"Racist" Humor [Archive]

Alexanderofmacedon

04-18-2006, 01:58

If they're your friends or they know you're joking, I think it's a BS answer to all your problems. If you don't understand what I mean...

Say you're having a bad day (like I did today) and a Jewish friend of mine does something stupid/annoying, when I'm quite tired. I just looked at him for a while and said "Dirty Jew". He laughed, I laughed and we all went about our business...

As for Taffy: I'm half Indian...lay some of those spice jokes on me!:2thumbsup:

If you can't make fun of yourself, you're just not any fun in my opinion. If you defend yourself every time you get made fun of, you'll go insane.:dizzy2:

Strike For The South

04-18-2006, 02:09

We have a jewish guy at our school. We call him Jew:laugh4: and its funny. In 7th grade IIRC there was a rather ugly incdent with a mormon child but I wasnt really part of that.

KukriKhan

04-18-2006, 02:23

SFTS: "...its all in the delivry...

And I add: "It's all in the environment". Dave Chappelle, a professional comedian making a race joke, in a comedy club where people expect, and have paid, for him to be outrageous, is one thing.

And like SFTS says: 'delivery'... that paying customer (including cable subscribers) can see his facial expressions and body language, and take into consideration the 'entertainment' venue.

Repeating such material on an internet text-based forum, lacks that delivery and environment.

The posts above speak of times when, in real-life some race joke was made, understood to be harmless by the hearer/see-er of the joke, because they could see the face and body language signalling lack of intent to offend, and therefore, all offense was forgiven.

That environment, and those signals, don't exist here. We have members and guests, and readers from every continent except Antarctica, and many of those eyeballs would not understand, or would understandably mis-interpret a joke easily understood as harmless in San Antonio or New York or Los Angeles.

I apologize for the long-windedness in this post. I thought it seemed time to answer the "Can I tell Race Jokes here?" question, before anyone got the urge. Short version:

"Can I?". No.

"Can I link to a race joke video on the 'net, that I found?" Yes. If you describe it as such. And only the link... we hold posters accountable for all content within their posts - even if Robin Williams, or Dave Chappelle, or Louis Farrakkan originally said it. We don't hold you accountable for forum-rules-violating content on some other website, if you have labelled it/warned readers, as such.

Alexanderofmacedon

04-18-2006, 03:01

That environment, and those signals, don't exist here. We have members and guests, and readers from every continent except Antarctica, and many of those eyeballs would not understand, or would understandably mis-interpret a joke easily understood as harmless in San Antonio or New York or Los Angeles.

I apologize for the long-windedness in this post. I thought it seemed time to answer the "Can I tell Race Jokes here?" question, before anyone got the urge. Short version:

"Can I?". No.

I agree. It's quite annoying when people don't understand jokes (rascial or non-rascial) because of this barrier. I'm sure many wouldn't take offence, but there are those who would, and I can't blame you. I wasn't planning on any rascist comments, by the way...

Strike For The South

04-18-2006, 03:04

Dearset Kurki I was not going to post anything of the sort (well maybe if the disscusion evoled) I wanted to see peoples opinon from real life :bow:

KukriKhan

04-18-2006, 03:08

I know guys. Thanks. :bow:

I just wanted to be clear about org policy.

Fascinating discussion. Please continue.

Kanamori

04-18-2006, 03:42

Keep it with friends, and directed at friends who know you're joking, and it will be nothing more than good fun. Even in those circumstances though, they can still be quite tasteless; user discretion I guess, and that's why I think it should be kept among friends that understand that you are only joking. Did I mention they should know it's a joke?

Lemur

04-18-2006, 03:47

Faust|

04-18-2006, 04:53

I think a lto of it comes down to whether you're coming from a place of respect or disrespect. You can make wonderful jokes about race, sexuality, religion, etc., but there's something really un-funny about a guy who hates blacks making black jokes, or a person who hates gays making gay jokes.

If you're coming at it from a basis of understanding, it's hard to go wrong. Kindness makes all the difference. I know it sounds weird, but it's true.

I would basically agree. For someone with any aesthetic sense, this humor is only funny when the deliverer is speaking from a rostrum of social equality. In more ancient times a disrespectful deliverer could be as entertaining as those "chimp-parodies" of the 50's, but those times are long gone. Even someone who does not believe in the equality mentioned above must agree with this.

yesdachi

04-18-2006, 05:35

Racist humor isn't funny. Ethnic humor can be, that mind of mencia show is pretty funny.
I just finished watching an episode. He is very funny, I think it is because he keeps his punches just barely above the belt and doesn’t discriminate about who he makes fun of. :2thumbsup:

Alexanderofmacedon

04-18-2006, 05:41

I just finished watching an episode. He is very funny, I think it is because he keeps his punches just barely above the belt and doesn’t discriminate about who he makes fun of. :2thumbsup:

And he makes fun of himself, which makes it all round fun, instead of bigotry.:2thumbsup:

Banquo's Ghost

04-18-2006, 07:19

Those two jokes are not ones I would tell in a public setting, because you never know who knows if you are joking, or who might think you are a racist pigheaded son of a submariner.

But you just did post them in a public setting, despite KukriKhan's eloquent advice. :no:

This thread should be erased and locked immediately.

Faust|

04-18-2006, 07:38

Ah, I thought they were more insightful than offensive.

Duke of Gloucester

04-18-2006, 09:42

With a really good friend who knows that you respect them, any comments about their race or any other atributes will be taken in the spirit that they are meant. However in any other circumstance, they should, just as good manners, be avoided because they may cause offence.

Ser Clegane

04-18-2006, 11:58

In case it hasn't been noticed I repeat it:

I thought it seemed time to answer the "Can I tell Race Jokes here?" question, before anyone got the urge. Short version:

"Can I?". No.

This thread raises a valid question for general discussion (even if the org has a clear policy regarding how the answer looks for this board) - however, the next times I see somebody using this thread just to load off some of his/her favourite racist jokes, this thread will be closed (in addition to the usual individual response to forum rule "violators")

Thanks for your attention

InsaneApache

04-18-2006, 12:10

Racist humour is not funny.

English assassin

04-18-2006, 12:36

I second IA.

Why is it not funny? Because its lazy and untrue.

By "racist" I take we are meaning some joke that depends on a characteristic thought to be shared by people of a certain race, eg (to keep things nice) that Asians are hard working.

The basic trouble is that the stereotypes aren't true, not for everyone anyway. They use someone of a particular race as a symbol for what the joke is really about, like hard working nerdy kids, or men with large penises (that's englishman jokes, obviously.) So why laugh at them. The humour isn't accurately lampooning something in the real world, and its not totally off the wall and absurd, it inhabits a no-man's land signposted Pointless.

Whether we ought to object to something just because its not funny is another matter. Amongst friends you can say what you like (though personally I winced at the idea that pointing out that someone is a Jew could be funny). People of a certain race can, if they wish, tell jokes about themselves, or anyway if they can't its for other people of the same race to tell them so (you want to do Jewish jokes? Be Jewish). But IMHO a lot of racist jokes work by asking you to buy into some derogatory stereotype about someone different to yourself and laugh along with your WASP/black/whatever buddies. Or, if they don't work like that for you, are you sure they won't work like that for someone else.

So, no, not funny, as a rule.

Taffy_is_a_Taff

04-18-2006, 13:06

Leet Eriksson

04-18-2006, 13:30

I voted the first, you guys should check out the org irc channel when SFTS is on, i think at one time my jaws even hurt becuase of all the funny ethnic jokes he made.

English assassin

04-18-2006, 14:13

"Why is it not funny? Because its lazy and untrue."

but, that's why it is funny. When I ask my Jewish buddy about how many Palestinian children he has tortured today or how his secret plan to oppress and destroy the white working class is going, well, when I say that crap to him, I really don't expect him to reply with "well, 17 mini ragheads and my plan is going well", no, I expect him to say something charming about gentiles in reply. I'd be horrified if my accussation were found to be true.

Well, like I said, what two friends say to each other is between them. The humour isn't that you think jews kill children, the humour is that you can say something offensive to your mate but because he's your mate its OK. In fact the humour depends on the fact that the joke would otherwise be unacceptable.

Devastatin Dave

04-18-2006, 14:46

Obviously it is only funny if the person telling the racist joke is not white. If a white person tells a racist joke then its just plain racism. If a black comedian base their entire career on racism, then its "art" or "talent". All you have to do is watch Mind of Mancia or any Chappelle episode and imagine if a white comedian said those things.
GAH!!!

The Blind King of Bohemia

04-18-2006, 14:59

I am not a politically correct person and i believe it to be the language of cowards. I am all the better for it, i will laugh at most things, some times you just can't help yourself. The sickest jokes are always the funniest anyway

One of chubby's jokes of "As the Jewish Paedophile said Go easy on them sweets son", you just can't help but laugh. Some people just takes things to heart too much. Life shouldn't be that way, its too short to moan about something that just isn't important, if you don't like the comdey just switch over and as for the people who go and get offended they should know by rumour what these comedians are like before they watch them

People go at Chubby Brown for being racist, sexist and everything else but the fact of the matter is that he is hilarious. Sometimes white comedians will get itno trouble about racist material but are you telling me black comedians don't tell racist jokes? That chris Rock tells plenty of racist jokes about white people and the majority are very offensive for some. I don't take heed because he's not funny and has no talent so it doesn't get under my skin so i don't see if a white fella says jokes about black people what the difference is. A joke is a joke and shouldn't be taken seriously anyway

Dutch_guy

04-18-2006, 15:44

I voted the first, you guys should check out the org irc channel when SFTS is on, i think at one time my jaws even hurt becuase of all the funny ethnic jokes he made.

Seconded.

:balloon2:

Weebeast

04-18-2006, 15:49

Why is it not funny? Because its lazy and untrue.
So if you're gay and I pull a gay joke you'd be laughing?

Obviously it is only funny if the person telling the racist joke is not white. If a white person tells a racist joke then its just plain racism.
ROFL

Alexanderofmacedon

04-18-2006, 15:59

English assassin

04-18-2006, 16:38

Why is it not funny? Because its lazy and untrue.

So if you're gay and I pull a gay joke you'd be laughing?

I don't understand.

My point is, any joke that relies on a stereotype is not funny because its making fun of something that isn't true, eg all Jewish people are mean or what have you. So if your gay joke depended on me thinking, yeah, that's funny because all gay guys are really into interior design and cooking quiches, its not going to be funny, because I'm going to be thinking, but what about all the other gay guys who don't act like that.

A joke that begins "This gay guy walks into a bar in Texas..." is predicated on the listener having assumptions about what gay guys (and Texans) do in bars. Which bear no resemblance to the real world, where gay guys drink pints and Texans do cross-stitch. So its not funny.

Alexanderofmacedon

04-18-2006, 16:41

I don't understand.

My point is, any joke that relies on a stereotype is not funny because its making fun of something that isn't true, eg all Jewish people are mean or what have you. So if your gay joke depended on me thinking, yeah, that's funny because all gay guys are really into interior design and cooking quiches, its not going to be funny, because I'm going to be thinking, but what about all the other gay guys who don't act like that.

A joke that begins "This gay guy walks into a bar in Texas..." is predicated on the listener having assumptions about what gay guys (and Texans) do in bars. Which bear no resemblance to the real world, where gay guys drink pints and Texans do cross-stitch. So its not funny.

Oh, now I see what you mean. :book:

Weebeast

04-18-2006, 18:25

My point is, any joke that relies on a stereotype is not funny because its making fun of something that isn't true, eg all Jewish people are mean or what have you. So if your gay joke depended on me thinking, yeah, that's funny because all gay guys are really into interior design and cooking quiches, its not going to be funny, because I'm going to be thinking, but what about all the other gay guys who don't act like that.

A joke that begins "This gay guy walks into a bar in Texas..." is predicated on the listener having assumptions about what gay guys (and Texans) do in bars. Which bear no resemblance to the real world, where gay guys drink pints and Texans do cross-stitch. So its not funny.

Well, in this case I think you need to relax a little bit. Not a single blond I know stares at juice cartons but when someone asks me, "why do blondes stare at juice cartons," and answers, "because it says concentrate" I would be laughing because ...well the punchline is funny. Of course, not all blondes are stupid or ditzy but it's out of the question already.

yesdachi

04-18-2006, 19:22

My point is, any joke that relies on a stereotype is not funny because its making fun of something that isn't true,
Almost all stereotypes are based in truth and reality. The percentage of the group that is being stereotyped that actually does whatever it is that is being stereotyped may be low but it is still significant or visible enough to have generated an across the board label or reputation for being a certain way. Not all two year olds are terrible but enough of them are to get a reputation for the way they act. Pick a stereotype and follow it thru, I cant think of a common stereotype that doesn’t have at least some truth to it.

Don Corleone

04-18-2006, 20:01

Jokes based on stereotypes aren't the same thing as 'racist' jokes.

There's an important distinction between being a bigot and being a racist that I think you should all consider.

A bigot is Archie Bunker. Benighted, rather crass and callous, ignorant, forms opinions based on stereotypes. At the end of the day though, he doesn't actually believe in keeping slaves and he wouldn't tolerate anybody mistreating Lamont (the Jeffersons' son).

A racist is David Duke. He actually puts the sheets on and works actively to put people, even people he knows in an inferior place and keep them there.

Bigotry comes from ignorance, and a large part fear of the unknown. Racism comes from hatred and an evil soul and the desire to subjugate others.

The point in all of this? The problem with white people using the "N" word isn't simply that it's offensive. (I'll use two of my own ethnicities, so as to not offend other target groups) It's not equivalent to calling somebody a mick or a guinnea. These terms are offensive and are guaranteed to get a reaction out of Irish and Italian people, respectively.

The "N" word is strictly speaking, not an ethnic insult. It's not the same as (forgive me Big John) calling somebody a spook. Because the "N" word was used for centuries, in a non-insulting way. People used it to describe property. You can go back to pre Civil War documents, such as wills, and see "Zechariah H. Hodgepodge bequeaths on his eldest son, Jeremiah: 3 mules, 2 acres of land, and 10 "N".) When non-black people use the N word, black people hear it as though you're referring to THEM as property. They use it among themselves in an effort to desensitive the word, but in reality, I think it's in poor form and Quincy Jones & Bill Cosby seem to agree with me.

That being said, what you described in your opening statement SFTS, I would describe as ethnic humor, or bigotry, not outright racism. Racism implies a goal of maintaining the superior status of one race over the others. If you told a bunch of hispanic jokes in your workplace, where everyone was white except for one Mexican, and you all looked at him and laughed at him while you told the jokes, that would be racist. If you're all redneckin it up, calling each other spic and gringo, hey, that's just being a guy.

Tachikaze

04-18-2006, 20:22

Any kind of joke can be funny, due to clever use of language, unexpected twists, etc. But I would rather find commonality in people, rather than reinforce their differences.

Devastatin Dave

04-19-2006, 05:18

Zalmoxis

04-19-2006, 07:58

I'm more into stereotype jokes than anything else. If anyone's seen the Latin Kings of Comnedy stand up with one of them (can't remember the name) said he wouldn't mind if you would call a crayon "lazy brown" :can't hold a job black" or "can't drive for **** yellow", and yes, these can be very racist, but that's just humor.

LeftEyeNine

04-19-2006, 15:06

I'm against anything "just humor". They cause subconscious discrimination, believe it or not. And subconscious is to be revealed somehow.

Something interestingly related to how the West looks upon Muhammed charicatures.

Fragony

04-19-2006, 15:10

I'm against anything "just humor". They cause subconscious discrimination, believe it or not. And subconscious is to be revealed somehow.

You are only made a fool off when you think you are one yourselve.

LeftEyeNine

04-19-2006, 17:38

You are only made a fool off when you think you are one yourselve.

Equal points with whom I accused of making such jokes.

By the way, very creative way of finding excuses. Great talent. :2thumbsup:

Goofball

04-19-2006, 18:18

This reminds me of my ebonics episode I played in the Backroom a couple of months ago. I got warnings not because I was speaking ebonics, but speaking ebonics and being white. Its a double standard, but its one that will continue as long as the overly sensitive pc drama queens continue to have way to much influence in our lives.:no:

But surely Dave, we can find some middle ground between "sensitive PC drama queens" and guys who think jokes that start with "two ni***rs walk into a bar..." are the pinacle of good comedy?

I agree with what was said earlier. Racist jokes, by their very nature, are hateful and not funny.

Ethnic humor, on the other hand, can be very funny.

Devastatin Dave

04-19-2006, 20:50

But surely Dave, we can find some middle ground between "sensitive PC drama queens" and guys who think jokes that start with "two ni***rs walk into a bar..." are the pinacle of good comedy?

.
I don't use the n-word, thank you very much. Besides its a Rabbi and a preist that walks into a bar, get it right drama queen!!!:laugh4:

Goofball

04-19-2006, 21:02

I don't use the n-word, thank you very much. Besides its a Rabbi and a preist that walks into a bar, get it right drama queen!!!:laugh4:

We drama queens never get anything right. We're far to busy trying to keep left...

:hippie:

Fragony

04-21-2006, 09:56

By the way, very creative way of finding excuses. Great talent. :2thumbsup:

It's a superior thing ~;)

Avicenna

04-21-2006, 19:30

I would basically agree. For someone with any aesthetic sense, this humor is only funny when the deliverer is speaking from a rostrum of social equality. In more ancient times a disrespectful deliverer could be as entertaining as those "chimp-parodies" of the 50's, but those times are long gone. Even someone who does not believe in the equality mentioned above must agree with this.

The fifties hardly count as ancient do they? In ancient times they probably wouldn't have been that racist as well, seeing how people went all over the place and Alexander wanting to create an empire where there was no racial difference, completely contrasting Hitler's ideas.

Faust|

04-21-2006, 22:11

The fifties hardly count as ancient do they? In ancient times they probably wouldn't have been that racist as well, seeing how people went all over the place and Alexander wanting to create an empire where there was no racial difference, completely contrasting Hitler's ideas.

It has nothing to do with the 50's except that that is when the chimp parodies occurred. In other words, I'm speculating that "racist" humor in the ancient world would have been similar to, or had the same cultural purpose as, our mocking of chimps violation of "normal" behavior.

Philippus Flavius Homovallumus

04-22-2006, 19:15

I think observational ethnic humour is very funny, harsh offensive racist humour isn't.

InsaneApache

04-22-2006, 20:06

I think observational ethnic humour is very funny, harsh offensive racist humour isn't.

Pray tell me, what is the differrence? Show some examples.

Strike For The South

04-22-2006, 20:34

Pray tell me, what is the differrence? Show some examples.

I understand what hes saying. Something along the lines as asians cant drive or whitey cant jump are acceptble while there are some that go to far and are extremely offensive.

InsaneApache

04-22-2006, 20:52

Why can't Asians drive, or whitey jump? :inquisitive:

Strike For The South

04-22-2006, 20:53

Why can't Asians drive, or whitey jump? :inquisitive:

They are stereotypes which usually not condsidered very offensive (note the saying themselves arent the joke) I beleive he was talking about honest racial offensive humor

InsaneApache

04-22-2006, 20:55

Honest racial humour! Sorry I don't get the joke.:wall:

BigTex

04-22-2006, 20:58

Pray tell me, what is the differrence? Show some examples.

A black guy and a mexican are both riding in a car, who's driving?

The cop.

Strike For The South

04-22-2006, 20:59

I meant offensive horrible type as in 'honest to god offensive racil humor" There are much worse sterotypes and jokes out there that could hurt some feelings or promote rage. Whitey cant jump and asians cant drive are just 2 "tame" examples.

John86

04-22-2006, 23:07

We have a jewish guy at our school. We call him Jew:laugh4: and its funny. In 7th grade IIRC there was a rather ugly incdent with a mormon child but I wasnt really part of that.

I feel bad for the two black kids in our school. One is called "Carlton" and the other "Bubba" (I admit, I started the Carlton one, but it was by mistake :p)

But yes, I use racist jokes all the time.

Alexanderofmacedon

04-22-2006, 23:41

I feel bad for the two black kids in our school. One is called "Carlton" and the other "Bubba" (I admit, I started the Carlton one, but it was by mistake :p)

But yes, I use racist jokes all the time.

You only have two black kids at your school? We only had two before Catrina, but now we have about ten. Not being rascist, just stating a fact:sweatdrop:

John86

04-23-2006, 01:20

You only have two black kids at your school? We only had two before Catrina, but now we have about ten. Not being rascist, just stating a fact:sweatdrop:

Yes only two, at least in my grade.

By the way, if anyone was wondering:
Carlton was a character on the show Fresh Prince of Bel-Air. He was black, but acted extremely white.

yesdachi

04-23-2006, 22:29

I feel bad for the two black kids in our school.
There were only 2 black kids in my high school at the time of my graduation. But I did go to a very small school in the middle of the country.

Hummm, both were good at basketball too. Like I said before, stereotypes with roots in reality. ~D

Shawn_MacDonald

04-24-2006, 03:23

Meh at times I find humor like that funny but I usually try not to go too far cause I tend to respect other peoples cultures highly (unless they disrespect me in that case Iignore them). Ethenic steriotype humor can be funny at times though.

Devastatin Dave

04-24-2006, 18:11

A black guy and a mexican are both riding in a car, who's driving?

The cop.
Unfortunately it not only funny but 9 times out of 10, the truth...

KafirChobee

04-24-2006, 19:25

Racist humor isn't funny. Ethnic humor can be, that mind of mencia show is pretty funny.
Taffy asked, "What's the difference?" And many attempted and gave good examples and arguements.

Racist:
Q: When does a Blackman become a "N"?
A: When he leaves the room.

This, imo, is racist and inappropriate in todays world.

Ethnic:
Jewish boy to Father: Daddy, Daddy can I have $5 bucks for a guinea pig?
Father: Here's $20 bucks, go get yourself a nice Irish girl.

Crass, but not particularly racial (unless you're Italian and insulted by the difference in monitary worth or value given the girls .... though the boy just wanted a pet).

Racial jokes are meant to be demeaning, an effort to place one race as superior to another. Where as, ethnic jokes make jabs (mostly playful, but can be biting as well) at others ... even themselves (own race).

Making fun of anothers race is racist. period. It is not meant to be humorous, as much as it is meant to place one's own superiority above the others.

Devastatin Dave

04-24-2006, 20:45

Remember not to use this thread as something to insert jokes like the mod requested. There's some good discussion going on. Please don't get it locked, thanks.

LeftEyeNine

04-24-2006, 21:00

Remember not to use this thread as something to insert jokes like the mod requested. There's some good discussion going on. Please don't get it locked, thanks.

Yes agreed. Even though you want to oppose the idea of the joke, please omit the jokes. Let us imagine ~:)

Sasaki Kojiro

04-24-2006, 21:04

Taffy asked, "What's the difference?" And many attempted and gave good examples and arguements.

Racist:
Q: When does a Blackman become a "N"?
A: When he leaves the room.

This, imo, is racist and inappropriate in todays world.

Ethnic:
Jewish boy to Father: Daddy, Daddy can I have $5 bucks for a guinea pig?
Father: Here's $20 bucks, go get yourself a nice Irish girl.

What's funny is I would label those the other way around. The first one is just a comment on white people to me.

Just goes to show.

Devastatin Dave

04-24-2006, 22:05

I thought a guinea was an Italian? Man, I got to brush up on my derogatory terminology.:laugh4:

John86

04-25-2006, 02:08

I thought a guinea was an Italian? Man, I got to brush up on my derogatory terminology.:laugh4:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ginny

Mispelling of guinea, derogatory slang for Italian

"Go 'head, now I'll kill you. You guinea brat you."
- Carlo in The Godfather

Goofball

04-25-2006, 23:50

Unfortunately it not only funny but 9 times out of 10, the truth...

How horrible. You must have extremely racist police in the U.S.

yesdachi

04-26-2006, 00:24

How horrible. You must have extremely racist police in the U.S.
Probably but we might also have a high percentage of minorities committing crimes.

Goofball

04-26-2006, 00:45

Probably but we might also have a high percentage of minorities committing crimes.

That's due to economics, note genetics.

yesdachi

04-26-2006, 00:48

That's due to economics, not genetics.
Or race.:wink:

Devastatin Dave

04-26-2006, 17:33

That's due to economics, note genetics.
Tell that to OJ and the large percentage of black professional athletes that are rich beyond any imagination but still can't seem to stay out of trouble with the law. I'm not saying its genetics it just strange how 10 % of the population can inflict the majority of crime in the United States. Are statistics racists? Is it the media? I don't know, all I know is blacks commit the most crime in the United States and that's just the way it is. Come visit me, I live outside of East St Louis and you can see how the "community" is using its government hand outs.

KukriKhan

04-26-2006, 17:41

Umm... which part of that would be the 'humor' part?

Goofball

04-26-2006, 18:13

Tell that to OJ and the large percentage of black professional athletes that are rich beyond any imagination but still can't seem to stay out of trouble with the law. I'm not saying its genetics it just strange how 10 % of the population can inflict the majority of crime in the United States. Are statistics racists? Is it the media? I don't know, all I know is blacks commit the most crime in the United States and that's just the way it is. Come visit me, I live outside of East St Louis and you can see how the "community" is using its government hand outs.

I want to make very sure that I understand you Dave, because we are entering a very sensitive area here. Are you saying that it is your belief that people of African descent are genetically more predisposed to criminal activity than white people?

BigTex

04-26-2006, 18:28

I want to make very sure that I understand you Dave, because we are entering a very sensitive area here. Are you saying that it is your belief that people of African descent are genetically more predisposed to criminal activity than white people?

I believe he is implying the Black culture is more predisposed to criminal activity. Whether you agree thats its the culture our genetics, he states facts. One should also note though that black people are statistically poorer, and statistics say the poorer you are the more likely you are to commit a crime. But I'm not saying it all has to do with economic problems, if you notice most rappers do not have the best criminal record in the world, and most black people idolize them. So I say its more of a culture/economic problem.

Sasaki Kojiro

04-26-2006, 18:57

Lots of white celebrities have criminal records :/

Goofball

04-26-2006, 19:11

Lots of white celebrities have criminal records :/

Exactly.

Dave, I'll see your O.J., and raise you a Robert Blake.

Devastatin Dave

04-26-2006, 19:23

Exactly.

Dave, I'll see your O.J., and raise you a Robert Blake.
And I'll raise you 1 Brian Williams and a Ricky Williams and throw in Michael Jackson even though he's not exactly human with all the surgery, much less a black man. No its not genetics but its the culture. Raise a white kid in the gangsta lifestyle and he'll act the same way. It just happens that black culture in the US glorifies crime. Is that a little clearer?

BigTex

04-26-2006, 19:24

Lots of white celebrities have criminal records :/

I'm not denying it, just trying to supply a reason for the statistics. There are many people with questionable backgrounds that are idolized, but hip-hop has brought that to a new level IMO.

Originally posted by Devastatin Dave
No its not genetics but its the culture. Raise a white kid in the gangsta lifestyle and he'll act the same way. It just happens that black culture in the US glorifies crime. Is that a little clearer?

Precisely, thank you DD. It has nothing to do with race, but culture, raise a child who glorifies crime and they'll grow up to be a criminal.

Sasaki Kojiro

04-26-2006, 20:16

I don't think black culture glorifies crime. Rappers aren't the be all and end all of black culture. You're going to have to explain that one a bit furthur.

Goofball

04-26-2006, 20:56

And I'll raise you 1 Brian Williams and a Ricky Williams and throw in Michael Jackson even though he's not exactly human with all the surgery, much less a black man. No its not genetics but its the culture. Raise a white kid in the gangsta lifestyle and he'll act the same way. It just happens that black culture in the US glorifies crime. Is that a little clearer?

Much clearer.

And it proves my point that the higher crime rate among African Americans is due to economics, not genetics. Hundreds of years of being first slaves, then second class citizens who were still abused, exploited, and held down by white people at almost every turn have led to a culture that does not have a lot of trust in the "rich old white guy" establishment and still believes to an extent that only by not playing by the rules can they get ahead.

Sorry, but it might take more than 20 or 30 years of not being held down because of skin color before the African American minority as a whole becomes more trusting and integrates fully into the system.

Taking another tack, and apropos of nothing whatsoever, it seems to me that Italian and Sicilian Americans are also responsible for a higher proportion of crime than their overall representation in the population would merit. And they too have cultivated an American subculture of not playing by the rules and taking what they want from life by whatever means necessary.

Why is it then, that we hear very little ire/frustration directed against them, compared to the same that (in threads like this, for example) is directed against African Americans?

Devastatin Dave

04-26-2006, 21:21

.

Why is it then, that we hear very little ire/frustration directed against them, compared to the same that (in threads like this, for example) is directed against African Americans?
Because statistically blacks commit the most crime in the US. When I'm in a dangerous area in town, I'm not looking over my shoulder for Tony Saprano, I'm looking for Tyrone who is statistically more likely to bach me over the head.
I'm just "keepin it real".
Sasaki, you would be very suprised at how much rap and other bad influences influence Blacks in the US. Go to any public school that the majority is black and survey the kids there what they want to be. I bet you all the gold "teef" in East St Louis that the majority either want to be a rapper or a professional basketball player and their dress, actions, and grades will reflect their desire. Sorry, its just the truth. Its a harsh stereotype but its to common to simply call it a racist statement. When successful blacks in the US is considered Uncle Tom's or kissing the Man's ass by their fellow black citizens, then the problem can't simply be explained away by the "400 years of oppression" crapola that is always brought up. I bet 30 years from now they are going to be blacks using Katrina as an excuse to their dependency on government handouts and blame whitey for their condition. It gets old. So that's the true humor in all of this; the fact that so much money in taxes are put into programs to benefit blacks, afirmative action that uses a quota system not based on the quality of the worker but the color of the workers skin, and all the while the myth of the Man holding the black man down is the greatest "racist" joke ever told by liberal poverty pimps that simply sue blacks as a voting block because they know that all they have to do is promise more "free" handouts. If it wasn't so nausiating, I would have a good gut laugh over it.:wall:

Goofball

04-26-2006, 21:51

Because statistically blacks commit the most crime in the US. When I'm in a dangerous area in town, I'm not looking over my shoulder for Tony Saprano, I'm looking for Tyrone who is statistically more likely to bach me over the head.
I'm just "keepin it real".
Sasaki, you would be very suprised at how much rap and other bad influences influence Blacks in the US. Go to any public school that the majority is black and survey the kids there what they want to be. I bet you all the gold "teef" in East St Louis that the majority either want to be a rapper or a professional basketball player and their dress, actions, and grades will reflect their desire.

And I also bet you all of the pointy white hoods with eyeholes cut in them south of the Mason-Dixon Line that most of the white kids in that same school would want to be rappers or basketball players if they could too.

But what would that matter anyway? Is it illegal to be a rapper or a basketball player?

Because statistically blacks commit the most crime in the US. When I'm in a dangerous area in town, I'm not looking over my shoulder for Tony Saprano, I'm looking for Tyrone who is statistically more likely to bach me over the head.
I'm just "keepin it real".
Sasaki, you would be very suprised at how much rap and other bad influences influence Blacks in the US. Go to any public school that the majority is black and survey the kids there what they want to be. I bet you all the gold "teef" in East St Louis that the majority either want to be a rapper or a professional basketball player and their dress, actions, and grades will reflect their desire. Sorry, its just the truth. Its a harsh stereotype but its to common to simply call it a racist statement.

That's where you're wrong.

You've filled this thread with anecdotal statements about how blacks are responsible for so many societal ills in America but supported those statements with nothing more than your own pet beliefs. This post in particular uses "I bets" and "you' be surprised's" to support further generalized statements about blacks as a whole.

But the greatest clue about your extreme ignorance on this topic is the fact that you refer to the "myth" of blacks being held down.

If you can't acknowledge the fact that blacks in America suffered hugely in the past, and continue to suffer now (though to a lesser extent) from oppression based on skin color, then it appears you have severe blinders on.

Your posts in this thread have embodied just about every reason why skin color will continue to be such a divider in the U.S. for a long time to come.

Sasaki Kojiro

04-26-2006, 22:10

Sasaki, you would be very suprised at how much rap and other bad influences influence Blacks in the US. Go to any public school that the majority is black...

I did ~:handball:

Well, 1 out of 3. I didn't see what you are describing.

Devastatin Dave

04-26-2006, 22:29

That's where you're wrong.

You've filled this thread with anecdotal statements about how blacks are responsible for so many societal ills in America but supported those statements with nothing more than your own pet beliefs. This post in particular uses "I bets" and "you' be surprised's" to support further generalized statements about blacks as a whole.

But the greatest clue about your extreme ignorance on this topic is the fact that you refer to the "myth" of blacks being held down.

If you can't acknowledge the fact that blacks in America suffered hugely in the past, and continue to suffer now (though to a lesser extent) from oppression based on skin color, then it appears you have severe blinders on.

Your posts in this thread have embodied just about every reason why skin color will continue to be such a divider in the U.S. for a long time to come.
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/race.htm

Goofball

04-26-2006, 22:59

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/race.htm

You're not getting it Dave. I am not arguing that blacks are not convicted of crime in the U.S. at a much higher rate than their proportional representation in the population. This is a reality I don't dispute.

Our differences of opinion are not in the "how much," but in the "why" blacks are being convicted of so much crime.

Devastatin Dave

04-26-2006, 23:11

You're not getting it Dave. I am not arguing that blacks are not convicted of crime in the U.S. at a much higher rate than their proportional representation in the population. This is a reality I don't dispute.

Our differences of opinion are not in the "how much," but in the "why" blacks are being convicted of so much crime.
Ok, now I understand. Well, I'm sure you will disagree with this but i believe the largest factor is personal responsibility. I'm sure that does not jive with your opinion which is basically to blame everyone except the individual, that tends to be the mindset of your arguements. But I will concede that there has been many injustices done to blacks in the past, but I don't understand how a legal immagrant from India can come here and within a generation he's successful and his kids are in college while a large portion of blacks continue to use the victimhood from "whitey" as an excuse for their poverty, criminal acts, etc.

Goofball

04-26-2006, 23:47

Ok, now I understand.

No, it's plain from the rest of your post that you don't.

Well, I'm sure you will disagree with this but i believe the largest factor is personal responsibility. I'm sure that does not jive with your opinion which is basically to blame everyone except the individual, that tends to be the mindset of your arguements.

Thanks for bringing Dorothy's empty-headed friend into the discussion, I wasn't sure if he was going to make it or not.

~;)

Contrary to the nonsensical viewpoint that you attempted to attribute to me, I believe that everybody is ultimately responsibly for their own decisions in life.

But having said that, there are sometimes circumstances in life that can "funnel" people into a downward spiral of bad decisions.

The problem is that hardcore lefties don't acknowledge the validity of the former, and hardcore righties don't acknowledge the existence of the latter.

Why don't we try to meet in the middle somewhere?

I am not saying the black kid who decides to sell crack is blameless. But I am also acknowledging that in many cases it may have seemed to that black kid like his choices were very limited. And the best way to lessen the chances of him making those bad decisions is to try to remove the circumstances that cause the funnel to come into being.

But I will concede that there has been many injustices done to blacks in the past, but I don't understand how a legal immagrant from India can come here and within a generation he's successful and his kids are in college

Because that immigrant from India was an immigrant, not an imported piece of property.

His/her ancestors didn't have to endure slavery, and oppression for four hundred years before they could open their own business.

while a large portion of blacks continue to use the victimhood from "whitey" as an excuse for their poverty, criminal acts, etc.

http://www.jointcenter.org/2004election/CBC-health-briefs/Crime+Brief.pdf

Hmmm. Average length of a white guy's jail sentence for a violent crime: a little over 6 and a half years. A black guy? Just under 8 and a half years. A white guy's sentence for a drug related crime? 5 years. A black guy? Over 8 and a half years. Overall average sentence length for a white guy: 3 years 9 months. A black guy? 7 years.

You're right Dave. There's no bias against African Americans in the system.

Whites oppressing blacks is a myth.

P.S. It's "jibe," not "jive." Ebonics on the brain, Dave?

:laugh4: