Attack dogs.

[HumphreysCraig00]

What bonuses do attack dogs have? As I have just had 3 hastatii and 3 triarii completely destroyed by a single attack dog unit charge and I am just wondering if this is supposed to happen or was a crazy glitch?

[HumphreysCraig00]

I know spearmen have an disadvantage against infantry, is it exacerbated when fighting dogs as that may explain it as the triarii took huge quick losses then routed which made the hastatii rout and the charge carried on over them and thats what completely destroyed them.

So Should I avoid dogs with spearmen then?

[Orb]

There is that other 'minor' issue that men don't actually attack dogs properly.

[Severous]

Hi

Dogs are quite strong. Taking down 6 Roman units is real bad luck. I dont consider the dogs that strong.

Dogs are called cavalry units during the game. So Ive always assumed they do bad against spears and relatively OK against swords. Never tested it though.

Dogs go after one target unit and keep chaisng it until its killed every last person in that unit. Only then does it go after another nearby unit. So I suspect the dogs collided with your other units rather than deliberately went and attacked them. Dogs cause morale problems. Accidental combat and morale problems...enough to start a chain rout ?

[HumphreysCraig00]

One unit of attack dogs attacked my 3 units of triarii at once propably as it was a siege and I put upto 3 units of the same kind on the same spot in sieges so theyre taking up the same space, As far as im aware puts more of my men in contact at any one time.

The Hastatii were killed simply because any unit routing near them routs them too for me and they were behind the triarii, the dogs just ran over them, presumably I had the flash hired as a triarii and he pegged it

So this is likelu a glitch and I shouldnt adapt my methods to avoid it then.

[quoteThere is that other 'minor' issue that men don't actually attack dogs properly.[/quote]

How dont they?

[antisocialmunky]

Owww... The best way to deal with dogs, as is the best way to deal with anything, is make them charge into a phalanx.

Also, routing units get roadkilled by faster units. If you ever seen a chain rout on a bridge... yeah... You can get 1000s of kills that way with any cavalry unit.

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Hi there,
Wardogs are the ultimate fearsome weapon. They really shouldn't be used for actual hard combat, unless you are letting them loose against peasants. The moment you see an enemy unit wavering or starting to feel unstable in their current situation, unleash those cute little doggies on them to really make them feel the fear. Once the handlers have let the brutish dogs go, hit the withdraw button so that the handlers flee from the field. This keeps them alive for the next battle. Those dogs will chew their way through routing enemies without any further prompting from you, leaving you free to concentrate on spreading the rout.

The war dog's special ability is that it causes morale penalties in nearby enemies. This can cause them to rout. However, they cannot really be used for destroying three Hastatii and three Trarii. That would just be almost impossible unless the dog army was either much larger than your army and was fresh or your troops were very tired and were on the very verge of routing. Another reason why it could have happened is that you were playing on a high battle map difficulty level. In that case the AI gets epic sized bonuses on the attack of their troops. I hope that this helps you figure out what happened. Cheers.

[HumphreysCraig00]

Do you actually have to withdraw the handlers as in my experiments to see what caused the triarii to suck I found out that the dogs dieing effected the morale of the handlers and if alot of the dogs died the handlers routed without taking a single casualty.

I am on very hard and my entire force except for the 120 strong hastati were winded, the dogs were fresh, but my general (6*) was close enough for them to be encouraged by his something or other.

My triarii did take huge losses, you know the quick flash then numbers do to indicate near rout, each time it flashed visible the number was 10 -15 men lower.

The rout/massacre happened so quickly my general couldnt move the 40 or so feet to engage before the entire 6 units were destroyed.

dont know why the triarii did so badly though, its not that theyre infantry, and its not that thier weapon class is light, and its not thier spearmen status, and theyre reasonably heavily armoured which is supposed to semi negate dogs so how did they cause so many casualties...

I think I have right before the battle saved, though I may have saved over it, I will replay and see if I can get it to happen again

[Squid]

The reason units don't attack the dogs properly is that if you tell a unit to attack the dogs, they leave the dogs and go after the handlers is what appears to be happening.

[dacdac]

have you ever made a full stack army of war dogs. i did and took out thousands of troops on full cahrges. as long as you withdraw the handlers, you should be well off. i never had a battle last longer than 2 minutes b/c of mass routing.

[General-Winter]

Another reason why it could have happened is that you were playing on a high battle map difficulty level. In that case the AI gets epic sized bonuses on the attack of their troops.

Was wondering why cavalry charged into my Pahalanx and came out alive. Is there a mod or somthing for hard level AI to simply receive getting 'intelligence' instead of getting +20 to charge? Been trying harder difficulty settings but am getting slaughtered pratcically every time. I'm thinking I just need to revise my higher difficulty tactics.

In relation to the topic at hand, an angry dog is a damned scary sight. Let alone one with rabies. I can easily see what happened to your poor Hastati. "Oh don't worry about the dogs, Marcus." "Are you sure?" "Of cour- -gack!" Of course, I've never seen them rout six units. Is there a way to know if AI units are upgraded or not?

[antisocialmunky]

No, not really.

[HumphreysCraig00]

have you ever made a full stack army of war dogs. i did and took out thousands of troops on full cahrges. as long as you withdraw the handlers, you should be well off. i never had a battle last longer than 2 minutes b/c of mass routing.

I have in custom battle mode, they actually didnt do very well (all the dogs died) but I did have them against a Pretorian army.



an angry dog is a damned scary sight. Let alone one with rabies.

In reality I dont find angry dogs frightening, If I growl at them as they growl/bark at me they generally get confused and scared, the ones that dont run off then I leave and the ones that go for me I kick in the head until they run off.

People are surprised by how little I regard dogs as threats. Ive never seen a rabies dog though so that may scare me I dont know.



Is there a mod or somthing for hard level AI to simply receive getting 'intelligence' instead of getting +20 to charge?

Darth mod is supposed to from what ive been told but its only ever made the AI stupider when ive tried it.

A Phalanx... LETS RUN INTO THE SPEARS WEEEEEEEEEEE


If you want a challenging battle online play is the only real option.

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Was wondering why cavalry charged into my Pahalanx and came out alive. Is there a mod or somthing for hard level AI to simply receive getting 'intelligence' instead of getting +20 to charge? Been trying harder difficulty settings but am getting slaughtered pratcically every time. I'm thinking I just need to revise my higher difficulty tactics.
Sadly there is no mod that effects AI, it is unfortunately hardcoded in R:TW. However, DARTH's formations pack could help. It doesn't effect the AI directly, but it causes it to manage it's army much more efficiently by forcing it to use more tactical formations.

In relation to the topic at hand, an angry dog is a damned scary sight. Let alone one with rabies. I can easily see what happened to your poor Hastati. "Oh don't worry about the dogs, Marcus." "Are you sure?" "Of cour- -gack!" Of course, I've never seen them rout six units. Is there a way to know if AI units are upgraded or not?
I think that there is, but only to know how much experience they have, not if their weapons and armour are improved. When on the battle map click the pause button and then simply double click on a unit. In the statistics column on the top left side of the page there is a category which says "experience". The higher that is then the higher the units defence skill and attack is. Cheers!

[Primus_Pilus]

Several things of note on Wardogs:

1) They don't fair well against phalanax/hoplite units... Triarii aren't considered a hoplite/phalanx unit persay since they are actually the senior footsoldiers... they fight more like principes than Hoplites. So, moral, don't use wardogs on hoplites unless they have already been engaged.

2) Wardogs are AWESOME for elephants. If you're in the south fighting Carthage/Egypt or Nubia, consider one or two cohorts a must. Just set some cavalry or infantry loose on the elephants, and then let slip the dogs of war.

3) Wardogs are great support units for large infantry/archery legions. Frankly, you should have a set of them in a legion anywhere... south is best, though.

~Primus

[TosaInu]

Hello,

I played online against a skilled player in RTW, it was a friendly match. He used a strong Carthagian army, I had 20 wardogunits. The dogs ate his entire army, until his warelephant entered the stage. All 20 dogunits were then destroyed by 1 elephantunit.

That was the first patch, so things may be different now.

[HumphreysCraig00]

I played online against a skilled player in RTW, it was a friendly match. He used a strong Carthagian army, I had 20 wardogunits. The dogs ate his entire army, until his warelephant entered the stage. All 20 dogunits were then destroyed by 1 elephantunit.

I'll bet that was annoying lol

Still Im fairly sure any number of dogs wont have a chance against an elephant due to the elephant being huge with thick skin

[TosaInu]

I'll bet that was annoying lol


We're both shocked, yet amused, in turn. Him about his tough army being eaten by 20 dogunits, then me about his one :elephant: trampling all my dogs.

The dogs were barking and jumping as if there was a cookie in the trunk.

[Roman_Man#3]

People are surprised by how little I regard dogs as threats. Ive never seen a rabies dog though so that may scare me I dont know.

Dogs don't bother me that much, and concerning that rabies part, have you ever seen the movie Cujo? I thought it wouldn't be that scary, because its just a dog. But, something about the plot and the setting is so creepy, I don't think I would be able to look at a rabid dog the same way again.


http://www.leffa-arviot.com/arvostelut/c/cujo/01.jpg

[HumphreysCraig00]

Never seen Cujo no, what is it?

[Poulp']

the story of a dog, one big and mean.

Cujo is not man's best friend.

by Stephen King

[guineawolf]

when playing my germania campaign in large scale unit size,i did use a dogs army with 1 General,1 gothic cavalry and 18 warhounds(40 soldiers with 120 unit size,60 denarii upkeep each warhound squad).I use those dogs to defeat a full stack army of roman legionaire.

If i not mistaken,i fight that roman army when i siege Rome,those puppies chasing 2 roman general into the city after completely exterminate those legions,boiling oil killed so many puppies and still killed that 2 roman general.:laugh4: :2thumbsup:

[guineawolf]

Several things of note on Wardogs:

1) They don't fair well against phalanax/hoplite units... Triarii aren't considered a hoplite/phalanx unit persay since they are actually the senior footsoldiers... they fight more like principes than Hoplites. So, moral, don't use wardogs on hoplites unless they have already been engaged.

2) Wardogs are AWESOME for elephants. If you're in the south fighting Carthage/Egypt or Nubia, consider one or two cohorts a must. Just set some cavalry or infantry loose on the elephants, and then let slip the dogs of war.

3) Wardogs are great support units for large infantry/archery legions. Frankly, you should have a set of them in a legion anywhere... south is best, though.

~Primus
Yeah! don't use dogs go straight to hoplites/phalanxes,but you can try to hold that hoplite with other units or 1 of your puppies,then send other dogs to the hoplite weak point(their flankand thier back)and release them.Even the mightiest spartan hoplite have to die!!:beam:

[Caliburn]

One thing about wardog units is that they can gain huge amounts of experience easily without any losses - at least that's what I found in first two of my campaigns - didn't bother with the dogs in later games, as training up and using dogs with 3 golden chevrons seemed too cheap to me. Phalanx units seemed to rout pretty quickly as well (while not taking too many casualties if they're at least decent quality) as long as you manage to get the dogs to charge the flanks.

I guess the handlers have exactly the same stats as the dogs? A disturbing thought somehow...

[lottrbacchus]

just a quick thought- you said your general is 6* which is great. but did you check to make sure he doesn't have overall negative moral effect? some traits that help with moral at first then become negative. i think bloodthristy is one of them. if general has negative moral effect, and add the negative moral from the dogs, your troops would rout very very quickly...

[fallen851]

In reality I dont find angry dogs frightening, If I growl at them as they growl/bark at me they generally get confused and scared, the ones that dont run off then I leave and the ones that go for me I kick in the head until they run off.

People are surprised by how little I regard dogs as threats. Ive never seen a rabies dog though so that may scare me I dont know.





Stupid omnivore. One day, you'll go to kick a dog in the head, and it will sidestep and leap for your neck. On it gets a hold, it won't let go, the dogs instincts will kick in as his teeth sink deeply into your veins until you stop struggling and die. It will be all over in a few seconds. Best thing is, it won't even be a big dog, a brittany spaniel or something.

Don't mess with dogs you don't know. I've heard plenty of horror stories from the local kennel. Dogs are a lot stronger than most people think once (not if) they get to you the ground by biting your tendon. You won't be so tough then.

Anyways, back on topic... wardogs are a lame part of the game, I suggest modding them out completely.

[César Victor]

Oooo, we have a PETA member in the forums! My girlfriend has a rottweiler- supposedly one of the fearcest dogs- which is a big wimp! If it growls at you, you just shout back. I don't condone kicking dogs but, honestly, some of them are built like walls and probably won't even feel it.

Anywho- I HATE wardogs. They tear cavalry apart. There's nothing more annoying than ordering a unit of cavalry to rush some enemy infantry only to see a group of bloodthirsty dogs hunting my horses hamstrings!

[Spajus]

I have a Staffordshire Bull Terrier.
I love him to bits, but I would put money on him over any biped you could put against him, if you stapled some bacon to him.

Love Wardogs in the game, love running through the streets of Rome with British packs of dogs. :)

[Caeser The III]

:wall: :whip: well there is a big weakness againt the dogs, warhogs