View Full Version : Medieval 2: Kingdoms - Expansion Discussion
(Moderators: I made a new thread as this is definite info from CA with pics and trailer, so everyone will read it instead of it being page 3 on the old thead. Ive included all the info we know from the old thread as well.)
Info from the Total War newsletter.
We are pleased to announce, after much speculation and guess work on the part of the community, the arrival of the new expansion pack for Medieval II: Total War. Kingdoms will feature four new campaigns of the epic proportions fans have come to expect in Total War games. Britannia, The Crusades, The Teutonic Wars and The Americas finish off a thrilling line up of scenarios for even the most discerning of Total War players.
A host of new features accompanies the expansion. Some 23 playable factions join the melee, including Native American and European factions. In total more than 150 new units grace the battlefield, including the deadly Greek Flamethrower.
Kingdoms also features the ability to control multiple armies, including reinforcement armies, while new historical characters and events appear, such as the rise of titanic figures like William Wallace. With many new mission types, six new multiplayer scenarios and 20 new custom battle maps, Kingdoms is a fantastic addition to Med II that will satisfy any fan of the game.
Screenshots:
http://downloads.sega-europe.com/downloads/totalwar/newsltr_screens/20070330/King_Americas2.jpg
http://downloads.sega-europe.com/downloads/totalwar/newsltr_screens/20070330/King_Britannia5.jpg
http://downloads.sega-europe.com/downloads/totalwar/newsltr_screens/20070330/King_Crusades3.jpg
http://downloads.sega-europe.com/downloads/totalwar/newsltr_screens/20070330/King_Crusades.jpg
http://downloads.sega-europe.com/downloads/totalwar/newsltr_screens/20070330/King_Teutonic.jpg
Trailer:
http://downloads.sega-europe.com/downloads/totalwar/newsltr_screens/20070330/Kingdoms_Trailer_Low.wmv
Info obtained from Gamestar magazine:
The Addon will contain 4 Campaigns, with new faction(bolded):
* Britain: With England, Wales, Scotland, Norway, Ireland.
* Crusade: Two Alliances vs. Each other: Jerusalem + Antiochia vs Egypt, Byzantines, Turks and all together vs. Mongols
* New World: Azteks, Maya, Apache,Tarasken, Chichimeken, Tlaxkalteken and Spanish Settlers under Cortez
* East Europe: With German Knights, Poland, Lithuania, Denmark, Novgorod
- Moats added around castles
- They also added "Special abilities" for the historical persons in the 4 campaigns: Richard I. can collect fleeing troups, Emperor Manuel of Byzanz can "confuse" enemy units, that they hit themself.
- The campaings have different targets and a different way of playing it. In the Eastern, the religion plays a big role (because of unrest and unit development -> u can only build teutonic knights in a catholic area) in the New world if you play the spanish have only few Units and you have to look for alliances and trading routes.
- More units on a battlefield.
- You can build Forts with water around it.... keep their position and which you also can conquer and use for urself.
- More + Different Mission Targets: A noble man apears and asks for your help in a combat. If you are successfull, your reward will depend to how you won (how many you killed).
- In the Britain Scenario you can make as enemy of England an alliance with renegate(?) english aristocrats. They ask for your help, to conquer a town. If you give them the town after the victory, they will found a new anti-english fraction "Allianz der Barone"!
Info from Wikiman:
This is a great post but a couple of things. The modders can make a killer game, there is no doubt about that but we can add and change features which will then provide an even more expansive platform for the modders to build on. We want the modders to have new toys despite our own fears that they become competition for us. We provided the depacker, we exposed variables to config files, we helped the modders to understand the mesh file format and we even paid for one of the mod forum moderators to fly out to Australia to see how stuff works up close at the end of Med 2.
We think of it like we are providing a sandbox with a huge bunch of cool toys inside. We set up some cool scenarios in the sandbox but ultimately we know they will be pulled apart and configured a 1000 different ways into different mods. Lets put it this way, the number of new subtle features that have been added to the campaign will keep the modders busy for a long time and I am sure they are going to stretch the game way beyond where we will end with Kingdoms.
OK Heroic abilities are only available in one campaign and only 5 (pretty sure it is 5) characters will ever have a heroic ability. If you think of how many generals there are on any one campaign then this puts it in perspective.
As someone earlier said generals all didn't have equal abilities. Some were masters of the battlefield and both sides standing there facing each other knew it. We have just gone someway to represent this. This is one feature out of about 100 added to Kingdoms, I am looking forward to you guys feedback on them once the information starts to flow.
Rock on,
-wikiman
My own personal thoughts:
It sounds very interesting. I like the idea of the different campaigns, and all the new factions we will get. Plus it looks like they are putting more work into the interfaces, and i can't wait to see the greek flamethrowers in action.
Quickening
03-30-2007, 16:52
Great stuff! Thank you Lusted!
a lot of information Lusted!A very big thank you :)
Kingdoms also features the ability to control multiple armies
That should be cool. No more AI reinforcements in the add-on maps.
IPoseTheQuestionYouReturnTheAnswer
03-30-2007, 17:19
I'd get this just for the American campaign alone. Sounds very nice. Hopefully someone will be able to mod all these factions into the Grand Campaign (or some.) Ha, it's not even out and I'm already asking for a mod!
Wow, looks amazing, and the Flamethrowers are at the very end of the trailer.:2thumbsup:
Another expansion that looks like it has great new additions, especially on the graphics side of things(just watch the trailer, beautiuful fortresses with water:sweetheart: ).
Ok, for now I am looking forward to the patch, but I think that will be a very nice expansion
I do wonder whatt he patch will consist of, as if it sorts the game out finally, i might actually ahve to buy M2.
As for the expansion itself, nice one :2thumbsup:
I like the fact that it isnt JUST one new campaign, but 4 mini ones instead, should pose a lot of oppurtunities for fun! :laugh4:
Furious Mental
03-30-2007, 17:37
Looks tasty.
I'm already thrilled about the American and Teutonic campaigns :2thumbsup:
Midnight
03-30-2007, 18:33
Hmm - looks intriguing. I'm not too sure about this 'special abilities' thing (they sound a out of place, IMO), but we'll see.
Thanks for the information!
For those concerned about the "Heroic Abilities" feature, it has already been stated that they will only exist in 1 of the new campaigns and even then only 5 generals will have them. They will not be common by any means.
adembroski
03-30-2007, 18:50
*rubs hands together* I was thinking I might get this just for the modding tools for DL:TW, but now that I look at it... I dunno, just seeing Krak de Chevalier on that map is exciting... the mini-campaigns seem interesting.
Okay, now I've watched the trailor... OMFG!!!! I'm excited now.
Alexander the Pretty Good
03-30-2007, 19:32
Can't wait for the Eastern Europe campaign; I have a killer book on the Teutonic Order at home.
Special abilities? ~:rolleyes: Not necessary. The AI won't use it properly and it's just another tool to beat
The trailer is ridiculous; I never knew the Byzantines had invented the WW2 flamethrower. :laugh4:
Hopefully they add the tools to make new units on the battlefield. Until they do that, they aren't really helping the modding community that much.
CA is still going to get my money, so don't counterflame me. ~;p
The trailer is ridiculous; I never knew the Byzantines had invented the WW2 flamethrower.
As ridiculous as it may seem its true, the greeks did have a weapon like that.
Wow, this looks really nice :)
The trailer is ridiculous; I never knew the Byzantines had invented the WW2 flamethrower.
The Byzantines used hand-pumped flamethrowers for their Greek Fire.
Are all you guy's serious? This expansion just doesn't sound that good to me.
Will any of the mini campaign factions be playable in the Grand Campaign? If not this expansion will be crap.
But as long as at least mabye half of the new faction are playble in the Grand Campaign I will be happy.
King of Kings
03-30-2007, 19:49
Nice work it looks great.
Will any of the mini campaign factions be playable in the Grand Campaign? If not this expansion will be crap.
But as long as at least mabye half of the new faction are playble in the Grand Campaign I will be happy.
I doubt it, they will only likey be in the mini-campaigns.
And yes we are all serious.
Quickening
03-30-2007, 19:51
Are all you guy's serious? This expansion just doesn't sound that good to me.
Will any of the mini campaign factions be playable in the Grand Campaign? If not this expansion will be crap.
But as long as at least mabye half of the new faction are playble in the Grand Campaign I will be happy.
Eh? If everything works well then this will easily be the best expansion for a Total War game yet.
I doubt it, they will only likey be in the mini-campaigns.
And yes we are all serious.
What about all the new units? How many of them will be in the Grand Campaign?
Probably none if its like BI for RTW. Most of the new units are for new factions.
Just look at BI and VI, one thing CA don't do is produce half assed expansion packs. Xehh, xpacks for TW are normally new campaigns, not "heres some more units and a new faction" like say Dawn of War: Winter Assault was.
It sounds great for singleplayer. Very cautious about how a 5 faction era will work n mp, especially if they continue the trend of not enabling mirror matches. Will need a good review from mp community for CA to get my money.
Still kinda annoyed its not ____ Invasion though, always liked traditions :shame:
VI added new units, and made factions playable, I did also add a new campaign...but if this expansion is only going to add stuff to the new campaigns...ah what's the point in arguing I don't care I'll probably buy it anyway.
Believe me this is better than BI. 4 different campaigns, each focusing on a different area, with different factions and different gameplay is very good expansion.
wow, Baltic Crusades, who would have thought that
Hmmm... My reaction is mixed. Overall it looks .. promising.
The one thing that I am not too terribly pleased about are the moat implementations. I was expecting something like a drawbridge or a "fill in the moat" type piece of siege equipment to handle this, instead there's a land bridge that's always passable at one or more points. Oh well, at least it appears to serve a real function to force siegers to break through the main gates, thus providing a means of funneling and controlling entry points.
Greek flamethrower units look interesting as well. Hopefully they will have a major impact on morale like they should.
Welshmen!
What more could you ask for?
Yay for not being able to edit my posts...
I forgot to ask, is there a ballpark release date for this, yet?
FactionHeir
03-30-2007, 20:48
Yay for not being able to edit my posts...
I forgot to ask, is there a ballpark release date for this, yet?
Best not to ask that or it will be rushed out the door and we can wait merrily for patches!
King Bob VI
03-30-2007, 20:52
Possibly one of the greatest ideas for an expansion ever. I cannot wait.
Tristrem
03-30-2007, 20:53
Overall I think this is a major step forward in expansion creation. I am a little sketchy about flamethrowers, but the Romans do look more interesting. I think this idea of small maps with focused conflicts is the right path to take as it has been a success in the past (STW, and VI). Besides I think it is more realistic for a final goal to be control of Britain, the baltic or the holy land, not all of europe. anyways it looks good, and I look forward to playing the Romans, and the Teutons.
Hmm - looks intriguing. I'm not too sure about this 'special abilities' thing (they sound a out of place, IMO), but we'll see.
Thanks for the information!
I second, I really don't want "special abilities" to affect an already great game. I also believe that they are out of place and will hinder the game, not make it better. I am glad its only in two expansions campaigns and not all of them. As far as everything else, it looks nice but I hope CA reads the forums here and fix the messes before adding more.
I am worried however, with so much added, that more bugs will be rampant and some features will be broken. I surely hope not. All in all, it does look impressive as long as its somewhat realistic (The key factor of the Total War games) and "could actually had happen in real life" as CA is known to publish and design. As much as I love the TW games, I will jump off the first stop if they add wizards/spells/build orders in a battle and campaign mode. I love this game, truly, but I surely hope they don't make it worst by adding too many ingredience to an already good entree.
Is everyone kidding on the expansion being crap. I just added a minute ago about not being into the whole "Special" ability thing but as a whole, I will buy this expansion. I mean come on, does anyone play anything else? I almost quit playing even CS with my stepson and will only play that OTHER game when he asks me. M2TW is all I play when I have free time.
Quickening
03-30-2007, 21:21
Is everyone kidding on the expansion being crap. I just added a minute ago about not being into the whole "Special" ability thing but as a whole, I will buy this expansion. I mean come on, does anyone play anything else? I almost quit playing even CS with my stepson and will only play that OTHER game when he asks me. M2TW is all I play when I have free time.
I want to play other games but I end up thinking about M2TW whilst playing them which is a bit annoying.
I have so many games that barely get given a chance because of M2TW. Ive just ordered STALKER and I bet I'll play it for about an hour before starting a new M2TW campaign.
Discoman
03-30-2007, 22:35
Looks great. I hope they don't rush the game. The idea of 4 seperate campaigns in specific moments in time is good. I can't wait to take over the British isles as Ireland or Wales! The American campaign is nice and I hope I can actually forge allainces with native tribes. I also wonder of you can also list foriegn aide. IE playing as the Kingdom of Jerusalem you can get the pope to call Crusades to help you. Or playing as the colonial Spanish requesting aid from the motherland. Also Byzantine Flamethrower = cool. Except I don't think it had that far of a range. Also I notice boats in the backround in on of the battles, landing battles?
I love the idea of the four smaller, more focused campaigns, especially the Baltic and the Crusades...
Also, this just provides the excellent modding community that much more to work with regarding units and features etc. Can't wait!
Valdincan
03-30-2007, 23:46
Looks great.
I forgot to ask, is there a ballpark release date for this, yet?
Autumn 2007 according to the official press release.
I guess we'll get it for x-mas :P
this looks frickin' awesome. i like the idea of several, smaller campaigns - it's almost like VI x4! this is way better than another stupid "invasion" pack that's already been done. a promising direction for the tw series, i think.
the teutonic knights looks wicked. i can't decide which campaign i'll play first.
also, i really like how the game was just announced and people are already bitching about it. maybe wait for it to come out? i know you like to whine and all, but holy smokes...
hellenes
03-31-2007, 01:26
this looks frickin' awesome. i like the idea of several, smaller campaigns - it's almost like VI x4! this is way better than another stupid "invasion" pack that's already been done. a promising direction for the tw series, i think.
the teutonic knights looks wicked. i can't decide which campaign i'll play first.
also, i really like how the game was just announced and people are already bitching about it. maybe wait for it to come out? i know you like to whine and all, but holy smokes...
Sadly after its released and you bought it youve already been tricked...they got your money...
The more demanding you are about a product the better service youll get...
true, i suppose. but talking about how the game sucks horribly seems a tad excessive to me when it's not, you know, actually finished.
Barbarossa1221
03-31-2007, 02:31
I really REALLY want to play as the Native-Americans, looks frickin sweet. The rest of the new stuff looks pretty good to.
And the Flamethrowers, I knew the Byzantines used them on their ships at sea but on land? I didn't know they went that far...
Autumn 2007 according to the official press release.
Thanks!
Has anyone else noticed the different interface style for each different campaign?
A very minor, but nice touch.
Ignoramus
03-31-2007, 02:48
This looks very promising. I wonder if it will be possible for modders to include more than one campaign in the game now? It would be nice for some of the major mods(MA and MTR) to be able to include eras.
candelarius
03-31-2007, 02:58
I was blown away by RTW, and didn't think a game could get better.
Then, I was blown away, far away, by M2TW, and didn't think a game could be better.
...with this expansion, I'm speechless. Good god, with four new campaigns, I'll be playing this game for years to come! And I wonder if they'll make a second expansion like this one? I can only hope.
The Teutonic Knights are spot-on perfect. Indeed, they look lifted directly out of the Osprey history books. Actually, I have an Ignite Action Figure that looks EXACTLY like one of the Knights in the Gamespot screenie. Wow.
The new castle forts are also really cool. I just hope they are buildable in the core grand campaign.
Great job CA, I'll be the first to pre-order this one! :yes:
Hell, I was expecting just another VI, and I was still expecting to be happy, now we're getting VI, the Crusades, the Baltic Crusades, AND America!? Oh god, everything looks so great. And I hope those compact moated forts means an end to the wooden fort! (For us who have enough Florins, that is!)
I can't believe people are complaining about this expansion, why don't you go by any other standard RTS expansion and then complain? Most expansions are usually "ZOMG, WE'Z GOTZ 6 NEW UNITS, BUY NOWZ" You're getting 150 new units, 4 focused, awesome campaigns, new in game features, and more mechanisms the modders can mess with! Not to mention, that trailer was perfect in terms of presentation. M2TW reassured me that Total War will continue to be dominant in the "Epic War" genre, and this expansion sure is making me stick to that statement.
Ivan_the_Terrible
03-31-2007, 08:39
Looks interesting. I think I will reserve my opnion until I actually play it.
I am wondering though, do all the new factions just use the extra, unfilled of the 31 faction slots, or do they bring their own?
So potentially, there could be an opportunity for modders to add many, many more factions to the grand campaign. And honestly, its this possibility that excites me most at this stage.
Mailman653
03-31-2007, 08:50
Hee hee hee....playable Crusader states.....move over Papal States, I have a new fav faction to try out, and the Americas seem quite interesting as well, I would deffintely give the natives a try as well.
pevergreen
03-31-2007, 10:45
I can honestly say I will not like this expansion pack.
I refuse to buy it, with its glorious new things...and mini campaigns.... must resist....
I just cant handle a TW exp pack not having Invasion at the end.
:no: Lost my money.
I am wondering though, do all the new factions just use the extra, unfilled of the 31 faction slots, or do they bring their own?
If I would guess I would say the campaigns are seperate and therefore either each campaign has a 31 faction slot limit or all the new campaigns(not the grand campaign) together use the 31 slots.
gibsonsg91921
03-31-2007, 16:31
i saw one of the britannia pics- awesome!!!!
i would think that not all, if any, of the new factions will be featured in grand campaign. however, new factions in rebel-intensive areas like crusader states in israel and ireland in dublin and lithuania near russia would be nice
It seems either that CA has gotten better at making those videos or the animations have gone through a lot of improvement. They look far more natural and smoother than anything I've seen in M2 atm. Overall its looking like a very impessive expansion.
Interestingly enough I just caught a bit of a show in the history channel that talked about chinese weapons, including a replica of an flame thrower... It wasn't mobile but it hit a target at 60 feet. The show was "Ancient Discoveries - Chinese Warfare" if anyone wants to try and catch it on TV again
Personally i think that the Byz. Need some good units anyways. End game they sort of suck when gunpowder comes around
Bob the Insane
03-31-2007, 23:13
I wonder if any of the new features, new units or factions (not necessarilly all) will be rolled into MT2 vanilla... I am thinking of the little updates the the MTW campaign the VI added...
The moats and permant forts sound like possibilities... And the expanded missions... They could easily add in the Ireland, Walse and Norwegian factions as single province factios given that their home provinces are rebel at present (I say easily because they will have already gone to the troble of generating a flag, units colours and new units for the campaign games.
I don;t think doing this would detract from the new camapigns because i assume they will not use the full map and will be more like VI in style...
Heinrich VI
04-01-2007, 03:39
this expansion sounds very promising and might beat any of CAs older invasion single campaign expansions.
i just hope some of the features will make it into the grand campaign. because in the long run the grand campaign is what matters most to me and what i will continue to play after beating the new campaigns. i just need a huge map to conquer, lots of factions and it has to be a loooong campaign - i like to take my time (especially since rushing makes the game too easy and dull).
especially the "control all reinforcements" is a MUST for the grand campaign. it would move mtw2 battles to a higher level (at least for me) since i NEVER use AI reinforcements.
as a sidenote: have you noticed the castle in the background when the german order knights are shown?
i knew it looked kinda familiar:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Marienburg1.jpg
yep it looks like Marienburg the orders headquarter! wow!
one thing i always disliked about RTW and MTW2 are the generic cities and castles. more variations and and unique citys/castles would greatly enrich the game and stop me from always using the same tactic to attack them!
nikolai1962
04-01-2007, 04:00
I think this idea of small maps with focused conflicts is the right path to take as it has been a success in the past (STW, and VI). Besides I think it is more realistic for a final goal to be control of Britain, the baltic or the holy land, not all of europe.
Definitely.
If the new campaigns include new units then it will be possible for modders to create a teutonic order faction for the main campaign using those new units i guess.
Also CA need to have *cool* stuff like cannon elephants and heroic abilities to make the game have as wide an audience as possible. As long as the games are moddable, people who like things historical can mod them out and we get the best of both worlds. CA will sell a lot of copies providing them with the money to keep improving the base game and people who like a harder more realistic game can make it for themselves out of the games toolkit underneath the vanilla game.
All good.
I wonder if any of the new features, new units or factions (not necessarilly all) will be rolled into MT2 vanilla... I am thinking of the little updates the the MTW campaign the VI added...
the only real obvious added feature to the main campaign seems to be, to me at least, moats and the "control reinforcements" option. ideally, they'd add a few new units per faction (english and byzantine units seems like obvious choices; here's hoping they add to the rest...), optional special abilities, and maybe a few new factions (i.e. could play as the aztecs or whatever). but, honestly, 4 (!!!) new campaigns is enough to get me excited.
pike master
04-01-2007, 06:04
i would surely hope they will add some new factions and units to the grand campaign.
HoreTore
04-01-2007, 12:55
i would surely hope they will add some new factions and units to the grand campaign.
No real need for that. It will be a simple task to add them manually from the expansion campaigns to the main campaign. I'm sure some modders will do it, if not, there are some excellent guides in the mod forums.
Might require a few extra provinces in the main game too..
That clip was very juicy. It actually was able to whip me up a bit! Then again it's a trailer kind of,.... we'll see how it turns out when it's there *skeptic*
FilibusterÃa
04-01-2007, 15:47
No Inca, the largest empire in america?
or Mapuche, who reisted over 300 years to the spaniard invasion and defeated them in the end?
CountMRVHS
04-01-2007, 17:59
Anyone know what the map for Britain will look like -- number of provinces, etc? I was encouraged to see the number of provinces in the mini-maps in the screenshots for the Crusader and Eastern Europe campaigns, and I'm hoping it will be similar with Britain -- around as many provinces as are in VI, or more. All I've seen are those screenshots posted on the first page of this thread (can't watch the trailer), so I'm wondering if anyone has any idea on more specifics of the Britain campaign -- the one I'm looking forward to the most.
Psyched for this expansion. I can't wait until autumn!
King Jeron
04-01-2007, 20:01
I'm wondering if anyone has any idea on more specifics of the Britain campaign
Is this helpful? (http://games.telenet.be/images/screens/57/78/26344s_Medieval_II__Kingdoms__expansion_pack_-PCScreenshots8129King_Britannia.jpg)
They can't even fix the basic aspects of the game and they are already scavanging for more money with an expansion?
:wall:
King Jeron
04-01-2007, 22:22
There's nothing to fix in this game, only added.
Don't fix what ain't broken.
in fact I find patches mostly worsen the game.
Maybe you guys wanna try uninstalling third parties and defragmenting your hard drive before installing a game?
caius britannicus
04-01-2007, 22:51
Hmmm, I guess they liked the idea of localized campaigns with minimal factions that I did with crusades....
There's nothing to fix in this game, only added.
Don't fix what ain't broken.
in fact I find patches mostly worsen the game.
Maybe you guys wanna try uninstalling third parties and defragmenting your hard drive before installing a game?
Shield bug.
Quickening
04-01-2007, 23:19
There's nothing to fix in this game, only added.
:smash: Well... there is. Quite a lot actually.
in fact I find patches mostly worsen the game.
Ive seen a mere handful of examples of this in the last fourteen years. By and large, patches make games better.
King Jeron
04-01-2007, 23:38
Well I don't understand 'cause I really don't have bugs in this game. Maybe smaller ones I overlooked or something, but if I read about certain bugs on this forum I just haven't experienced them, I play this game since release.
I never heard of the 'shield bug' and I can't think of anything -related to shields- I have trouble with. But one thing I do know, the basis aspects of this game our flawless. It runs smooth and does exactly everything I expect it to do, and how the devs promised us it will do.
Offcourse, I known expansion that bring new bugs to a game, if that's the case here I'll have no other choice but to patch it. But all previous expansions of total war series were good.
I guess it just differs from individual to individual, it's exaclty why a PC is called a 'personal' computer. ;)
The only (recent) games I know that really do need patches are games like Neverwinter Nights 2, Gothic 3 and X3 reunion.
The Spartan (Returns)
04-02-2007, 00:26
wow.
i dont need an American expansion anymore!
Incongruous
04-02-2007, 00:42
Well I don't understand 'cause I really don't have bugs in this game. Maybe smaller ones I overlooked or something, but if I read about certain bugs on this forum I just haven't experienced them, I play this game since release.
I never heard of the 'shield bug' and I can't think of anything -related to shields- I have trouble with. But one thing I do know, the basis aspects of this game our flawless. It runs smooth and does exactly everything I expect it to do, and how the devs promised us it will do.
Offcourse, I known expansion that bring new bugs to a game, if that's the case here I'll have no other choice but to patch it. But all previous expansions of total war series were good.
I guess it just differs from individual to individual, it's exaclty why a PC is called a 'personal' computer. ;)
The only (recent) games I know that really do need patches are games like Neverwinter Nights 2, Gothic 3 and X3 reunion.
No we are all, pretty certain that the shield bug exists in every unit. As do countless others.
I never heard of the 'shield bug' and I can't think of anything -related to shields- I have trouble with.
It's an absolutely devastating bug, on par with the two-hand weapon bug. Learn about it here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=77217)
Tristrem
04-02-2007, 00:53
Well then If you think patches are bad, don't use them. It is a personal choice, download whatever you want. For the rest of us... is the patch here yet :laugh4: . You know what they say, ignorance is bliss:2thumbsup:
Stuperman
04-02-2007, 01:15
This looks terrible for people who complain of the game being too short, 4 more campaigns of RTW:Alexander length? also, I agree with being hesitant about heros with "special abilities"as cool as Prince Arthas is I don't play WC3 for a reason.
Hoplite7
04-02-2007, 01:24
There's nothing to fix in this game, only added.
Don't fix what ain't broken.
in fact I find patches mostly worsen the game.
Maybe you guys wanna try uninstalling third parties and defragmenting your hard drive before installing a game?
You can't be serious...nothing wrong with the game?
Wow..
stuff
Don't let it bother you. I have made a bit of an amusing pasttime to try and spot the paid shills from hardcore fanboys. :grin:
I would like to echo some sentiments that others have made in this thread as well. It would be most unfortunate if CA did not include many (if not all, barring the Super Saiyan mega-powerups) of the new features in the main campaign of the original game. In fact what'd be even better is two flavors of the main campaign, "classic" and "expansion" which respectively do and do not include the new options.
Zenicetus
04-02-2007, 02:58
This looks terrible for people who complain of the game being too short, 4 more campaigns of RTW:Alexander length? also, I agree with being hesitant about heros with "special abilities"as cool as Prince Arthas is I don't play WC3 for a reason.
That was my initial reaction too... I'd rather have a RTW/BI style expansion that expanded on the overall long campaign. On the other hand, if they're really putting some effort into atmospherics with those mini-campaigns -- individualized voice acting, new graphics on the static info panels, etc. -- then it might be worthwhile. I just hope the Crusader allies campaign can be played from the Muslim side too, and not just the Christian factions.
My pet peeve remains that the Apaches were chosen to spice up the Americas campaign, instead of the more historically accurate first-contact factions the early European colonizers actually had to face (Apalachee and Calusa in Florida, the real Carib Indians, etc.). Choosing the Apaches is the Holywood version of history.
Afro Thunder
04-02-2007, 03:53
There's nothing to fix in this game, only added.
Don't fix what ain't broken.
in fact I find patches mostly worsen the game.
Test it for yourself. See what happens when a unit of peasants attacks a unit of spear militia on the Grassy Plain map. Or try to send a unit of billmen into a cavalry unit. Apart from the initial charge, the billmen will cause absolutely no casualties to the cavalry unit, even if the billmen have 9 experience and you're fighting Hobilars or Scottish Border Cavalry.
No Inca, the largest empire in america?
or Mapuche, who reisted over 300 years to the spaniard invasion and defeated them in the end?
Read the factinos involved. I suspect that the bottom of the map will be where the Maya are. That is it doesn't go any farther south than Venezuela and Columbia. Tricky to include the Inca under those cercumstances.
Please keep discussion on topic
pike master
04-02-2007, 04:32
No Inca, the largest empire in america?
or Mapuche, who reisted over 300 years to the spaniard invasion and defeated them in the end?
yeh i kept forgetting to mention that. the inca empire made the aztecs look like telatubbies. shame that there is no mention of that war. since cortes conquered them trying to find eldorodo? i think thats how its spelled.
Pizarro you mean. And he had to push 100's of kilometers into Terraincogneta just to reach an Incan out post.
pike master
04-02-2007, 04:37
me didnt have my books opened. 8P
Inca aren't on the map, it's pretty much only the Caribbean and a bit of North America.
Anyways, I'm sure I'll enjoy the mini campaigns far more than the actual Grand Campaign. I'm usually bored with that after conquering 25 provinces (which doesn't take too long, let me tell you) because I know I basically have won...
So, I'm looking forward to this expansion, if the CA guys do it properly, this will become the best expansion they released so far (although I admit to not having played Mongol Invasion - but then again I haven't played STW, either)
How easy it is to make people happy ! Give them some new units , flamethrowers and some campaigns and they are enlighted. Nothing what modders can not do by themselves.
What I'm really hoping for are new gameplay elements to change Rommedieval into a real medieval experience. Still waiting for Dynasties, Heraldic system, medieval interactive dynamic events (Hunts, Claims...) as for example in the Anno Domini mod. If not, it's just a repeating of boring battles in a different costume...
Up to now i can see only the glamour but not the beef !
repman
Furious Mental
04-02-2007, 10:12
Frankly I prefer flamethrowers to hunting rabbits.
Taiwan Legion
04-02-2007, 10:28
this is glorious!!!
With this expansion, I could finally live my dream of slaughtering and pillaging Indians.
Ignoramus
04-02-2007, 10:44
I have to agree with repman a bit. While battles are nice, what I appreciate most is immersion. I want to believe that when I am playing a medieval game, that I really am in the Middle Ages. Medieval: Total War did this quite nicely for me. The sequel, however, I find slightly lacking. But it is still an amazing game despite that.
MilesGregarius
04-02-2007, 10:47
No Inca, the largest empire in america?
or Mapuche, who reisted over 300 years to the spaniard invasion and defeated them in the end?
My pet peeve remains that the Apaches were chosen to spice up the Americas campaign, instead of the more historically accurate first-contact factions the early European colonizers actually had to face (Apalachee and Calusa in Florida, the real Carib Indians, etc.). Choosing the Apaches is the Holywood version of history.
From the looks of it, the Americas campaign will be based around the Valley of Mexico and environs. That would place the Inca, the Mapuche, the Florida tribes, and the Carib well off map. More appropriate than any of those, and far more accurate than the Apaches, would be the Zapotecs or the Mixtecs. The Zapotecs in particular were a significant player in the region.
The idea of four smaller campaigns seems pretty cool, just hope this also includes the end to all those infuriating bugs in the original grand campaign, and maybe somewhat less stupid AI diplomacy, at least the spaniards are gonna need that if the americas campaign is going to be remotely realistic.
also, I really hope this expands the grand campaign somewhat too, some new units for all factions, inclusion of the MP units that were omitted from the grand campaign, and a couple of new factions and new provinces.
PseRamesses
04-02-2007, 13:32
IMHO the ability to control multiple armies including reinforcements was the feat that surprised me the most. The way the sentence is written I got the impression that you will be able to control even your allies armies beside your own reinforcements. This will really spice up my playstyle since I usually deploy two armies together in an campaign, one offensive and one defensive.
More epic battles, yahooooo!
:yes:
I presume that that feature was included in order to make the 'alliance' campaigns more realistic and immersive; now we've just got to hope it's carried over into the main campaign.
pike master
04-03-2007, 01:34
maybe they will work on the americas map some more before release.
and you cannot have byzantine flamethroweres without the da vinci steam tank and steam cannon and his infamous rotating blade assault chariot.
https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s286/hunterhornet/tankrepro.jpghttps://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s286/hunterhornet/tank2.jpghttps://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s286/hunterhornet/steamgun.jpg
https://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s286/hunterhornet/davincicondotta.jpg
That last bit looks like it'd cause more damage to the horses driving it than anyone else.
Personally, I think madchat is on to something with his laser armed terminator cohorts. I'd also like to see the inclusion of several lances of various clan and star league era mechs as elephant replacements. ~:thumb:
Info posted by Caliban at TWC:
Kingdoms Expansion isn't finished yet, but its well on its way. The testers here are already playing through the campaigns and giving us some really positive feedback.
The patch is due out very soon and will be out well before the expansion.
These are definitely abilities and not 'special powers'. We wanted to expand on the general’s influence to give different characters abilities that compliment their personalities. You should see more detailed information about the different abilities soon.
The Control multiple armies feature is extremely cool. This lets you send orders to the generals of the reinforcement armies to carry out commands. You can select the armies via the 'army tabs'. I was watching Palamedes control 6 reinforcement armies in a siege battle last week! Very cool stuff.
Ituralde
04-03-2007, 12:33
I finally got my hands on the copy of GameStar to dig through the facts collected there. Man I love living in Germany!
First, I would like to point everyone reading this thread to the following link where you can find some more screenshots from the AddOn:
http://www.gamestar.de/aktuell/screenshots/medieval_2_total_war_kingdoms/52718/medieval_2_total_war_kingdoms.html
Second, I would like to add some of the things I gathered from reading the GameStar article that have not been mentioned yet.
The major drawback that the Preview mentions concerning the AddOn is that many features contained in the four scenarios will not be available in the original M2:TW. For example the forts with moats can only be built in certain scenarios and you won't be able to control AI reinforcements in the original campaign.
Let's come to the new additions though for each scenario:
Eastern Europe:
Faith will play a huge role in this campaign as the Teutonic Knights will only be able to train their best units in catholic settlements. This means they will have to put a lot of effort into converting.
On the other hand pagan or orthodox factions like Novgorod or Lithuania can convert to Catholicism. This can lead to riots but gives them access to more advanced weapons. It also has the drawback that the Teutonic Order can immediately pump out it's best units should they conquer one of your towns.
The Danes have other goals, they are bent on uniting Scandinavia which will give them access to special norwegian warriors.
While the HRE will have to try to secure vital trading posts to boost the Hanse in the Baltic Sea.
Crusade:
Important towns and cities like Jerusalem will offer unique bonuses to the faction that controls it and enable you to recruit elite units. You will also receive steady reinforcements from the settlement.
There will be Holy Relics that you can find in victorious battles or in conquered cities. You can assign those Relics to one of your generals. After his death it will be given to his successors. Relics can be lost to the enemy if you loose a battle.
New World:
If you start as the Spaniards, you can gain Presitge points that will let you raise in rank from mere Noble to Marquis. Every rank will give you more money and give you access to more advanced troops. You can also be demoted if you loose too many battles.
The Spaniards will not only have to subdue the Indians but later in the game they also have to defend their possesions against French and English colonists.
The Indian tribes can ally with the Spaniards and gain Musketeers and other advanced units through it. They also have the option to sacrifice prisoners to their Gods to make their populace happier.
Britain:
In this scenario you will see a large and strong Britain that has to fight against the Welsh, Irish and Scots on all fronts, while having to fight inner squabble as well.
The Norwegians will be raiding against all parties present on the British Isles.
I hope you found the above information helpful. I'm only passing it on from what I read in the GameStar magazine so don't hold me responsible for any of it. Have fun!
Cheers!
Ituralde
And a TW blog with info no the general abilities:
First off – hello. I’m Mark Sutherns, I work at CA UK in the Studio Marketing department and hopefully, you’ll be seeing a lot more of me on this very blog and on the forum in the months ahead. Enough of the introduction though, let’s get down to business.
I wanted to make a post to follow up on some of the comments and threads I’ve read on the Medieval II forum since the announcement of Kingdoms. In particular, I wanted to post some more info on the heroes and special abilities feature to give you some more detail and perhaps put some people’s minds at rest. I would have posted on this before now, but I wanted to get some additional info from the dev team in Oz and with the time difference...well you know. Anyway, enough of the rambling excuses, here's the beef on heroes and abilities.
Firstly heroes have been added to Kingdoms in order to reflect the role that certain significant leaders played in battle. Up until now in Total War, you've developed your own Generals, their traits and command abilities but with Kingdoms we wanted to take that a step further by giving the player unique General characters that came equipped with improved abilities in battle. These special abilities reflect the influence that these great leaders of men had on their troops and their potential to turn the battle in the favour of their armies.
By giving these heroes increased abilities, it makes these particular Generals even more precious, therefore introducing new strategies concerning how these heroes are used in terms of where they are deployed on the campaign map and which battles they are thrown into.
The special abilities included in Kingdoms (we’ll reveal more detail on these in the weeks and months ahead) will be limited to one per hero and will be carefully balanced so, while they have an influence on the battle, they are not so powerful as to unbalance things dramatically. Typically these powers will be limited to morale effects on your own troops and in some cases, the morale of enemy troops. As you'll see when you get to play Kingdoms, these abilities make these heroes significant to the campaign game so that the player you’re driven to keep them alive and to use them strategically at the right time and in the right battles within the campaign.
To give you even more detail, Dan Lehtonen, a designer on Kingdoms from our studio in Brisbane, sent me this overnight:
“The one ability that seems to have spooked a lot of people is the Byzantine politics ability. This unfortunately prompted by an inaccurate translation from the Gamestar magazine preview in which it was thought that enemy units would be made to fight against other enemy units, when in fact they cause a ruckus throughout their own unit, causing a distraction and holding that unit up. This can provide many tactical opportunities on the battlefield with possible flanks being opened or vital units being held up by infighting.
Manuel’s ability represents the skill and cunning use of Byzantine agents’ provocateur. These men slip into an enemy army before battle and bribe greedy members of enemy units to start a ruckus when given a signal from the Byzantines. They do not kill anyone in their own unit! Because if they did and the battle is won by their army they would be strung up as murderers! Of course Manuel has promised through his agents that they will be spared if they lose… There is no magic at work here, just capitalizing on pure human greed.”
So there you go. I hope this sheds some more light on this particular feature. More will become clear when we reveal each of the heroes and their particular abilities in a month or so. In the meantime, keep the feedback coming and I’ll endeavour to keep you updated with extra snippets of information and detail up until release.
http://www.totalwarblog.com/
The major drawback that the Preview mentions concerning the AddOn is that many features contained in the four scenarios will not be available in the original M2:TW. For example the forts with moats can only be built in certain scenarios and you won't be able to control AI reinforcements in the original campaign.
:furious3:
:furious3:
Times 80 hojillion... C'mon, that's just crap CA. We've been chomping at the bit for this feature since STW, and now we finally get it but we can ONLY play it in a few small campaigns? This must be what it's like to buy a sports car and find out you can only drive it at 35 mph in stop and go traffic.
:no:
My guess is so that those who don't get the expansion can still get update 3 patch without it being several gb in size and featuring things others have to pay for. I mean BI didn't add anything to RTW, apart from a few things that could be modded in.
Ignoramus
04-03-2007, 14:32
:furious3:
:yes:
Aye, it shouldn't be a big deal to mod most of that stuff into the grand campaign.
Aye, it shouldn't be a big deal to mod most of that stuff into the grand campaign.
But, if it is not a big deal for the modders, it is a lot easier for CA. :)
That´s a feature the player are looking for, CA knows that and are going to use on the new exp. Why not use in the main campaign?
Sometimes I think we are being too kind if the companies, as if they are doing us a favor just making the game. Why spend money to play it and its not a big deal to wait for the best CA could do, not the best the modderes could do.
Just my toughts.
Fabiano
pike master
04-03-2007, 17:44
That last bit looks like it'd cause more damage to the horses driving it than anyone else.
Personally, I think madchat is on to something with his laser armed terminator cohorts. I'd also like to see the inclusion of several lances of various clan and star league era mechs as elephant replacements. ~:thumb:
well mech commander 2 did somewhat of a decent job of what you are talking about. but still it would be awesome to see battle mechs going through a wormhole and appearing on the medieval battlefield although im sure it would be one sided unless they had to take on timurid cannon elephants.
we would have to take the terminators guns away from them since when they travel through time displacement they cant take mechanical devices with them. so they would have to go catch some knights and soldiers and relieve them of their attire and duke it out with pole arms and swords.
also a zombie army would be neat as well but they would have to show arms and legs getting hacked off for that.
it would be neat instead of wardogs you had to fight a bunch of war wolves or in other words and interpretation ware wolves.
and of course the zombies would have morale so you can watch a bunch of zombies trying to run while their legs come lose and their rotten bodies disintegrate.
skeleton armies like out of sinbad. with sword and shield.
these ideas should definetly make mtw2 more historically i think:yes:
Does this seem like 4 alexanders bundled into 1 xpac to anyone else?
King of Kings
04-03-2007, 18:14
to me it seems like 4 great campaigns and one great expansion.
Quickening
04-03-2007, 18:28
to me it seems like 4 great campaigns and one great expansion.
Sounds like a tagline; "Four Thrilling Campaigns in One Epic Expansion Pack!!!"
The aspect of this that I'm really encouraged by is the size of the campaign maps. We're now getting 4 completely new maps of regions that have far more detail than most modders have been able to achieve. Even though it looks like there are only a few factions in each campaign, there's no reason why modders can't easily alter that and make each individual campaign into a massive game of its own. For instance, the British Isles map appears to only have 4 factions, but is easily large enough to support 15. That alone makes it a gold mine for the modding groups.
The aspect of this that I'm really encouraged by is the size of the campaign maps. We're now getting 4 completely new maps of regions that have far more detail than most modders have been able to achieve. Even though it looks like there are only a few factions in each campaign, there's no reason why modders can't easily alter that and make each individual campaign into a massive game of its own. For instance, the British Isles map appears to only have 4 factions, but is easily large enough to support 15. That alone makes it a gold mine for the modding groups.
Just you wait until some mods are actually released. Most of what we have right now is rebalancing vanilla, really (although that in itself is often a very good achievement).
Anyways, maybe CA will put those features into the grand campaign with a patch for the original game, or they simply didn't work on it until the version Gamestar got. If I'd make an expansion I'd try to get the expansion content right before adding stuff to the original game, too...
IrishArmenian
04-03-2007, 22:30
Does this seem like 4 alexanders bundled into 1 xpac to anyone else?
(Gasp of Anticipation)...No.
I never played Alexander because it just looked like they were not making it to enhance gameplay experience, as it looked uninspired.
These, hower, look inspired, imaginative and made for the sole purpose of a more enjoyable gaming experience.
Xtiaan72
04-03-2007, 23:22
Does anybody know?
This reinforcing army feature they are talking about. What is the best info on how they are implementing this. Are we really finally going to be able to toggle between two full stack armies in one battle?
This info posted by Caliban at TWC is the best we've got to work on:
The Control multiple armies feature is extremely cool. This lets you send orders to the generals of the reinforcement armies to carry out commands. You can select the armies via the 'army tabs'. I was watching Palamedes control 6 reinforcement armies in a siege battle last week! Very cool stuff.
Xtiaan72
04-03-2007, 23:27
It sounds really promising. So there is no info on troop limitations yet.
Threads merged. Please keep all expansion discussion in this thread.
Of the scenarios: three made sense, but the British Isles one surprised me a little. I would have thought an Iberian Peninsula scenario or a British Isle plus France scenario would have been a better go.
Hoplite7
04-04-2007, 03:30
So... most of the new content is only accessible in the 4 minicampaigns?
Honestly, doesn't sound like much of an expansion. Would be better suited as downloadable content.
If I were to buy this expansion, and I'm not terribly thrilled by it so far, it wouldnt be so much because of what CA did but more like what the modders can do with it. I'm of the opinion nowadays that CA makes a okay game but the modders can make it a good game.
Alexander the Pretty Good
04-04-2007, 05:14
I'm just wondering how much they'll charge for it. :book:
Lord_hazard
04-04-2007, 10:28
Prob around half the originals cost.
gibsonsg91921
04-04-2007, 23:03
i would much rather have CA make a good game than have modders make a game that may have bugs that screw up a good game
i would much rather have CA make a good game than have modders make a game that may have bugs that screw up a good game
The thing is though is that its the modders who so far got alot of the fixes for the original game and made it playably enjoyable. M2TW should never had so many obvious bugs at launch. No excuse for it and I dont care if its CA's doing or Sega's(there seems to be an argument over who was responsible for pushing it out too soon). It was BS for it to launch so buggy like that. Its the modders who fixed alot of the bugs before CA ever got the first patch out. My respect for the modders grows with each new game CA releases.
I'm not trying to sound nasty towards CA because I do like their games but its just how I personally feel about their lack of QA lately.
Frederick_I_Barbarossa
04-05-2007, 00:43
Has anything been said here about whether or not it would be possible that we would be able to get the heir selection option back in the expansion?
Quickening
04-05-2007, 00:44
Has anything been said here about whether or not it would be possible that we would be able to get the heir selection option back in the expansion?
No mention of it but Im willing to bet "no".
Frederick_I_Barbarossa
04-05-2007, 00:52
Everyone together now...
:furious3: *UGH*:furious3:
I'm really missing that feature...and as far as the claim of historical accuracy on it...I can easily wikipedia a dozen instances where the eldest son did NOT inherit the throne...even Charlemagne didn't initially inherit the whole Frankish kingdom at first...
gibsonsg91921
04-05-2007, 02:08
i would prefer if it was just legit primogeniture with the throne going to the kings son, or if the king had no sons to his brother, or if he had no brothers his uncle, and no uncles the closest, oldest male heir
Yeah, well, a very good deal of us don't want the current method. The best solution that's win-win would be to give us the ability to set the heir, and if you don't want to do that, just let the game handle it. The game would follow primogeniture (sp?) rules unless you jump in and manually set someone.
Everybody wins. Everybody's happy. Group hug. ~:grouphug:
(Captain Picard voice)
Make it so, CA.
pike master
04-05-2007, 03:55
this here expansion kinda makes me nervous:sweatdrop:
Afro Thunder
04-05-2007, 04:01
Everyone together now...
:furious3: *UGH*:furious3:
I'm really missing that feature...and as far as the claim of historical accuracy on it...I can easily wikipedia a dozen instances where the eldest son did NOT inherit the throne...even Charlemagne didn't initially inherit the whole Frankish kingdom at first...
There's plenty of times in Medieval II when the eldest son doesn't inherit the throne... More often than not, it's the worst perverted drunkard in the family that gets to be king. Yeesh...
doorknobdeity
04-05-2007, 06:42
Latest on the Total War blog: http://www.totalwarblog.com/
It seems to suggest that the hero abilities are less "WoW"-ish than previously thought. I think the explanation for the Byzantine emperor's confusion ability-- that the unit is bribed to be an undisciplined liability-- is a bit contrived, but not unbelievable.
Divinus Arma
04-07-2007, 21:48
Kingdoms also offers new multiplayer maps and hotseat multiplayer, a first for the Total War series, allowing players to play one-versus-one campaign games on the same computer.
http://www.gamespot.com/pages/news/story.php?sid=6168368&part=rss&subj=6168368
(3rd comment down after the article)
Huh?!
Hah! Hotseat games. They are slowly moving up in the world though. Soon they might add multiplayer campaigns. Maybe an fps approach to it heh.
Boyar Karhunkynsi
04-09-2007, 01:26
I can't sit back and not have my two cents worth.
The Britannia campaign looks damn sexy. It will really show what the new Norman overlords of England had to struggle against to secure their kingdom. Should be fun, but I'd still like to see a mod exclusively on this (ie. the British Isles being the whole map). Would be interesting to see a scando-celtic faction spring up in northern Scotland - as did happen, the Clan Gunn (from whom I happen to directly descend) sprang out of nowhere and raided and killed lots of Scots. Damned Keith's!
The Crusades campaign will be a major improvement. It was not nearly covered enough. It just didn't cut the mustard. The Holy Kingdom of Jerusalem will have an odd assortment of units (and they better bloody be included!) and should be interesting - but difficult - to play as. They will have a real hard time fighting off the Muslims and dealing with civil unrest (but should have very low-upkeep units).
The Teutonic campaign is something I'm looking forward to. This campaign should be more about religion than even the Crusades campaign. I'm happy to see Lithuania in there, too. I thought they would have been mentioned in the original game (not just couple of units used by Poland). The Teutonic knights appear to be covered well.
American campaign? They always look good and turn out horrid and unrealistic. So many games have tried to encompass the conquest of the Americas while trying to retain some sort of realism; but it's never been done and it looks doubtful that it ever will be done justice. The Native American factions were (almost) never organized into battles. It was nearly exclusively guerrilla warfare. Anyway, I'm not going to lecture on this.
Overall, I'll buy it asap, and it should give me something to waste my spare time on for a few months. It looks classy but more fantastic than the original game. It would be cool if they make a Viking Expansion next...
I loved VI. :P
-Max
MilesGregarius
04-09-2007, 21:00
The Native American factions were (almost) never organized into battles. It was nearly exclusively guerrilla warfare.
Simply not true. There were a number of battles, not only in Mexico, but also in the Yucatan and in Guatemala.
The Spaniards fought a number of battles against the Tlaxcaltecas, then in conjunction with the Tlaxcaltecas against the Aztecs - the siege of Tenochtitlan, la Noche Triste, Otumba, Tlacopan. And these are only the large ones, far larger than almost any battle fought in Europe to that point.
Later, Pedro de Alvarado faced 72,000 (no doubt an exaggeration, but assuredly a large force nonetheless) Quiche Maya led by Tecun Uman near Quetzaltenango. He also had to storm the capitals of the Tzutujil, Mams, and Pokomams. The Pipils, under Atlacatl, even managed to drive Alvardo out of their territory in El Salvador.
In the Yucatan, the elder Francisco de Montejo failed to subdue the Maya despite a number of pitched battles. The younger Montejo fought a pitched battle as late as 1546 to finally end large-scale military resistance.
Also, there was plenty of fighting between the various Native polities long before Cortes showed up. The list of factions would seem to offer the opportunity to recreate the regular warfare between Aztecs and Tlaxcalecas, for instance.
I can't sit back and not have my two cents worth.
The Britannia campaign looks damn sexy. It will really show what the new Norman overlords of England had to struggle against to secure their kingdom. Should be fun, but I'd still like to see a mod exclusively on this (ie. the British Isles being the whole map). Would be interesting to see a scando-celtic faction spring up in northern Scotland - as did happen, the Clan Gunn (from whom I happen to directly descend) sprang out of nowhere and raided and killed lots of Scots. Damned Keith's!
The Crusades campaign will be a major improvement. It was not nearly covered enough. It just didn't cut the mustard. The Holy Kingdom of Jerusalem will have an odd assortment of units (and they better bloody be included!) and should be interesting - but difficult - to play as. They will have a real hard time fighting off the Muslims and dealing with civil unrest (but should have very low-upkeep units).
The Teutonic campaign is something I'm looking forward to. This campaign should be more about religion than even the Crusades campaign. I'm happy to see Lithuania in there, too. I thought they would have been mentioned in the original game (not just couple of units used by Poland). The Teutonic knights appear to be covered well.
American campaign? They always look good and turn out horrid and unrealistic. So many games have tried to encompass the conquest of the Americas while trying to retain some sort of realism; but it's never been done and it looks doubtful that it ever will be done justice. The Native American factions were (almost) never organized into battles. It was nearly exclusively guerrilla warfare. Anyway, I'm not going to lecture on this.
Overall, I'll buy it asap, and it should give me something to waste my spare time on for a few months. It looks classy but more fantastic than the original game. It would be cool if they make a Viking Expansion next...
I loved VI. :P
-Max
Good post.
Personally I would defintely not qualify M2:TW as historically accurate. It's just a RTS game. There's no real history lesson IMO. It's vaguely based on history. When MTW/VI was launched I was all into the history, but the more history I read the more I realised what nonsense MTW was, historically speaking. That is, if you believe the historians, which is the only source of info we have anyway.
It's a GREAT game and a GREAT series. However it does not in any way offer an accurate picture of what happened in history.
invalidopcode
04-11-2007, 16:59
The features look cool, but because of the way the patching has gone on the original M:TW2, I will wait a while before spending money. Why spend money at the premium price just to have to wait until the show stopping bugs are fixed?
The only good thing to come out of the press release is that now we know why CA is so slow to fix the bugs on the original game - they are too busy working on the expansion. :furious3: So perhaps the developers are techincally competent but the management is not allocating resources correctly...
Cadwallon
04-12-2007, 06:49
Yes shortcuts have been made, factions have been simplified (for example, Seljuks/Ottomans, Almoghuvars/Almohads), histories streamlined - I still think all in all its probably the most accurate AND challenging game I've ever played - and that goes for the whole series from Shogun. Its the only reason I upgrade my computer!!
If some mucking around with history hadn't happened - we'd just be recreating history - rather than re-writing it.
I'm waiting with baited breath both for the patch and for the expansion. Both RTW Barbarian Invasions and MTW Viking Invasions were worthy expansions to the original - and I like the idea particularly of the British Isles, so I can rewrite history and have one of the three celtic factions showing those Sassenachs who the real Britons are!
One criticism - in MTW you could have civil wars. I'm yet to have a rebellion - let alone civil war. This is on VH/VH - will this come back into play with the expansion?
On another note - this labelling of supporters of MTW2 as fanboys is patently childish and smacks of idle flamers with no wit :dizzy2: ....nor real argument.
This is not a sarcastic post.
Fanboy means someone who is oblivious and blind to the shortcomings of the game. A fanboy supports the developers and the game blindly, without making any constructive and challenging remarks and critique. The only thing that ever come out of the fanboy are positive supportive comments. So even if someone comes out and says hey !! look why are the 2 handed units not doing anything. The fanboy comes and says well they are just look again, or maybe you don't know how to click, try right clicking. Why don't you just quit playing the game if you don't like it ? This is typical fanboy attitude.
Blind faith is always ... blind.
I LOVE and SUPPORT the series and CA since Shogun and I'm sure my contributions through stern and direct critique have been just as valuable as the times I've said GOOD FREAKIN JOB ! I LOVE IT !
Not all M2TW supporters are labelled fanboys but those who are so in love that they cannot see the faults often are. The word is also very often just used to put down and belittle.
Anyway I'm hoping to see lots of Native Americans with feathers and face paint in the expansion !
Wonder if they'll go as far west as Arizona, apparently there's gonna be Apache so I guess they'll have to. Can you just picture how beautiful the scenery will be, if it's anything like the current game. It will be AWESOME ! I also can't wait to see Apache in cantabrian circle... that's going to be AWESOME. Imagine if they have rifles AND tomahawks as secondary weapon. I hope they will be a playable faction. Wonder who the leaders will be and their special abilities. Can't wait to command Geronimo and his RAGING braves !
I also wonder how Saladin will be portrayed in the Crusades, if he will actually make an impression. In M2:TW I have'nt really noticed him though he must be there, somewhere. I have'nt played the Egyptians either so I would'nt know. Wonder if he will be well portrayed and what his special ability will be. I'm sure loads of people (like me) just can't wait to command him and his chivalrous warriors !
Salute !
Taliferno
04-12-2007, 14:00
PC Gamer Uk had a six page preview (mostly screenshots of the Lithuanian and Americas campaigns).
Heres a short summary of stuff that I dont think has been mentioned before
Some of the New Units:
Scythe wielding followers of Perkunas
Dieva Guards (calvary with warforks)
Iqta'dar
Priests of Quetzalcoatl
Szlachta
Rhyfelwyr
Sacthwyr
Ulster Swordsmen
Calievermen (Irish Harquebusiers)
Features in Americas Campaign:
Expeditionary forces can arrive from England, etc
New Prestige System
Reinforcements get sent from Spain (related to Prestige system I think)
British Isles:
English can send Edward on Crusade. If successful comes back with veteran knights and new traits, failure means he dies and you'll have to do without him.
Welsh get spontanious sympathies (extra manpower for welsh generals in border regions).
I got the impression that the permanent, moated Forts were limited to the this campaign.
For All Campaigns:Possibilityof new agent types (such as the Explorer in Americas).
Derfasciti
04-12-2007, 14:39
This looks very fun, indeed. I wish I had it now. I also agree with at least one of the posters that taking over a specific area i.e. all Britain or the Holy Land is a much more realistic goal to be set for the Middle Ages than trying to conquer the entire world.
I just hope/wish that factions like Wales and Ireland would enter into the grand campaign since these countries were actually existent. (granted very divided at the time)
pike master
04-12-2007, 19:57
what in the world is that thing on the cover of the magazine? is that actually one of the units in the expansion?
Antagonist
04-13-2007, 22:05
PC Gamer Uk had a six page preview (mostly screenshots of the Lithuanian and Americas campaigns).
Heres a short summary of stuff that I dont think has been mentioned before
Some of the New Units:
Scythe wielding followers of Perkunas
Dieva Guards (calvary with warforks)
Iqta'dar
Priests of Quetzalcoatl
Szlachta
Rhyfelwyr
Sacthwyr
Ulster Swordsmen
Calievermen (Irish Harquebusiers)
Features in Americas Campaign:
Expeditionary forces can arrive from England, etc
New Prestige System
Reinforcements get sent from Spain (related to Prestige system I think)
British Isles:
English can send Edward on Crusade. If successful comes back with veteran knights and new traits, failure means he dies and you'll have to do without him.
Welsh get spontanious sympathies (extra manpower for welsh generals in border regions).
I got the impression that the permanent, moated Forts were limited to the this campaign.
For All Campaigns:Possibilityof new agent types (such as the Explorer in Americas).
Interesting info, thanks for posting it. New agent types sounds very promising. The new units sound interesting too, although I was sure Szlachta were already in the game for some reason. And I think Sacthwyr should be Saethwyr or something like that. :book:
Antagonist
EDIT: Have to say though, "Ulster Swordsmen" is quite an annoying name in comparison to the others.
Makes me think of the Tain or something.
Taliferno
04-13-2007, 23:11
I'm gonna guess that the Ulster swordsmen are sort of an anglo/Irish men at arms type unit, seeing as at the start of the campaign most of Ulster would be under Norman control. Historically in the 1500s the name for the able bodied men of Ulster was 'the swordsmen' so swordsmen amongst their armies was obviously quite common.
I also forgot to post about how the controllable reinforcements work, so here it is:
-A new UI element appears on the side of the battle screen.
-this allows you to assign behaviours to reinforcemnets (aggressive/defensive/shootout and give them destinations
-You cant micromanage every unit (but we already knew that).
and your right Antagonist it is Saethwyr, I mistyped it in.
Boyar Karhunkynsi
04-14-2007, 09:12
Simply not true. There were a number of battles, not only in Mexico, but also in the Yucatan and in Guatemala.
The Spaniards fought a number of battles against the Tlaxcaltecas, then in conjunction with the Tlaxcaltecas against the Aztecs - the siege of Tenochtitlan, la Noche Triste, Otumba, Tlacopan. And these are only the large ones, far larger than almost any battle fought in Europe to that point.
Later, Pedro de Alvarado faced 72,000 (no doubt an exaggeration, but assuredly a large force nonetheless) Quiche Maya led by Tecun Uman near Quetzaltenango. He also had to storm the capitals of the Tzutujil, Mams, and Pokomams. The Pipils, under Atlacatl, even managed to drive Alvardo out of their territory in El Salvador.
In the Yucatan, the elder Francisco de Montejo failed to subdue the Maya despite a number of pitched battles. The younger Montejo fought a pitched battle as late as 1546 to finally end large-scale military resistance.
Also, there was plenty of fighting between the various Native polities long before Cortes showed up. The list of factions would seem to offer the opportunity to recreate the regular warfare between Aztecs and Tlaxcalecas, for instance.
I do see where you're coming from, I really do.
But the fact of the matter remains, the majority of the European invader/settlers were not, in fact, killed in battle but by wonderfully sneaky guerrilla warfare. There were battles, aye, big ones at that - but if you were trying to show any half-decent portrayal of the invasion of the America's the M2TW game is not the place to do it. How could you possibly show a skirmish or raid? Men were picked off by enemy, environment and disease - not just a "line up and hack away" battle. I do not have a bias. I see it from a different perspective to anyone who can say "my great-great-granddaddy..." in regard to the Americas. I assume you do?
Personally I would defintely not qualify M2:TW as historically accurate. It's just a RTS game. There's no real history lesson IMO. It's vaguely based on history. When MTW/VI was launched I was all into the history, but the more history I read the more I realised what nonsense MTW was, historically speaking. That is, if you believe the historians, which is the only source of info we have anyway.
It's a GREAT game and a GREAT series. However it does not in any way offer an accurate picture of what happened in history.
I'm aware. It's a game and I do not expect realistic content (well, some - but not a lot). The entire TW style of play does not allow for much realism. "Line up and hack away" does no accurately show much of anything. Events were happening on a communal and provincial level during wartime that cannot hope to be shown in the near future. The TW games I play are a way for me to waste my time in a way that I deem relaxing (I like to see little men being hacked down - it's oddly soothing). But hey, it beats FPS.
:medievalcheers:
I mean no offense by any of this.
Cheers,
Max
edyzmedieval
04-14-2007, 11:32
i would much rather have CA make a good game than have modders make a game that may have bugs that screw up a good game
Uhm, if you check around the big mods for MTW and RTW, you'll see that they are more bug free than the original game.
MilesGregarius
04-14-2007, 11:58
I do see where you're coming from, I really do.
But the fact of the matter remains, the majority of the European invader/settlers were not, in fact, killed in battle but by wonderfully sneaky guerrilla warfare. There were battles, aye, big ones at that - but if you were trying to show any half-decent portrayal of the invasion of the America's the M2TW game is not the place to do it. How could you possibly show a skirmish or raid? Men were picked off by enemy, environment and disease - not just a "line up and hack away" battle. I do not have a bias. I see it from a different perspective to anyone who can say "my great-great-granddaddy..." in regard to the Americas. I assume you do?
The same can be said for much of Europe until at least the Renaissance.
Ireland, for example, saw few pitched battles of the type you say Mesoamerica lacked, yet remained in constant turmoil for centuries, essentially a millenium of skirmish and raid, and the same can be said to a lesser degree of much of the Norman Conquest and and English attempts to subdue Wales and Scotland. Neither M2TW nor VI successfully models this, and I doubt that Kingdoms will either. And it is far more absurd to imagine an Irish or Welsh faction conquering and uniting the whole of the British Isles than it is to imagine an Aztec leader crushing Cortez's little expeditionary force.
Similarly, much, if not most, of the fighting between the Teutonic Order and the Lithuanian pagans they crusaded against consisted of little more than raid and counter-raid. Where in the game's current incarnation can we recreate the slave raids and the village burning which no doubt claimed far more lives than at Liegnitz or Tannenberg?
In RTW, Caesar's men spent far more time burning villages and warding of ambushes in Gaul than they did standing toe-to-toe with any Gallic armies. The Aztecs, Tlaxcalans, Tarascans, Zapotecs, et al were at least unified polities. A unified Gaul? Laughable. The TW series is simply not scaled to represent guerrilla tactics in any place or in any time period.
Finally, the single most significant occurence, and greatest cause of casualties, in the Europe of the M2TW period, the Black Death, is not represented in the game. If more Europeans died due to the plague than in all the dynastic wars and crusades combined, how can you say the M2TW as it stands now is any more representative than a conquest of Mexico scenario?
I'm aware. It's a game and I do not expect realistic content (well, some - but not a lot). The entire TW style of play does not allow for much realism. "Line up and hack away" does no accurately show much of anything. Events were happening on a communal and provincial level during wartime that cannot hope to be shown in the near future. The TW games I play are a way for me to waste my time in a way that I deem relaxing (I like to see little men being hacked down - it's oddly soothing). But hey, it beats FPS.
:medievalcheers:
I mean no offense by any of this.
Cheers,
Max
This seems counter to your point about the Americas' campaign. If you "do not expect realistic content (well, some - but not a lot)" regarding European campaigns, how do you deem an Americas' campaign insufficiently realistic?
If I have any (MILD) complaint with the campaign selections in Kingdoms, it's with yet another rehash of the conquest of the Britiain. The Reconquista or the era of the condottiere in Italy would have made for fresher subject matter.
Finally, the single most significant occurence, and greatest cause of casualties, in the Europe of the M2TW period, the Black Death, is not represented in the game.
The black death is ingame, it's freakin lethal when it arrives.
When does it arrive, anyway?
I don't think I've ever still been playing (definitely never seen the unlocking of the new world, so if it's after that....) when it comes around
It arrives in 1346 in Southern Europe first.
The black death is probably the most terrifying thing in the game.
Not even power of the mongols or Timurids can match the destructive power of that plague.
Ruins your economy and gets you into a deficit just with 2-3 turns and wipes out most of your family.
Anyway, reading the gamespot preview made me very interested in the Teutonic campaign.
The recruitment method for the order sounds cool.
MilesGregarius
04-14-2007, 12:59
The black death is ingame, it's freakin lethal when it arrives.
Sorry. I only play short campaigns.
And Lusted, absolutely love LTC. It's the main reason I'm content to wait until whenever for 1.2 to finally show.
Hross af Guttenburg
04-14-2007, 22:03
Is it at all possible that NEW elements will come into the game? moats fair enough, and flame thrower... those will be great new dimensions and hopefully summit to mod. But will we get an increase on 31 factions? Will we get a higher unit limit? Without these things, the four mini campaign system just seems a way of giving limited pleasure which won't enter the grand campaign, it won't really revolutionise the engine and allow us to make a decent game out of it
And as stated little things like setting the faction heir or princesses/queens inheriting, leading armies, remarrying and so on just seem to be ignored. The dispatching and acquisition of titles as governor, bishop etc that existed in MTW is totally needed here too... will we get it? Do they care if they can blind us with other nice sounding things in the PR package and flashy advertising. Once we've bought the game...they won't care...but we will...
Quickening
04-15-2007, 01:03
PC Gamer UK have a four day report on the expansion pack on their site.
Here is day one and the links to the next three are on the right hand side: http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=161675
pike master
04-15-2007, 02:33
i hope they let yu play the english on the americas campaign. the english expeditionary force?
I like the look of the castle/forts which are shown in the Britannia screen shot and look like they are unmanned. I'd like to see a screen shot of a battle involving them just to see what they really look like.
Hross af Guttenburg
04-15-2007, 13:23
PC GAMER "In fact, that's one of the major issues with Medieval 2: the sheer scale of the game. Campaigns demand months of your time, and much of the end-game is sheer grind to clinch those final few provinces. That's where Kingdom's four new mini-campaigns come in. "
told u so, this is going to be VERY acrade, the mini campaigns will be over in an hour or SHOULD be, they will not offer anything to hardened players...if we can get some good modding out of it remains to be seen
Have you seen the amount of provinces in the mini-campaigns, there are about 50 provinces on each map. You won't be able to beat that in an hour. I doubt they'll be arcady, just smaller more focused camapigns that can be played quicker. I mean i've never finished a campaign in M2TW(only finished one in MTw and RTW), but i think i might in Kingdoms.
Quickening
04-15-2007, 13:31
They will hardly be "arcadey". It's the same game you're playing. It's Medieval 2 in more focused bite sized chunks which is a great thing in my opinion. I can't always be bothered conquering (or trying to) all of Europe. Sometimes I want a nice little campaign that I can focus on over the course of a week or two. It definately won't be over in an hour that's for sure.
EDIT: Hell some of my battles take a good half hour.
If I have any (MILD) complaint with the campaign selections in Kingdoms, it's with yet another rehash of the conquest of the Britiain. The Reconquista or the era of the condottiere in Italy would have made for fresher subject matter.
Guess its a personal taste thing but me I'm looking forward to this as the Britannia campaign and and castles bit is exactly what I was looking for for my mods. This era wasn't exactly stable in Britain so is ripe for modding (I was already doing one starting 1280).
The only thing I don't get is that I thought the Britannia mod had a start date of 1272 or did I remember that from something else?
Hochmeister
04-26-2007, 08:23
Caliban just posted this in the Official CA Discussion Thread over ay the .com
Hi everyone,
I thought I would stop by and answer some of the questions raised in this thread. I'm really sorry if I haven't answered your question, I will try and answer the most commonly asked questions.
How will you be able to control multiple armies on the field?
Via the control multiple armies feature. You will have to option to control the reinforcement armies before you enter the battlefield. From there you can swap between armies and issue orders to your reinforcements.
Will you be able to fight the new factions against the old factions in multiplayer?
Yes, in multiplayer and custom battles you can choose most of the older factions to play as.
Will the new "control reinforcements" option be available in the "core" (original) campaign?
We are currently looking into it.
Will boiling-oil be brought back?
Yes Boiling oil will be back and available in all campaigns except Americas
Will there be historical battles?
There will be some multiplayer scenarios as well as some single player scenario battles. But no historical re-creations.
Will there be a multiplayer mode?
Yes, you can play multiplayer battles in each campaign as well as the hotseat mode.
Will money will be a problem for the Teutonic Order, which can only build castles ?
Castles will be the main source of unit production for the Order, however we are now looking at giving them the ability to upgrade their cities to increase their income. The outcome will be decided based on balance testing.
The English will have troubles with the 2h bug again, or will the patch fix that in both games ?
The 2H will be fixed in 1.2 as well as any future releases including Kingdoms.
The game will have a new soundtrack or use the one from Medieval 2 ?
Yes, there are new sound effects and so far, 35 new songs for Kingdoms composed in-house by our award winning Sound guys :)
Also, during the Crusades campaign will European crusading armies appear at random times throughout the campaign?
Yes, you will see a host of European factions arrive to take part in the crusade. Off the top of my head, Venice, England and France.
How many of the features in the expansion will be added also to the original game?
This is still unknown as of yet and being discussed due to balance reasons
Will you release the ***** Hot-Seat before Kingdoms so in the expansion we will see a real Multiplayer Campaign :)
You can still access the hotseat mode via command lines, but it won't be fully implemented until Kingdoms
* Will factions from the core game have new units, any new siege units, ships??
Yes! But you will all have to wait to find out what ;)
Will Kingdoms be fully modable and will the new features be hardcoded? For example, could I make Ireland have no family tree or give Norway the ability to change religions if I wanted to?
In the Britannia Campaign we know of 5 factions that will be playable, will it be possible to add (mod) other factions into this?
You will be able to mod Kingdoms the same as M2 vanilla, there won't be any restrictions from modding the original M2 game to the expansion. We are looking to include more modding features in Kingdoms as well as implementing some features asked by the community. Some of the new features (most I think) will be modable.
Could you please add fires and famines to the descr_disasters events list, and also add floods, storms, fires and famines to the descr_events file for modding?
It will be added to the long list of community modding requests. Only some of the requests will make it in because of the huge amount of work involved to add them all.
What will the colour of my pants be when I play M2:TW Kingdoms?
Brown, if you're wearing any..
Please bring Burning Oil back.
Sure thing!
Please bring Sapping/Under Mining back
I already gave you one feature, don't get greedy!
Please answer these questions.
Is three ok?
Apparently from what they have said in interviews kingdoms is ment to be the most modable Totalwar project to date(notice word apparently)
Correct!
Well you be able to switch off/disable the hero's, or their abilities, for the people who do not want to play with them?
You don't have to use their abilities if you don't want to. Just don't press the button.
Will we see improved AI?
Yes, the upcoming patch will see a lot of big AI improvements, these will be carried over to Kingdoms.
Will the option to view cities be available again?
Unfortunately no, that feature was removed during the engine transition in M2.
Is there any way they can change the name to have the word "Invasion" in it?
Kingdoms Invasion? Probably not, sorry
Of the previously listed patch -"bug" repair requests, how many will be addressed? There are simply to many to list in one post. If you would (finally) fix the items listed in either "R&R" or the patch request posts this should make the day.
We are well aware of the community bug lists and we have been using these for some-time to help prioritise our in-house bug list. The upcoming patch will contain some of the top priority bug fixes, we will be including more in the kingdoms release as we get to them. I couldn't give you an exact number as of yet because we haven't finished.
Campaign modding - will we be able to add additional campaigns like we could in RTW, or will we have to stick to modding one of the grand campaigns like we have to in M2TW?
Yes it is now possible to have multiple campaigns in the one mod. It requires some menu work and maps to be placed in the correct folders. This is available in the leaked 1.2 and will be available in the upcoming patch.
Will the pope have any power and if so is it just gonna be the crusader and Teutonic campaign. can he excom faction still?
No, the papacy won't be included in the expansion pack, however there will be dialog from the pope but he won't have any direct influence over the campaigns.
In the Britannia Campaign, will there only be a map of Great Britain, or will Norway be included on the map as well (not only as an invading faction)?
Only the norwegian faction is available in Britannia, however you will be able to visit them in the Teutonic campaign as most of Scandinavia is featured on the campaign map.
Will the aztecs/native americans have their own distinct voices? I think in MTW2 they use the Mongol voice.
Yes! The Native Americans will have new unique voices in Kingdoms.
Will anyone from CA answer this thread?
I hope so, it's getting pretty damn long..
Again, sorry if I didn't get around to answering your question/s, I hope this atleast sheds a bit more light on the expansion and some of its features.
EDIT: Hochmeister, I hope you didn't mind me fixing the formatting for you ~sapi
Furious Mental
04-26-2007, 08:45
If anything Kingdoms sounds less "arcadey" to me. For instance the way troops recruitment and diplomacy are linked with the native American factions introduces a whole new layer of strategy to it.
Interesting.
Thanks for keeping us up to date (I can't bring myself to read the .com :laugh4:)
NagatsukaShumi
04-26-2007, 15:35
I certainly find that FAQ a bit more uplifting than previous information, I can certainly see Kingdoms being quite enjoyable from a gamers and a modders perspective, especially if they deliver what they are claiming they will, that of course remains to be seen.
Looks good either way, looking forward to playing some hotseats with friends :whip:
It's funny... the thing I'm looking forward to the most from Kingdoms is actually the mods of the Britannia map that will eventually surface. I'd love to play a Britannia game with 21 factions!
It's funny... the thing I'm looking forward to the most from Kingdoms is actually the mods of the Britannia map that will eventually surface. I'd love to play a Britannia game with 21 factions!
I was already working on one. I kept delaying things for the patch as I didn't want to redo a lot of things but now that the Kingdoms expansion has the extra castles (and units and presumably voices) its making me rethink things a bit. I'm almost certainly going to delay till the expansion is out but use the extra time to prepare some of the factions and some different sized maps.
I also wonder how Saladin will be portrayed in the Crusades, if he will actually make an impression. In M2:TW I have'nt really noticed him though he must be there, somewhere. I have'nt played the Egyptians either so I would'nt know. Wonder if he will be well portrayed and what his special ability will be. I'm sure loads of people (like me) just can't wait to command him and his chivalrous warriors !
Salute !
I've never noticed him either. But If your looking for a guy named Salah Al-Din you'd be waiting a long time. Salah Al-Din or Salahuddin or Saladin was a name he took later in life. His real name was Yousuf Al-Auyyubi. I'll be on the look out for that name (or alternate spellings of Yousuf) for sure.
boiling oil is back. cool. Sappers are not back. Also cool.
danobnano
04-27-2007, 17:00
When will this be out?
I don't know if anyone has already posted the same question, but still, WHEN WHEN WHEN!
Dan
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