What s wrong with the Pope?

[Tony Furze]

I took Wallachia as part of my expansion (Spanish) after a Crusade. The Egyptians originally held it. After a while the Polish turn up next door and attack from Carpathia. The Polish,being Catholic, I waited for the excommunication of the Polish message from the Pope. None came.
After four years waiting, I invaded Wallachia to get it back. Instant message to get out in 2 years. Where was the Pope when the Poles invaded aCatholic neighbour?
TF

[UltraWar]

Is the Papacy allied to the Polish?
If so that could be why.

[Dutch_guy]

The pope will always side with the weaker catholic faction, meaning the smaller one.

So it means that even if you take a province back that was conquered by another catholic faction who just happens to be smaller than you, the pope will side for him. Even defensive wars aren't allowed.

:balloon2:

[UltraWar]

The pope will always side with the weaker catholic faction, meaning the smaller one.

So it means that even if you take a province back that was conquered by another catholic faction who just happens to be smaller than you, the pope will side for him. Even defensive wars aren't allowed.

:balloon2:

That must be why factions around me keep getting me excommunicated.

One way you could get away being excommunicated is to ally with the pope early on.

[Sensei Warrior]

It's been my experience that being allied to the Pope will not stop him from messing with my plans for world domination. I believe it solely has to do with the Pope backing the underdog or the smaller of the 2 countries. I also believe smaller meaning the actual number of Provinces not how "small" the country looks on the map.

[Ironside]

You'll get the warning if you do any offensive actions (sallying out from a besieged castle counts as an offensive action) if the catholic faction less than 50% (I think it was that size) of your size. On the positive side, the pope can only give out one warning at the time, so you'll get a carte blanche against any other catholic faction.

This will happen, no matter the stance with the pope.

[DukeofSerbia]

One way you could get away being excommunicated is to ally with the pope early on.

You can still be excommunicated even if you are ally with Pope. That's not important.

[LadyAnn]

Time to install a new Pope :) [when you got excom]

Annie

[Sensei Warrior]

Too true, LadyAnn. Any annoying edicts dictated by the Pope can be solved by the proper application of troops and/or assassins. He can't excomm you twice.

I personally prefer the Troop method, along with pillaging and burning, and finished by evacuation.

[Ciaran]

One thing is important to keep in mind: There is the Pope as in "the pope" and there is the Papacy faction of which the pope is the leader. Most of the time, but not always, they´re the same, but not when it comes to excommunication. For instance, alliance with the Papacy will not protect you from being excommunicated, but being at war with the Papacy doesnt always result in excommunication. It´s a bit schizophrenic, really.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

In my experience attacking the Papacy is instant excomunication, unless you already attacked someone else.

[Sensei Warrior]

You can attack the Papacy without getting excommed? Is that because of the Thing where the Pope can only track one infraction at a time.

[mfberg]

Take the province immediately, do not wait for a year to let the seige mature or bring up reinfocements. You have to invade with enough forces to force the Polish out or make a successful attack of the castle with those forces, and within a year be able to reinforce enough to frighten the Poles into not attacking again in the future. Even attacking into a Polish group sieging one of your castles is considered an attack.

mfberg

[Deus ret.]

On the positive side, the pope can only give out one warning at the time, so you'll get a carte blanche against any other catholic faction.

? I made the opposite experience: A warning from the pope seems to count for all factions possibly at war with you. To clarify this: I regularly get excommed as the HRE when dealing with my numerous warlike & well-armed neighbours (Medieval Mod :sweatdrop:) one after the other. say I take on the Polish and cripple them sufficiently within the 2-year-term, so no further offensive action against them is taken (bo castles besieged etc). the next turn, the hungarians invade and I consecutively force them out....BANG I get excommed without having being warned. not that it's really that problematic in early (as ling as no other Catholics are able to launch a crusade) but it's annoying nevertheless. or did I do/realize something wrongly?

[Ironside]

? I made the opposite experience: A warning from the pope seems to count for all factions possibly at war with you. To clarify this: I regularly get excommed as the HRE when dealing with my numerous warlike & well-armed neighbours (Medieval Mod :sweatdrop:) one after the other. say I take on the Polish and cripple them sufficiently within the 2-year-term, so no further offensive action against them is taken (bo castles besieged etc). the next turn, the hungarians invade and I consecutively force them out....BANG I get excommed without having being warned. not that it's really that problematic in early (as ling as no other Catholics are able to launch a crusade) but it's annoying nevertheless. or did I do/realize something wrongly?

Sounds odd :inquisitive: . Either the mod changed something (unlikely) or then you missed something. Any offensive naval battles?

Only thing that'll get you excommed for pure defending is refusing for letting crusades pass. That'll give instant excommunication.
It might be that you do the offensive action against the Hungerians before the acual warning has started for the Poles. But I don't think it should matter, it's simply that I don't remember if I tried that.

[Ciaran]

In my experience attacking the Papacy is instant excomunication, unless you already attacked someone else.

I didn´t say "attack", I said "be at war". If the Papacy attacks you then you won´t be excommunicated. If you counterattack or reconquer lost territory, however, you might face excommunication.

[ajaxfetish]

Yes, if you're purely on the defensive you can be at war with the Papacy but in good Christian standing. One other thing to keep in mind regarding excommunication, just a sidenote really, check out your king's age and that of the pope before launching an attack that will probably get you excommed. If either are in their twilight years it might be worth it to bite the bullet and then let them die off afterwards to restore your communion with the faithful. One of numerous ways to deal with the pope's annoying tendencies.

Ajax

[Deus ret.]

Sounds odd :inquisitive: . Either the mod changed something (unlikely) or then you missed something. Any offensive naval battles?

Only thing that'll get you excommed for pure defending is refusing for letting crusades pass. That'll give instant excommunication.
It might be that you do the offensive action against the Hungerians before the acual warning has started for the Poles. But I don't think it should matter, it's simply that I don't remember if I tried that.

You're right, I missed something....I had to replay much of the campaign due to a savegame crash (never rely too much on quicksave alone :furious3:) and indeed in the same turn the battle for Poland took place I had a minor naval skirmish with the Hungarians, who had already tried to attack me; this resulted in the warning being valid for them, not the poor crippled Polish ~:doh: :oops: I got excommed soon anyway because when playing as the HRE there virtually is no possibility to stay peaceful and fight purely defensive wars on all fronts - one HAS to take some action and cripple some of those pesky invaders.

[Ayachuco]

Originally posted by Tony Furze:
I took Wallachia as part of my expansion (Spanish) after a Crusade.

I did not know wallachia was an actual city. Today it's in Romania i believe?

[gaijinalways]

Stopping a crusade will get you automatically excommed?

[Martok]

Stopping a crusade will get you automatically excommed?
Yes, that is correct. (I actually just commented to that effect in response to your post over in the Different tactics for the English (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1185008#post1185008) thread.) ~;)