The command stars, and you

[Dan_Grr]

I can have a general running around like crazy doing endless battles just to have him reach old age with an astonishing battle record behind.... and dying with 3 stars.

On the other hand I can see a horde of enemy generals running around, some of which almost always have several stars on it, probably without even deserving it.

It would be nice to have more of my generals with command stars. I always pick 1 of my generals to develop. He usually reaches 3, 4 stars. The rest of the family members are complete eunuchs.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

We have explained the situation with regards to command stars (and their inferiority in comparison to morale traits) countless times it seems. We really should get cut and paste responses for some of these issues.

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We have explained the situation with regards to command stars (and their inferiority in comparison to morale traits) countless times it seems. We really should get cut and paste responses for some of these issues.

i think he was just asking why generals get command stars at a significantly slower rate compared to vanilla, not how relevant they are. Might be off though :2thumbsup:
Anyway, i'm not that familiar with RTW's mechanics, but don't the command stars give +1 morale per each star? While the ''very confident troops'' only gives total +2 (although it applies to all troops). It's probably a personal preference thing, but i'd rather have my best general give +10 morale to nearby soldiers than +2 to all of them :smash:

As i said, i could have misunderstood the command star bonus, and don't take this as criticism (i assume you know much more about modding than me), just my point of view :yes:

[bovi]

Stars: +morale to nearby troops, rumoured attack bonus to nearby troops (also grants night fighter in BI/MTW2, but not relevant here)
Morale: +morale to ALL troops in battle under his command

[BozosLiveHere]

The Command requirement for Night Battles is also present in cunctator's mod, and I believe it will stay that way for our next build. I might lower the threshold though.

[Afro Thunder]

What I would like to know is why AI generals have command stars that don't quite match up to what their traits say. Are they getting "hidden" traits that raise command somehow, while the human-controlled faction doesn't?

[BozosLiveHere]

Yes, we've said that thousands of times already.

[Dan_Grr]

The general I develop is usually talented, victor, conquering hero, very confident troops, bla bla bla to eternity, all goodies. Even then, I usually don't get past 3 or 4 stars and I've made endless battles. And then, I just see the AI roaming around with 8 stars generals. That gets me depressed, I'd like to see some of the work returned, and it's pretty seeing all those stars.

[abou]

You do get that return, but not in command stars. Instead, you get them in traits.

Seriously, take a look through what your general has.

[Barbarossa82]

Perhaps this should go in the FAQ, as it sounds like a Q that is A pretty F.

[blacksnail]

We should just flat out alpha the command stars so that everybody has none of them.

[Redmeth]

No, please don't take the stars I way, you can manage to get some many starred generals. In my Sauromatae campaign I had a general with 10 stars and 2 more with about 8 (when attacking and/or commanding cavalry as the steppe people are good at this) and fighting stronger Eleutheroi generals helps plus it balances out the AI factions fighting them as a many star general puts up a good fight on the other hand I watched the AI and seen almost full stacks (composed mostly of levies though) pushed back in an attempted siege by a many starred triple gold chevron general and one or two levies.
All in all I think they should be kept in the game.

[Dan_Grr]

We should just flat out alpha the command stars so that everybody has none of them.

You can't be serious... forget it.

[Teleklos Archelaou]

If it were not for them affecting auto resolve battles so much (more than played-out ones), I think we would seriously consider it. Players can always look at the opposing general on the "start battle or run away" screen, and check their traits out.

[blacksnail]

You can't be serious... forget it.
I was half-serious. Please understand that I wasn't making fun of you. The issue is that the command stars in EB do not mean much of anything. If there was a way to remove "Command" I suspect we would do it, but there isn't.

The confusion here comes from the way new players approach Comamnd stars in EB. Fighting lots of battles does not, in EB, provide lots of Command stars for the human player. It usually provides highly effective battlefield or campaigning traits which make your general a force to be reckoned with. The Vanilla Command star gives a +1 morale bonus per star to those who are in a small radius around the general. By contrast, most EB traits provide a morale bonus to all units on the battlefield. The command stars that remain are "icing on the cake" - an additional "spot bonus" for having an amazing general right next to the units.

If you could, load up a game with your awesome general and go through his traits. Look for those that provide a morale bonus. Total those up. Then, add in the 4 Command stars. That's the total morale bonus your general provides to his men. This means his morale bonus plus his Command stars make him superior to an enemy general with just Command stars. Add this in to his campaigning traits which allow for faster movement and a mastery of logistics, allowing your general to be the clearly superior one.

Another thing, did your general fight most battles being outnumbered by the enemy? Was the battlefield odds indicator 1/3 your general vs 2/3 the enemy in most battles he fought, or were your odds even or 2/3 in your favor?

[Ethan Smith]

Be careful Blacksnail, you are treading on my dreams.

[blacksnail]

It is what I do best, sadly. :beam:

[Afro Thunder]

OK, now that I've determined that the AI's generals do get "bonus" stars, does anyone know how these stars get awarded?

[Spoofa]

I find Command Star's easy to get.

Typically if I use my generals wisely they tend to get command star's, typically at least four before their retirement.

Even if they lose they sometimes get command star's.

[Thaatu]

Auto-resolving gives tactician/leader related traits more often than a "real" battle. In my Seleucid campaign my current governer of Judea is Alexandros Syriakos. He has command 10, management 9 and influence 10. I used him in his youth to battle rebels and other independents west of Babylonia, most of which I auto-resolved, and I promoted him to lead the second field army. After I secured the Levant I retired him to governership, as he's pushing 60.

My Aedui king has command 7, but he already had 3 when the game started if I remember correctly.

[nediak]

With my makedonian campaign I have auto-resolved a few battles because I have grown very weary of commanding every single battle. I recall (on the few occasions that I did this) that I lost an inordinate amount of men compared to them. For example, taking one of the cities in southern italy with two thousand men yielded me 600 casualties with only 300 kills... and that was with an army of silver shields and royal guards against eporite (sp?) rabble levies and militia (450 soldiers in the army that I attacked).

Granted, this loss was with a general with no stars and against a captain, so there were no morale boosts that i'm aware of.

So my point is, I wish that some of my generals had command stars so that i could auto-resolve a few battles. I hate to whine like a wimp, but at this point of my expansion I have to fight 2-3 battles every turn/end turn and I'm weary of it. Plus, who doesnt want their general with a half-dozen shiny stars next to his head?

[Dan_Grr]

You should then use auto_win. Auto_win is, in my opinion, the "real" auto-resolve, and even then, there are battles that I use auto_win and think that I still have too much casualties. I've tested this several times fighting the battle and losing something like 100-200 men. With auto_win I've lost 600. With auto-resolve it's a joke, instant loss. But that heavily depends wether you're fighting a general or a captain, specially if you're seiging a city, now there the auto-resolve is completely ridiculous.

There are times when it's fair game to use it, and others when it's not. If you have 200 levies in your army against a 2000 batallion of elite units you're going to win anyway a Heroic Victory if you use auto_win. For me, auto_win is reserved for the pesky cities and some annoying generals and armies that I know I can win over... always.

[Zaknafien]

well 2 for 1 casualties in an assault on a city isnt bad, was usually much higher in real life. i dont care if they are super silver ninjas or what-not. anyone with a height advantage and a wall between them and the enemy will inflict extensive casualties.

[Watchman]

Outta curiosity, how is the "auto_win" thingy used in practice ? Do you type it into RomeShell before the battle or what ?

[The Errant]

Outta curiosity, how is the "auto_win" thingy used in practice ? Do you type it into RomeShell before the battle or what ?

When the battle screen pops up with the different army compositions and the options to fight, autoresolve or whitdraw hit the ~ or whatever key that brings up the console. Then type "auto_win attacker" if your the attacker even if it's a sally from one of your cities against a beseiger. If you are the one attacked use "auto_win defender". Once typed hit enter, exit the Rome shell and hit autoresolve.
The game will calculate a "clear victory" with about 10 % casualties on your side and a defeat with a larger number of casualties on your enemies side. Eleutheroi stacks tend to be destroyed wholesale. Captain led stacks tend to disband if hit hard enough. Enemy family members tend to survive, whitdraw and gain a couple of chevrons for their surviving troops.

[Watchman]

Thanks. I can see where that can be useful (or at least convenient) for cleaning up tedious bandit and leftover army stacks.

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

Enemy family members tend to survive, whitdraw and gain a couple of chevrons for their surviving troops.
I once tested to see how long it would take to kill a family member using "auto_win". I chased him back and forth across Persia using the "character_reset" command. He took the two groups of merc pezhetroi (480 men) that I brought with me down to 30 guys, and after about 8 battles he died, alone (his bodyguard had been depleted the previous battle).

[The Errant]

I once tested to see how long it would take to kill a family member using "auto_win". I chased him back and forth across Persia using the "character_reset" command. He took the two groups of merc pezhetroi (480 men) that I brought with me down to 30 guys, and after about 8 battles he died, alone (his bodyguard had been depleted the previous battle).

Aah. The wonderful, infamous, six hitpoint AI Jedi generals. Who wouldn't love those? They escape even when totally surrounded only to return the next turn with half their bodyguards respawned and a kickass merc army. Why wouldn't you love them?
How about some custom music to go with them. I was thinking Hotel California and the part where they keep stabbing but just can't kill the beast.

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Aah. The wonderful, infamous, six hitpoint AI Jedi generals. Who wouldn't love those? They escape even when totally surrounded only to return the next turn with half their bodyguards respawned and a kickass merc army. Why wouldn't you love them?
How about some custom music to go with them. I was thinking Hotel California and the part where they keep stabbing but just can't kill the beast.

yeah that's nice... :laugh4:

I fought the Greek faction leader (Kleomenes) the other day, he had more and better quality units so i took heavy casualties but still won. However, Kleomenes managed to escape even though being surrounded by a unit of Deuteroi Phalangitai, a unit of classical hoplites and my own faction leader. I didn't see him around so i besieged their capital with my remaining soldiers. The next turn, he of course returned, having recruited all the mercs in the region (12 good quality units, merc phalanxes, cretan archers, classical hoplites, thureophoroi), vs my 6 depleted units :2thumbsup:

[Wolfman]

Is there a way to fix this bug? In my Romani campaign it took me according to the timer a good 10:00 minutes of my life just to kill the epeirote general to the south. I even brought in the Triari and he brought the, down to half their size.

[Dyabedes of Aphrodisias]

Is there a way to fix this bug? In my Romani campaign it took me according to the timer a good 10:00 minutes of my life just to kill the epeirote general to the south. I even brought in the Triari and he brought the, down to half their size.
Eh...it's not a bug...it's a result of traits and ancillaries...

About auto_win...I use it when the odds are in my favor, and it's a rediculous little skirmish that I won't bother fighting myself or letting the computer fight for me. For example, a city with a FM and a unit of militia gets assaulted by the Romani with two units of accensii and a unit of hastati every other turn. I know I would win myself, and auto resolve would lose it for me, so...