View Full Version : "Mess" on twcenter.net
FrauGloer
01-17-2007, 16:34
Hey everyone! I don't know where else to put this, so I'll just ask here:
I just visited twcenter.net for some board-browsing, but then I saw that there seems to be something like a mod-war going on there. I never noticed what someone called "that mess here". Would someone of the guys who frequent both the ORG and TWC care to tell me what has happened to make that informative site go down just minutes ago?
I find it rather sad that personal quarrels over a game can cause so much trouble... :no:
I liked that site... :embarassed:
It is quite simple.
The entire staff and 70% moderators at TWC got fired yesterday by the guys that own the server.
The staff got no explanations nor any warning.
Instead they installed a member that was banned for flaming and other things to be sole-admin.
The moderators that were left resigned, me inclueded because we either disagreed or refused to serve under that incompetent fool(my reason).
The other members started speaking up against this and in return they got banned.
Then more of us got furious by this behavior and started attacking the admin for his incompetence and in return we got banned as well.
Right now the situation is chaotic to say the least.
There are only 3 moderators(inclueding the admin himself) for that entire forum.
And one of the moderators got appointed yesterday.
That moderator is a known CA-basher and loves to flame other people and was gonna get banned as well but thanks to the IQ of the admin he is now a moderator instead.
To put it simple, TWC is dead.
But a new site is in the making by the old staff members and it will be like TWC before this whole mess started.
FrauGloer
01-17-2007, 17:27
Ouch! How stupid... :no:
Well, I'm glad "the good guys" don't let themselves down and are creating a new, clean site! :yes:
Thanks for clearing it up for me! :2thumbsup:
You are welcome dude :bow:
the Black Prince
01-17-2007, 17:38
TWC is owned by Ogres Net, but until recently has been run by community members as site admins.
Recently ON have been meddling more and more in the running of their sites, which has caused issues on other boards, not just TWC. Suggested changes to administraotr access, reducing the number of administrators to three have angered staff on several ON forums, but would have hit TWC hardest, since we had about 8 admin. But lets face it, we were a massive site.
For unexplained reasons, a former moderator, who was for a time banned for Terms of Service violations, is known to be incompetant, was a known spammer and flamer and has no technical ability is now the sole admin of this massive site. His installtion into this role involved all other admin and most other staff members being sacked without warning or explanation. all but 1 of the remaining moderators then began resigning. Many other leading community members have been banned for being openly critical of this action.
TWC, an incredibly busy site with thousands of members, and usually 150+ logged in at any one time quite simply began to fall apart. Spam and flame became rampant. A new moderator was appointed, one i might add who is a known CA basher, but 2 mods and 1 admin cannot run a site that big even if they're online 24/7.
This state of affairs was reported to the network administrators, who have taken the advice to temporarily close the board while they try and work out what exactly to do.
With TWC's entire corps of experienced moderators and administrators gone, even should they be offered their jobs back, its unlikely any of them will want to work with someone who has been readily labelled as TWC's most hated member, and now site administrator. When you consider that those people sacked include TWCs most reputable, respected and well-known members, with great links to other community sites, and to CA, its fair to say TWC will not be able to recover from the mismanagement its suffered at the hands of its Network. I know of some mod teams who are already planning to leave the site, and with the lack of support teams are likely to get from the remaining staff, i imagine more will follow suit.
Its a great pity to see this happen to a website i used to run, and have dedicated almost 4 years of my life too, but there it goes. The people who own the server clearly want TWC to be a small nondescript unoriginal and boring fansite with a draconian staff team that nobody would want or need to visit, and thats the way its heading right now.
My advice to any other TWC members,stay here on the Org, and wait for news of the replacement site thats apparently being planned by the recently deposed site admin team.
Instead they installed a member that was banned for flaming and other things to be sole-admin.
Sounds like a coup to me. That individual must have been whispering in the ears of the owners of the hosting for months, either that or they're the best of friends offline and have been planning this for a while. Whoever they are they don't sound particularly mature. This has happened before on other messageboards, it's because they recruit the wrong type of people and/or their server is controlled by an insecure individual. By insecure I mean a third party that is not directly involved with the site. Such people are vulnerable to the manipulation and whisperings, because they don't understand enough about the workings or organisation of the forums. Sorry to hear it's turned out like this. I hope the decent admins and mods that were kicked out unfairly can make a go at another site, avoiding any more infighting, which always destroys a messageboard.
:bow:
It's quite amazing how fast an empire can fall when a bad leader becomes in charge :yes:
I never liked TWC, but this is just sick ... so how old where the guys that owned the server and thought they could be funny? 13?
Sounds like a coup to me.
It is a coup IMO.
They have tried changing TWC before but because of massive uproar they backed down.
However it has gone too far this time and the damage is done.
The mods and modders for TW are leaving and the members had enough, CA will certainly not visit and post in the forum when there is a CA-basher in charge of the TW forums.
As the Black Prince said, wait until the new site is up.
Yup Ogres Net have destroyed TWC, but they have not destroyed the community. The old staff are already getting a new site up and running. We should have it up and running soon.
I've already got CA support for the new forum, and most of the mods will probably leave TWc and set up at our new forum as we can offer them hosting for their mods.
Antagonist
01-17-2007, 18:26
Bizarre situation...
I can only feel for the people who commited so much of their energy and time to that website, it's a disgrace to see it ruined like this. :no:
I especially worry about the mod community, which was particularly vibrant there and saw dozens, even a hundred projects start up over the last year alone. I was helping out with one project that didn't even have it's own development forum at this point, all their research may well be lost now...
Thanks to TWC people like TB666, tBP and Lusted for explaining what's going on.
I look forward to hearing about the new site.
Antagonist
Well I cant speak for the team Roma Surrectum, but personally i find what happened at TWC disgraceful. This was a very popular site with tons of quality content and great members and projects.
Hopefully the members "in exile" will keep the community alive and all the talented people keep on working hard to produce amazing stuff.
Hopefully we can get our stuff back....
Ben,
Member of Roma Surrectum mod
We have a backup of the forum from yesterday we can use(or at least i think ill chat to Sim). So your stuff should be on there, plus we are offerinh hosting for mods at our new forum, so you can upload your mod there.
And it looks like i've been banned for complaining about the new admin, oh well.
Lusted, same with me. No longer able to get to the forum. but it doesnt matter. I'm looking forward to new page.
Yes anyone who has disagreed with the new admin has gotten permabanned.
nah the forums is offline, all I can see is a blank bar thingy
Hmmm... That way he will stay there alone...:laugh4:
I've already got CA support for the new forum, and most of the mods will probably leave TWc and set up at our new forum as we can offer them hosting for their mods.
it's good to hear that... At least I'll be able to keep playing LTC 2.x... pitty that my post count and 2 year contribution to TWC is down to one post in here :no:
ps- TWC is not even running now, that's bad.
TWC is up, just the guys banned most of the people
Solon of Athens
01-17-2007, 19:02
The fact that TWC has been down for the past 2 hours while ON wiped any trace of our existance shows how incompetant they are. We shall set up a new site, don't worry, free from ON and their incompetant administration.
JP
Ex-TWC Staff and banzored member :skull:
spirit_of_rob
01-17-2007, 19:22
Yep i got permabanned aswell for objecting the second it came back online i started posting haha
antiochus epiphanes
01-17-2007, 19:23
rofl me and spirit of rob got banned forever, apparently:
farting in HGs general direction, is spam.:furious3:
oh well i sent him a pm about that..
btw did you know they eat babies and choke puppies?
Templar Knight
01-17-2007, 19:35
The new admin has only 10 posts! Yea, he really knows the community :laugh4:
Quick, someone find an eager doctoral student to do a post-mortem and send it to SlashDot...
This is simply bizarre. Condolences to everyone who put a lot of time and energy into TWC, and best of luck getting that new site going.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-17-2007, 19:52
This is awful! What confuses me is why Ogre's Network wanted to install a new admin anyway? From what I saw you guys were doing a great job. Anyhow I wish you immense amounts of good luck with the new site. I also hope that Ogre's Network takes off this tyrant and reinstates the rightful rulers. Good luck again and cheers.
antiochus epiphanes
01-17-2007, 19:54
This is awful! What confuses me is why Ogre's Network wanted to install a new admin anyway? From what I saw you guys were doing a great job. Anyhow I wish you immense amounts of good luck with the new site. I also hope that Ogre's Network takes off this tyrant and reinstates the rightful rulers. Good luck again and cheers.
orges net is the tyrant. they orcastraited the whole thing
And now the dictator is banning people he simply dislikes.
:2thumbsup:
antiochus epiphanes
01-17-2007, 19:58
like me and rob for a example :2thumbsup:
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-17-2007, 20:03
May I ask, is "Richard the Lionheart" this new "hated" site administrator?
Yes he is, and he is locking all threads where people dissagree with backstab...
Yes aka Honor and glory.
But as you can see he has no honor nor glory.
spirit_of_rob
01-17-2007, 20:10
or brains hahah
He made a post asking for new mods ~D
and he has over 10.000 posts, somehow I doubt that
Ow, so now they are down again...
antiochus epiphanes
01-17-2007, 20:14
yup sure is :laugh4:
all them farts i sent them must of paid off
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-17-2007, 20:16
Guys, I'm sorry to be the one to point this out but how are you going to tell everybody about this new site if you can't post on TWC?
Well I will be glad to join the new community at the new forum once it is up. Should clean out a lot of the people who don't care about the community, as they will stay at TWC.. still its sad.
Guys, I'm sorry to point this out but how are you going to tell everybody about this new site if you can't post on TWC?
Advertise on .com and .org ~D
have someone who isnt yet banned (me for example) post it here and there, then get banned I guess..
the Black Prince
01-17-2007, 20:20
word of mouth, many of us know each other through msn... advertising on .com...
plus, not everyones been banned
last i checked, i hadn't been (though i'm waiting for ON to read what i wrote here lol)
TWC is down offline for me right now, anyone know if i'm banned yet? lol
Guys, I'm sorry to be the one to point this out but how are you going to tell everybody about this new site if you can't post on TWC?
Don't worry.
I just read from the dictator himself that TWC will no longer by a gaming forum.
It will be a network forum.
killerxguy
01-17-2007, 20:23
Damn, each second someone gets banned! I hope the new site is as good as the original TWC.
Kara Kolyo
01-17-2007, 20:25
huh, i was away from twc for couple of days and now H&G is the ruller?! TWC is down again and maybe i'll get banned soon.... can't wait for the new site
Are you able to open a TWC page? I always got site is offline...
TWC is down now because they are resetting all the accounts.
killerxguy
01-17-2007, 20:28
It's down, and I think he's changing it to some other site currently.
EDIT: My artifex promotion, barely a few days :( , and now he pops up and rules TWC!
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-17-2007, 20:30
Do you guys mean that he is destroying the TW bit of TWC?
Do you mean that he is destroying the TW bit of TWC?
Yep, there is no more TW nor will it ever be.
All the mods are gone as well
It is something unacceptable... it is like making Hitler a mayor judge in Norimberg tribunal... sooner new site will be up, the better.
the Black Prince
01-17-2007, 20:36
they've deleted all the mods? and all the material that was in the modding forums???
bloody gods above...
how can there be a Total War Center without the total war lol?
killerxguy
01-17-2007, 20:37
Will my account still have the same #posts, rank...etc. because I heard Lusted backed up the site.
<richard_lionheart> its likley that they have ideas for the forum, possibly not TW related
<NecroBrit> Will they be announcing an uptate on an announcement forthcoming?
<richard_lionheart> the members that i banned will be allowed back once everything is sorted
<RZZZA> great, they have ideas do they? wonderful...cant wait to hear this. have they shceduled lobotomies for us all>?
<richard_lionheart> all mods will be removed from the website
<richard_lionheart> (modifications)
<G-Drakan> WHAT?
<G-Drakan> Jesus...
<NecroBrit> eh?
<_God> oh fantastic
<richard_lionheart> not my doing folks
<RZZZA> what a lie that is
<richard_lionheart> believe it or not im trying to get things back to normal
<NecroBrit> So... getting web traffic is a bad thing these days huh?
<G-Drakan> By removing the biggest source of traffic for twc?
<richard_lionheart> TW Center will be changed from a gaming forum to a network/general forum
<Sher_Khan> Honor, surely you can mediate some compromise with ON for members like imb49..
<Sher_Khan> Huh?
<G-Drakan> Why will it be called TWCenter then?
<Sher_Khan> A network/general forum?
:no:
spirit_of_rob
01-17-2007, 20:44
i love the comment how this isnt his doing and he wants it back to normal
serenius4tsd
01-17-2007, 20:44
Yes! Banned as well!
And I have evidence of 37 deleted posts (btw this was at least an hour ago.. so make it more now)
https://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o187/kennywww/untitled.jpg
https://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o187/kennywww/untitled2.jpg
Thats a who's who list of who's been to TWC. :yes:
With the modifications gone TWC will crash and burn - although seeing as it won't be TWC anymore, that may not be such a bad thing.
antiochus epiphanes
01-17-2007, 20:46
what a liar!
Nothing has been necessarily deleted. They are hidden and access is restricted. This of course was not done immediately, it was done after several members (who are banned for now) attempted to damage the website and the network as a whole.
I have to type something, you can't just post quotes
Spartacus-FIN-
01-17-2007, 20:47
Hi guys, greetings from TWC =)
Just heard about these "changes" and I'm getting out of there. Eagerly waiting for the new site now. I still have an account, so I'll try to save some guys from there.:laugh4:
Good luck to you all TWC-veterans, do note when your site is ready. I'll be there.
Hi guys, greetings from TWC =)
Just heard about these "changes" and I'm getting out of there. Eagerly waiting for the new site now. I still have an account, so I'll try to save some guys from there.:laugh4:
Good luck to you all TWC-veterans, do note when your site is ready. I'll be there.
hehe good, get as many as you can and notify them of what will happen.
Especially the modders.
spirit_of_rob
01-17-2007, 20:56
@ stigs quote
haha moron several members tried to harm the site exactly what is it he is doing then, oh look calling himself your good friend richard must of course mean hes a good guy.
quite frankly the guy is the lowest piece of sputum it has ever been my misfortunte to encounter
Arakorn-eir
01-17-2007, 20:57
Anyone wanna bet how many "revolutions there's gonna be this year?
Was it 3 last year? :D
antiochus epiphanes
01-17-2007, 20:59
@ stigs quote
haha moron several members tried to harm the site exactly what is it he is doing then, oh look calling himself your good friend richard must of course mean hes a good guy.
quite frankly the guy is the lowest piece of sputum it has ever been my misfortunte to encounter
i fart deficated feces on orgesnet and HG
http://www.ogresnet.com/forums/showthread.php?p=42184#post42184
even the antichrist hates orgesnet
im sorry, this is the biggest load of shite out there.
F*** you H&G and F*** you Ogre.
you are both C***
didn't know there wasn;t a censor!
Teleklos Archelaou
01-17-2007, 21:06
The whole thing is ridiculous - I can't believe they would do something so stupid. I would invite you to hang out over here more though now if you like. :grin: I tend to think it's a pretty good place (as my post count probably indicates).
spirit_of_rob
01-17-2007, 21:07
Oh incidently i apologise for any behaviour on here that offends unless it offends H&G in which case no apology
the Black Prince
01-17-2007, 21:07
Should anyone happen to see someone from ON or TWCs new staff here, you can tell them that if i see any article i wrote, anything i designed, anything i have Intellectual Property rights on anywhere on any ON site, i will be taking legal action. I maintain copies of all my material, i can prove whats mine and what isn't.
antiochus epiphanes
01-17-2007, 21:11
dito all of the above post
if i see a ON or HG here ill tar and feather em~!
I just cant believe my eyes...
Should anyone happen to see someone from ON or TWCs new staff here, you can tell them that if i see any article i wrote, anything i designed, anything i have Intellectual Property rights on anywhere on any ON site, i will be taking legal action. I maintain copies of all my material, i can prove whats mine and what isn't.
hmmnnn...
I think I may also have a case on this :smash:
spirit_of_rob
01-17-2007, 21:25
yep i think all my skin packs were removed but just in case i missed some the same goes for me
minibomb74
01-17-2007, 21:26
God ,I just read Spirit of Robs heads up and thought I'd head here and find out whats going on. I can't believe they banned lusted and spirit of rob (your warning was very helpful) .Are the modders of EB banned? surely they can't delete anyones work :furious3:
Fondor_Yards
01-17-2007, 21:27
Quick, everyone jump on the totalwar.org lifeboat! Hurra land ho!
*Turns and watches the sinking TWC*
God dam Honor and Glory iceburg, we never saw it coming...
Kagemusha
01-17-2007, 21:31
This:smash: whole mess is just ridiculous.I hope that the new site will be good,but then my main place of intrest has always been here in the Org.So life goes on.
Quick, everyone jump on the totalwar.org lifeboat! Hurra land ho!
*Turns and watches the sinking TWC*
God dam Honor and Glory iceburg, we never saw it coming...
Actually we did.
However we was assured that he would never take power by ON.
They lied:shame:
Ser Clegane
01-17-2007, 21:32
As I am not a frequent visitor of the TWC (primarily due to the lack of time) I am unable to pass any judgement with regard to who is the blame, but it is quite sad to see a popular TW-site in such distress, and it is obvious that some people (whoever that might be) apparently set some wrong priorities here and put personal pride above the service for the community (which should be the purpose of such a site)
All the best for setting up the new site, guys - and I hope that all the work that a lot of community members invested in the content of TWC is not lost...
Hotspur II
01-17-2007, 21:35
I am a Lurker. I have Lurked for years. Two weeks ago I broke down and registered at TWC because of all the mods and I thought maybe I should get involved in a community I have, lets face it, leeched off of since MTW. I was just getting comfortable posting every once in a while when BOOM! TWC blows up in my face. I can come only one conclusion: it's my fault. I broke a sacred covenant. I am a Lurker and at no time should I EVER register at a forum. I knew this and did it anyway and the Forum Gods were watching and were much displeased. So they smote TWC in their righteous fury. My bad.
Of course to post this I had to register here. Uh oh....
Ser Clegane
01-17-2007, 21:40
Of course to post this I had to register here. Uh oh....
Prepare to be assimilated :stare:
Hey all,
I cannot believe what has happened. I'm stunned, stunned I tell you!
I will join the new boards thats for sure. just point the way!
jopo
minibomb74
01-17-2007, 22:07
Richard has "unbanned everyone"?
spirit_of_rob
01-17-2007, 22:15
For now yes BUT the damage has been done by his actions
@S_o_R
Any idea where your skin packs and Hegemonia: CS will find a new home?
spirit_of_rob
01-17-2007, 22:47
prob be moving to the RTR forums and here aswell as for Heg no idea i assume it will maintain its primary location at its own forums
Will my account still have the same #posts, rank...etc. because I heard Lusted backed up the site.
that'd be really nice 'cause I quite liked my rank and post count in TWC :beam:
So if I understand this correctly a whole community has just been... killed?
All the hard work, especially from the modders, entirely destroyed? The existence of a community of so many people, just gone...?
It's like destroying a whole village and leaving the inhabitants without a home, forcing them to move to somewhere else.
This may sounds dramatic and off course, this is not real life, but still, the members who visited the TWC everyday and contributed to it, worked hard and dedicated alot of their time...
This is just :jawdrop:
Good luck with the new site guys, hopefully you all saved copies of your work somewhere and you'll be able to become as big as TWC once was.
Dol Guldur
01-17-2007, 22:56
TWC has been a time bomb waiting to go off. In setting up a "new TWC" (whatever it's name may be) please do not sow the seeds that led to this - i.e. avoid internal politics, have modding of at least the same importance as the rest of the community (and not a poor relative), and don't be so concerned about titles and patronages (get rid of them if you ask me).
But I pretend no great insight or experience - just my honest opinion. Learn from the Org.
minibomb74
01-17-2007, 23:03
everyone has been unbanned and richards invited an open forum, but the site is down or over loaded.does anyone have any idea whats going on?
Bigfooted
01-17-2007, 23:12
I am a Lurker. I have Lurked for years. Two weeks ago I broke down and registered at TWC because of all the mods and I thought maybe I should get involved in a community I have, lets face it, leeched off of since MTW. I was just getting comfortable posting every once in a while when BOOM! TWC blows up in my face. I can come only one conclusion: it's my fault. I broke a sacred covenant. I am a Lurker and at no time should I EVER register at a forum. I knew this and did it anyway and the Forum Gods were watching and were much displeased. So they smote TWC in their righteous fury. My bad.
Of course to post this I had to register here. Uh oh....
I've lurked this site for many years, while being registered on TWC.
It is sad to see what a was such a huge website go down the pan.
ah well..
This seems a like a friendly place.
everyone has been unbanned and richards invited an open forum, but the site is down or over loaded.does anyone have any idea whats going on?
Well, i was unbanned too it seemed. and before the site went down.
I was reading several threads that with logs from the new admin (priase the fearless leader) had been telling people on the IRC channel the site would be shut down, while it was re-made. before that also, i noticed large chucks of the forums being deleted. such as the mod forums.
Irishman3
01-17-2007, 23:16
So if I understand this correctly a whole community has just been... killed?
All the hard work, especially from the modders, entirely destroyed? The existence of a community of so many people, just gone...?
You know, watching this whole thing go down over the course of the day kept reminding me of the Death Star scene in Star Wars, whatching helplessly like Leia Organa as Alderaan was obliterated for no other good reason than a show of force.
Reading what I could before the site went down (can't get to it now, or any other ON board for that matter) there was some changes that needed to be made, and heavy politicing for and against. Won't say I think anyone was right or wrong, but I can say it has definitely not handled in the best way. Not where the TW community as whole is concerned.
It was a great site that, much like here, I lurked around a lot on and just started to become an 'active' member on. Hope things get resolved and it gets back on its feet, or the new site the banished memebrs are talking about starting gets off its feet and can replace it.
TWC has been a time bomb waiting to go off. In setting up a "new TWC" (whatever it's name may be) please do not sow the seeds that led to this - i.e. avoid internal politics, have modding of at least the same importance as the rest of the community (and not a poor relative), and don't be so concerned about titles and patronages (get rid of them if you ask me).
Don't worry i'll make sure the mod community gets greate rprominence on the new site.
My god. That's just....unbelievable. ~:eek: For the nothing that it's probably worth, you guys definitely have my most sincere sympathy. I've only been an infrequent visitor to the Centre, but it's a pretty impressive community there. I hope you're up and running again ASAP. :yes:
In the meantime, and on behalf of the Org, I welcome all TWCentre refugees! Regardless of whether or not you decide to stay, there's always a place for you here. :balloon2:
Yup, truly a shame.
I have been lurking around the fan sites for awhile, .Org from the time of Shogun, TWC from RTWs time. Registered to both several times I guess, but always forgetting the login details when I have put TW games on the shelf for awhile.
AAAnnywayyy, I had pretty much no idea what went on internally in TWC, the Curia and other things like that, I was just there for the gameplay discussions and especially the mods.
I sincerely hope that all the hard working modders get a new home swiftly.
Nothing against the .Org but personally I just dislike the appereance nowdays.
Lord Gruffles
01-18-2007, 06:12
I too registered here a couple years ago and cannot for the life of me remember the password or even the email address I was using. :inquisitive:
I always prefered TWC's layout and stuff but I must say I am very greatful for the warm welcome we have recieved here the past couple days. Frankly the only thing I'm after is EB right now so layout aside, I'm here to stay.
Again, thanks ORG.
It is very good that new site is comming along old community - I myself will gladly join the site!!!
Regards
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-18-2007, 09:04
I agree with you Dol Guldur - the internal politics of the site are probably the cause of this event. The TWC really, due to it's republican nature, is prone to let's say, power hungry dictators, as was the original Roman Republican system. It is clear from the events that have occurred that Richard the Lionheart, the dictator, as it were, of this terrible event, was in on this "hijack" from the start, using the Ogre's network staff as a hidden path to power for the TWC site and forum, knowing that he would never get on the staff through these elections that you guys hold with the way he was behaving. This is a very immature attitude in my opinion and would never have occurred on the Guild, even if we did have overlords such as Ogre watching over us every day.
BTW, a very warm welcome to all ex-TWC members.
cegorach
01-18-2007, 10:49
I am completelly switching to the ORG.
The whole affair happened when I wasn't even there, but such events made me disgusted enough.:furious3:
Nothing against the .Org but personally I just dislike the appereance nowdays.
It's not a good idea to judge on appearances. It is most often those boards that are loaded with eye candy and unnecessary features that have the worst content, members and administration. An eye candy forum skin and lots of toys always attract the wrong kind of people.
I also agree 100% with Dol Guldur, follow that advice and the new TWC cannot fail to return stronger than ever, and replace the old one. Too much emphasis on internal politics, ranks, titles, the forum appearance, features and an elitist approach will soon land TWC back in the same situation again.
Geoffrey S
01-18-2007, 12:50
While I believe TWcenter had some serious problems making it, for me, an unattractive place to be an active member, and while I believe the site needed a major overhaul, I do not believe the approach taken by Ogre to achieve this was at all productive. If he wants to reform the site to something different, something without the admittedly close community ties that were present, then the least he could have done was to provide a couple of weeks notice allowing people to sort out their site, their modifications, there contacts. This he did not do, and I half wonder in appointing such an inept new administrator this was a concerted attempt to drive away as many users as possible before intergrating the forums more tightly into Ogre's Net.
I wish the best of luck in creating a new site with the old community, but I must echo the suggestions to create a tighter organization structure to prevent new issues.
Leon_Corona
01-18-2007, 20:39
Hey all Invictus from TWC just saying im supporting the exiled members. Hope you guys get that new site running soon, ill be sure to sign up :) -Leon
the Black Prince
01-18-2007, 22:10
the Drama continues...
ON have fired Richard the Lionheart, and reappointed Archer as admin.
meanwhile, TWCs 4 mods now include a CA basher, a former banned member, and a homophobic member who recently engaged in gay bashing.
this is going to be interesting...
thankfully Lusted tells me the new site is almost ready
it should be noted here, TWC politics, and the Curia, played no part whatsoever in this drama. Or the last one either. All the recent problems on TWC have been caused by the very bad relationship between the site community and pro-community staff members on the one hand, and Ogre's Net and pro ON staff members on the other. While i don;t presume to know everything thats gone on behind the scenes, when your sites owners seem to be going out of their way to screw the site over, one way or another, and someone in staff is trying to play both sides against the middle for his own advancement, something is going seriously wrong.
i long for the day when TWC is owned by its own community, and not answerable to anyone else
Samurai Waki
01-18-2007, 22:27
Hmmm... it seems with this massive influx of refugees it would be the precise time for the .Org to strike deep into the heart of the Sinister Empire that is Total War Center. Rally behind the .org Standard we shall fight for your salvation!
Snoil The Mighty
01-19-2007, 01:45
Wow, that whole site appears to have imploded. Don't know anything about policies&politics over there, always seemed to me that the site was a bit elitist for my tastes but the content was pretty good. I do post on another site that isn't twc or the org but geez louise, that was a huge site to go fubar like that.
Grey_Fox
01-20-2007, 11:06
I have to say I avoided the TWC after the spam attacks some of their members started on the .com. I also disliked how there was 20 different offtopic areas, all with daft latin names. But it was undoubtedly stupid to do what happened to it just recently.
Solon of Athens
01-20-2007, 13:50
Horsearcher has removed the ability for anyone to see any of my posts or the rest of the people who oppsoe him. We are baisically TWC ghosts. This is a new low for Archer who has totally lost all my respect....
If you support us post this at TWC in the Questions&Suggestions forum (I wouldn't normally advertise like this but I can't do it anywhere else):
Thread title: jp26991 says hi
Go here for the Full Article: Archer's Plot (http://tw.generalscollective.com/wiki/index.php?title=Archer%27s_Plot)
Archer has removed our ability to post threads! Maybe even post at all. That is why I (jp26991) have to resort to using a duplicate account. I posted the following at TWC about 20 minutes ago and then found none could view it. Now my duplicate acocunt has recived a similar fate as has Ozymadias'.
It seems a few of us are having the abiltiy to search for each others posts removed. Like why can't we see my last post in my profile? (Link (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/member.php?u=9425))
Also why are posts being deleted even after HG ceased to be an admin. (Follow the Link in this post (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1455402&postcount=10))
And why is Archer using invisible mode? :hmmm
Here is the proof that i can see the thread, but no-one else can:
https://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c317/jp26991/jp.jpg
Archer can not be allowed to get away with this!
Spartacus-FIN-
01-20-2007, 14:28
That's just sick.:laugh4: I see that every post concerning the new site have been removed too. This guy is going to be the next president or something..:idea2:
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-20-2007, 14:45
I agree with you Spartacus-FIN-, what he is doing is sick - what causes me to wonder why he want to destroy the current site even though he was previously a very well respected high-ranking Optifex, I think that is high ranking, in the community? What confuses me is why HorseArcher would want to use the ON staff for his own means and visa versa - there must be something that we are not seeing behind all this - why is he trying to destroy, by agreeing with ON's ideas, a site that he clearly once supported?
pevergreen
01-20-2007, 14:54
Is horsearcher a good or bad guy?
Is that site entirely run by pubescent teenagers or something? I'm afraid it looks to me as if the place will disintegrate after a power struggle. What needs to happen over there is simple: Some people need to stop playing at Senators & Republics, ban the troublemakers and get one of you installed as the main admin with sole access to the admin control panel. If a new site is started, the same needs to occur. You have based the structure of your site administration around the Roman Republic but you seem to forgetting what happened to that system eventually.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-20-2007, 15:08
I agree there Caravel, perhaps however, not about the 100% sole access the the AdminCP. As the site is large, perhaps more than that are required to manage the site to a decent extent - perhaps up to three, like here at the .org, yet not eight - I agree with Ogre's net on that matter. Eight men managing a site is almost impossible and, as most of the time they all will be disagreeing with each other, little or nothing will get done, or at least not at high speed. With three it should be much easier to agree on a compromise.
Guys Archer is a Good Guy, I know him and worked with him for about 4 years now. He is honest and wanted TWC to be great, there were ALOT of invisible pressures and crap from higher up and he was Sacked too like all the rest, he only stepped in again to SAVE all that Hard work he put in. Think about it for over 6 months he had no help from ON and then instead of helping him or promoting they dump him and basically decide to USE TWC NAME that was built on mods to make Buku money.
Basically I also had good relationship is H&G so I wont comment on the recent actions, but to say I have only had very good dealings with him.
But the Main issue is the comment he made on what ON has planned! They WONT change their Minds, they will just WAIT again till the right time. I think its obvious ON has change policy probably because of that Internet 2 crap going on, and the corporate takeover of all the Hostsing.
They plan to dump the Modders and their Mods, which means they have become unreliable to support the modders and their work, the only logical course would to move to another site as a backup until the final blow occurs. I am totally nuetral on the political side of things over their, but ON's statements seem clear to me what they are THINKING behind the scenes and that scares me. I think they only Fired H&G because of him slipping and telling about their plans.
Who is the Main person to talk around hear for hosting possibilities?
Lt
pevergreen
01-20-2007, 15:23
All Hail! SPQR Total War!
used to haunt the TWC just for SPQR.
Now i want to get permabanned, so im trying to figure out who to flame. :laugh4:
Itll convince good people to come here!
I can confirm what has been stated.
We are at this moment being censored.
We can post but no one can see them except ourselfs.
My guess they are doing it to prevent us from posting the link to the new site.
What better way is it to do that then to make us think that we have posted the link but no one will ever be able to see it.
Personally that is good.
Now even their biggest supporters will rally to our cause and join the exodus to the new site.
After all, how can people get help with M2TW or their mods if the modders can't post(well they can post but no one can see it) ??
Solon of Athens
01-20-2007, 15:34
Is that why Archer and the Ogre's Net admin have put us in this mode where no one can see our posts?
List of people on ignore mode:
* jp26991
* imb39
* Tacticalwithdrawal
* Soren
* Ozymandias
* Aristocrat
* -apocalypse-
* Lusted
* TB666
The list of the banned for helping us by posting messages at TWC:
* Mangerman
That is the current list we know of, others can't tell us they are on the ignore list...
pevergreen
01-20-2007, 15:40
A person has taken all the threads in a forum hostage until he is sure he wont be banned or something
I soft deleted all the threads in this forum just in case my posting privileges are removed. As soon as I'm sure that they won't be, I'll bring them back.
I'm not holding these "hostage," just making sure that my creation is preserved.
Anyone noticed the new weekly poll at TWC?
"What is the main reason you visit TWCenter?"
1. Information and help for Total War games
2. Modifications for the Total War games
3. Other topic than the Total War games
Option 2 got 71% so far ...
pevergreen
01-20-2007, 15:46
Check out my rant in Content News in :Total War Center Forums > Community News, Articles and Interviews > Front Page News
Check out my rant in Content News in :Total War Center Forums > Community News, Articles and Interviews > Front Page News
Very nice work :2thumbsup:
Too bad it will "disappear" in a few minutes and you will be put on the global ignore list. :whip:
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-20-2007, 15:54
That poll, to me, seems like a bit of work on the part of Ogre - perhaps he is having some doubts over turning the site into a general "network" site and wants to think what the general community believe on the matter?
Well right now for you guys its personal, for me I am concerned about ON their statement about the modding is scary, it looks like they plan to make it an Atari style setup. If So my mod work hosting is gone anyway, so I backed up everything I NEED incase of the closing of out forums.
I like Archer, and dont think he is controlling much of this as you think, but I am sure that there is nothing that is going to save TWC now, because the owners have a different mind, even if there is a reprieve they will still go forward later with their plan.
I'm just waiting now to see what happens. Basically for me SPQR comes first, so I have to make sure hosting is available atleast until Internet 2 is off the ground then all our freedom on the net will be gone. :book:
pevergreen
01-20-2007, 15:55
Still waiting to be banned.
If im not banned by the time i wake up (8-10 hours) i will be surprised.
Pevergreen has now been put on the global ignore list.
I can no longer see his good post he made.
pevergreen
01-20-2007, 15:57
Neither can i...sad
posted another two replys to same thread, test it please.
Solon of Athens
01-20-2007, 15:58
If anyone can't post just edit your name into our list:
http://tw.generalscollective.com/wiki/index.php?title=Archer%27s_Plot#We_can.27t_Post.21
Neither can i...sad
posted another two replys to same thread, test it please.
well if you can't see it yourself then they just deleted it.
Consider yourself lucky then :laugh4:
And I can see your "hello" post.
Lt, we suspect a lot of what happened was because of what Archer said, or because of archers doing. I no longer trust him.
I am about to rally the TW modders to our cause, the latest incident included putting several mod team leaders on global ignore which has stopped them from being able to do anything at TWC.
pevergreen
01-20-2007, 16:06
Im not banned, but i have a junior member saying im spamming. He has less posts than me...and ive posted in 3 different threads.
Ive only been on the TWC 4-5 times since regging there.
Sigh
I hope the new site will be up soon Lusted.
I can't take anymore of this stupid behavior anymore from ON and horsearcher.
Personally I think it is ON admins doing this they have absolute authority over that site. Personally I would wait and see on Archer, This DOESNT sound like the Archer I know, and I have worked with him alot. He is not a Child or a Kid in College.
These actions are unique though because before people were just banned, now they are ignored, This sounds like something Higher up the ladder that is handle this for PR reasons.
Posting Tons of Hate Threads accomplished Nothing and is Childish, just wait and see what happens. They already tipped thier hate when they said they are combining the site to a GENERAL Gaming site and not a modding community. IN the meantime continue your work and when you site is done, People will Know trust me.
In the meantime try not to upset yourself over gaming forums. But I sympathize with the issues hapening to you and others.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-20-2007, 16:10
Posting Tons of Hate Threads accomplished Nothing and is Childish, just wait and see what happens. They already tipped their hate when they said they are combining the site to a GENERAL Gaming site and not a modding community. IN the meantime continue your work and when you site is done, People will Know trust me.
I agree with you lt1956 - hate threads, or spam, will only cause more problems for the place and will, sadly, not cause Ogre to back down with his policies or transformation that he has in mind. Yet, perhaps he is having some doubts about his plans - the poll, to me at least, seems to hint at this.
Lusted I HEARD a rumor that you guys plan to go over to RTR forums? If so I disagree with that choice, Remember RTR knifed the community in the back when they split under Tyr and talked alot of Trash about other mods including Mine and EB. I have nothing against them I just dont know if that is the Best choice?
I have none SPARTAN for a while and he was willing to Host and He helped RTR and EB when they were first starting. GJ liked Spartan well enough and was one of the father of RTR so to speak.
Let me know what you have planned?
minor update
We know that it is Meiyogen too, he more or less admitted to it on msn to me and Ozymandias. He doesn’t want us to be able to advertise the new site and thinks this will stop us!
I would like to thank anyone who I asked to post on TWC to get the message out, poor old Mangerman even got banned for it.
http://tw.generalscollective.com/wiki/index.php?title=Archer%27s_Plot#We_can.27t_Post.21
Meiyogen has no right to edit the TWC wiki since it is outside ON network.
This is clearly an abuse of power.
Lt we are not going to the RTR site, the old admins from TWc are setting up a new site, and one which will focus more on the modding community.
And Archer has said so many conflicting things, given conflicting accounts that i no longer trust him. I personally believe he has had a big hand in this.
spirit_of_rob
01-20-2007, 17:48
Lusted I HEARD a rumor that you guys plan to go over to RTR forums? If so I disagree with that choice, Remember RTR knifed the community in the back when they split under Tyr and talked alot of Trash about other mods including Mine and EB. I have nothing against them I just dont know if that is the Best choice?
I have none SPARTAN for a while and he was willing to Host and He helped RTR and EB when they were first starting. GJ liked Spartan well enough and was one of the father of RTR so to speak.
Let me know what you have planned?
That sounds like it might have been a misunderstanding of something i said, before i knew they were sorting out somewhere else someone asked me where i would move my skin thread to and i said guild and RTR forums probably
Boudicca
01-20-2007, 18:09
Well well....I am the next piece of driftwood to arrive here. I've seen enough on TWC of that complot. I hope the new site will be up soon. Anyway I shall stay on .org for the time being. Seems like much more stable here.
PorT_Lobo
01-20-2007, 18:22
This is a shame..... how this guy become in front of a site like TWC?
It seems that an adult site have in comand a stupid kid..... i always liked to read and participate in TWC and this is just surprising and absurd.
Leon_Corona
01-20-2007, 18:33
Hey all im just a bit confused as to why people seem against internet 2, could anyone explain? As i do not know much about it the info would be nice. Thanks, -Leon
Internet 2 SOLE purpose is to nock out the little guy and limit Prite Website by limiting their Bandwidth, what will happen will be WORSE than the Phone company takeovers. Sites that Shrill for Parties or Governments and big business will get Premium Bandwidth, those that are independant and fight for the little guy Wont so the Sites wont be hosted or will be so slow its not funny.
Sure at first it will look and feel the same, but thats the old bait and switch, then POW you have all these Rules and restrictions that kick in and what do you do then? Once they switch the businesses the money will be their with I2
Also they could BLOCK political Ideas that conflict with a government at the time and TRACK everything you do ALOT more easy than now, I2 has alot of thought built into it, if you like the internet now and the freedom of ALL these Webistes and information then you wont want internet 2.
You have heard how the CIA is using Google and now Yahoo to Spy on people? They have also shut sites etc that speak against certain parties. This my friend is what is called Fascism and it will be your Worst Hell on Earth and I dont mean DOOM3 Hell either, Try 1984 or Brave New world Hell. No identity or freedom of thought.
Bigfooted
01-20-2007, 19:24
Holy Hell in a handbasket...
TWC is sinking very very fast.
Thanks for the lifeboat kind people of the Org.
Very glad to see the TW coummunity sticking together in this.
Well ON is at it again with the banning and deleting threads that in anyway complains about the fubar situation.
Spartacus-FIN-
01-20-2007, 20:01
Well ON is at it again with the banning and deleting threads that in anyway complains about the fubar situation.
I'm pretty impressed, they even delete the threads with fake titles in seconds! They're professionals..
I wonder how this turns out..:yes:
Jesus H. Christ. They´ve deleted the thread with the wiki article by jp 6 times and several others, too. This is madness...
Spartacus-FIN-
01-20-2007, 20:05
Well ON is at it again with the banning and deleting threads that in anyway complains about the fubar situation.
I'm pretty impressed, they even delete the threads with fake titles in seconds! They're professionals..
I wonder how this turns out..:yes:
Remember:
http://tommcmahon.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/looselips2.gif
I'm pretty impressed, they even delete the threads with fake titles in seconds! They're professionals..
I wonder how this turns out..:yes:
ON is now even starting to delete threads on their own forums where people are demanding a comment from ON.
And not just from TWC but from other ON owned forums who are rallying our cause.
Manstein16
01-20-2007, 20:42
Hey all former TWC members. According to the Wiki, I'm on the global ignore list as well (I've tested it out on the boards and it seems to be correct). Rather odd, given that it's been nearly 24 hours since I last posted on there. Apparently my ideas were "subversive" to an extreme for them to muzzle me like that. Ah well. Let me know if there is anything I can do to help get the word out on the new site when the official announcement is made.
In my sig is the link to the new site.
It will be up in 24h-48h.
Soon our wait is over and we are finally home again.
Away from the tyrants of ON.
Manstein16
01-20-2007, 20:47
Thanks, jp just gave it to me over MSN as well. It's in my faves folder.
I want to thank the Org for being so kind as to allow we dissidents to spend our exile here until our new home is up. This will make communication much easier in the meantime.
Solon of Athens
01-20-2007, 21:23
Well all my duplicate accounts on TWC are exhausted and many have been banned. But www.totalwarhorde.net will live on!
AntiochusIII
01-20-2007, 21:25
WTF is this all about?
Wow. Just wow. And I used to frequently lurk TWC back in the day, around RTR 4.x or something like that.
Anyway, I have no personal stake in this, but wish you guys good luck nonetheless. It'll be sad to see a lot of the modding content gone.
Not that I even know why Orge's Net would do something like that in the first place. :dizzy2:
Here at the org we don't really have anything remotely close to site politics. Which is good.
The revolution is beautiful :yes:
Now we just need to keep at it.
serenius4tsd
01-20-2007, 21:28
Things are getting very fishy. I have not been banned (again) yet, but probably will be in ten minutes.
Here is the fishy thing: A user called Narses has become a moderator, although if you see his profile, you see his last post was to say he was leaving. http://www.twcenter.net/forums/member.php?u=7769 (Might be changed once people know)
Unless this is the same guy who in this thread said he was going undercover.
Solon of Athens
01-20-2007, 21:39
I have been IP banned... :D
I do apologise to .org for advertising the new site but there are exiles here and I think they deserve to know the link.
Especially since the admins over at TWC has now infact censored the word www.totalwarhorde.com to try and keep people from leaving.
Spartacus-FIN-
01-20-2007, 21:47
Totalwarhorde? Sounds cool. Do you have any details about the new forums, btw? Surely you will maintain the great intellectual offtopic-section?:yes: And the traditions of the TWC will live on? (the good traditions of course:p)
Juggernawt
01-20-2007, 21:58
ITWC has now infact censored the word totalwarhorde.com....
So, is it totalwarhorde.com or totalwarhorde.net??
So, is it totalwarhorde.com or totalwarhorde.net??
oppss sorry :oops:
It's .net
I'm too used to .com
serenius4tsd
01-20-2007, 22:11
I like the name. :yes:
tnick777
01-20-2007, 22:22
I'm a father of a mod over there...
I'm definately going to twh.net
minibomb74
01-20-2007, 22:36
jes that was fast. do we have a date for the opening of the horde site?:beam:
serenius4tsd
01-20-2007, 22:37
Its been a whole hour, and Im not yet banned. W00t.
HA seems to be going through the list of possible words and phrases to censor and updating it constantly ... I had to change my sig several times to show the new website...
minibomb74
01-20-2007, 22:42
i tried to postthe word "horde" in the twc forum section and its being censored with ****
oh thats clever
serenius4tsd
01-20-2007, 22:43
Should I ask HA if i can be banned? ;-P
Spartacus-FIN-
01-20-2007, 23:00
You guys are really working hard. I've received three PM's this far asking to join the new site.:laugh4: Good, good.
HA must be doing this right now::wall:
I have bad news:
Entering in total war horde.com redirects back to the old site
Juggernawt
01-20-2007, 23:06
Lovely, now they switched off the sig-images over there. Guess they just didn't want people advertising the new site.
Juggernawt
01-20-2007, 23:12
I have bad news:
Entering in total war horde.com redirects back to the old site
That's 'cos it's totalwarhorde.net - NOT totalwarhorde.com
Manstein16
01-20-2007, 23:15
I have bad news:
Entering in total war horde.com redirects back to the old site
That's because it is totalwarhorde.net. Accessing the website will have you directed to a placeholder page.
I just received The Sword of Cao Cao's mass PM regarding the new site. The word "horde" has been censored out and the address listed on the attached image is hardly decipherable. Could someone please tell him to resend the PM using a censor bypass for the worde "horde" (i.e., h o r d e)? I would ask him myself except they've blacklisted me. I'm worried that most users won't be able to find the proper URL, even with the PM. Thanks!
Interesting that Archer deny that H&G is staff , Archer also says they arent removing the mods. Funny thing is H&G says he spoke to the owners and they arent moving them, and the chat log is a fake. Then if he isnt staff how can he speak to the owners?
I think I will wait and see what happens. I can careless about a coup, but something dealing with the mods is another story.
Well I don´t know how many accounts I´ve created today, but I´m exhausted now...My threads dissapered instantly so I don´t know how many succeded to read them. My latest, and last alias, is "Cerxes". I´m going to be "cool" with that one so I can post something.../C22.
I didnt recieved anything so far... :juggle2:
What happens in twcenter?And please, stay in the org.We need fresh meat here :laugh4:
"junior member"? - hehe...
Manstein16
01-20-2007, 23:45
What happens in twcenter?And please, stay in the org.We need fresh meat here :laugh4:
Ogre (possessor of the site), desiring to transform TWC into a general gaming community, sacked the entire administration, appointed a reviled member as the new "Imperator" (as they called it), and then purged the entire Old Guard by banning them when they protested the actions. Threads were summarily deleted without notification or warning and scores of members placed on a global ignore list for (in many cases) politely promoting the new community, twhorde (TWH).
Ogre (possessor of the site), desiring to transform TWC into a general gaming community, sacked the entire administration, appointed a reviled member as the new "Imperator" (as they called it), and then purged the entire Old Guard by banning them when they protested the actions. Threads were summarily deleted without notification or warning and scores of members placed on a global ignore list for (in many cases) politely promoting the new community, twhorde (TWH).
This will not happen here.
Here, there is speech freedom.You follow the rules and everything will be ok.
SUPORT THE TOSACRACY!:bounce:
What happens in twcenter?And please, stay in the org.We need fresh meat here :laugh4:
hehe well I'm sure some of us will still post here.
I do but TWH is the homebase :yes:
wow, your thread just been blasted, lusted...
Manstein16
01-21-2007, 00:02
wow, your thread just been blasted, lusted...
Which thread is that?
Which thread is that?
Im lost.
nothing unusual today/yesterday, just putting some former members in coventry list... /C22.
It´s a disgrace what they, ON and some collaboratores, are doing to this fine forum which I´ve visited several years from the Shogun days. And I wanted to remain neutral in this conflict, but realised that it was impossible to stay untouched and look the other way around...And when "they" started to remove threads and posts, well, that was enough for me. I´m only sad that some of the moderators have chosen to go ON:s way... /C22.
Manstein16
01-21-2007, 00:25
It´s a disgrace what they, ON and some collaboratores, are doing to this fine forum which I´ve visited several years from the Shogun days. And I wanted to remain neutral in this conflict, but realised that it was impossible to stay untouched and look the other way around...And when "they" started to remove threads and posts, well, that was enough for me. I´m only sad that some of the moderators have chosen to go ON:s way... /C22.
From what I can tell, the only mods remaining are either (a) members-in-exile who were brought back by Horse Archer and ON to support their policies (such as Honor & Glory), and (b) novice members who exploited the situation and are now mods as a result. Sadly, Horse Archer has forced everyone to choose sides: either you're with him or you're against him. Anyone even expressing tolerance of the new community on the boards is punished swiftly.
Yes I´ve noticed that...but Archer...I thought first, and especially since his thread were he "spoke clearly" about the conflict, that he was tied up or overrunned by ON, but since he still in a leading position back at TWC, then he is apparantly in to this split of the community... /C22.
Bigfooted
01-21-2007, 00:38
well, i noticed entire sections of forums just 'dispearing'
So i started a thread titled 'ok, what the hell is going on now'
That then 'vanished' so i started antoher one.
Then i got dumped on the block list.
Its not just dissent they are crushing.
They are attempting to wash away any evidence of anything taking place at all.
So, someone has registered the "totalwarhorde.com" domain and has redirected it to twcenter.net? You are dealing with some rather, shall we say, very immature people, with far too much time on their hands. You had registered .net on the 16th of this month as far as I can tell. Your opposition seem to have registered the .com domain today on a one year lease. You were caught napping a bit there. You should have registered .net .com and .org as quickly as possible.
I think it's highly probable that you're being observed here also. The .com domain was probably registered and redirected after noticing the accidental link in one of your posts on this thread. This is also why they're filtering certain words over there and turning you into "ghost" members. It seems rather futile to me, as people will find out about your new site eventually anyway.
Bigfooted
01-21-2007, 00:42
oh, and my apologies for double posting. but i dont seem to able to edit my posts...
The staff memebers now, are all simple people who became mods.
Including a homophobe, who publically 'insulted' many members calling them homosexuals and largely flamed to high heaven. after that incident he became a moderator.
Antoher new moderator. is a user who got in seroius trouble on the .com for Repeated and unabated CA bashing and slander. he has done much the same on TWC. he is now also, a mod.
Anyway.
Lets hear for the ORG, and total war Horde ~:cheers:
The True total war community.
I can´t belive it! Someone (ON...) has bought the .com domain and redirected it to TWC...The story repeats itself from the RTR affair, where Tyr & Co. did the same, even if they owned the server at the beginning /C22.
antiochus epiphanes
01-21-2007, 01:03
well i got banned, along with lusted and spirit of rob, to see why i got banned PM me and ill show you, as posting here would be frowned apon haha
Boudicca
01-21-2007, 01:14
Totalwar horde. It's going to be my place. Please get this site to run swiftly. I would love to join a new forum, since the old one is dead.
spirit_of_rob
01-21-2007, 01:16
at LT H&G is defiantly back on staff even if it says he isnt because he just banned me for asking why he had the ability to delete threads again :laugh4: and i spent so long making sure it was polite!
Caravel, you´re right, It would have been best if those taking care of the new domain would have reg. the other big domains also. The opportunity is lost, but I belive in the power of the "djungle drum"...So I think that this "strategic move" by someone at TWC will hit back sooner or later as this is indeed a very immature act, which every intelligent person will agree on. /C22.
ho hum. My account has been deleted. I clearly was much more dangerous than I thought. Still, being assassinated has a certain appeal.
oh, and my apologies for double posting. but i dont seem to able to edit my posts...
The staff memebers now, are all simple people who became mods.
Including a homophobe, who publically 'insulted' many members calling them homosexuals and largely flamed to high heaven. after that incident he became a moderator.
Antoher new moderator. is a user who got in seroius trouble on the .com for Repeated and unabated CA bashing and slander. he has done much the same on TWC. he is now also, a mod.
Anyway.
Lets hear for the ORG, and total war Horde ~:cheers:
The True total war community.
There is also an extreme catholic(also history of flaming) and I think one of them is a rumanian nazi that once got suspended for making racist remarks but not sure if that was him.
Edit: yes, it is the nazi, Arbaces now known as Oroles.
It's good that we have this thread going on... I logged off for a day and found TWC upside down and modders clearing up their sub-forums... my sign gone and the links for the TWhorde removed... that's very cheeky and immature from their part :thumbsdown: I whish u guys very good luck and let's hope u can host the new site soon, I'm certainly going to be an active member since the mods I follow r leaving TWC :beam:
Manstein16
01-21-2007, 01:28
I'm still trying to figure out why I was ghosted. On no occassion did I flame or criticize anyone. I simply stated my support for a new site that focused more on the community.
:wall:
Ok, of course I know why I was ghosted. It's the complete lack of procedure or protocol that astounds me. It represents the arbitrary nature of rule that has taken over TWC. What a shame. I understand that forum politics can be a nuisance (thus the utter lack of them on virtually all community sites) but fail to understand why Ogre couldn't understand the very unique nature of the site he owns. Much of the draw to TWC is that it is different. Dozens of sites abound for the purpose of educating players on the intricit nature of the Total War series. TWC was so much more than that. And I say "was" because it is rather quickly being dismantled. A good idea of how many threads have been deleted can be ascertained by the fact that my post count dropped by over 100 overnight. It's a shame that an admin could be so myopic as to believe that erasing words equates to erasing the ideas behind them. He's scared, really; countless websites have been advertised on TWC over the years without consequence, while now the mere mention of "totalwarhorde.net" is enough to cause a member to be banned indefinitely. It is a sad, sad state of affairs.
I'm sorry to see that ON pulled a fast one and purchased TWH's .com counterpart. No matter. Word has gotten out quickly in ways that TWC's admins will not be able to halt until the damage is done.
Again, many thanks to everyone on the Org for allowing us to spend our time in the wilderness here. Your kindness will not be forgotten.
Artorius Maximus
01-21-2007, 01:30
I just happened to register there the day after all of that happened.
At first, I didn't know what was going on, then I found out.
Antagonist
01-21-2007, 01:38
This whole situation stuns me. Obviously the circumstances are ridiculous in themselves, but I don't understand why they go through this absurd tyranny of censoring members who "speak out" and even blanking out a normal word which has a perfectly legitimate use when discussing the game in order to prevent people finding out about any alternative. Not only is it completely futile (as people can just go here, or to the .com or wherever) but it's unnecessary and counterproductive. If they're so dead set on repackaging TWC as a generic forum, wouldn't they want the old guard to leave? Why not just say "OK we've taken control of the forum and are making changes, if you don't like it you can leave"?
It's bad enough that someone (whoever is really behind this) is bent on usurping an entire community whom not a few people have invested a significant part of their lives in for their own purposes, but this totalwar*****.net stuff is farcical.
Antagonist
Guys, about the .com site, I don't think there is any reason to be concerned, most people will find out that modders moved to totalwarhorde.net and most importantly modders do know each others and they will move (and most mods has their own web pages anyway). As it was with RTR domain some months ago.
Now atleast most modders (except for those working on new site) will have more time to spent modding :idea2:
About things on twcenter, I'll wait for some days(or weeks) with making conclusions who is playing what role and why is he playing that role.
About new site(to which I'm looking forward), I guess modders will know what environment they will need, one notice through - having mods sorted by for which version of RTW/RTWBI thay were made - I don't find this optimal, as some do work with both at some moment, so I would recommend joining them to one thread for all RTW.
Don't worry dude.
These guys know what they are doing.
The system they created on TWC worked well and I can imagine that it has the same system now.
Manstein16
01-21-2007, 01:55
I posted the following open letter to Horse Archer and Ogre on both TWC and Ogre's Network Forums. It took about 10 seconds for it to be deleted on the first and a few minutes for it to be deleted on the second. So I am taking the liberty of posting it here, in case the powers-that-be over on TWC are observing this forum (as has been suggested). I hope I step on no toes in doing so.
I have no doubt that this thread will be deleted within seconds of being posted and that I will be banished from this site soon afterwards. Indeed, I almost hope that this will happen, as such an action will simply prove my point. A 3rd person has informed me that I have been placed on the global ignore list, for reasons I cannot ascertain. I have never flamed any persons related to this site and, at worst, have politely disagreed with some of the actions various staff members have taken. At no point in time have I violated the ToS, nor been warned that my actions have done so. No matter: this message is not directed towards the community.
Horse Archer and Ogre, why do you fear the birth of a new TW fansite so? Anything associated with TotalWarHordes.net is automatically censored, as if the very name has acquired in odious conotation in the same manner that various 4-lettered words have. Members are banned for mentioning the new site. You have placed every member who has ever discussed the events of the last several days on a global ignore list, as if silencing them and erasing their posts is enough to erase your actions. A clever, if myopic, coup. Why are you so convinced that TW:H is a threat to TWC? Its (future) members have made no attempts to harm TWC through acts of cyber-vandalism or spam. Are you honestly so afraid that the formation of a more community-driven site to replace the one you have destroyed will effect your bottom-line? Is our competition really that worrisome? And if it is, if a mass exodus to another site really does result from your actions, then why have you insisted on using your heavy-handed ways to change TWC when it so obviously does not pander to the community-at-large, the very people who have made TWC so popular? If you truly are a businessman first, why have you insisted on depriving your customers of exactly that which they request?
Hopefully some sort of explanation will be proffered as to why you fear the creation of a new website so greatly, rather than hiding behind your virtual wall, retroactively changing the ToS to quash any and all statements that are not completely in adherence with the "party line," so to speak. If nothing else, it would help make this parting more amiable.
Regards,
Manstein16
wow, a thread that is still alive and even Archer cared to answer...
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=79820
/C22.
I nearly fell of my chair while reading this thread (have a close look at OTZ´s atavar): TWC Associations (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=79820)
could be deleted soon, so hurry ~D
Edit: Argh, Calle22 beat me to it...
Very well written Manstein, a pitty that it will not reach to a broader public at the TWC... /C22.
Seems twcenter.net is dead.
With leaders like TosaInu and Ser Clergane, this will never happen.I hope.
Bigfooted
01-21-2007, 02:12
I nearly fell of my chair while reading this thread (have a close look at OTZ´s atavar): TWC Associations (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=79820)
could be deleted soon, so hurry
its gone...
its gone...
I can see it.
O.k. now my post in OTZ:s thread was deleted where I asked Archer why "someone" at the TWC has redirected totalwarhorde.com to TWC. I mean it doesn´t suprise me that I was deleted, but I´m sure that (my speculation) a lot of people, including the leading figures at TWC knows about the redirection, more than they want to admit. So very Machaiavelli... /C22.
Manstein16
01-21-2007, 02:16
From the aforementioned thread:
Originally Posted by Manstein16
Several mods not found on TWC may be found at totalwarhordes.net.
Horse Archer: Which can be fine and can be linked once people give up raising hell here.
:dizzy2:
spirit_of_rob
01-21-2007, 02:19
so why ban anyone talking about it even if they dont give the adress the post is deleted! pathetic i have nothing but contempt for the whole lot of them especially the new moderators that took this chance to get some power at the exspence of people who actually know things
Thats hilarious, they´ve spent half of the day deleting any traces of totalwarhorde.net from their forums and now archer responded several times to a guy with a big fat totalwarhorde sign as his atavar. :stunned:
Nice, just got a caution point for promoting the Org :laugh4:
Hm, I think I wasn't agressive enough :whip:
[edit] lol, banned until 20 July 2007
Omnissiah
01-21-2007, 02:40
This whole situation is so baffling. I'm a member of several boards that have had the occasional political meltdown (adultswim.com, theforce.net, etc), but the thermonuclear fury on TWC (talk about total war!) is just weird.
What is up with ON's lunatic binge? I mean, if they want to change the site's format, that's fine...it's their website, they can do whatever they want to it. But this ironfisted, crypto-fascist whack-a-mole nonsense seems intentionally designed to disrespect and annoy their own customers! Where'd these guys study business administration? In clown college?
And Horsearcher's little Benedict Arnold move is weird too. I've dealt with Archer several times, and he's never been anything other than helpful and polite with me. I always thought him to be a friendly and even-keeled chap. These cybercommunist antics seem totally out of character for him.
It's just too weird. I can't get past the feeling that this whole fiasco is some kind of hoax, or a very unfunny joke.
It's too bad, I really liked that site. Oh well, viva la org!
Man, youa re a genious
:grin2:
antiochus epiphanes
01-21-2007, 02:48
but the thermonuclear fury on TWC (talk about total war!) is just weird.
What is up with ON's lunatic binge? I mean, if they want to change the site's format, that's fine...it's their website, they can do whatever they want to it. But this ironfisted, crypto-fascist whack-a-mole nonsense seems intentionally designed to disrespect and annoy their own customers! Where'd these guys study business administration? In clown college?
haha thats good, i think ill make that my sigg haha:laugh4:
yep, I agree BB, it´s indeed hilarious...I think they will get tired soon at this witch hunt, chasing around, cencoring everybody who aint agreeing with their methods. /C22.
Omnissiah
01-21-2007, 02:53
haha thats good, i think ill make that my sigg haha:laugh4:
Wow, immortalized on my first post! Whoop whoop!
:bow:
:laugh4: you´re retoric genious Omnissiah, lol, glad I´m not on your list of "Most hated people"... /C22.
spirit_of_rob
01-21-2007, 03:12
i like the "whack a mole" comment best hehe
A new thread from Sim:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=79835
/C22.
spirit_of_rob
01-21-2007, 03:15
erm little helpe for the banned ones please :dizzy2: just give me the gist of it
erm little helpe for the banned ones please :dizzy2: just give me the gist of it
Sim is asking us to calm down and don't break the ToS by spamming the TWC.
I note that Gaius Baltar has decided to make some insinuations about our new site. There will be no charge levied on the members.
spirit_of_rob
01-21-2007, 03:28
Sim is asking us to calm down and don't break the ToS by spamming the TWC.
I didnt they still banned me
I note that Gaius Baltar has decided to make some insinuations about our new site. There will be no charge levied on the members.
I misunderstood GB's post - at least I hope I did. I have PMed a moderator to remove it.
I didnt they still banned me
That's because ON thinks you are a threat to them.
And I think you should take that a compliment :2thumbsup:
Bigfooted
01-21-2007, 03:46
Nice, just got a caution point for promoting the Org :laugh4:
Hm, I think I wasn't agressive enough :whip:
[edit] lol, banned until 20 July 2007
banned for posting a link to the org?
They've really lost the plot....
wow, that´s to bad Roy:whip: Apparantly you were to aggresive :yes: /C22.
green tea
01-21-2007, 03:59
I have one question:
What are the possible motives for the owners and the current staff of the center for behaving like they do actually?
I mean- in a buissiness-way.
if they want to have a new site, isnt it much easier just to build a new?
Or is this too expensive?
When I read a story like good vs. evil, it always bores me when the evil ones dont have any plausible motives exept from "being evil, since I am the evil one".
What sense could be in working like that? What is the personal gain valued in money?
Maybe I am a little bit stupid or unexperienced, but could please anybody who sees any weird logic in it try to explain that.
I asked about the commercial aspect of Gaius Baltar´s comments regarding having links in the sig:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=79820&page=2
Meanwhile I reccived a PM from Archer exploring my IP under different nicknames, well, it´s not a problem for me to change IP several times per minut If I want to, but why in the h**l would I do that!? just for asking things at the forum?? I havn´t broke any rules christ... /C22.
banned for posting a link to the org?
They've really lost the plot....
That's what I got the warning point for.
Archer then deleted that post.
I posted again, and apparently I used too much of those guillotine emoticons :laugh4: --> ban
I have one question:
What are the possible motives for the owners and the current staff of the center for behaving like they do actually?
I mean- in a buissiness-way.
if they want to have a new site, isnt it much easier just to build a new?
Or is this too expensive?
When I read a story like good vs. evil, it always bores me when the evil ones dont have any plausible motives exept from "being evil, since I am the evil one".
What sense could be in working like that? What is the personal gain valued in money?
Maybe I am a little bit stupid or unexperienced, but could please anybody who sees any weird logic in it try to explain that.
It´s all about branding...An unknown site has a low value, but a site like TWC have a high value since it has a lot of visitors, no hard work for establishing the site at a target group = easier marketing = easy way of earning money...so... /C22.
A new/old moderator is back:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=79854
/C22.
O.k. regarding the link in my former post: some individuals in this "game" has to be mentally sick...and it´s not me...:thumbsdown: /C22.
But it seems as TWC has been sold to the community, since imb is a new site admin. But I´m not sure just yet...Let us hope so! /C22.
Bigfooted
01-21-2007, 05:13
It Is True.
The Coummunty will own Twcenter from now on.
It has been a long week.
Total War Center has had a long run--some of it good, some of it bad, but all of it exciting--and I'm happy to say that the site is going to live on. It's going to continue on being the great place that it has always been except under a different "ownership". I'd rather say banner, but ownership is more the precise term.
The transition period will probably take the rest of this month. And will slowly happen until things are completely transferred over to the new owners. During this period Ogre's Network will limit its day to day involvement with the site.
Ian Burgess, imb39 as most of you know him, is going to be taking over the site. After the transition period is done, Ogre's Network will relinquish all site operations to the new owner.
Ogre would like to appologize for many of the things that have happened over this past week. He really didn't want for things to go as they did. And for that he apologizes. Sorry guys.
I would like to thank the ORG for hosting this thread/section while the mess at TWC occured. Many Thanks! /C22. :2thumbsup:
AntiochusIII
01-21-2007, 05:48
So that's what they wanted, to sell it.
Makes sense. Clever, that. Goes wild, forces the community to buy it "back" somehow. Because the community is attached, someone among them will offer considerable price for a simple domain name to retain the existing order.
Though I've got to admit there might be repercussions involving negative word-of-mouth about Orge's Net from now on. And negative word-of-mouth in the geek circles is quite powerful...
:book:
Teleklos Archelaou
01-21-2007, 06:22
On a more serious note:
One thing I hope folks catch on to while here is that while the org doesn't have the type of poster/participant-led forum that some TWC refugees are desirous of (and should absolutely be able to set up if they have the funding and want to do it), is that it really is absolutely terrific for hosting mod development. I say this as an EB member for a couple of years now - we have the most complex and largest mod ever developed for the TW series, and if we've been very happy with it, I think it could work for almost anybody else too. With search engine functions a lot better now too than they were a year ago, our abilities to do pretty much whatever we want here, with no interference (nay, with help!) from the org staff. The only thing we still would like are larger inboxes for regular members (compared to twc they are quite small), but this is has not really limited us that much. It may not be exactly what you are looking for, but if you are looking for a place to develop your mod, this is the perfect spot. It might be *too* peaceful for some folks actually, but it has been wonderful for us - good traffic, no unsettling coups to potentially throw a wrench into development, and really a bunch of very friendly folks overall. A new place for TWC curiaphiles to engage each other will be great I think, but you won't find a place better to develop a mod, IMHO. Keep both in your bookmarks and visit often. :2thumbsup:
---------
edit: Hadn't read of the news of the sale when I posted this. Best of luck to the new owners, and if it's true I'll still keep visiting both frequently, but I do believe, as this upheaval has shown, that the stableness here has proven it to be an ideal place for mod development.
So that's what they wanted, to sell it.
Makes sense. Clever, that. Goes wild, forces the community to buy it "back" somehow. Because the community is attached, someone among them will offer considerable price for a simple domain name to retain the existing order.
Though I've got to admit there might be repercussions involving negative word-of-mouth about Orge's Net from now on. And negative word-of-mouth in the geek circles is quite powerful...
:book:
Actually the sale has been in the pipe work for some time, though events ensured a completion.
I want to extend my appreciation to the Org for their tolerating of our problems spilling into their domain.
I also want to thank Ogre for working with us in resotring the site. Lots of work is needed.
I would also like to thank many who helped in so many different ways with me directly. I wont mention names atm, but a list will be prepared!
Of course, I am also mindful of the great work the Community put in in helping for this transiotn to take place. Despite adversity being forced upon it, it responded. Admittedly excesses were made, but many were restrained. That was great to see.
Now we need to move into a healing phase. It will be very easy to keep animosity going etc but at the end of the day the site needed monitoring. I applaud them that they were prepared to do this in the teeth of a hostile community. No one should berate them, either publicly or privately. It will be looked on very sternly by me as it is quite unnecesaary and contrary to the values that we have.
I amn quite tired now. Emotional too. It is currently 5:30am and a long, difficult and fantastic day draws to an end. See you all in a couple of hours...
:help:
KukriKhan
01-21-2007, 07:01
I would like to thank the ORG for hosting this thread/section while the mess at TWC occured. Many Thanks! /C22. :2thumbsup:
:tries to make himself useful handing out blankets and
cups of hot coffee and cheese sandwiches:
I know these events are fresh, and difficult to completely digest right now; and that you're all waiting to re-migrate to another place; and that there are hard feelings to be navigated through.
I'm just wondering (as an individual guy, not as a staffer of the Org), while you're waiting, whether any of you think some good or important lessons can be learnt from this exercise?
About content ownership, for example.
Or work-group procedures.
Or anything. It's been a crisis; you guys survived. Maybe we can learn something from you. Or you from each other.
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-21-2007, 09:07
imb39 has purchased the forum, I'm not sure about him though, I've never heard of him till now - so is he, let's say, a Populares (pro-TWC and it's citizens) or an Optimate (pro-ON and it's staff).
Warluster
01-21-2007, 10:17
Wow, its just like in the movies.... a great Empire rises, then the invaders come, and despair.
*Crys as Godfather music plays*
I love the movie....
Spartacus-FIN-
01-21-2007, 10:43
Alright, could you update a bit now? I have no idea what's going on..:dizzy2:
Faenaris
01-21-2007, 11:57
I'm glad to hear that the TWC is coming through. There are a lot of talented modders over there, it would be a shame to lose them.
Oh, one suggestion: Please don't take the Curia too serious. Reading all the "if that change comes through, I'll resign" only to see the member return after 2 days, was a bit melo-dramatic.
Alright, could you update a bit now? I have no idea what's going on..:dizzy2:
Imb39 has bought TWC and ON will leave the forum.
We won :yes:
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-21-2007, 12:41
Imb39 has bought TWC and ON will leave the forum.
We won :yes:
Does that mean that you are all going back as heroic admins/moderators to reclaim you rightful home off the tyrants of ON?
Solon of Athens
01-21-2007, 12:44
There will be no retribution against anyone who were 'HG lovers'. New Admins, New Slate, New TWC!
And thanks guys, I never thought we could get so many people to spam the hell out of TWC with the link. My 10 threads truly were replaced with 100's more from the loyal members of TWC, kudos to you!
Omanes Alexandrapolites
01-21-2007, 12:53
What about the great new site. Will it ever be used?
the Black Prince
01-21-2007, 13:25
doubt it... the only reason we were setting up a new szite was because we didnt think ON were going to let go of our home.
@Kukri
in the last 18 months - 2 years, TWC's biggest problem is that its been owned and operated by network admin who knew nothing about the history of the site, or the community, didn't care, and didn't interact.
they'd come along one day, make some changes, and look surprised when the most active 200 members or so would all go up in arms and start screaming at them.
TWC was first created in September 2002. We're not as old as the Org, but we are a very well established site. Some of the senior members, myself included have been on the site 3 years or more. We have our traditions, our ways of doing things, and above all our site administrators underlying ethos has always been, For The Community. A website run for the community, by the community.
ON always viewed TWC just as another small part of their network that they could do what they liked with. Of course, they could do this. But by not listening to the people at all, they caused problem after problem. The site staff had the hardest time... ON weren't around all the time, but the site admins rarely had the full admin privilidges to run the site efficiently.
The Curia forms the heart of the community ethos at TWC.
I know you all groan when i said it, but TWC isn't run as a government, TWC politics isn't politics in any form of government sense. The Curia is the place where the leading community members, the citizens of the site, have their say on site actions. Over the years since the Curia has been in existance, a great many things have been achieved by it. I don't deny either that its been a source of problems. The staff, for the most part, (with maybe 3 exceptions) have always tried to do what they thought best for the community, and respect the Curia, but they were constantly blocked by the network who kept making network decisions that while they may have worked on the largly dead other sites in the network, just didn't work on a site the size of TWC.
Their latest idiocy was what they called a 3 tier administration system
Network Admins (ON Staff)
Site Admin (1 head of site)
Junior Site Admin (2 assistant head of site)
at the time, TWC had not 3, but 7 administrators, each with a different area of responsibility. Reducing that to 3 would have put an incredibly burden of work on the 3 remaining, and to make it harder, we still wouldn't have been able to rely on the network admins for the technical side of things. they've just never been there for us.
What have we learnt? That for a site to function, the people in charge need actually be interested and work for the site, and not expect the site to listen to you. That the power of the members can never be underestimated. At the height of these troubles, 80% of our top community members, all the mods, most of the modders, and an amazing number of normal members were all willing to head off to our new site. That would have left ON with a bunch of spammers and new people. The very centre of TWC will always be the members.
Now, we have an admin team drawn entirely from the community, a leader who's a long standing very well respected community member, and a series of events that if anything have drawn the community closer together.
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