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Beren Son Of Barahi
03-21-2007, 05:10
linky here...! (http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/C69A1836-7E6D-4C5B-A242-9A9A9C46E76E.htm)

What do you people think?

i'll save my flower hugging views untill later...

got that for you below -Kukri



West meets Palestinian ministers


Mustafa Barghouti said that without occupation
there would be no need for resistance



In the first contact between the US and the recently formed Palestinian unity government, Jacob Walles, the US consul-general to Jerusalem, has met Salam Fayad, the Palestinian finance minister.

The EU also made its first contact with a non-Hamas minister but is unlikely to resume funding to it any time soon, EU officials said.




Tuesday's meetings came as Israel cancelled plans to meet the Norwegian deputy foreign minister after he held talks with the Palestinian prime minister.

Norway has recognised the new Palestinian government, restored full political and economic ties and called on Israel to work with it.






In separate statements, France and Austria signalled they would also take tentative steps towards official contact with non-Hamas members of the government.

Israel, however, says it will continue to shun the government, which is made up of Fatah, Hamas and several other smaller factions.

Economic boycott
Fayad, an independent, said his meeting with Walles was aimed at bringing to an end the economic boycott that has crippled the Palestinian territories and encouraged inter-faction fighting.

Micaela Schweitzer-Bluhm, spokeswoman for the US consulate, declined to confirm the meeting took place.


A spokeswoman for Javier Solana, the EU foreign policy chief, confirmed that the bloc's Middle East envoy, Marc Otte, had held talks on Tuesday in Gaza City with Ziad Abu Amr, the Palestinian foreign minister, an independent member of the cabinet.

Mustafa Barghouti, the minister of information and unity government spokesman, told Al Jazeera that the government was abiding by international law.

The new government has been repeatedly asked to renounce violence, to recognise Israel and to abide by previous peace agreements.

"We are ready to have a complete ending to all violence through the establishment of complete, comprehensive and reciprocal ceasefire with Israel," Barghouti said.

"We don't need resistance if there is no occupation.

"We are the oppressed. We are the people who are occupied. If there should be conditions, they should be put on Israel."

Financial aid



Resistance is a word that could be key in securing full recognition for the new Palestinian government.



Condoleezza Rice, the US secretary of state, has said some forms of resistance are tantamount to "terrorism" and refuses to deal with the new Palestinian government or to lift economic sanctions.



Palestinian officials have repeatedly called for an end to the international aid boycott, as the Gaza Strip spiralled into economic chaos and violence.

But officials said on Tuesday that the EU was in no hurry.


One official in Brussels said on condition of anonymity that the EU needed "to see real action from the government, and that won't happen from one day to the next".


The EU is by far the biggest aid provider to the Palestinians. It donated $900m last year, without any of the money reaching the Hamas government.


Most of the funds went through a temporary mechanism set up to provide fuel for hospitals and generators and pay temporary allowances to those most in need, and officials expect that to evolve.


Cristina Gallach, Solana's spokeswoman, said: "We'll keep using the mechanism for a while. It allows us to give aid. We're not going to close the door but we're not going to open it right up either."



Norway


However, Jonas Gahr Stoere, Norway's foreign minister, said the Palestinian coalition was a "historic event" whose alternative would have been continued violence in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank.


Raymond Johansen, Norway's deputy foreign
minister, met Ismail Haniya on March 19 [EPA]
Stoere told a news conference: "Norway will deal with members of the new Palestinian government as representatives of a broad and representative unity government."


He said it was "essential that the unity government gains control of the security situation ... and that the rocket attacks on Israeli areas cease".



"We particularly call on Israel to take a constructive approach to the unity government, for example, by releasing withheld Palestinian revenues from taxes and fees and by increasing the freedom of movement for the Palestinian population," he said.



Norway's left-of-centre government has had warm relations with the Palestinians and avoided using the word sanctions or boycott after Hamas gained power, although it placed "restrictions" on aid and other political contacts.



"On the basis of the new government's political platform, Norway expects the Palestinian authorities to respect basic international standards as regards compliance with previously concluded agreements, renunciation of violence and recognition of Israel's right to exist," Stoere said.



Stoere praised efforts by Mahmoud Abbas, the Palestinian president, to form the new government as well as efforts by Washington in forging ahead with peace efforts.



"We will continue to support President Abbas actively in his efforts to establish an independent Palestinian state free of occupation," Stoere said.







Source: Al Jazeera and agencies

Crazed Rabbit
03-21-2007, 05:59
Well, they haven't denounced violence or accepted Israel yet, have they? Seems like a change of paint, with the same old car underneath.

CR

HoreTore
03-21-2007, 14:53
Well, Israel still haven't accepted the rules of a democratic election yet, have they?

Tribesman
03-21-2007, 18:54
Well, they haven't denounced violence or accepted Israel yet, have they?
Why should they ? do you or your government accept Israel (what ever that means) ?

Scurvy
03-21-2007, 19:01
its a step in the right direction, hopefully the international community will start to work with the palestinian government to attmpt to resolve things now...

it seems to me that by not working with the previous government they were punishing the palestinian public or excercising their democratic right...


Well, they haven't denounced violence or accepted Israel yet,

I dont think they have too, they know that they will have to negotiate with Israel under any circumstances, perhaps through a neutral, similarly if diplomatic events progress the violent aspect may well decline --> they maintain both to keep the (anti-israel) palestinian public's support

:2thumbsup:

Crazed Rabbit
03-21-2007, 19:03
Accepting the existence of the State of Israel, tribesy. :rolleyes:

Sheesh.

CR

Tribesman
03-21-2007, 19:31
Accepting the existence of the State of Israel, tribesy.

Sheesh.

Ah right , thats explained it then . So simple really when you think about it .
thanks Rabbit :2thumbsup:




But hold on there .....accepting the existance of a State ? a State is one of those things with borders isn't it , could you tell me where the borders of this State are ?
It must have them to be a State , so where are they ?
I'm a bit confused on this but since you clearly know since you accept it and think that not accepting it must be some sort of crazyness , where is there them border thingies to be found ?

If thats too complicated for you then could you tell me why your government hasn't got its Embassy and Ambassador in the place this State calls its Capital city ? Doesn't it recognise it or could they just not find it ?

Sheesh rabbit :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:

BTW has your government or yourself denounced violence ? or is it a case of only denouncing some violence :hmg:

Crazed Rabbit
03-21-2007, 20:20
its a step in the right direction, hopefully the international community will start to work with the palestinian government to attmpt to resolve things now...

it seems to me that by not working with the previous government they were punishing the palestinian public or excercising their democratic right...

I dont think they have too, they know that they will have to negotiate with Israel under any circumstances, perhaps through a neutral, similarly if diplomatic events progress the violent aspect may well decline --> they maintain both to keep the (anti-israel) palestinian public's support

:2thumbsup:

Punishing the palestinians for voting? That's rich. Just because the palestinians voted for terrorists, that doesn't mean the terrorists are any different. Why should Israel negotiate with an entity that wants to destroy it?

I think it funny you think it ok if terrorism against Israel continues while Hamas is 'negotiating', because Hamas has to keep the support of the palestinians, who elected terrorists. Doesn't really give much reason for Hamas to really negotiate anything that matters.

I don't think that's called negotiating in good faith.

Tribesy, if you want to try and debate semantics forever over a simple concept, have at it.

Crazed Rabbit

Tribesman
03-21-2007, 21:24
Tribesy, if you want to try and debate semantics forever over a simple concept, have at it.

whassup wabbit , questions too hard for ya ?
to describe acceptance of the state of Israel as simple concept is a truly astounding thing to say , absolutely astoundingly silly might be a good description .
But hey I shall go really easy for ya , since you found the last simple questions too complex .
You make an issue of of acceptance of the state , more than 30 states do not accept the state (though one of those is an unaccepted state aswell), another 68 only accepted or restored their acceptance 16 years ago.
But you have a problem mainly with one faction of one "government " not accepting the State and see that as a reason why the "government" should not be talked to with the aim of reaching a settlement .
So here are your two simple questions ........
Did Egypt accept the state before they were talking with Israel or did the acceptance come when the states sorted out their issues through talks ?
Did Jordan accept the state before they were talking with Israel or did the acceptance come when the states sorted out their issues through talks ?

Now it might appear that those two questions are pretty much the same , but due to a deal between the Hashemites and what was to become Israel from before independance there is a difference .:yes:

I wait with eager anticipation your answers to these simple questions about what you funnily describe as a "simple concept":laugh4:
Though somehow your "simple" view of a "simple concept" might put such simple questions beyond the reach of your comprehension .

Crazed Rabbit
03-21-2007, 22:15
whassup wabbit , questions too hard for ya ?


LOL. What's wrong, trolling getting a bit harder lately? :yes: :clown: :smash:

CR

Tribesman
03-21-2007, 23:19
LOL. What's wrong, trolling getting a bit harder lately?
Nope just an easy demonstration that your post and assertion was complete bollox , totally lacking in any thought or substance and hence completely undefendable .
Its what happens when you do a knee jerk response to something complex that you see as simple but that you don't actually see at all because of your preconceptions .
You see Rabbit when views are based on such bollox its very easy to put them down with minimal effort , if you want the trolling to be harder then you really need to work on your content .:yes:

Beren Son Of Barahi
03-21-2007, 23:48
Update: Link here: (http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/E8414734-7220-47B8-A158-1C91800B65FC.htm)

I have been following this issue since i was a boy, something so complex and bloody really got my attention. The issue is not so simple as one would see it, esp. through US, Israeli eyes. Whether Hamas are terrorist or freedom fighters doesn't matter, the fact that they supply and fund most of the schools, clinics and other community support structure in gaza is, as is the fact that parts of the west bank and gaza are controlled by an occupying force...

I think that Israel needs to give Hamas a carrot to get it to fully recognise Israel, this will happen in time as Hamas needs to have something to show for itself for all the progress it has made in moderating its actions and views. They have already said that they will uphold past accords, the are willing to sign long term ceasefires that will lead to a peace treaty if Israel stops its insane policy of targeted killings every time there is a ceasefire.

Israel needs to understand that they are not the victims here (the state not the people) and that the millions of poor starved and sick in the gaza and west bank are. Israel for too long has held the position of the high moral ground based on nothing what so ever...

Tribesman
03-22-2007, 00:06
The issue is not so simple as one would see it, esp. through US, Israeli eyes.
Which would be demonstrated by Rice doing her visit at the moment , talking to Isreal , pushing them to talk with with the PA , and also visiting the quartet for their talks with Israel to get the talks with the PA going , strangely two countries in the quartet don't accept Israel yet.
Perhaps they hadn't heard of rabbits wise view that not accepting Israel means you cannot talk ~:doh: