still amazed at that mod RTK did in that 3v3 yesterday, making rebels playable. Any guide? I know I think it was Dinadin in game told us how but I was so busy chosing units to remember what he said :oops:
NihilisticCow
04-15-2006, 14:35
If you want to allow rebels to be played online, you just go to the bi/data folder, open descr_sm_factions.txt find the slave faction and set custom_battle_availability to yes. It appears that it's only needed for the host of a game to set this for the rebels to be selected and played online. Whether you really should make it playable is another thing, as they pretty much have all the units in the game, so tend to just have an extra "no rebels" rule... ~;)
x-dANGEr
04-15-2006, 14:42
Yes but they're fun to play with. Dozen kinds of peasents, what's cooler :D
NihilisticCow
04-15-2006, 14:47
Yes but they're fun to play with. Dozen kinds of peasents, what's cooler :D
Of course, so you can peasant spam while still sticking to max 6 of a unit. :grin3:
OK in my opinion if clan allow on max 1 same fraction and choose 3 romes at the beginning - it's proof of weakness and of course lack of honor.
Especially on 1.6 when rome is far too strong.
Alexanderofmacedon
04-15-2006, 16:13
I don't know. You see many clans have different ways of fighting. I use a phalanx and cavalry, but this particular clan may use the style of the Romans. It's possible that their specialty is the Roman factions and if they used any other no matter how good they were, they would lose. I for one will almost always choose Macedonia or Greece.
If you want to allow rebels to be played online, you just go to the bi/data folder, open descr_sm_factions.txt find the slave faction and set custom_battle_availability to yes. It appears that it's only needed for the host of a game to set this for the rebels to be selected and played online. Whether you really should make it playable is another thing, as they pretty much have all the units in the game, so tend to just have an extra "no rebels" rule... ~;)
Thanks it worked :D
And I'll probably always have a no rebels rule apart from the fun interclan games where we just mess about usually with berbers and r-brits :P Rebels fit that perfecty :P
If you want to allow rebels to be played online, you just go to the bi/data folder, open descr_sm_factions.txt find the slave faction and set custom_battle_availability to yes. It appears that it's only needed for the host of a game to set this for the rebels to be selected and played online. Whether you really should make it playable is another thing, as they pretty much have all the units in the game, so tend to just have an extra "no rebels" rule... ~;)
Nice one cow mate :)
Ahh and worst dishonor for me is when someone is inventing new army and then choosing rules perfect for it. If someone do things like that i really like kicking his "back part of body"
King Edward
04-26-2006, 20:43
I always play to win but if its me and 2 other RTK's against randoms we always try and pick the more random factions or try strange unit combos. for example last week Dagonet Cow and myself played 3 randoms and spammed shieldwall units (Still within the 6 max rule of course :p) just to see what would happen. (we won but was a very close run thing and a very enjoyable game!)
This may come across as arrogant which isnt my intent but there is no point 3 experianced clan players going out and 'pwning nOObz' just for the sake of it!
In aswer to the question in the title of this thread, i'd say yes it is pretty dishonorable to play randoms and take all the rome factions. IMHO.....
x-dANGEr
04-27-2006, 11:49
Tell me about your crazy ideas Flintoff.. Last game I had with you (The trial), it was a HA spam game, too active if you ask me, and has nothing to do with boredom :)
NihilisticCow
04-27-2006, 14:31
Tell me about your crazy ideas Flintoff.. Last game I had with you (The trial), it was a HA spam game, too active if you ask me, and has nothing to do with boredom :)
lol, that wasn't so great an idea (I blame Dag). ~;)
I always play to win but if its me and 2 other RTK's against randoms we always try and pick the more random factions or try strange unit combos. for example last week Dagonet Cow and myself played 3 randoms and spammed shieldwall units (Still within the 6 max rule of course :p) just to see what would happen. (we won but was a very close run thing and a very enjoyable game!)
This may come across as arrogant which isnt my intent but there is no point 3 experianced clan players going out and 'pwning nOObz' just for the sake of it!
In aswer to the question in the title of this thread, i'd say yes it is pretty dishonorable to play randoms and take all the rome factions. IMHO.....
Lol nice one. Last week, me, Foxx and Tomi all went Huns and cav spammed, sticking to max 6 same units but we never play with a max cav rule, so we could only have so many decent cav and then we had some crummy light stuff too. We basically took the guys out one at a time, and 2 of them being newbies they didn't help each other. So far so good. However then we got to the last remaining guy we had taking a beating against a the second guy (not a newbie, from BRO iirc) our depleted cav moved on. However as we where taking them 1 by 1 we hadn't yet looked at that guys army (lol I know, but..). Then came the bad news. All spears and cav, with one first cohort comistanses for good measure. The spears owned us and we suffured a close defeat.
Good fun though :P
BHCWarman88
04-27-2006, 16:55
Ahh and worst dishonor for me is when someone is inventing new army and then choosing rules perfect for it. If someone do things like that i really like kicking his "back part of body"
Yes
Look at em for Example
Sassdian Army on BI,88K, No Art,Hilly or Flatland,and those two are good maps for my army. my army only needs 17950 Denarii,but you know I never play below 15K unless it a Tournment or if I don't feel like it.
I hate when "noobs" and regulars and even a few vetreans alike all Berserkers on RTW or BI with Germania/Celts.
on RTW, I got 8 spearmen,3 eles,3 Cats,2 Chariots,4 legionares. if someone spamm all Berserks at 25K, my Seleciud army needs 24990, so I won't have any money for upgrades.but if they spam all zerks with little or no upgrades,they usally lose cuz I manage to have them run into my spears, but my Legions,cav,eles and chariots usally get killed,escally on 88K.
on BI,If I play 18K, berserkers get better on me, I have no Spearts. I have 4 Slughidan Warriors,4 Levy Spearmen,3 Cats,2 Clib,3 Ele,2 Desert Archers,1 Slinger,1 Kurdilish Javelinmen
18K or 88K, my army usally has a heck of a time trying to fight off all Berserkers. I usally lose half my inf,my eles,and most of my cav, only things that can save me is my archers (unless they use 1 or 2 units of cav and 18-19 units of zerks) and/or my Eles (they do good 99.8% of the time,thank you big boys)
but yeah,I am tending to like 15K more on RTW then BI,cuz I not used to BI much,even though I had it since the second day it came out..
NihilisticCow
04-27-2006, 18:17
I very much doubt any "veteran" players go all berserkers, as it is so easy to defeat it's untrue. All you need to do is wait for them to go berserk and use a cavalry unit to keep the beserkers running around in circles after it while you shoot them with archers. You can quite easily win without taking a single casualty.
BHCWarman88
04-27-2006, 19:25
I very much doubt any "veteran" players go all berserkers, as it is so easy to defeat it's untrue. All you need to do is wait for them to go berserk and use a cavalry unit to keep the beserkers running around in circles after it while you shoot them with archers. You can quite easily win without taking a single casualty.
well yeah,that what I was saying that if I am playing on Warman Death Field on BI,they go up my steep hill,y I have my archers move to the flanks as my guys charge down,and fire ahead and wipe them out, I do loose sometimes for a odd reson or two.
Hunter KIng George
04-27-2006, 19:25
Lol nice one. Last week, me, Foxx and Tomi all went Huns and cav spammed, sticking to max 6 same units but we never play with a max cav rule, so we could only have so many decent cav and then we had some crummy light stuff too. We basically took the guys out one at a time, and 2 of them being newbies they didn't help each other. So far so good. However then we got to the last remaining guy we had taking a beating against a the second guy (not a newbie, from BRO iirc) our depleted cav moved on. However as we where taking them 1 by 1 we hadn't yet looked at that guys army (lol I know, but..). Then came the bad news. All spears and cav, with one first cohort comistanses for good measure. The spears owned us and we suffured a close defeat.
Good fun though :P
Just to show, even defeats can be fun and enjoyable. :2thumbsup:
BHCWarman88
04-27-2006, 19:36
Yes Sir we :-) :-)
lol
WHOOOOOO
8
Just to show, even defeats can be fun and enjoyable. :2thumbsup:
Hell ye!
Mainly in that one because it was pure experimental and funny. Also I find it fun if I'm just pipped in a nice long strategic battle. One where I'm up against somebody of similar ability to me and the battle actually lasts longer than 5 minutes. Havn't had one of them in a while though :wall:
x-dANGEr
04-28-2006, 08:22
Hell ye!
Mainly in that one because it was pure experimental and funny. Also I find it fun if I'm just pipped in a nice long strategic battle. One where I'm up against somebody of similar ability to me and the battle actually lasts longer than 5 minutes. Havn't had one of them in a while though :wall:
Lyer.. My last game with you had lasted a long bit. (When my ally broke a rule and wrecked havoc :D )
Lyer.. My last game with you had lasted a long bit. (When my ally broke a rule and wrecked havoc :D )
Ye that lasted long because you and you're ally had loads of HAs which are an absolute bitch to kill :wall: (we allowed canta)
x-dANGEr
04-29-2006, 12:21
Just 4 of them for me, and my ally didn't use CC except at the end :D
BHCWarman88
04-29-2006, 16:36
I had a few good 1v1's monts ago, now I get sucky games will ocssionaly "OK" games
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